Do you respect or awed by level 50? No?

Would everyone be okay with just t-shirts and jeans that say "PLD" and "WHM" and the like? Perhaps we can fight with index cards while we are at it!

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Originally Posted by HumsterMKX

Whao... you must live in.

1) A great place/town/city/country

2) You living alone for too long.

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You may want to place a service call in on that sarcasm detector of your's.

The fact that some people here really feel that gear and level in a video game should inspire some sort of "awe" among people who haven't reached that tier outlines exactly what is wrong with current MMO culture.

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

The fact that some people here really feel that gear and level in a video game should inspire some sort of "awe" among people who haven't reached that tier outlines exactly what is wrong with current MMO culture.

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Mhm ! But I still dont respect people I do t know ;o

It needs to be scalable... so auras are not a great idea- as the game scales, starting at 90 everyone will have some kind of perpetual flashy effect- that will get old and overdone quickly.

I like the idea of magic looking different, but because of the way the game is designed, they probably wouldn't see it. Since the game is kind of a lobby game at high end...

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

The fact that some people here really feel that gear and level in a video game should inspire some sort of "awe" among people who haven't reached that tier outlines exactly what is wrong with current MMO culture.

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Exactly, we should all be as one amorphous blob of "meh" about each other. armor designs? bah! customization? Humbug! The nail that sticks up will be struck down! We should all be embedded in the wood, wholly separated and not giving a wit about each other. /sarcasm

In FFXI, everybody is beating Maat. Beating Maat doesn't mean you're elite, just that you know a bit how to play your job and to prepare. Like everybody else.
Having a good equipment in FFXI doesn't mean you are elite. Just that you are super lucky on the drop and the roll against all your "friends" from you HLS.

Nothing about this game gives you a sense of accomplishment. There are 50 other people, same class, same gear, same everything as you in toll at all times. This is why people have to cry "SERVER 9th TURN 3!" any chance they get.

It's very fast to hit level cap. But if they made it more time consuming, people would bitch.

FFXI story inc...
I remember a LS popping up on my server around 2004/2005 that was so hardcore you needed 2 level 75 jobs to join. That was some serious shit back then. It took the average person 6m-1yr to get a 75.

I remember being around level 20 and seeing a level 50. He was in his republic yada yada gear. I wanted to look that cool. This dude I was looking at hadn't even hit his AF gear, but I had no idea what that was.

Sorry for nostalgia of a (way) better time.

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Originally Posted by Blazer

Nothing about this game gives you a sense of accomplishment. There are 50 other people, same class, same gear, same everything as you in toll at all times. This is why people have to cry "SERVER 9th TURN 3!" any chance they get.

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I love this quote, it's so true. People yell about this stuff like anyone cares. It's just as sad as the people standing in Toll with weapons out or on mounts... no one cares- they aren't special... a lot of people have those items in their bags or mounts they don't use. People are desperate to feel special in a game full of homogenized blandness.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

Exactly, we should all be as one amorphous blob of "meh" about each other. armor designs? bah! customization? Humbug!

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Not at all what I'm saying. Customization is one thing. Wanting to feel so powerful in your digital pixels that you expect other people to bow down to your mmo supremacy is something else. I'd love to dye my allagan armor. I don't need it to give off an aura or come with a message saying "this pleb rose from the ranks of common scum to become a supreme god of eorzea by running a raid for 5 months before the RNG blessed him with this armor. Bow down, mortal."


Furthermore, the real question that begs to be asked is: Why do you need to feel special?

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Originally Posted by XNihili

In FFXI, everybody is beating Maat. Beating Maat doesn't mean you're elite, just that you know a bit how to play your job and to prepare. Like everybody else.
Having a good equipment in FFXI doesn't mean you are elite. Just that you are super lucky on the drop and the roll against all your "friends" from you HLS.

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Not trying to derail the thread (based on my post above this). But it wasn't as simple as hitting a queue button and doing a dungeon to be able to roll against someone. There's a reason only a handful of LS's were even in something like SEA let alone getting drops 1-2 years after CoP came out. There was a big "elite/elitest" player base in FFXI, trust me.

I'm okay with seeing someone with some cool piece of gear that might even glow a little and be like "hey that's cool, wonder where they got that".

When someone just stands there in battle stance with glowies everywhere that's obviously just for the heck of it or to show off...I will just walk away. ^^

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

Furthermore, the real question that begs to be asked is: Why do you need to feel special?

