Fan Fest London info

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Originally Posted by Leash

It doesn’t matter to them if you can’t go because of the price, there are more dedicated fans ready to take your place.

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Firstly, I appreciate you remaining civil even if I was a little snarky in my response. That said, it's not a case of not being to afford the ticket, rather a case of not being prepared to pay that much. Unless people vote with their wallets on things like this then S-E will continue to give a second-rate service to the Euro playerbase, as I felt was the case with FFXI.

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Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

Firstly, I appreciate you remaining civil even if I was a little snarky in my response. That said, it's not a case of not being to afford the ticket, rather a case of not being prepared to pay that much. Unless people vote with their wallets on things like this then S-E will continue to give a second-rate service to the Euro playerbase, as I felt was the case with FFXI.

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£65 (exchanged) in the US is different to £65 in the UK is different to £65 (exchanged) in Germany. The cost of living in each country is different, the average wage and what portion of that is considered disposable income. So to say that just because the US get three days in Vegas compared to the EU getting one day in London is imbalanced doesn't show an appreciation of global economics.

I think it's a perfectly acceptable price for a whole-day event (cheap, even) - in fact I wish the cost of the VIP had been significantly higher so that a few of those 200 lucky souls would have been put off in that first eight seconds of sale, enabling me to get a pair! :)

What I'm saying is each to their own. You may not think £65 is worth paying and that's fine, but don't think for an instant that there aren't 2,000 FFXIV players in the EU for which £65 hits their wallet from two hours' salaried work.

I do concur that travel and accommodation for non-England residents drives up the cost of attending the event significantly, and perhaps somewhere more central like Paris would have been a good idea, but presumably S-E piled the postcodes of all active subscribers into a Google Map api and saw that there were proportionally more players in England than anywhere in the rest of Europe. Presumably. Or it could be that the venue's up the road from the S-E Europe offices.

£65 seems alright to me, i have paid almost that if not the same to go to some 2-4 hour music concerts. This event is the better part of 11 hours with items etc thrown in, so im quite happy with the price :)

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

£65 (exchanged) in the US is different to £65 in the UK is different to £65 (exchanged) in Germany. The cost of living in each country is different, the average wage and what portion of that is considered disposable income. So to say that just because the US get three days in Vegas compared to the EU getting one day in London is imbalanced doesn't show an appreciation of global economics.

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Maybe you'd care to enlighten me then. For example, how, if the average wage/disposable income in the UK is significantly lower than in the US is it acceptable to charge the same price for a third of the product.

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

You may not think £65 is worth paying and that's fine, but don't think for an instant that there aren't 2,000 FFXIV players in the EU for which £65 hits their wallet from two hours' salaried work.

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I'm not sure what's more depressing, the fact that you believe people whose earnings are in that level range would blindly throw money at S-E or the fact you actually believe there are 2,000 European FFXIV players who earn circa £108k ($185k)?

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Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

I'm not sure what's more depressing, the fact that you believe people whose earnings are in that level range would blindly throw money at S-E or the fact you actually believe there are 2,000 European FFXIV players who earn circa £108k ($185k)?

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Rich people have no clue about what the world really is.

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

Rich people have no clue about what the world really is.

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Or FFXIV for that matter.

However, unless they're the kids of rich people you generally find people who earn their millions have a distinctly thrifty view on their expenditure.

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Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

Maybe you'd care to enlighten me then. For example, how, if the average wage/disposable income in the UK is significantly lower than in the US is it acceptable to charge the same price for a third of the product.

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Bear in mind Cost of Living expenses. Wikipedia may show a higher 'disposable income', but that figure's just gross wages minus statutory taxes and doesn't take into account the country's economy, secondary tax rates (sales tax, alcohol/cigarette/fuel levies), eg the cost of 'gas' in the US is very low compared to the UK.

Let's take two identical new products - from amazon.co.uk, the new Judas Priest album is £13.99 which today converts to $23.92. From amazon.com, the same album is $11.88 - no special sales or discounts. The album costs twice as much in the UK as it does in the US in direct terms. This isn't because of production costs and distribution, it's because that is how much a music album costs in each market.

