Vote Kick abuse really needs to end.

While such events are sad, removing vote kick is a terrible idea. For every time I see or hear about vote kick abuse, I see another case where it's too hard to vote kick someone who's simply being an ass or a detriment to the team. Without vote kick it's impossible to kick or punish these people so you can actually clear the content.

It's a necessary evil, because the game would be worse off without a vote kick feature.

While I agree votekicking is way over the top, the attitude of some of the cutscene watchers in this topic is simply awful.

CM/Praetorium could never be run by newbies if the Main Story Duty Roulette wasn't there, and experienced players hopping in for a quick Myth boost. In the end, SE is to blame for being lazy and placing mediocre cutscenes in story dungeons.

"as originally intended" wtf, really? Why can they be skipped then?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashaltiriak

CM/Praetorium could never be run by newbies if the Main Story Duty Roulette wasn't there, and experienced players hopping in for a quick Myth boost. In the end, SE is to blame for being lazy and placing mediocre cutscenes in story dungeons.

---

Agreed, while the cutscenes are moderately fun to watch, they really spoil the fun for veteran players. I just ignore the roulette because it's absolutely no fun. Though I understand that the scenarios weren't originally built around having veteran players help out, this is the current situation and it's a bad move by SE.

If seven other people want to clear a dungeon they're sick of seeing as fast as possible then I'd let the guy watch his cutscenes if he's adamant about it but I'd merrily press on and kill regardless. S-E gave the players the ability to watch the cutscenes in their inns and ignoring the desires of the majority of the people making it possible for you to clear the dungeon is a bit of a selfish stance. I wouldn't vote kick the cutscene watcher though but I would happily kick a tank or healer white-knighting and holding the rest of the run up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

I wouldn't vote kick the cutscene watcher though but I would happily kick a tank or healer white-knighting and holding the rest of the run up.

---

I thought I'd seen it all, but this ...
So actually wanting to be a decent human being is "white-knighting" now? >.>

Tell you what. If you don't want to risk having to wait for newbies, don't do Main Scenario roulette. You can get that myth faster in Brayflox anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rynia

I thought I'd seen it all, but this ...
So actually wanting to be a decent human being is "white-knighting" now? >.>

---

How is it anything but? You're ignoring the desires of five other people in favour of one person who chooses to watch the cutscenes and hold seven other people up. As a tank or healer you're abusing your key role to force those other five people to wait. That is the definition of harassment right there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

I wouldn't vote kick the cutscene watcher though but I would happily kick a tank or healer white-knighting and holding the rest of the run up.

---

I think that most people will agree that you can run both scenarios perfectly with 7 people and you lose nothing by not being in the fights (as you can run the scenario an unlimited amount of times afterwards), so there's really no reason for someone to hold up the group by waiting, yeah.

When I did the scenarios for the first time the group just rushed forth, and I could enjoy a half-hour long movie with sometimes walking towards the next movie. I didn't mind at all and was glad they torment themselves by waiting for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jars

aren't you doing the same thing?

if people don't wanna wait then why should they have to wait

---

I never said anyone had to wait on me. Just don't get mad at me if you choose to run ahead whilst I'm in the cutscene and things don't go as planned. Doesn't bug me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mellowlicious

When I did the scenarios for the first time the group just rushed forth, and I could enjoy a half-hour long movie with sometimes walking towards the next movie. I didn't mind at all and was glad they torment themselves by waiting for me.

---

Same happened with me. I created my character on a Legacy server to be with friends from FFXI who'd played this game since 1.0. They strong-armed me through all the alliance fights while I slowly chugged along on my PS3 at the time. I felt guilty because the cutscenes took so long to even skip over on that platform but once I discovered I could watch them in my inn I urged them to plow on ahead and lay waste to everything.

I've done all those zones dozens of times since and if it's with friends I'll happily let them watch the cutscenes and have no problem waiting for them but where the roulette is concerned I'm not so inclined to wait while they watch and certainly wouldn't force other people to wait if I was on my Paladin or White Mage.

