Why bother with ATMA now?

atma drop is bull shit

As far as the topic itself is concerned, there's truly no need to bother with ATMA. It serves no other purpose than vanity. For endgame purposes it's not required. And as long as wielding the relic weapon is required to progress through the stages of upgrading the weapon, it's by far one of the most tedious grinds seen in an MMO thus far.

You're far better of merely leveling offclasses, crafting, etc. And only start bothering with the relic weapon if you'd ever decide you'd be wanting it for vanity purposes.

And now we know that the next relic quest will be released in patch 2.38.

Look, if you haven't started on your relic yet, you need to start. Seriously. Don't wait until you realize: "Uh oh, it looks like the relic will eventually be the best weapon in the game" to BEGIN your relic. Just...start...now.

I don't always farm for ATMA, but when I do, it's for 12 hours and never get one.

I did that, and never tried again.

Y'all are some softies. It takes 0 effort to spam FATES while you queue for stuff. I get the drop rates suck, but it's not the end of the world. Specially if you do it between/during queues.

Anyone who says the current Atma/Animus/Novus grind is acceptable is being delusional and elitist. The work put in / reward given ratio is currently not worth the time investment to achieve the result. Why would you go through hours upon hours, spend millions of Gil in order to obtain something that is equal to what you have a chance to obtain in a single night?

This was a bad design decision by SE and why they are continuing it is concerning.

*Edit* For what it's worth, I have every relic and have zero, ZERO, urge to upgrade any of them.

Atma is frustrating sometimes, but not what people make it out to be, at least IMO.

I started doing Fates less than a week ago in between queueing for Frontlines, and yesterday finished the set for my summoner relic, which is the third relic I have gotten Atma sets for.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Anyone who says the current Atma/Animus/Novus grind is acceptable is being delusional and elitist. The work put in / reward given ratio is currently not worth the time investment to achieve the result. Why would you go through hours upon hours, spend millions of Gil in order to obtain something that is equal to what you have a chance to obtain in a single night?

This was a bad design decision by SE and why they are continuing it is concerning.

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If you are referring to gil spent, you are wrong. You can gather/craft/convert all needed items for the entire relic. If you are referring to gil not made by using said items instead of sell, you are correct, it is very costly. I hate the entire process, from atmas, to farming fates for books, and haven't even gotten to the alexandrite phase yet. I think it needs a major overhaul to a better and different system, but that probably won't happen ever. I wish you all the best of luck with your relics if you so choose to use them.

All those threads reminiscing about how awesome it was to camp NMs for days to try and get relics in FFXI and disparaging anyone who didnt get it as casuals lol. More than a few of them are now complaining about Atma, at least you don't have to wait for a fate to pop. During the atma phase anyway lol at least the "Trial of the Braves" should give those people fond memories.

anyway. Why should you do atama? the same reason people who hate DoH/DoH things, because its part of the game and has an interesting story.

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Originally Posted by Everdark

...and has an interesting story.

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The relic quest line after the first step (obtaining the base weapon) has almost no backstory or substance to it; All they do is send you on your way to collect XYZ to "power" it up. Especially the atma portion of it where it doesn't gain any powerup at all (despite the npc telling you otherwise) and even lose the cosmetic glow to it; I felt like it got weaker after turning in all 12 Atmas.

You're also comparing it to XI, which from what I heard, the relic weapon was BiS at the end hands down. That would at the very least justify the tedium. Here (espesically after hunts and St release), handing in a piece of rock to a random schmuck gives you an equal Ilvl weapon that may have already have optimized stats depending on your class.

The amount of people who are being vocal Atma portion alone compared to those that are stuck on FATEs for animus books. Heck, of all the steps in the entire relic questine Atma has the most people voicing negatively about it.

Someone in my FC started the ATMA quest this week and yesterday got all 12 of them.

Kinda makes me want to give it a second chance lol.

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Originally Posted by Moqi

Someone in my FC started the ATMA quest this week and yesterday got all 12 of them.

Kinda makes me want to give it a second chance lol.

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That's like saying someone on my block just hit $100,000 on a scratch off ticket... maybe I should go buy some too...

Can you farm on an alt (another job) and still trigger a drop? Or do you have to be using that weapon?

