SMN DPS: Pushing it to the limit

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

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These are 3 of the worst "advice" posts for any job I've ever seen, especially SMN. All of it is wrong, except for "Your gear makes your pet." which is only partly correct. If this thread were about minimizing SMN dps while still pressing buttons, this would be how to do it.

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

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No....no...no...no.

This guy is giving you advice to be a SMN nobody wants.

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

Hay now! some fights just are worth DOT's You get more Damage in with a 5 or 6 Ruin II fight. some fights are over when you finish your DOT's. and if you hind sight it you contributed very little damage in a short fight. review your battle tab just to see what you did.

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Okay, I'm not even a SMN main, and yet I have to correct you, because misinformation of this magnitude shouldn't be allowed to stand.

First off, if a fight lasts 6 seconds, Bio is a better spell to cast first than Ruin II. At 6 seconds, assuming the worst possible timing on dot ticks, they've done the same 80 potency damage, and Bio is a cheaper spell. Heck, Miasma is even better, because it's more damage. Between 6 seconds and 11 seconds, you start looking at a Miasma -> Bio opener. Around 13 seconds and beyond, you go into the normal Bio II -> Miasma -> Bio rotation. That's just over 5 GCDs. So if you have time to do 5 Ruin II casts, you should have started with your dots. And that's assuming you don't Bane. More on Bane later.

Also, you say to check the battle tab to see what you did. . .The Battle tab doesn't reflect dot damage, so checking the battle tab is useless for a SMN.

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

I have found Bane & Fester to useless at 50th lv, what I found very useful is Energy Drain as a Cannon. It is 150 Potency, with the Restores MP ability. I have also put into Macros (Bio; Miasma; Bio II) This is because Bio is a mobile spell. This way I'm only stuck in 1 place for 5 seconds. My roll changes by the needs of the party.

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Bane and Fester useless? Seriously? Bane almost single-handedly keeps SMN ahead of BLM when it comes to AOE up to 4 targets. How can you possibly say it's useless when it outpaces the "kings of AOE"? And Fester is a 300 potency attack off the global cooldown. I shouldn't even have to explain why that's awesome, but I guess you probably never noticed if you aren't using dots. Seriously, why aren't you using dots all the time? Energy Drain is only really good for a SMN who's somehow MP starved himself, which shouldn't be happening. If you still have more than enough MP to make it to your next Aetherflow CD, there's absolutely no reason to use ED over Fester.

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

Don't call Titan Egi a Tank; it is a heavy AOE dealer. You may say its only 70 Potency every 15 seconds, But it is adding 70 Potency plus holding all adds in a 5y area, which is important do to 2 of your 4 AOE's are zero range (Miasma II & blizzard II),

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That. . .that's the tank's job. That's why Titan Egi is a tank. It's only going to hold those targets into a small area if your tank is either already doing that or is just incapable of AOE threat generation (or you're playing solo, in which case you're right to be using a tank egi). And someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I didn't think SMN even used Bliz II if they could help it.

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

while Bane may seem to be an AOE, it only targets a randomly +3 targets. In a party with a large pull I spam the Tri-Disaster, It maybe only 30 potency, but in support of Titans & the parties AOE's it dose plenty damage. Just remember to use Energy Drain to minimize MG loss. While Virus cool down is bad, I use macros; Ruose and Spur and Virus, to make Virus useable.

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If you only Baned Bio (our weakest dot aside from Miasma II), it would be approximately 720 potency. You'd have to hit 19 targets with Tri-Disaster and Energy Drain once just to equal a Baned Bio. If you Baned Miasma, it would be 840 potency. That's 23 targets and ED. Bio II is 1050 potency, or 30 targets and ED. Where are you finding all these targets to hit at the same time with Tri-Disaster? And the numbers I quote above aren't even counting the damage done to the original target you Bane *from*, which just puts Tri-Disaster even further behind.

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

Please don't forget about your gear. Your gear makes your pet.

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Right, right. . .

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

You have a sorry pet with Black mage gear on. Alter your gear to your play style.
The ilvl 100 Accessories for summoned is just no good for your pets.

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. . .what?

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

I’m using +10 Vit Rosegold HQ. with melds. My Egi Titans hp = 9.6k. not finished yet.

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I mean, if that's what you want to do when you solo, I guess. . .

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

Tell the tank about Egi Titans AOE ability. And it’s not for the full fight. I switch Egi Garuda and Egi Titan often.