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why do you feel the need to dye your gear? It'll only be vendor trash in 3-6 months.

As I said, would you be fine with your allagan gear not being elaborately designed, but looking like a curiass/tin can?

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Originally Posted by Kallera

why do you feel the need to dye your gear? It'll only be vendor trash in 3-6 months.

As I said, would you be fine with your allagan gear not being elaborately designed, but looking like a curiass/tin can?

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Allagan IS ugly. The shield is ... okay... but most of the armor, imo looks like starter gear in other games. Boooring.

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Originally Posted by Blazer

Not trying to derail the thread (based on my post above this). But it wasn't as simple as hitting a queue button and doing a dungeon to be able to roll against someone. There's a reason only a handful of LS's were even in something like SEA let alone getting drops 1-2 years after CoP came out. There was a big "elite/elitest" player base in FFXI, trust me.

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Even my little LS managged to do the big stuff (except training Darter for MPK the other HLS) and we were not elite.
We didn't feel elite and didn't expect to command awe and fear to newbies.
Sure we felt more fulfillment but nothing else.

EDIT: equipment and level don't matter and should not. Deeds do.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

why do you feel the need to dye your gear? It'll only be vendor trash in 3-6 months.

As I said, would you be fine with your allagan gear not being elaborately designed, but looking like a curiass/tin can?

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Or vanity, why are we wasting time on it?

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Originally Posted by Kallera

why do you feel the need to dye your gear? It'll only be vendor trash in 3-6 months.

As I said, would you be fine with your allagan gear not being elaborately designed, but looking like a curiass/tin can?

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Do you really think people take you more seriously when you coach just about every single argument in hyperbole? Or do you actually view the world in those extremes?

On topic, the look of armor is fairly unimportant to me. XI had some of the most god awful, and ugly armor designs but I still wore them. Function over fashion as far as I am concerned. Given options, I'll tailor an outfit with dyes, but it's hardly something I need to feel better about myself.

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Originally Posted by ApolloGenX

Allagan IS ugly. The shield is ... okay... but most of the armor, imo looks like starter gear in other games. Boooring.

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Well, he feels the need to add color to his ugly. He wants to look different, huh? perhaps he is the one suffering, that needs to measure his epeen.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

Well, he feels the need to add color to his ugly. He wants to look different, huh? perhaps he is the one suffering, that needs to measure his epeen.

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How do you not see the difference between dying gear and needed to feel love and respect from lower levels because of the gear you've received?

But to answer your question: I'd like to dye my allagan because I have to look at it everyday. It would have nothing at all to do with other players and everything to do with me having to look at my own gear for 99% of my time in game.

Same reason people use the in game barber.

Not sure how dying ones gear means one has to measure epeen. Its not like anyone is dying it with their current dps averages...

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Originally Posted by ApolloGenX

I love this quote, it's so true. People yell about this stuff like anyone cares. It's just as sad as the people standing in Toll with weapons out or on mounts... no one cares- they aren't special... a lot of people have those items in their bags or mounts they don't use. People are desperate to feel special in a game full of homogenized blandness.

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so just because I like my behemoth mount and not everyone uses it... when i stand around in toll LFG on my behemoth, I'm trying to feel special?

I could honestly care less what people think. I think it looks awesome. I also happen to think that my Relics look cool too, so I run around with them. Im not so naive to think that I am original, but its what I like so thats what I use.

your comment is a sweeping generalization.

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Originally Posted by Lord_Zlatan

so just because I like my behemoth mount and not everyone uses it... when i stand around in toll LFG on my behemoth, I'm trying to feel special?

I could honestly care less what people think. I think it looks awesome. I also happen to think that my Relics look cool too, so I run around with them. Im not so naive to think that I am original, but its what I like so thats what I use.

your comment is a sweeping generalization.

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Yes it is. My comment is a sweeping generalization. I am sure there are different reasons for sitting in Toll on an annoyingly large mount or running around with your weapon unsheathed. I am sure visual pleasure is one reason among many.

In general, I try to avoid toll because it is full of people looking for attention, stupid chat, or generally annoying players with giant mounts in densely populated areas.

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

How do you not see the difference between dying gear and needed to feel love and respect from lower levels because of the gear you've received?

