The Masked Mage

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Originally Posted by Hanzzo_Kai

Is it confirmed somewhere that the set of twins from the Clan of Dawn are the same in each opening? I was thinking that there are a bunch of members and the Alfino/Alphinaud character may be their leader?

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They are the same regardless of starting city....keep in mind, they are part of YOUR, the adventurer's story. All the main storyline missions work this way and are 'the same' no matter what city you start in. The only difference is 'local flavor'.

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Originally Posted by Hestern_Nestern

Oh...that...that makes a lot more sense than my theory. Ahem. :o

Hey...if every primal is summoned by a certain group or what-have-you, does that mean that someone summoned Odin? Is it established in the canon that someone has to summon the primal first in order for them to come to Hydaelyn or have there been instances where a primal comes unbidden to this world?

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I think with the term Elder Primal applied to Odin and Bahamut they don't necessarily need to be summoned into the world like the regular Primals. The Primals are summoned with crystals and when defeated turn back into aether. We don't know what happens with Elder Primals, after all the most technologically advance civilization could only 'defeat' Bahamut by sealing him away and sending him into orbit so he could not draw on the aether of the land.

But chances are Bahamut and Odin have been "summoned" into Eorzea at least once and are still around.

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Originally Posted by Hestern_Nestern

Hey...if every primal is summoned by a certain group or what-have-you, does that mean that someone summoned Odin? Is it established in the canon that someone has to summon the primal first in order for them to come to Hydaelyn or have there been instances where a primal comes unbidden to this world?

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The NA website says, "There are none now alive who know the truth of when or by whom this elder primal was first summoned into the world," so I would say it's confirmed that Odin was summoned long ago. I get the impression from the story so far that the beast tribes in Eorzea are being used to summon primals. So who was used on the continent of Othard?

The Empire first encountered primals in the east - so how did those get there? That we have no confirmation on. Perhaps they came unbidden to the world. Perhaps there were beastmen. Perhaps there are wandering races over there. Perhaps the only reason they used the beast tribes in Eorzea was to spark the war between the Wandering races, beast tribes, and Empire and the ascians just summoned them personally on Othard. Who knows? Totally open.

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Originally Posted by NoloeTazier

Siren.

On a serious note, I'm probably complete wrong with this theory as of Phase 3, but I wanted to say it before but I forgot. The 2 new Elezen teens/whatever are probably Archons, representing the Twins Nald and Thal. After all they share similar characteristics to the Archons from 1.0. They arrive with us (sure it's in an Echo) on our voyage to the city-state we chose. If Louisoix is Thaliak, Ahldbhar is Rhalgr, the Twins being Nald and Thal...then yeah. That's as far as I got with labeling the rest of the Circle of Knowing Archons.

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I did not see this anywhere in the thread but: Who the twins are: Highlight below:

They are the grandchildern of Louisoix

Totally not far enough through the beta quests to be commenting on this.

But I still think the idea of Archons = Incarnated Twelve is crack.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

This force is likely the Ascians, who we know want to see the realm destroyed and the crystal dark.

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Kind of like when a crystal is bereft of it's light no? Like what was said would happen should the Garleans achieve their Godslaying motives.

Nael Van Darnus: "Oh how I grieve for this world! This world beset by fools! And that the worst of them should hail from mine own land! Gaius van Baelsar, the Emperor, his beloved subjects -- fools, one and all! Blindly, they struggle to exterminate the primals in the name of conquest. Yet what worth is there in a realm bereft of the crystals' light? What has become of Garlean pride, that we must scavenge the leavings of false gods!?"

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Originally Posted by Alaltus

Kind of like when a crystal is bereft of it's light no? Like what was said would happen should the Garleans achieve their Godslaying motives.

Nael Van Darnus: "Oh how I grieve for this world! This world beset by fools! And that the worst of them should hail from mine own land! Gaius van Baelsar, the Emperor, his beloved subjects -- fools, one and all! Blindly, they struggle to exterminate the primals in the name of conquest. Yet what worth is there in a realm bereft of the crystals' light? What has become of Garlean pride, that we must scavenge the leavings of false gods!?"

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Careful, buddy. Nael was being drip-fed influence by one of the most powerful dragons on Hydaelyn. His view of the world was somewhat warped to put it lightly.

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Originally Posted by Catapult

Careful, buddy. Nael was being drip-fed influence by one of the most powerful dragons on Hydaelyn. His view of the world was somewhat warped to put it lightly.

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Even so he was hardly speaking in tongues (though they may have not truly been his words) and i see no reason for him to have lied, as far as he let on; he was convinced he had already won no matter what happened. But i understand what your saying, like it might be a biased opinion of Bahamut's along the lines of "nothing can exist without me!" or who knows.

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Originally Posted by Catapult

Totally not far enough through the beta quests to be commenting on this.

But I still think the idea of Archons = Incarnated Twelve is crack.

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They may not be reincarnated Twelve, but they do "represent" them. Thaliak and Louisoix, Ahldbhar is second hand information but he's said to represent Rhalgr. Whether the representation is because they believe they're the reincarnated forms or it's for symbolic reference...I'm for the symbolic reference. After all the whole "we're here from a city in the north west, we're really smart and want to help everyone" just doesn't come off the same as "/pose I am Thaliak here for your women, oh yes and to save you all from being destroyed cough cough yes."

He looks a bit like Urianger is all.