And again, all what you've said I said myself before, read carefully. It seems to me that you, folks don't wish to look or read the topic in it's full. I've SAID, that we have new skills, that replaced cross-class actions AND THEY ARE FINE. The thing I'M NOT FINE WITH - is that we have damage actions where we should've had utility actions. I'm not fine with removing counterattacking mechanick from PLD, I'm not fine, that we have TWO AoE spells for damage, I'm not fine, that the way PLD plays and feels now is more similiar to DPS job, that sometimes, throws some protective action. I'M NOT FINE with PLD loosing his master in defense and protection spells identity and becoming some dumb battle mage! This is not OK. This is BAD. It's not the job I loved anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotSiren
In every game possible, the Paladin job/class/role/whatever has always was and will be the defensive, healing and protective magick user with some form of Smite. That's the way he was here. Not anymore. Now it's some inquisitor archetype, that only doing some protection ocasionaly and more often casts some damage spell. No good.
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08-14-2019, 10:06 PMRakshazi
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08-14-2019, 10:27 PMRiotSirenPlay something else then.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakshazi
From my perspective paladin has evolved in a pretty straight forward manor. If it needed more protective abilities they would have added them.
And why can't it be a battle mage? That fits plenty fine within the lore in my opinion.
You said its a "Royal Guard" but how do guards protect things in real life? They stop them from attacking you and attack them back, these are things paladin already does.
Add more defensive abilities simply because you say "It's a tank and it needs more" would simply make them redundant. 99% of the time you are tanking you are also DPSing, that's how you hold threat what all of these DPS skills do is make it so that DPS is interesting. Pally actually has 3 buttons for AoE DPS, Two which are a combo which build mana, one that hits hard and spends mana. All that replacing one of these would do is make paladin more boring to play in a AoE situation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakshazi
- Defensive
- Healing
- Protective magick user
- with some form of Smite
Seems like it checks off all your boxes, honestly the way you describe it makes it sound like a healer, which is isn't here. -
08-14-2019, 11:10 PMRakshaziYou have a weird way to twist my words in your favor. I can only applaud you for that skill. But nonetheless, you don't see what I've talking about all this time. PLD have a plenty of damage already in his physical damage rotation. Holy Spirit and Holy Circle are kinda fine even if they basicaly AoE and sigle target versions of the same spell. But Confiteor is out of place. Anywho, the way I think PLD should've been is the counterattacking tank with buffs or debuffs after counter. THIS is the way the guard works. This is the way we could use our shield properly. Smiting could be placed not like literal damaging nuke (that is more befiting to RDM) but like more flashy version of Atonement (it's the only skill I approve in ShB PLD). SE could give us more chances to actualy use our shield in fights and not only like blocking device. We could buff our allies or amplify damage on target after we counter it! We could be so much better than spamming Holy Spirit/Circle till the mana drops to 0, refill it with Riot Blade/Prominence - repeat. I do love the way PLD developed through the expansions, but the ShB changes are out of place and don't develop the SPIRIT of the job the way it should. My opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotSiren
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08-14-2019, 11:51 PMIntrovertAntI’m sorry you feel this way and can understand if you already had these specific expectations for what a PLD should or should not be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakshazi
Tbh, I think that the PLD now fits the game better from a mechanics point of view. This game really is setup to be weighted on the side of dps. The fact that they brought PLD in line (and even exceeded) with making it fit within what the game caters to (dps) while at the same time (in my view) kept its identity as a tank that protects others (intervention, clemency, PoA, cover) is truly a breath of fresh air to me.
As to PLD aoe, man, it feels so good in dungeons now. The old way of spamming flash and then a single aoe skill felt so bad to me.
Again, I get that you’re coming at this from like a theme perspective. But I really think its not worth it to make such a hyperbolic post about it when PLD just got a ton of love from this past expansion. :/ -
08-15-2019, 02:18 AMhoanghiep2111
PLD is the most fun it's ever been, I think Square Enix have done a great job balancing all the tanks in this patch. PLD has always been my bread and butter ever since ARR, but I would always have to level another tank class for specific purpose like OT or faster dungeons clear, since their damages were lacking in both single target and aoe. Now we have potent DPS in both areas, with nicely overlapped burst window for physical and magic damages. Our raid utilities are still amazing with Divine Veil, Passage of Arm and the best Invul skill in the game. I can just pop Hallowed Ground, and then turn to heal the OT while the healers scrambles to res people. That feels amazing, and it feels like a natural progression for a tanking class with some whm elements mix in. Are you gonna tell me next that Whm should just heals and not throw stones at all?
I get that you're upset your favorite class isn't what it used to be, and you want to voice your opinions on what it should be; but being hostile with anyone that's disagreeing and trying to explain to you why Square Enix did what they did isn't the way to do it. Play a different class, or a different game altogether. The game is balanced around mechanics and dps to reach completion, it's been that way for years and they're going to stick to this formula. Sounds like you want to play a reactive tanking class that focus on debuffing the target and retaliate when your shield is hit. Lancer from Tera is thataway. Best of luck. -
08-15-2019, 04:13 AMosutinNow you're speakin my languageQuote:
Originally Posted by Rakshazi
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08-15-2019, 06:04 AMDyniaI loled so hard here :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Rakshazi
well I played some as pally in sb but not main and im playing paladin now as main, for me pally is so much better in Shb finally feel like "holy" warrior or pure warrior of light with new spells -
08-15-2019, 06:18 AMLambdafishI honestly don't know what you want PLD to be tbh, nor do I understand what has changed in ShB that makes it suddenly ruined after SB, its pretty much the same theme-wise with some extra DPS and QoL abilities.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakshazi
Seriously dude, you are going around in circles.
- You have said you both want it to be unique and you also don't want it to have spells (something that makes it unique)
- You have said it should be healing and support based, despite all of its utility being healing and support based
- And you have straight-up misunderstood how crap PLDs utility used to be and how powerful it is now.
Oh and what hasn't been mentioned to debunk a claim that PLD has been neutered: PLD was straight up broken in SB, you complain about cover being worthless now, but cover was busted, and that needed to change. I'm speaking as someone who loved cover for being busted.
TLDR: PLD is literally the same but with a more fun rotation and some much-needed skill pruning/balancing, and literally everyone disagrees with you. -
08-15-2019, 06:33 AMMagiusNecros
OP spelled Dark Knight wrong.
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08-15-2019, 09:55 AMMagnedeus
Idk what game you played previously before you started playing this one, but i think you need to go back. Because paladins don't and will never be as what you described.