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I had a joy for making my own gear, editing my own stats. They weren't even that shiny! But that had to be watered down and moved aside because no one would get the precious allagan gear. My own interests for the game were deemed "Special snowflake syndrome" and other such nonsense that just couldn't be bothered in a triple A MMO.

So no, I don't have much interest in entertaining your request to dye your allagan gear. Keep your brown and like it with everyone else.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

I had a joy for making my own gear, editing my own stats. They weren't even that shiny! But that had to be watered down and moved aside because no one would get the precious allagan gear. My own interests for the game were deemed "Special snowflake syndrome" and other such nonsense that just couldn't be bothered in a triple A MMO.

So no, I don't have much interest in entertaining your request to dye your allagan gear. Keep your brown and like it with everyone else.

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just... huh? how did we get from a "gear/level should inspire awe in lower level players" discussion to "i'm pissed because crafted gear isn't as good as end game raid gear". Isn't that a different thread?

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

just... huh? how did we get from a "gear/level should inspire awe in lower level players" discussion to "i'm pissed because crafted gear isn't as good as end game raid gear". Isn't that a different thread?

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No, not really. You want a different look, same as I do. I can't have mine, so I don't care about getting yours.

Not as if you cared about anyone really. So why should I agree with you?

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Originally Posted by Kallera

No, not really. You want a different look, same as I do. I can't have mine, so I don't care about getting yours.

Not as if you cared about anyone really. So why should I agree with you?

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You're right. When I said "the idea that people think other players should be in awe of end game gear/levels is exactly whats wrong with mmo culture" I was really saying "I don't care about anyone else. You should agree with me"

You are absolutely right. /sarcasmextreme

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Originally Posted by ApolloGenX

Yes it is. My comment is a sweeping generalization. I am sure there are different reasons for sitting in Toll on an annoyingly large mount or running around with your weapon unsheathed. I am sure visual pleasure is one reason among many.

In general, I try to avoid toll because it is full of people looking for attention, stupid chat, or generally annoying players with giant mounts in densely populated areas.

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well i rarely go there either. most of my group content comes from FC or DF, id rather not try to meet MD or PF expectations. I just don't think its fair to make a sweeping generalization that puts a negative light on people that are simply enjoying features of the game.

on topic... if someone jizzes themselves because of my awesome mount while I'm riding from horizon to vesper bay, good for them, i could really care less.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

No, not really. You want a different look, same as I do. I can't have mine, so I don't care about getting yours.

Not as if you cared about anyone really. So why should I agree with you?

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I think you're having a completely different argument than everyone else.

The topic at hand is "are you awed by lvl 50s? No?" You seem to be talking about character customization, which I think everyone would agree "the more the better" but what the OP and this thread seem to be on about, and opinion seems to be very divided about is "should people give a crap that you did something that was inevitable but may vary on when an indavidual may accomplish it"... I guess you can tease out my feeling on that.


Edit: I guess a real world example might be in order...

Popular (teen) media in the US would have us believe that all Freshman are in awe or fear of Seniors while they are attending High School... When I was a high school freshman I did not nor did not know anyone who gave a crap about " OMG Seniors". When I was a high school Senior the only people I knew who gave a crap about being a Senior or about rubbing it in the freshmens' faces were the people who peaked in high school.

I was only awed by max level people when I started FFXI because the Japanese had a whole year head start on me. That quickly wore off when I reached max level myself.

Sword Art Online was about an mmo game? oh maybe at first :P stick with hack anyway as a lvl 50 why do you need ppl to look up to us? {not like geting to 50 is very hard} and you want to glow at 60 lol how bout at least wait to 70 as i'm sure once 60 comes ppl will glow so much you may think your in a city :P

I respect people with twin wins. Then when they act like a d-bag to other people because they need to be a snowflake, I pretend my lala is giving them a cleveland steamer. As a former end game min/maxer and end game runner, I have tons of respect for Blue Gartr. They beat twin pre-nerf and since everyone else cried foul, they cheapened twin. Still respect post nerf. But I hate elitist that think too highly of themselves and feel the need to be superior. Especially post nerf.

considering im working on my 5th lvl 50 and most of my friends have at least 3 if not more, id have to say no, being lvl 50 does not impress me at all

I would hate having Maat back. Even though I completed the trials to raise the cap to level 75 ( I quit before the cap raised to 99), I still don't want to do it again.

