6.1 Samurai

Both of these changes are quite tone-deaf. Why not put guaranteed crit on Resolution, Hyosho Ranryu, Double Down then? Feels bad whenever your cool finishers don't crit.
Or maybe it's time to just rethink philosophy behind crit entirely since there's only so much fun to be had with getting double damage on your abilities completely randomly.

In the grand scheme of things it changes very little. That said, its probably my favorite button. The concept of weaving in a charge before your big hit is simply fun and the animation is one of my favorite animations. They could have easily just made Shoha 1 an aoe with potency drop off and removed shoha 2 instead of removing kaiten. I'm not really sure bloat was the reason its being removed and more so has to do with balance and them not knowing what to do with it now that their 3 biggest moves all auto crit.

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Originally Posted by Luin

Should we upgrade Shoha1 into Shoha2?

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New Shoha 2:
Range 3 -> 5y
Deliver an attack with a potency of 580 to the target and 200 to all other nearby ennemies.

Repeat for every ability sharing a cooldown with an aoe variant.
I solved button bloat.

Kaiten was kinda never exploited, mainly used everytime you are going to spend your stickers.
But I do agree there was better solution than removing Kaiten...

It will mess with my muscle memory, but honestly, I won't miss Kaiten. It really had a purpose when SAM was in SB because Setsugeka was all we had, but once we moved into Kaeshi in SHB, it started to become too redundant.

Now that we have Namikiri, it is used so often that IMO, it is a waste of Kenki. I will take guaranteed Crits any day over spamming the same button to get the damage that is expected in a fight. The only thing I wish now is instead of just getting rid of Kaiten, replace it with another Kenki spender so we aren't just constantly spamming Shinten. Gives us that cool looking skill in PVP, make it buff our damage for a time on a 90s-120s cooldown.

The only time I was upset at the devs over a SAM change was when they removed Hagakure in SHB launch. That sucked.

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Originally Posted by DaemonInazuma

It will mess with my muscle memory, but honestly, I won't miss Kaiten. It really had a purpose when SAM was in SB because Setsugeka was all we had, but once we moved into Kaeshi in SHB, it started to become too redundant.

Now that we have Namikiri, it is used so often that IMO, it is a waste of Kenki. I will take guaranteed Crits any day over spamming the same button to get the damage that is expected in a fight. The only thing I wish now is instead of just getting rid of Kaiten, replace it with another Kenki spender so we aren't just constantly spamming Shinten.

The only time I was upset at the devs over a SAM change was when they removed Hagakure in SHB launch. That sucked.

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They cannot - will not - add anything to replace Kaiten. What could they possibly add as a kenki spender? Kaiten buffs your attack, Shinten deals direct damage, what else could they possibly do to increase damage. Making Kaiten guarantee a crit is effectively a damage buff.

So it's just Shinten spam now, and that's all it ever will be, until Shinten is also removed, because Shinten is an arbitrary button that just spends a gauge that only exists for Shinten (and Senei, which would just become its own, stand-alone CD).

(Also, we did Kaiten Higanbana in SB)

I wish they'd stop blowing smoke into the air when they make job changes to "reduce button bloat". As stated previously, there's many other examples of button bloat in this job that can be baked into other actions. So why then, remove job identity and flavor with the removal of Kaiten? This continuation of the Shadowbringer's job design philosophy is starting to make less sense. Unless, of course, you change the narrative and recognize these changes are to reduce the skill ceiling, and boost the skill floor. You know... it's OK to have, as the devs like to say, "busy" jobs, right?

Kaiten is iconic and flowed nicely with the job's kit. But hey, I guess we have a bunch of extra kenki now to spend on burst windows outside of 2 minutes... oh wait.

I welcome the removal of kaiten. I never felt it was an interesting or valueable part of the flow or rotation but such views are very personal.

I do not seeit as a reduction of skill expression as there never was any decision making or variance involved. A key pressed before every sen finisher and thats all.

I dont see it as being similar to removing shinten or other skills, as i see those holding more meaningful positions in the kit.

I feel sorry for the sam players upset by this removal. Time will tell what the majority thinks.

Ima miss that back sword twirling animation. Hopefully they add it to the movies we used it on atleast.

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Originally Posted by Quyn

I welcome the removal of kaiten. I never felt it was an interesting or valueable part of the flow or rotation but such views are very personal.

I do not seeit as a reduction of skill expression as there never was any decision making or variance involved. A key pressed before every sen finisher and thats all.

I dont see it as being similar to removing shinten or other skills, as i see those holding more meaningful positions in the kit.

I feel sorry for the sam players upset by this removal. Time will tell what the majority thinks.

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Skill isn't really what I think people are taking issue with. Kaiten just fit well with the class fantasy and people enjoyed the design of buffing before your big attacks. Personally for me the differences of having it or not makes little difference in actual gameplay, but in terms of enjoyment I definitely wont like it being gone because now there's going to be this awkward hole when doing midare or ogi.

I don't fully understand why kaiten has to be removed in the name of action bloat when so many other actions could be modified to reduce the perceived action bloat that exists, especially one so ingrained into me as a player. Samurai gets kaiten at 52 and is just told, "hey, use this for a really long time." It feels like a good wind-up before a hard hit and that really helps me enjoy the job. Every time I get level synced down I acutely notice the lack of kaiten because it just makes fights feel so much less fun, and I'm afraid that same feeling will carry over into 6.1.

save my boi kaiten