Other than stronger and more consistently frequent punishments for this kind of behaviour, I'm really not sure what else there is that can be done. Removing the vote kick is simply not an option. Yes, it does a lot of bad. But the good definitely outweighs it in my opinion. I've been kicked a few times for no justifiable reason and it really sucks and makes you feel awful. But I can think of 2-3 times as many examples, maybe more, when the vote kick feature has come to the rescue to help us replace someone who was flat out going to cause the run to be a failure (intentionally I'd like to add.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TeganLaron

Other than stronger and more consistently frequent punishments for this kind of behaviour, I'm really not sure what else there is that can be done. Removing the vote kick is simply not an option. Yes, it does a lot of bad. But the good definitely outweighs it in my opinion. I've been kicked a few times for no justifiable reason and it really sucks and makes you feel awful. But I can think of 2-3 times as many examples, maybe more, when the vote kick feature has come to the rescue to help us replace someone who was flat out going to cause the run to be a failure (intentionally I'd like to add.)

---

They need to make AFK toons in dungeons autolog after 10 minutes, most people can use the bathroom and paper in that span.

If I takes 11 minutes, oh well into every life a little rain must fall, this also applies of course to the people face-palming over their lost speed run.

If people drop intentionally up the penalty to one hour.

I am pretty sure nothing can be arranged to discourage abuse of the vote kick, I would say maybe a week lockout of all party systems and instances.

I only use my PLD powers for good!

If I do ANY dungeon with 8 people and other tank is new, I'll give them hint and tricks and stuff I learned from doing the dungeon. For CM and Prae, I'd let them tank the bosses. Learn by doing, right. If something should happen, I'll be there to literally cover them. Good thing about being a tank, we set the pace. Like others have said, for an 8 man dungeon, unless both tanks or healers are new, you really shouldn't have any issues continuing on with the dungeon. Of course the new person doesn't have a chance to learn the mechanics.

Even if the person is not a tank, I'll still stay by them as they watch CS. It really is not a big deal. If someone watches their cutscenes, AT MOST it adds what, maybe 15 minutes to the dungeon? Boo-friggin-hoo. Happily, I rarely see a vote-kick initiated. When I do, and I don't see any reason as to why, I instantly say "no". Problem with majority rules is that me saying "no" might not be enough to prevent the vote kick or abandon, I hope I don't get added to the list of people being reported.

For 4 mans, I make the group wait. Although, admittedly, there aren't really any CSes for the 4 man dungeons. If the other people wanna rush, I hope they have fun dying. I'll be by the new person explaining mechanics and stuff before we get to that part of the dungeon.

I can not understand why waiting an extra 15 minutes (and I'm being generous) is a "the sky is falling" thing. It's 15 minutes. Get over it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

snip

---

You completely missed my point, which is that as a person who has run the dungeon before, the roulette is not designed to help YOU. It is designed to try and get people running the story dungeons so new people don't get stuck unable to get a group.
I feel like I should mention that my first run of Prae was appalling because of people with your attitude, whinging at me for watching the cutscenes then vote-kicking my friend because she told them to leave me alone. That is the sort of vote-kick abuse that is being talked about in this thread.

I won't argue with you further because this point tends to go round and around with neither side able to see the other's point of view. But honestly, if you don't get the simple point that the roulette was not designed with us vets as a priority then there would be even less point in continuing this conversation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rynia

I thought I'd seen it all, but this ...
So actually wanting to be a decent human being is "white-knighting" now? >.>

Tell you what. If you don't want to risk having to wait for newbies, don't do Main Scenario roulette. You can get that myth faster in Brayflox anyway.

---

Lol "this" is a classic case of reverse psychology, I believe it has also been called the "Lemming syndrome", and probably some less flattering descriptions, go with the flow.

I get the feeling she likes to go with the flow.

Obviously if going with the flow drops all vestiges of integrity, so what?^^

they actually do have that feature to kick an afk automatically, i believe its 15 mins though. i remember the game would log you out after 10 or so mins of inactivity but was removed a couple patches ago. personally i believe duty finder should be for newer people and party finder should be for speedruns/vet groups. i am a firm supporter of the vote kick feature though, way too many "trolls" and dumbasses out there that seen to only join things to be counter productive or in cases like titan hardmode/extreme mode where people will join for a free clear without actually contributing.



tbh nobody knows exactly what SE looks over or disregards, if they're gonna respond to posts about how the pillow minion isnt as plush as it should be then i believe this is just as valid if not more.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nomad-phx

they actually do have that feature to kick an afk automatically, i believe its 15 mins though. i remember the game would log you out after 10 or so mins of inactivity but was removed a couple patches ago. personally i believe duty finder should be for newer people and party finder should be for speedruns/vet groups. i am a firm supporter of the vote kick feature though, way too many "trolls" and dumbasses out there that seen to only join things to be counter productive or in cases like titan hardmode/extreme mode where people will join for a free clear without actually contributing.