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. . .wait, you're doing this in parties? Why would I take you in a party when I could get an actual DPS who'd make the fight go faster and put less strain on the tank and healer?

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

Come on dose it do any good at all to put DOT’s on a group of targets. Bane is good verse 2 or 3 targets.
But it is waste of time ageist a pull. Put Shadow Flare so tank see’s the area you are controlling,
Then get in for Miasma II & Blizzard II. Then pull out for 20 to 30 seconds of Tri-Disaster and a hit 1 or 2 of Energy Drain. Start over again with Shadow Flare. Remember it’s not just you doing AOE’s.

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Yes, yes it does do a lot of good. See the numbers above about how much damage Bane actually does versus how much Tri-Disaster does. At least your comments about Shadow Flare and Miasma II are right, but you really really need to lay off on the whole Tri-Disaster thing.

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

Try using Energy Drain as a weapon, every time your MG drops 1/4.
Use Energy Drain 1 or 2 times.

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Do you mean every time it drops by 1/4, or to 1/4? I mean, either way is probably wrong, because 700+ MP is still a bit to work with and might last you until Aetherflow comes off CD. Unless you're spamming that 200+ MP move that no one uses because it's nearly worthless. By which I mean Tri-Disaster. Maybe if you used your MP anywhere near efficiently (and had an actual DPS pet out, not the tank pet), you wouldn't ever have to ED and could Fester instead. Just a thought, though. Wouldn't want one of the top DPS classes doing good DPS.

A study in how not to play a SMN, by whoisthekiller.

I believe (hope) you're getting trolled.

Well...reading whoisthekiller's advice certainly opened my eyes.
To all new and improving summoners, do the exact opposite of whoisthekiller and you will be an asset to any party.

To whoisthekiller, may I never, ever, ever have you in my parties.

I got a SMN using Ifrit in Mog Ex with Sic stance, may be it's him :x

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Originally Posted by whoisthekiller

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This guy....is an epic fail summoner, my brain explode just by reading his post....

speaking of SMN DPS, our Turn8 kill last night. 384 dps (me+pet)



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3gBFnpjzDU

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Originally Posted by Samano

speaking of SMN DPS, our Turn8 kill last night. 384 dps (me+pet)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3gBFnpjzDU

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I took one look at the video and saw you start casting Miasma as your first spell.... then I decided to stop watching.

lol because casting bio2 first on an opening rotation make such a big difference right? dont give me that shit, that's an idiotic line of reasoning

Since the original thread was created last year, can someone post an updated general rotation which includes Garudas obey commands mixed into the rotation if possible? Or direct to a link.

Much appreciated

Without contagion, I feel that I have an easier time bouncing miasma/bio + bio2/bio refreshes if I cast miasma first on my initial rotation, letting me move more and cast more ruins. Yes, for the big raging strikes combo bio2 should open. So many end game fights have a ton of movement 'jumping' phases (like titan and levi) and I often am more concerned with getting the heck out of the way and getting contagion off on anything before the phase change...

My personal perfect rotation - I try to get 3 festers off under raging strikes. I also macro Fester and Ruin2 together to spam to get as much as I can out of each GCD.
With dots already up...
RS / Fester >
Bio2 >
Miasma >
Bio >
Contagion (mia2 during contag cast delay if possible) >
Ruin2/Fester spam ((10 second mark)) >
Swiftcast/shadowflare >
Ruin x1-2 >
Ruin2/Fester spam (20 second mark -RS is done)

Interesting way to use Fester there

Did you compare both normal RS then 3 DOT then Fester until out of Aether vs Put up 3 DOT first then RS then Fester until out of Aether?

I curious if your method did more dmg

EDIT

Done test it, its impossible

Raging Strike is 20 sec duration, Fester is 10 sec cooldown

Even I did it perfect RS and immediate Fester while 3 DOTs is up, its delay like 0.5-1 sec (Server delay forcement) RS will down to 18-19 sec duration already then my 2nd fastest Fester is at RS 9 sec and then RS wear off already when 3rd Fester is up.

No way we can do 3 Fester in 1 RS because Server will force to delay at earliest 0.3 sec, can't bypass this 0.3 sec delay even you have NASA internet.

If it's a mid-fight burn phase, I should have dots up already. I would not ever advise taking time to cast weaker dots if your goal is to get damage on the target fast.

I'm curious about LB mechanics. Can we help speed up LB gain by casting shadowflare?