If coil is supposedly ending in the 3rd turn, how can weapons from that be better than something that will be getting an upgrade throughout the games life?
Should probably add this is more aimed at a new 50 in 3.0 looking for a weapon. Of course there will probably be new weapons added by then, but one of the biggest arguments defending atmas as is is the "if you dont like the system dont do it" ^_^

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Originally Posted by DenariusJay

Can you farm on an alt (another job) and still trigger a drop? Or do you have to be using that weapon?

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Any Job with a Zenith weapon equipped in the mainhand can trigger a drop as long as your at that point in the quest line :] I usually just run into fates as my Bard with Artemis Zenith because it's easier to grab mobs even though I'll be spending my atma on my Monk.

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Originally Posted by revonine

Any Job with a Zenith weapon equipped in the mainhand can trigger a drop as long as your at that point in the quest line :] I usually just run into fates as my Bard with Artemis Zenith because it's easier to grab mobs even though I'll be spending my atma on my Monk.

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Oh okay, well I only have 1 lvl 50 right now and im trying to move forward on the relic quest (need to get past titan) so I haven't gotten that far yet, but when I do I'm basically gridning fates without actually getting any progress done. That kind of sucks, I was looking forward to using the atma fate grind as an excuse to lvl up all my lowbie jobs but I guess that ain't gonna happen.

Mentality of getting gear in this game is easy...
Work is involved and don't have the possibility of getting to lot in the end is a turn off for a lot of people. Relic is a side quest, and its called side quest for a reason, no one is pointing a gun to your head and telling you to do a relic. Shits a grind... Old school FF11 players should know it doesn't take 2 weeks to get an ebody or duelist chapeau, should I mention the relic weapon grind?
You find its ridiculous to start this side quest? No one will complain that you don't have one, you can't play your job? That's a different story.

The only reason to get start another ATMA now is the possibility that they will be upgrading the relic next patch (which I hear they were but not 100% sure). As it stands though, there is no reason to start a new relic if you only care about now, as other lv100 and 110 are far easier to get due to HUNTS, ST, and that more people are now getting through Coil. When it first came out, it actually took less time and effort to get than the UAT weapon but it was just so tedious and boring to get. Of course, the UAT was simply not an option at the time for most casuals, as even the more hardcore were still progressing through Coil, so you "filthy casuals" should been glad that you even had another option.

I'm just amused with the newest patch that they made non-relic weapons EVEN easier by making UATs guaranteed drops.

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Originally Posted by Ringabell

And now we know that the next relic quest will be released in patch 2.38.

Look, if you haven't started on your relic yet, you need to start. Seriously. Don't wait until you realize: "Uh oh, it looks like the relic will eventually be the best weapon in the game" to BEGIN your relic. Just...start...now.

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Hopefully some smart person listened...

I think it's definitely a mess; you most likely got pretty lucky. I farm from 5pm to about 12 at night after work for the past three weeks going on fourth. Not a single drop. Personally I find the amount of time farming a completely unacceptable amount wasted for just one zone currently. Either I have the worst luck ever in drops, or something is seriously wrong with my quest.

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Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

Atma is frustrating sometimes, but not what people make it out to be, at least IMO.

I started doing Fates less than a week ago in between queueing for Frontlines, and yesterday finished the set for my summoner relic, which is the third relic I have gotten Atma sets for.

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Originally Posted by velric42

You can obtain better weapons now without the stupid ridiculous grind. Even Everquest from 1999 didn,t have a grind like this, plus I think its stupid that were grinding for ATMA items from low lvl FATES.

Why doesn't our epic weapons drop from epic bosses?????????????????????????.
Wouldn't that make sense? O no I need to farm lvl 4 fates,LOL LOL

15 years later and Everquest still has a better loot system than this crap.

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We must have been playing different versions of EQ. The EQ I played had me camping a rare random zone spawn for weeks just for a small part of my epic. Then when it spawned I had to make sure the others camping it did not kill it first.

I loved EQ, but I think the passage of time and nostalgia are clouding your view.

ATMA grinding would be fixed if they were random drops without needing Zenith equipped. At least you could level your other jobs running fates.

I'm on my books now, already bought my materia for the scroll, and looking forward to the glow. I don't think it's an argument of which is more hardcore, ScoB or relic grinding, but I do think it takes more dedication to upgrade the relic instead of running gated content hoping for your weekly drop. Which sounds better, RNG for actual weekly progression, or RNG for weekly progression? Yep, no difference I can see.