---

Bravo, this guy knows what he's doing, great job.

without these Vets he wont be able to do Main Scenario run, so let him skip-CS, respect all the the 6-7 Vets in his party, not waste their time, and help them help him to finsh his first time run by not wasting their time, other wise he will be kicked, 7>1

Quote:

---

without these Vets he wont be able to do Main Scenario run, so let him skip-CS, respect all the the 6-7 Vets in his party, not waste their time, and help them help him to finsh his first time run by not wasting their time, other wise he will be kicked, 7>1

---

What exactly is someone that's most likely in lv 45-50 gear at best going to do to be of any notable help to a bunch of most likely ilv 80-90 dudes that are way more than capable of beating the dungeon without him?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nouran

without these Vets he wont be able to do Main Scenario run, so let him skip-CS, respect all the the 6-7 Vets in his party, not waste their time, and help them help him to finsh his first time run by not wasting their time, other wise he will be kicked, 7>1

---

thats 100% untrue. the game did not not launch with vets and at some point groups had to do everything with no prior knowledge. why should vets get theyre way over newer players? new people pay a subscription just like everyone else and should be treated as equals not deprived of their game experience just so people can save a couple minutes because quite frankly mmos are for people with nothing but extra time lol respect the vets? i say respect anyone trying to enjoy the game :)

Umm, I warned everyone about what would happen if kick was implemented. Been in a hundred mmorpgs. It just gives trolls more ammunition.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nouran

without these Vets he wont be able to do Main Scenario run, so let him skip-CS, respect all the the 6-7 Vets in his party, not waste their time, and help them help him to finsh his first time run by not wasting their time, other wise he will be kicked, 7>1

---

Thats "bullying" and is reportable.

A few days ago, i joined a party as tank for Praetorium. One dps was new and he was watching CS, so "vets" said "nah, let's go without him. we can do this without one dps". I opposed to it, but since Praetorium is doable with one tank, they left me behind too. i always waited for the new player to guide him through the whole dungeon. why? because when the CS is over, he had no idea where to go, there wasn't any monster/soldier, etc... so we had to go through an empty dungeon and sometimes got locked out a battle thanks to the "wall". He could join right at the end,just to get killed by ultima and never get raised... he watched the CS previous to Lahabrea, so the "final boss" was dead before he saw the full cs. Everyone left.

So... a new player (who is was supposed to be helped by vet players doing main story roulette) cleared an empty dungeon (the FINAL dungeon from main story) where he couldn't enjoy any battle/boss battle because some pro players couldn't afford to waste 15 extra minutes in a run.

Great job, guys, i'm very proud of you.

High level players are being paid extra tomes to CARRY newbies through non-endgame anything. Low level players would have a longer wait time otherwise. Endgame players need to grasp this. This isn't exactly rocket science.

Those that fail to realize this shouldn't waste the time of the players who actually need to do the content in question.

Hmmm, intriguing arguement. Yes, we are being paid to carry them. Ergo, we are at their whim. If low level players are being kicked, this being the topic at hand, the roulette is not serving its purpose for low level content and the bonuses should be removed for such content. This is to cater the low level players, not us.

Quote:

---

False. The person holding up the rest of the grp is harassing everyone, and is a perfectly viable reason for them to be kicked.

---

You don't know what harassment is and should probably stop talking about it as if you do

Players are always told to use the DF to enter dungeons for the first time, not the PF. I feel they should be allowed to watch CS if they want to and not be forced to SR. I wish there was a SR option to the DF, tbh. And then SE could disable CS skipping in the DR so that those new to dungeons could get the story mode, relaxed help they need. That would be the point of earning extra tomes from the DR, getting paid to sit through CS (bonus for said new person's map completion too would be nice).

