Is this a common thing for tanks to do?

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10-13-2015, 04:45 AM
bounddreamer

Quote:

Originally Posted by TouchandFeel

For big pulls, for the most part it is resource inefficient to tag every mob along the way.

For the most part, absolutely. OP is talking about a very specific pull, the AK Hard pull. It's five mobs to pull the first section of trash under a vine. Five tomahawks, shield lobs, or unmends (followed by blood price) is not too much to ensure you secure ALL the initial aggro from those very hard hitting mobs.
10-13-2015, 05:17 AM
TouchandFeel

Quote:

Originally Posted by bounddreamer

snip

The OP used that instance as a personal example, while their overarching question was

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adire

Why do some tanks not think it a good idea to ensure every mob they're pulling has been hit, even if it means stopping for a second before continuing to the next group?

That is the question I answered along with my thoughts on casting a heal during a pull and tanks trying to do pulls beyond their capabilities.

As for that specific pull that was used as an example, yes you could try to tag all of them, but I wouldn't if it required me to slow down or stop at all to do so, for the reasons I gave near the end of my last post.
As for tagging them because they hit hard and allowing for a healer to then be able to heal you during the pull, in my experience it is better to just tag the closest mob from the max distance of your ability as you pass, that way they are trailed behind you and can't get hits in and therefore no need for healing. Couple that with a pre-pull shield and you should be good through the whole pull and the initial grouping of the mobs.
10-13-2015, 05:24 AM
Freyyy

Hey guys the OP said that the tank got hit by the vine and got the vulnerability debuff but still proceeded to pull more mobs, what about ending the debate now ?
10-13-2015, 06:12 AM
Adire

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian_

.

I gave enough specifics to tell you who was at fault actually, and you immediately assumed it was my fault as well as the tank's too. I already mentioned he had vuln up on, already mentioned he was almost dead by the time I healed him, I did fail to mention his job though I'm still right, because he was a WAR. A PLD could have been planning on popping HG, Holmgang would not work that way and couldn't be used in that way.

He was going to die had I not healed him. It's really that simple. So don't assume the worst so quickly, and I won't get defensive. Deal?
10-13-2015, 07:09 AM
IndigoHawk

Yes, you had a bad experience and shouldn't have been raged at, and no, it's not common that all tanks are bad, and yes, you wanted to vent on tanks in the tank forum to feel better and don't really have a question.

Sorry that happened but don't kick the tank forum and wonder why people are defensive about you asking if all tanks are bad.
10-13-2015, 07:19 AM
Adire

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndigoHawk

Yes, you had a bad experience and shouldn't have been raged at, and no, it's not common that all tanks are bad, and yes, you wanted to vent on tanks in the tank forum to feel better and don't really have a question.

Sorry that happened but don't kick the tank forum and wonder why people are defensive about you asking if all tanks are bad.

It was a legitimate question. I wanted to see if it's as common for others as it seems to be for me. Which still isn't all THAT common.

Also, please do quote where I said or asked if all tanks are bad. I tank more often than I heal myself.

Nice try at attempting to act like you know what I'm thinking, but you failed at it. The immediately confrontational people and wanna-be mindreaders around these forums is really getting old.
10-13-2015, 07:41 AM
Imoen

Is it normal for a majority of your runs?

If so, then yes it's normal. Adapt.

If not, don't rage, vote dismiss/leave or w/e and move on with your life.

(Simple question simple answer)

Do I do this on my tank? I try not to. (Miss mobs for tag i mean.)

Is there ever a reason to bitch people out at all? No

If I don't like the way a run is going I just leave, million better things I could be doing with my time (Real life, and game.) then dealing with crap parties or crap attitudes for that matter. With that said, if someone clearly needs help I try to offer advice and try to stick around to help, but if it gets redic, im out, no words, no yelling, no raging.

In my personal experience, most groups are filled with nice people that are just trying to get through a dungeon.
10-13-2015, 07:41 AM
Ashkendor

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adire

Also, please do quote where I said or asked if all tanks are bad.

Your post is titled 'Is this a common thing for tanks to do?' immediately followed by:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adire

Doing large pulls that is, and missing aoe aggro on some mobs.

Then you described a scenario with a tank that got hit by the vuln-up debuff as well. If you tank more often than you heal (as you stated you did), you already know the answer to the question you're asking. You are, in effect, asking rhetorically if bad tanks are common. My answer to that is: they aren't any more common than bad healers or bad dps. They're just more noticeable. I think what people are taking umbrage with is the fact that you're kind of framing it as a rhetorical question - i.e. you just came into the tank forums to bitch about a bad tank that raged at you rather than to ask an actual legitimate question.

I'm sorry you got a bad tank, and I'm sorry they raged at you. But no, it's not common practice. I make sure to tag all the mobs I'm picking up when I'm doing big pulls whether it be with a flash as I'm passing by or individually shield lobbing the ones I missed.
10-13-2015, 08:10 AM
Whiteroom

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adire

Doing large pulls that is, and missing aoe aggro on some mobs.

The other day while I was healing, a tank was running and missed several mobs with flash. While running, their HP was getting low, so obviously I had to toss a heal on them.

When I did, the mobs doubled back for me and got in enough hits to interrupt my casts a few times, and they dropped us both to low health.

When the tank suddenly got aggro on them after several seconds, the added strength of the mobs that were attacking me finished him off while I was trying to heal myself because one more round of attacks would have killed me, but the tank was further away from dying from the mobs attacking him. He also got vulnerability up on himself from the vines (AK HM).

He raged at me as if it was my fault we died.

Common but not right. Typically, you hit all mobs on the way, and throw up a couple CD or say HG once you finish moving. Obviously getting debuffed was his bad. Also, if the party make up wasn't AOE dps, there isn't too much of a point. Its a point of trust that you assume the tank will pop the proper CD, but DF is DF after all.
10-13-2015, 12:43 PM
Brian_

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adire

I gave enough specifics to tell you who was at fault actually, and you immediately assumed it was my fault as well as the tank's too. I already mentioned he had vuln up on, already mentioned he was almost dead by the time I healed him, I did fail to mention his job though I'm still right, because he was a WAR. A PLD could have been planning on popping HG, Holmgang would not work that way and couldn't be used in that way.

He was going to die had I not healed him. It's really that simple. So don't assume the worst so quickly, and I won't get defensive. Deal?

All I saw was under half health at the end of the vine hall. The end of the vine hall is the end of the pull depending on enemy pathing. It wasn't until later that you said he was at a quarter of this health. So, given the information I had, could it be your fault? Yes. Even if a WAR is at sub 50% with vul, they can be perfectly fine. With sufficient gear, sufficient CDs, and a good healer, they will be just fine.

Based on that info, you shouldn't have healed him. He could've been at higher HP and not had vul. Both had their faults.

Like I specified, without more info, it's hard to tell who is more to blame.

But apparently, you are just mad and want to vent.

And the ultimate question, whether or not tanks should tag mobs has a real answer I provided. It's not efficient. Since you've now specified it's WAR, then you should be even more aware of why. @50, a WAR has like 2-3 flashes and limited number of overpowers before they are TP dry. Every tomahawk you throw out is less overpowers later on because both are such high TP weapon skills. And because WAR skills are so synergistic, one overpower is much more than one overpower. It's less healing from blood bath, less damage from berserk and internal release. You do not want to waste unnecessary resources.

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