I am more awed and inspired by people with nice looking gear sets. Most of which are lv 50 pr beyond. As a new lv. 50 whm its nice that I can have similar gear as the padjals. Minus that leaf thing

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Originally Posted by Devilray

And to address further opinions about this matter, have you guys seen the anime .hack //sign, Sword Art Online, Log Horizon, etc... All of them are about MMO worlds where the high-level characters were sought after and respected the most. Just more evidence that FFXIV ARR is kind of going against the trend. High levels are supposed to be adored and respected, but there is honestly no reason to bat an eye at them in ARR.

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I promise you, if we ever get sucked into the world of Ezorea and physically trapped within our characters, we will all start respecting the hell out of iLevel 90s.

. . . Hey, it'd probably also fix the market!

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Originally Posted by Hycinthus

Bring back the respect from new players to players at max levels by these easy steps: snip

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Disgusting ideas.

If you need this kind of thing out of a video game you have some serious issues in your real life. Literally one of the worst forum posts I have ever seen.

Considering there are much more difficult video games where people actually compete against human players, no, I'm not going to look at someone who plays an MMO where he battles AI monsters with the help of a bunch of other players with much awe and respect no matter how much gear and levels he has. That's completely ignoring the fact that there are much more impressive hobbies one could participate in that aren't video games. In terms of difficult feats worthy of respect, I'd place Kobayashi eating a boatload of hotdogs infinitely higher than anything you could do in a PvE MMO.

Want people to respect you in game? Show that you're a person who possesses personal values worthy of respect. Be nice, competent, and helpful. Don't treat people as tools needed to obtain virtual gear, but as fellow human beings. These types of things are the ONLY things worthy of respect in game. Not your stupid achievements, levels, and gear. The only people who care about that crap are pathetic man-children. Not really the type of people who's opinions you should value.

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Originally Posted by Hycinthus

Neither do I.
Bring back the respect from new players to players at max levels by these easy steps:
1. When level cap is increased, bring back Maat fight system.
This means putting each player in a solo battle against Maat. Make this fight super hard, only 50% of players succeeds. This way, not everyone will be level 60 & you know those who made it are high in skills.

Even idiots got past maat.

2. Introduce hard monsters in low level areas.
This way, sometimes low level players will require the help of high level to clear the way. For example suddenly an NM attacks a town. This will bring awe to high level players.
Remember bogy in qufim in FFXI.

Not really, savvy folk would just stay out of the way. ffxiv mobs aren't exactly hard to get around. I do wish some mobs weren't as leashed though.

3. Introduce unique skills like Raise 3 for those high levels.
Although not applicable in FF14, something unique or cool looking magic will inspire awe to the low level ppl.

I'm still seeing Holies, Flare, and the occasional burning arrow in town, so I'd say this is already put in.
4. Make high levels glow with useful auras.
Level 60 can walk around with a shiny aura that will dispel certain effects, or increased protection by administering Protect 5.

That affects game balance, which is a nono. high lvl spells and abilities are one thing, inherent buffs from simply leveling any class are another.

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responses in red.

I remember the fight time I was impressed by a dude in a MMO. I was getting advice on how to play the game from a lvl 46 SK, it seemed so far away, but the important part was he explained to me what DOTs were and that I couldn't just sit them out. Ended up saving me a trip back to home point. thing was I couldn't see his gear, graphic card screw up made him look like a lizard in a black bodysuit,but I was grateful all the same. (Don't ask what the elves looked like...)

I admit I'm a little bitter about the endgame in ffxiv, but that's neither here nor there. There is nothing keeping a high lvl player from "thank you"s, happy emotes, and friendlist additions other than their ability to help others. That's what causes respect.

I wouldn't mind a battle like titan but as a solo encounter. Something that would be require very tight skill check that only skilled players would pass while the rest beat their head against it for weeks/months. The actual fight would have to be much harder then titan because the hardest part of titan is getting 7 other people to not screw up (if titan was a solo battle it would actually be very easy).

WHy should I respect some level 50 ive never met personally? Am I awed by them? Nope. And its not the games fault.

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Originally Posted by MomoOG

I wouldn't mind a battle like titan but as a solo encounter. Something that would be require very tight skill check that only skilled players would pass while the rest beat their head against it for weeks/months. The actual fight would have to be much harder then titan because the hardest part of titan is getting 7 other people to not screw up (if titan was a solo battle it would actually be very easy).

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Reminds me of the RDM/NIN fights