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Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

I'm not sure what's more depressing, the fact that you believe people whose earnings are in that level range would blindly throw money at S-E or the fact you actually believe there are 2,000 European FFXIV players who earn circa £108k ($185k)?

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Sorry, I threw 'salaried' in there for ease of calculation so we didn't have to deal with tax. £37.5 x 40hrs x 52 weeks is £67.6k. If you'd like, change my two hours to four hours, my point remains. Around two million accounts atm isn't it? 500k EU? 2,000 of them earn £67.6k+, yeah I think so. And it's not 'blindly' is it? It may be frivolously, but I'm not alone in supporting S-E; buying CEs of each of their games, subscriptions to MMOs, a range of plushies (for my kids, honest!), and audio CDs/Blu-Rays... and for some reason a box with a crappy pewter talisman in it sent form Japan, idk. A lot of people have done the same.

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

Rich people have no clue about what the world really is.

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In my experience, the reverse is true, but clearly that opinion is based on your own perspective.

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Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

Or FFXIV for that matter.

However, unless they're the kids of rich people you generally find people who earn their millions have a distinctly thrifty view on their expenditure.

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Yeah, I doubt there are many people earning millions who have time for FFXIV or the like. However, you don't need to be approaching anywhere near well-off to be able to afford £65 for a Fanfest.

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

In my experience, the reverse is true, but clearly that opinion is based on your own perspective.

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Poor people tend to know more what they can or can't afford in order to continue to live decently. While rich people tend to think "decent life" begins when they throw away money for useless stuff (it provides them fun, but is in no way necessary for them to live). I hardly see how poor people couldn't know what is "living" and what is worth the money or not.

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

Yeah, I doubt there are many people earning millions who have time for FFXIV or the like. However, you don't need to be approaching anywhere near well-off to be able to afford £65 for a Fanfest.

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see your flaw here ? the fan fest isn't "only £65". Unless you live in London, you'll have to pay for train/boat/plane, hotel, and other stuff you may need.

Taking my case, the entire trip from France would cost from 200 to 400 euros depending on how fast I book hotel/train. but first I'll have to decide if the Fanfest is really worth all that money, because I'm a student, have very few money to throw at hobbies, and because that week-end happens between 2 weeks of class. If I were to go to London for only 2 days, maybe I would not like to sacrifice one of these 2 precious days for a festival I know nothing about. But that's only a flaw in SE's policy. Releasing infos AFTER asking our money. Nope. Being a fan doesn't mean being idiot

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

Poor people tend to know more what they can or can't afford in order to continue to live decently. While rich people tend to think "decent life" begins when they throw away money for useless stuff (it provides them fun, but is in no way necessary for them to live). I hardly see how poor people couldn't know what is "living" and what is worth the money or not.

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Most 'rich people' have been poor at some point in their life and hence are able to appreciate a broader perspective.

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

see your flaw here ? the fan fest isn't "only £65". Unless you live in London, you'll have to pay for train/boat/plane, hotel, and other stuff you may need.

Taking my case, the entire trip from France would cost from 200 to 400 euros depending on how fast I book hotel/train. but first I'll have to decide if the Fanfest is really worth all that money, because I'm a student, have very few money to throw at hobbies, and because that week-end happens between 2 weeks of class. If I were to go to London for only 2 days, maybe I would not like to sacrifice one of these 2 precious days for a festival I know nothing about. But that's only a flaw in SE's policy. Releasing infos AFTER asking our money. Nope. Being a fan doesn't mean being idiot

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I trust they'll put on a good show. I'm impressed with what they've done so far commercially, and have been for many years now. I'll buy tickets to this before I know what it's going to entail. I'll buy PS4 CEs for KH3 and FFXV before I've seen a trailer. When their products start failing to meet my expectations, I'll be more cautious about sending them money. That's not being an idiot, that's a level of trust based on experience.