Square Enix didn't wake up one day and decided the roulettes were going to be for "vets" to carry new players through. I'm pretty sure they meant for "vets" to help new players through the dungeon by actually playing together with them, not locking them out of everything for watching cutscenes. By helping them out, they would receive extra rewards.

Of course, selfishness is human nature, it's so hard for them to give, they just like to receive. This wouldn't be a problem if people had humility and more selflesness, but if they are not perfect irl, they won't be in a virtual world.

And yes, if you PF you don't receive the tomes and that's the purpose for roulette. To help new players out, not locking them/kicking them for watching cutscenes. If your purpose is not to help but to beat the dungeon in the least amount of time possible, then you are not really helping the new player, therefore you don't deserve the reward.

It's not a speedrun dungeon, it's a main scenario dungeon. Cutscenes are there for a reason. I think the easiest way to solve this, to much annoyance for everyone, would be making the cutscenes unskippable. Maybe there would be less "vets" doing it because they don't wanna waste their precious time, but the ones really willing to help out new players would not mind and they'd be rewarded with a nice bonus, which they rightfully deserve.

*shrugs*

I have never needed to use the vote kick feature. It's funny, because when I wanted it it would have been great to have. But now that we have it, I haven't had a use for it at all.

I can see how it would be more necessary in 8+ player parties, but has been pretty largely unnecessary in Light Parties in my experience.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Delorean

I have never needed to use the vote kick feature. It's funny, because when I wanted it it would have been great to have. But now that we have it, I haven't had a use for it at all.

---

THAT'S the effect of the vote-kick. Because it exsist - That fact alone - is a threat to the trolls. And that's why they try to stay okay to not be kicked. It's working!

Before the vote-kick, nothing was able to stop them, they had no threats and no reason to restrain themselves. All of you who ask to remove this feature just have no idea what you're asking lol.

There is a reason why every online game on earth allows kicking. And this one shouldn't be different.

i was just talking about offline people, you know, due to the crazy server issues

but ok

i think just this once i had a group that had 2 players in it mouthing off back and forth and i just left the group~ cuz i wasnt gonna watch two people squabble at each other for an entire run.

i've never really had a troll player and i've been capping just about every week the same as anybody else

I really wish a SE dev could get on this thread just to clarify that it is NOT harassment for someone to watch a cutscene, even if 7 others are waiting. Is it inconvenient for those 7? Yes. But harassment is intentionally doing something that is against the ToS that inhibits the enjoyment of the game for others. Watching cutscenes which are part of the game and is considered playing it as intended is not, therefore, harassment - merely an annoyance to those wanting quick myth (in which case why are you even doing a main scenario roulette if you just want to myth farm...). Also, watching cutscenes is being 'afk' just because they don't answer? Really? What if they read slowly or just don't want to interrupt their story to answer some impatient people. What I think should happen is all the people who are saying it IS harassment -- go join a Prae run, get new players in it, announce to everyone that watching cutscenes is harassment because it wastes your precious time, then be the initiator (not just a voter) of a vote kick for the new players.... Get back to us later and let us know if you don't get banned in the meantime ^^

Strangely enough, and not to go 'white-knighting' the JPN, but I've played on JPN servers doing CM and Prae runs, and not once have I seen a vote kick during them. If anything, everyone just stands around talking while the cutscene watcher finishes. Usually they don't even fill up the chat logs, I believe because it would be impolite to the watcher (I speak Japanese and that's at least what I've deduced). Most US parties I've been in have at least been cordial, but every now and then we get the kinds of people some of which we see in this post... *sigh*

The vote kick system is needed, but shouldn't be allowed to be used until all party members have wipe.

I've been in tons of instances of Praetorium or CM and if someone is new and wants to watch the cutscenes as the tank I always wait for them. I will even lock myself out of the fight, and have multiple times just to get my point across.

If ANYONE gives me shit, I tell them the reason they're here to begin with... that's to get rewarded for helping players trying to clear the Story Mode dungeons.

This is someone's FIRST time in the duty, I remember my first time in Praetorium, the other tank told me to not skip the cutscenes and to watch all of them, and he had the entire party wait for me to finish even though I was not needed at all in any way. I will never forget his kind gesture, and I vowed to always do the same in the future.

