Need help / advice for this tank roulette situation

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Originally Posted by LittleArrow

Thanks for the response. I agree with the healer having the heaviest burden, thus I always check with the healer the size of pulls to take as a tank. I think I'll have to just agree to disagree as I do not see anything you've typed to warrant literally punishing another player based on pulling.

I do see that this mentality is one that I will have to deal with going forward and I'll need to adjust my gameplay. However, I cannot find it acceptable to willfully allow another player die, despite the fact that I can prevent it, purely based off principle. The sole job of the tank is to keep aggro, not teach other players lessons, imo. If we wipe due to extra mobs, I will apologize for my inability to offset the pull and ask for others not to pull more. Still, I would -never- punish a player for something that I can at least attempt to handle on my own and if the healer is capable.

I am happy to see in the few responses I've seen this thread that this is not the majority and I'm also happy that even though the times I've encountered have been so extremely distressing, it hasn't been the majority.

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Handle it however you want, but just understand that DPS running ahead and pulling is rude behavior and might illicit a rude response. Anyone should be capable of politely asking for bigger pulls, and if the tank and healer both agree then it'll happen. A DPS unilaterally deciding he's going to add stress to both the tank and healer by running ahead and pulling is out of line.

Tanks not turning the other cheek when party members are intentionally being rude isn't some pervasive issue with tanks, however; it should be expected.

"Sorry, I thought you were gonna pull more since you moved all the way here. I went a little too far. My apologies." should be enough. It the tank throws a tantrum after that, then simply schrug it off.

Also, you shouldn't run into this issue frequently. There's no reason to hug the tank so much that you can't stop in time when they do. As you said in your edit, this is a very specific situation. It seems that you're generalizing something that shouldn't have happened more than once or twice.
If you can't tell when a tank is going to stop, simply keep your distances. It doesn't matter if you miss a GCD or whatnot in a dungeon.

Finally, this game has roles. And one role of the tank is to pull enemies. This is not the healer nor the DPS' job. Your gameplay isn't being compelled by other as much as it's being compelled by the game itself.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

This is not the healer nor the DPS' job

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says you
nothing keeps anyone else from pulling enemies and then moving them towards the tank who can easily pick those enemies up with 1 (one) AOE aside from the tank's ego

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

says you
nothing keeps anyone else from pulling enemies and then moving them towards the tank who can easily pick those enemies up with 1 (one) AOE aside from the tank's ego

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Or you could just finish those which are stuck on the tank and let them get the next group(s).
I am pretty sure those who frequently tank know of their limits, while they remain unsure about the skill of the healer they have in the group and perhaps play it a bit safer than usual.

And, yes, many still can't keep up with clearing groups fast enough, so it becomes a problem for the tank/healer. Bardam's Mettle and the first groups in Holminister Switch/Dohn Mheg are clear examples of this.

You pull it, you tank it is griefing / obstructive gameplay. It is a plain example of someone going out of their way to undermine a dungeon run just to 'punish' someone, typically at the direct expense of the other 2 or 6 people in the party who are totally uninvolved.

Report people who engage in this kind of behavior without a second thought, they can and will be punished. The majority of people in the community (at least towards endgame) think these types of players are mentally and emotionally stunted.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Report people who engage in this kind of behavior without a second thought, they can and will be punished. The majority of people in the community (at least towards endgame) think these types of players are mentally and emotionally stunted.

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Calling them mentally and emotionally stunted doesn't make you look good either, you know. If you can't make it work without insulting the other side, then don't try to bother with a discussion.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

Or you could just finish those which are stuck on the tank and let them get the next group(s).
I am pretty sure those who frequently tank know of their limits, while they remain unsure about the skill of the healer they have in the group and perhaps play it a bit safer than usual.

And, yes, many still can't keep up with clearing groups fast enough, so it becomes a problem for the tank/healer. Bardam's Mettle and the first groups in Holminister Switch/Dohn Mheg are clear examples of this.

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or you could pull big, test your and the group's limit with pull sizes and adjust accordingly afterwrds instead of being scared about possibly dying and wiping

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

says you
nothing keeps anyone else from pulling enemies and then moving them towards the tank who can easily pick those enemies up with 1 (one) AOE aside from the tank's ego

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Nothing keeps the tank from not picking up any additional mobs the DPS unilaterally decides to burden the entire group with either. There's nothing stopping anyone from being inconsiderate in this game really, so long as you don't announce bad intentions in chat.

Still, it's funny how DPS defend their technical ability to be inconsiderate and then get offended that the tank might be inconsiderate in response.

"You pull it, you tank it" isn't the polite response, but it's a completely fair response to a DPS running ahead and pulling.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Nothing keeps the tank from not picking up any additional mobs the DPS unilaterally decides to burden the entire group with either. There's nothing stopping anyone from being inconsiderate in this game really, so long as you don't announce bad intentions in chat.

Still, it's funny how DPS defend their technical ability to be inconsiderate and then get offended that the tank might be inconsiderate in response.

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the tank's job is to hold aggro of the enemies and thus is not doing his job if he's letting the DPS keep it despite having all the tools available to take it from them
also; laughs in mantra, bloodbath, fists and riddle of earth

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

the tank's job is to hold aggro of the enemies and thus is not doing his job if he's letting the DPS keep it despite having all the tools available to take it from them
also; laughs in mantra, bloodbath, fists and riddle of earth

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A DPS that's running ahead to pull instead of AoEing down the enemies in the existing fight isn't doing his job correctly either.

No one's obligated to perform their job perfectly, though. Maybe the DPS wants to run ahead and pull instead of DPSing, and maybe I want to do my single target rotation to passively heal myself for a bit and don't end up picking up what the DPS pulled as a result. ;)