And I understand that the cost of the whole endeavour for each individual will vary. As I mentioned earlier, presumably London was chosen because S-E knows where the majority of its playerbase are, so this is the best choice for the majority. It's unfortunate that you're further away (not too far in comparison to some though), but hey, some friends and I travelled to Cologne last year to beat Titan, so it's only fair that you continentals come spend your money in the UK, right?

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

Sorry, I threw 'salaried' in there for ease of calculation so we didn't have to deal with tax. £37.5 x 40hrs x 52 weeks is £67.6k.

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You actually said:

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

for which £65 hits their wallet

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Which translates as take home pay following deductions. To receive £67.6k net take home pay, as you correctly calculated, you have to have gross earnings of £106,470.47 factoring in the higher 40% tax rate on earnings over £32,011 for this current tax year and assuming you're on the Basic 1000L Tax Code, which at that earning level is highly unlikely to be fair but you get the idea.

I wouldn’t say that only UK players are getting the short end. A flight from New York to Las Vegas right now is about $450 (~ £263) round trip (the cheapest), not including hotel stay. East coast USA attendees will also have to pony up a good amount of cash to travel, and even more if they wait too long. There are some attendees that have already thrown down over $1k (~ £586) in travel expenses.

I’m lucky in this case as its a 5 hour drive there, but it will cost me about $150(~ £88) in gas money to get there and back.


And I would be considered the low end of middle class based on my yearly salary earnings. But I learned at a early age to put money aside for anything that might come up. So when these events do pop up I can go out and enjoy myself.


But there is nothing wrong with making responsible choices. Those that don’t go this year will have time to prepare for the next one. Hopefully the first one will be a great success for more to come. I wouldn’t get too upset over SE choices as I’m sure they looked into what would be the best options. It would have been more crappy if they decided against having one in the UK.

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Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

Which translates as take home pay following deductions. To receive £67.6k net take home pay, as you correctly calculated, you have have to gross earnings of £106,470.47 factoring in the higher 40% tax rate on earnings over £32,011 for this current tax year and assuming you're on the Basic 1000L Tax Code, which at that earning level is highly unlikely to be fair but you get the idea.

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Indeed, your £10k tax-free allowance disappears gradually between £100k and £120k, so your salary would have to be £109,498.20. I can number too!

As I said before, call it four hours work, not two. I think I've spent about that long while at work today on this thread, so yah, £60k salary would cover it.

Sorry, this digression has nothing to do with your opinion that the NA FanFestival is better value for money. I didn't mean to derail.

I'm not bitter that in Las Vegas today, a litre of petrol costs £0.59 and in London it costs £1.30. That's just economics. Same applies to this.

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Originally Posted by Leash

I wouldn’t say that only UK players are getting the short end. A flight from New York to Las Vegas right now is about $450 (~ £263) round trip (the cheapest), not including hotel stay. East coast USA attendees will also have to pony up a good amount of cash to travel, and even more if they wait too long. There are some attendees that have already thrown down over $1k (~ £586) in travel expenses.

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Valid point. I often forget the size of your country despite the amount of time I tend to spend over there.

I live and work in London and think £65 for an all day event that can accommodate a relatively small number of people is not bad at all. It costs the same or more to watch a 90 minute Arsenal or Chelsea football match or to go to a 2 hour music concert at the o2 Arena.

I am ok with the price and I am happy that the event is one day only. I love FFXIV but really don't want to spend 3 days at the Fan Fest, that would be too much.

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Originally Posted by MarVell

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I wonder how much you would have liked it if it had taken place in Paris during the Japan Expo. You know, when all hotels are filled super fast and the prices skyrocket... Because London Comicon is totally gonna help.

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Originally Posted by Leash

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UK players are the lucky few. Sadly a LOT of us aren't in the UK. And for us lot it costs at least the same as NA players in transport alone, and hotel is going to cost a lot too. All in all, prices may be comparable, maybe.

So sad it's totally not student-friendly. The pre-sales were the only moment we could take the tickets without paying a lot for hotels, but absolutely no info => not taking the risk => bye bye Fanfest

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

So sad it's totally not student-friendly.