I remember one instance where a Dragoon kept complaining, I told him that you're here to help new players complete the dungeon, if there aren't any new players, speed run all you want, I'm all for it, but if there's someone that wants to watch the cutscenes, then you're here to help THEM, and if you don't like it, then leave the party. Needless to say, the Dragoon did actually leave the party, and was promptly reported after the instance, to which a GM actually contacted me about and was glad to hear that I was helping out and supporting new players in the game.

If you agree with kicking someone out for watching cutscenes in a STORY MODE roulette, I can only wish that you were to get banned from the game, as your kind aren't wanted here. Go get your 80 myth tomes somewhere else.

Anyone playing FFXI or FFXIV knows that they are part of the Final Fantasy series. Final Fantasy games are JRPGs, and thus the focus for these games is on storytelling. If you're playing this game and have no interest in experiencing the story, it's pretty much a mystery why you're playing at all. There are other, far less story-focused MMOs out there, very likely with much better endgame, battle mechanics, PVP, etc etc since the development focus will be on those aspects rather than story.

I think we can agree that at least the majority of folks that play FFXIV have an interest in the storyline. CM and Praetorium's cutscenes, boss battles, and even aspects of the trash-clearing (for example, the armor ride) are all part of an overall narrative. In the cutscenes, you learn WHY you're messing with spotlights, and WHY you're fighting such-and-such boss. Skipping them interrupts the narrative flow - even watching them later in the inn doesn't fix this. It's like reading the even-numbered pages of a book first, and then reading the odd-numbered pages later.

SE's heart was in the right place, but this wound up being a terrible, terrible design decision. They wanted an epic, story-rich final confrontation with the Garlian Empire, with a full party to handle greater challenges. They also wanted to ensure that these newbies would always have help available, and so made these dungeons a great source of Philosophy tomestones (later, Mythology). They learned well from FFXI that it is VERY hard to get folks to help out with older content unless there's a significant reward involved, so it was the right decision to make - even helpful folks will tire of repeating it after a while.

While it did work, and newbies can still find ready help with old content, SE made CM and Praetorium maybe a little TOO valuable a source of tomestones. As with all grinds, folks immediately went to work perfecting ways to make the grind more efficient. Skippable cutscenes in a grind dungeon? By far the most obvious corner that can be cut!

It is absolutely laughable to think that ANY representative from SE would ever consider a player, on their first time through the dungeon experiencing the content for the first time, to be "harrassing" the other players by wanting to see the story. To use the kick function in such a way is a clear abuse. That said, it is understandable why folks trying to grind the dungeon would be disgruntled by having to wait.

Fortunately, that SHOULD no longer be an issue. Brayflox Hard is a more efficient way to grind Myth. You can get 150 Myth pretty easily in the same time that you could complete a single Main Scenario Roulette. This means that anyone truly interested in speedy acquisition of Mythology tomestones will be doing that instead. Anyone signing up for Main Scenario Roulette is doing it either specifically to help newbies, or for a change of pace from the Brayflox grind. The former should be more than happy to let newbies watch cutscenes, and the latter is already accepting a slower pace than they could be getting, so why should they complain? (There's probably a third category - vets who were forced to skip before, who want to see the story done the right way.)

At any rate, things should be improving. If they're not, maybe it'd be best for SE to make the cutscenes in that dungeon unskippable (or, at least, make the bosses inaccessable as long as anyone is still in cutscene) and to boost the reward to encourage folks to continue to assist. It's frankly obvious that SE WANTS players to watch the cutscenes, at least once, or they wouldn't be there in the first place!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LineageRazor

Anyone playing FFXI or FFXIV knows that they are part of the Final Fantasy series. Final Fantasy games are JRPGs, and thus the focus for these games is on storytelling. If you're playing this game and have no interest in experiencing the story, it's pretty much a mystery why you're playing at all. There are other, far less story-focused MMOs out there, very likely with much better endgame, battle mechanics, PVP, etc etc since the development focus will be on those aspects rather than story.

