Be nice.. please.. or just use common sense.

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Originally Posted by Kat_Manx

I've been told "this is basic MMO knowledge" and have tanks and healers ragequit. Oh really? Well no MMO I ever played before ever had this. In fact, the last MMO I played had LVL1 bees right outside of the newbie zones. Easiest things to kill in the entire game. Heck, what if I have never played an MMO before? I fail to remember when I checked the "Yes, I have played another MMO before"-box while signing up to FFXIV.

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^This. This. This.

Scenario A.)
-Spend 15 minutes to get to first boss.
-Wipe.
-Leave group, take 15 minute queue penalty.
-Requeue
-Spend 15 minutes to get to first boss.
-Spend 25-30 minutes to complete dungeon.

1 dungeon run = 65-70 minutes.

Scenario B.)
-Spend 15 minutes to get to first boss.
-Wipe
-2 minutes to explain fight.
-Win
-Spend another 25-30 minutes to complete dungeon.

1 dungeon run = 42-47 minutes AND someone else now knows how to do dungeon.

Granted, times may vary depending on the group, but you get the jist of it. Take 2 minutes to explain the damn fights. Even if you wiped 3 more times on scenario A, it still takes less time.

Also, if you are going to have the attitude of "1 wipe and I'm out", then have fun with the possibility of doing this 2-5 times and taking 5 hours to do ONE dungeon. :confused:

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Originally Posted by Hexy

1) Get out of stupid. This includes anything bad dropped on the ground.

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Around my parts, we refer to these as "RED CIRCLES OF GTFO"

Yeah, I do read guides now beforehand, heh. Sometimes it's just really hard to understand the explanation before you actually see the fight though, you know? Also... well, it is smart of people to read up beforehand. But technically, it shouldn't be forced upon you. The game is about adventuring, and finding out things. Someone had to find out how to beat that fight the first time. I kind of envy those people, because all others after them require to have a guide open next to them or basically be labeled as noobs. While someone running the duty with you explaining it to you is kind of just like..sharing information they learned during their experience, and I listen to the wise ones. :3 You know? Ah well. /smiles

I always explain boss encounters to new players. Hell, I spent most of yesterday joining session in progress as WHM in Amdapor Keep just so I can help groups that were abandoned by some impatient healer.

There were a lot of undergeared players there for the first time so I pushed them through to the end everytime even if I had to tank half the dungeon. I also gave pointers on how they can upgrade their gear to make their future runs smoother.

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

Around my parts, we refer to these as "RED CIRCLES OF GTFO"

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Lol nice. My MMO of choice before FFXIV was WoW (sad, I know) and whenever I tanked in raids (bear druid) I always referred to anything bad on the ground as "stupid" because you really had to be pretty dumb to not see the bright red flames under your feet. To add to that, when I played Diablo 2, I always referred to the hirelings as "stupids" since they had a tendency to get into trouble.

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Originally Posted by Kat_Manx

The game is about adventuring, and finding out things.

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Maybe when you're running solo, or playing with your friends. But in a group with other random players, I think a lot would disagree with that. Most people don't want to deal with problems that could very easily be prevented.

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Originally Posted by Kat_Manx

While someone running the duty with you explaining it to you is kind of just like..sharing information they learned during their experience, and I listen to the wise ones. :3 You know?

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What do you think reading a guide is? How is that not sharing information from a wise one that has done it before?

Like I said - always read up on the fight, make an effort to know the moves and what your basic role is. You don't need to remember every detail, just the highlights that you need to worry about. If you have questions about a specific mechanic or whatever, then ask in group. Say you've read up on the fight but are unclear about certain things. People will be happy to help. But if you never speak up and never make an effort to learn before hand, it doesn't exactly present you in a good light and just pisses people off. Don't expect to be hand held through it all - make an effort to do what you can before you get in, be friendly, polite, and honest - and then most people will be friendly and polite in return. It's like anything else in life - follow the Golden Rule. If you want people to be helpful and friendly and go out of their way for you, you should make an attempt to do the same.

Hmm if only there was an area in the duty finder for training runs, and beginners to party together, it might solve some of the problems, and create a better learning experience for tanks in particular.

I'll be honest, for Light Party type of dungeons, which I equate to 5-mans in WoW, I'm not going to bother reading up on a fight. I think expecting people to do that is just silly.

For raids, which I suppose are the 8 and 24 mans in this game, I not only will read up on the fight, I'll read up on my role, watch videos, theorycraft damage numbers, etc.

Save the extra work for where it belongs, not on the easy stuff.

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Originally Posted by LucianDark

Hmm if only there was an area in the duty finder for training runs, and beginners to party together, it might solve some of the problems, and create a better learning experience for tanks in particular.

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Tutorials or training runs that just count for practice, sound great. Or sometimes I just lookup a YouTube video of the dungeon. Maybe just maybe, I'll think of picking up the tank role later on. Support roles such as a healer, seem more comfortable to me at this point, but there is always room to branch out from there. How else to learn if not by doing? ^^

Generally I will say if I am experienced in a run or not. I honestly don't tell people the mechanics unless they ask. Sometimes people like to experience their first run without spoilers. Sometimes wiping can be the best teacher. When they say "what happened?" I tell them.

However I am never nasty or rude when people are learning. As long as there is improvement even in failure I am pretty happy. If I wanted speed runs I would be finding a static group not DF it.