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Originally Posted by Yotsu

Why would i care about the Relic Questline i've killed T9 and didn't even started the Quest.

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You don't have to care. Some people care some people don't.

If you do not care about the Weapon's Lore
... or its appearance
... ... or the Bragging rights
... ... ... Or that it upgrades to ilvl 115 in its Nexus form.

Then don't bother with it.

And all those people saying their BiS is the T9 weapon, now see the Nexus that is on par if not better... a mindless grind will get you something better than a little skill does. Ohwell, I don't love my T9 weapon any less now that Nexus is out. <3

Because... 'dat glow :P

http://puu.sh/bMBEI/7f062b3a35.bmp

When mindless grind take over skills, think Nexus....

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Originally Posted by Skyl1n3

Because... 'dat glow :P

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Daaaaaaaaaamn. That is stylin'. I gotta get on my Atma grind now...

Atma is worth it when you get to Novus and I like it more than unweathered weapons. Working on my second Atma, at 10 of 12 in 3 days, 6 to 8 hours of fates only. Even got a few dupilcates while helping others in my FC. I use the Japanese time theory and I know Yoshi calls it wrong but I kept a log of my 1st atma and this 2nd one. I have rarely gotten drops on off hours in a zone, most drops happen in a zone that the hour goes to. My notes show for both atma grinds it is around 80% that you will havea better chance to get a drop in that zone in that hour. Some zone have given me 6 straight hours of hate. As for BiS t9 and put its' stats on the scroll, can't do it 100% of the time given some caps and the ilvl will be a little lower but it gives as close to the same stats as a t9 weapon.

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Originally Posted by LionKing

When mindless grind take over skills, think Nexus....

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What irks me is that this is simply like saying "why be/become skilled when you can just either grind something simple, or just wait?" I'm not saying those that chose to do relic stuff didn't work hard for what they've achieved/have yet to achieve, but at least Zenith felt like an accomplishment and not just a completion of a to-do list.

EDIT: I felt like this seemed as though I was attacking your words. I wasn't. I was actually supporting what you said and adding to it, sorry.

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Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

What irks me is that this is simply like saying "why be/become skilled when you can just either grind something simple, or just wait?" I'm not saying those that chose to do relic stuff didn't work hard for what they've achieved/have yet to achieve, but at least Zenith felt like an accomplishment and not just a completion of a to-do list.

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This is pretty much my thought on the latest relic steps. While I like the concept of an evolving weapon, both gameplay-wise and lore-wise, I don't like how the relic turned out from being the "rite of passage weapon" (killing Titan HM was not such a bad achievement back in early 2.0) to the "grind-a-lot weapon" which is now so shunned.

Relic currently is and most probably will be BiS in every patch with whatever build you want to do, the Novus step made it so. Which in a way is good, because RNGod is RNG in Coil. However - getting the latest upgrades is now not half as gratifying as it was getting the original relic. Atma and Novus required luck (the latter could also have just required money), Animus required patience. Hell, even Zenith back in the day required patience to gather the 900 myths instead of spending them in gear. I really hope they plan to reduce the grinding factor and introduce once again a challenging step. No matter how glowing the particles are, no matter the colour of the weapon, no matter the suffix.

We're all aware that Atma - huge gate as it is - is a worthless step. They may as well merge it with the Animus process, since it still takes time and effort to a degree. Novus, I have no clean words for. Nexus is somewhat of a step in the right direction, as it gets people challenging instances and other content again after the imbalance of the hunts.

Fact is, no matter how great the relic may become, Atma as worthless as it is, and Novus as expensive/random as it is, are going to be that big divider among players and gearing up. Sure, I'm aware they'll adjust it as time goes on, but I'll be brutally honest: my cynicism runs real high after seeing how Atma was so largely hated by the community, and yet was completely ignored.

So here's what I propose: Gerolt's Masterworks seems to be a thing now - Why not make the Soldiery weapons (or new ones introduced) upgradeable, comparable "rite of passage" weapons? The "grind" of it will be challenging and overcoming content. Sure, that might be too hard for some, but so is Coil already, and everyone accepts that as it is. Let the Relic be the long, easy road, the Raid weapons be the short, hard road, and the Primal/Gerolt weapons be the intermediary. Current raid weapons should always be stronger so to speak, with Relic/Gerolt both being upgradeable to comparable stats (and NOT just item level).

If this game is a "theme park" then BAM. Something for everyone.