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No offence but I prefer the event not to be student-friendly and hopefully attract a more mature audience.

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Originally Posted by MarVell

No offence but I prefer the event not to be student-friendly and hopefully attract a more mature audience.

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Being a student has nothing to do with maturity o.O

My mother teaches people who are 60+ how to use computers. Being a student simply means less resources regarding time and money since they're devoting time to studying something and thus don't have time to work and earn a lot either.

Most of these MMO things are held in mainland Europe and US. Nice to have one in UK for once :D

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Originally Posted by Chad

Most of these MMO things are held in mainland Europe and US. Nice to have one in UK for once :D

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Agreed. First fan fest I've been able to make and I played XI for 9yrs. Always wanted to see what these events hold.

hey all, i saw on the forum theres somewhere to fill in your character name for Las Vegas ticket holders? Do London get similar as well? not sure how to do that? ><

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Originally Posted by karbuncle

hey all, i saw on the forum theres somewhere to fill in your character name for Las Vegas ticket holders? Do London get similar as well? not sure how to do that? ><

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That was just to get their world on their badge. That's stated in the topic HERE. Unless you meant a different one.

I'm just wondering how we'll get our ingame goodies =D

SE, we really need more info for this, including the VIP details, theres info for the NA one, but what about this one ? We are about a month away now and its been very quiet.

It will most likely be with a bonus code that you enter on the mog station.

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Originally Posted by raelgun

SE, we really need more info for this, including the VIP details, theres info for the NA one, but what about this one ? We are about a month away now and its been very quiet.

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I just realised that we haven't had any submission information yet for the contests while the NA contest deadline close in a week and their event is only a week before ours.

I'm going with my bf and my french companion from Storm (Ragnarok), didn't get a VIP <sad> but I'll still enjoy it :D

Has anyone been to the Tobacco Docks before? I'm looking for an easy meeting point for my FC :)

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Originally Posted by karbuncle

hey all, i saw on the forum theres somewhere to fill in your character name for Las Vegas ticket holders? Do London get similar as well? not sure how to do that? ><

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Curious about this too. I've heard that the NA tickets you had to associate your character and world to the ticket, but the EU one was missing this requirement. I'm paranoid that I'm just missing it somehow or if for some reason the registration ended up being vastly different.

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Originally Posted by Kio

Curious about this too. I've heard that the NA tickets you had to associate your character and world to the ticket, but the EU one was missing this requirement. I'm paranoid that I'm just missing it somehow or if for some reason the registration ended up being vastly different.

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I believe it was because they are getting name badges that display this information, we are not getting the badges as ours is only one day and not three.

Any updates on a schedule or anything for this yet that I've missed? I can't believe there is no schedule on the site or information for the VIP's when we are 10 days away from the event.

7 days now and still no information. Turns out EU Fan Fest is a hoax. April Fools! (Wait, it's October? That's that theory out of the window..)

Also (from Yazpanda) isn't NA smaller than EU? Why are we getting a smaller event restricted to less of the continent? xD

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Originally Posted by neko_miyuu

I'm going with my bf and my french companion from Storm (Ragnarok), didn't get a VIP <sad> but I'll still enjoy it :D

Has anyone been to the Tobacco Docks before? I'm looking for an easy meeting point for my FC :)

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Hey I work in Wapping and I have to say its a bit of a weird place. Its an old Shopping Centre built by some brothers from the middle east that went under because its basically in the back end of nowhere... Saying that it should be a pretty cool venue as the whole place already had that Canopy feel anyway. In terms of meeting points thought its in a very residential area so meeting outside the venue could be an issue. The place itself has I would recommend meeting at Wapping Station.Its a three minute walk from the venue, unmissable with lots of space outside to wait. The venue itself has more than one entrance so god knows which they will use. Its main entrance is pretty unmissable but might be too busy to make meeting viable - its got huge wrought iron gates and a couple of full sized sailing barges in garish colours out the front (although last time I went past they were falling apart).

In terms of people wondering its also a pretty small venue in terms of event spaces avaliable in london...