SE, the concept of "Limited Jobs" is a really bad idea, turn back now

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

I still think there could be a way to have both—open-world/solo play where you run around and learn all these different mob abilities, and then matched group-play/raiding where you have a set arsenal of skills that are used and balanced against the other DPS jobs (and that you do learn throughout your BLU travels via quests or something similar), so that both parties can enjoy the new job.

Sadly, that would take extra development time. :rolleyes:

---

I get what you mean, but wouldn't that just kind of defeat the point?
"You get all theses cool abilities to learn and find!"
"Except for when you set foot in here, then you only have these ones, oh and they work differently then they did outside of here too."
At that point you'd effectively have two separate classes trying to live in one, it would be SCH and SMN all over again, only you get forced into one depending on being in the over world or an instance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zakon

Most feedback has been pretty well worded and polite, I wouldn't call it a tantrum. It's feedback. They introduced a system, people don't like the idea, they are allowed to tell the developers they don't like it.

Furthermore, it is possible to make content for non-raiders without making an entire class specifically devoted towards it.

---

Well worded, hyperbolic, inaccurate, demanding. It's an eloquent tantrum, but a tantrum none the less. And yes the can make classless content for non raiders, that doesn't mean that has to be the only content for non raiders.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

I get what you mean, but wouldn't that just kind of defeat the point?
"You get all theses cool abilities to learn and find!"
"Except for when you set foot in here, then you only have these ones, oh and they work differently then they did outside of here too."
At that point you'd effectively have two separate classes trying to live in one, it would be SCH and SMN all over again, only you get forced into one depending on being in the over world or an instance.

---

This is the problem I see with this concept too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EusisLandale

A level 50 Blue Mage, assuming they haven't slacked off on picking up abilities, should be able to contribute to primal fights perfectly fine. A crafter would never be able to pull any weight period.
And if it's already a mindless task that could be AFKed through as some insist, why would the 70/80 players care if a Blue Mage is there to learn something or not?

---

Why care, indeed? May as well not be there. That's not very meaningful "interaction".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EusisLandale

A level 50 Blue Mage, assuming they haven't slacked off on picking up abilities, should be able to contribute to primal fights perfectly fine. A crafter would never be able to pull any weight period.
And if it's already a mindless task that could be AFKed through as some insist, why would the 70/80 players care if a Blue Mage is there to learn something or not?

---

A very large amount of people only really go into party finder groups for very old content when its unsynced and so the most likely case would be a level capped tank or red mage joins to carry the blue mage to get the attack they want thus is asking people to take time out their day to carry a dead weight blue mage.

Ask your FC to help or pay people to carry you is what the future of blue mage looks like it will be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EusisLandale

So because it would require actual interaction, because it can rely on people stronger than it if people don't want to fully do it at level, it's not MMO like? Human interaction? THE HORROR!

---

Does it justify spending what is likely a lot of time and resources on a job relegated to little more than a tag-a-log when "real" jobs do all the work? Think about it. You wouldn't be playing Blue Mage in a dungeon because that level 80 Warrior would be doing all the work. You're 100% useless.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Belhi

Strictly speaking the Trust system might offset this if implemented for older content. God knows the lvl 50 MSQ dungeon issues could be greatly mitigated with that system.

That said, there does seem to be somewhat a lack of things to actually do with a BLU.

---

Unfortunately, the Trust system is currently regulated to Shadowbringer content only. Regardless, this still makes Blue Mage a solo only job. So... I'd rather they put their resources to content that actually matters. Perhaps I'll be proven wrong, but I fully expect Blue Mage to be Hildebrand-esque, where they update it every seven months with a couple quests and one or two new abilities. That just doesn't scream excitement to me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EusisLandale

A level 50 Blue Mage, assuming they haven't slacked off on picking up abilities, should be able to contribute to primal fights perfectly fine. A crafter would never be able to pull any weight period.
And if it's already a mindless task that could be AFKed through as some insist, why would the 70/80 players care if a Blue Mage is there to learn something or not?

---

I can currently solo every ARR Primal on any job. By level 80, this will be even easier. Therefore, Blue Mage isn't contributing to jack shit. They're standing there doing nothing. Go into Titan EX with a friend right now except you're a level 50 Dragoon and they're a level 70 Warrior. Now pretend you're a Blue Mage because it'll be about the same experience.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rysir

Ask your FC to help or pay people to carry you is what the future of blue mage looks like it will be.

---

And this is bad how?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Does it justify spending what is likely a lot of time and resources on a job relegated to little more than a tag-a-log when "real" jobs do all the work? Think about it. You wouldn't be playing Blue Mage in a dungeon because that level 80 Warrior would be doing all the work. You're 100% useless.

---

So you do it with people willing to do it at 50, or even actually 50 themselves? So you do it with people who don't mind helping you get your endgame abilities for the Masked Carnival?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

I get what you mean, but wouldn't that just kind of defeat the point?
"You get all theses cool abilities to learn and find!"
"Except for when you set foot in here, then you only have these ones, oh and they work differently then they did outside of here too."
At that point you'd effectively have two separate classes trying to live in one, it would be SCH and SMN all over again, only you get forced into one depending on being in the over world or an instance.

---

I imagine that the skills you retain in group content are the same as the ones you obtain in open-world—you just cannot retain all of the skills (due to the skew in “This BLU has all the good skills” and “This BLU only has half of them”) and/or need to have the required ones to enter the content (again, going back to addressing the problems with skew), and the skills you keep are scaled so as to not make the job overpowered in content (i.e., their power is balanced against the power of the other DPS jobs). Not that their inherent function is different.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EusisLandale

Well worded, hyperbolic, inaccurate, demanding. It's an eloquent tantrum, but a tantrum none the less. And yes the can make classless content for non raiders, that doesn't mean that has to be the only content for non raiders.

---

With regards to the raiders argument, speaking for myself:

I only raid on BRD and occasionally AST. While I was indifferent to BLU, I don’t find myself enjoying the job as much if I’m limited only to premades or open-world content. Open-world can only be so interesting, since all we have to go on right now is killing mobs and participating in FATEs (and I guess sidequests if you haven’t done those already—I’m assuming we can do sidequests with BLU?). I’d like to be able to take it into other things without having to find 3/7/23 (assuming we can take them into 24-mans under the criteria that it’s a full alliance party) people to do it with. I have friends I play with, but still...

I don’t even want it to raid on—the jobs I raid on are limited to one 95% of the time and the other 5% of the time. I just want to play it normally as you would any other job (i.e., I can participate in random-matching duties with it).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

I get what you mean, but wouldn't that just kind of defeat the point?
"You get all theses cool abilities to learn and find!"
"Except for when you set foot in here, then you only have these ones, oh and they work differently then they did outside of here too."
At that point you'd effectively have two separate classes trying to live in one, it would be SCH and SMN all over again, only you get forced into one depending on being in the over world or an instance.

---

It defeats the point far less than it not functioning as a job in the first place.
To put it in comparison, I like Monk's Somersault PvP action, it's a cool little Tifa reference and I'm sad that they don't get to use it outside PvP. That does not mean Monk should be a PvP only job.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EusisLandale

And this is bad how?

---

Unless you have a rather large FC you will be at the mercy of the log in times of specific people just to have you bum through content.

This also makes it a requirement of an FC to properly utilize a solo job. Think on that for a moment.