---

Many of us, of course, wish to enjoy the storyline. That doesn't mean the storyline should be intrusive or repetitive. Once you have watched it once, you are ESC'ing out of it every time it plays again. This is why I still believe that the storyline should be a HUGE part of the game experience, but it shouldbe OUTSIDE the randomly matched group content such as Duty Finder dungeons.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rynia

I won't argue with you further because this point tends to go round and around with neither side able to see the other's point of view. But honestly, if you don't get the simple point that the roulette was not designed with us vets as a priority then there would be even less point in continuing this conversation.

---

I wasn't aware we were arguing. I believed I was having a rational discussion with another adult but I clearly appear to have been mistaken.

Also, where do you derive this wholly incorrect belief the roulette is only there to help new players?

Lifted straight from here.

Quote:

---

The Duty Roulette allows players to enter instanced dungeons, trials, and guildhests at random. There are four roulette categories, each of which can be selected once per day.
In return for selecting a duty at random, players will receive enhanced rewards, including experience points, company seals, gil, and Allagan tomestones.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VesperValveto

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man



Incorrect; He is most certainly the one harassing the rest of the grp (if it wasn't, then the kick wouldn't get the required votes to go through. The vets are not the ones who should be doing PF, because PF will not give the 100 tomes. And the vets most certainly did help him, because he got completion for the quest and could move on. If he was sooo concerned with seeing the CSs, he can go into the inn and watch them, or make a grp himself to see it.

Also, everything you said can be used to bolster my argument, so it's moot.

---

...What is wrong with you lol? Jesus, go back under the bridge troll. All you're doing is spewing nonsense
and trying your best to make like you seem right, but sadly, you aren't. Sorry.
Seriously, we need to weed out nasty players like you and others who think we should all
bend backwards to play the game how YOU want it.
The guy didn't finish, if you read, he got kicked out before then. Sad day.
Thank god I'm not on your server or DataCenter. I'd just kick you out based on your forum posted
and I can already assume you'd be a handful in the party.

I'm going to reuse something i just posted within another topic about crystal tower to prove how bad this community is when useing this system.

I had a rather annoying run one time, i was the main tank of my group and we had done very well throughout the entire run, finished off the Vassago encounter and suddenly i was met by hostile remarks from a whitemage who had replaced another healer prior to the vassago engagement, his remarks were towards me not pulling the vassago out of the fire he places upon the ground for the dps, despite me having moved him over to the side of it so our only melee dps (A dragoon.) was able to hit him, shortly after as we raced up to Behe his slander continued and of course i retaliated when i was dismissed from the duty upon doing so. I found this rather frustating as of course i had more than pulled my weight throughout the entire encounter only to be kicked shortly before the end.

Total abuse of the system.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

Also, where do you derive this wholly incorrect belief the roulette is only there to help new players?

---

It is pretty much the only answer that make any sense, and it DOES make a LOT of sense.

If you've played any MMO with low- or mid-level content that requires a group to complete, you know quite well that after the initial rush to clear that content, it becomes harder and harder for new or lagging players to put together a group to complete it later. Thus, there is value in encouraging veteran players to sign up to re-clear older content.

If the goal was simply to award extra rewards for doing a dungeon once per day, why make it random? Why not have a once-a-day reward for clearing a dungeon of your choice? That would be FAR more popular, as folks would be able to pick the speediest dungeon each time. Instead, they made it random so that you would be teamed up with players who desire or need that content.

Whether SE spelled it out explicitly or not, it's not hard to read between the lines. Anyone who thinks SE added Roulette simply to give players a new way to obtain Tomestones is fooling themselves. They added it to ensure that no matter how the game ages, there will always be people available to help new players complete old content. It's a marvelous idea but, as noted in the CM and Praetorium examples, it needs some polish.

i have to disagree for players that want to enjoy the game not skip through everything its not entirely fun sure things are longer but thats what makes it fun i mean i share my opinion of them being a little to long but its more fun if you know the story behind it. i honestly say that people tend to rush to much and dont seem to look at the present to see that we can be doing right now as friends but i gotta say people who are trying to rush through the lower level dungeons and try to rush through it and not let the tnak get aggro before they attack completely sucks. but anyways i think it would be good if we kept the vote kick for these specific reasons.

That's no good.
I know sometimes I have something going on and will let a cutscene roll until I'm not afk. I would hate to be kicked while doing that