IF ya got money

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Originally Posted by cearka

after checking snugglebutts characters in lodestone, I'm not entirely sure he's not just trolling.

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...Fair point...

Still, there's 5 people in my FC who have most of their crafters at 58+, and both MIN/BTN at 60 w/ gear. 2 of them were dedicated 4 Star Omnicrafters by the end of 2.5. They all say the same thing, they'll gradually get everything up to 60, get HQ cross-class gear, probably meld the guaranteed slots, maybe do 1-2 cheap overmelds to make the current recipes easier to HQ from NQ, and thats it.
Beyond that they all say that they dont have time for Red Scrips.

They are not super rich, I think the richest one we have has 18M. But they, we, never really had to be. We're primarily raiders, and we work during the day. For the most part we craft raid supplies, the occasional set of leveling gear, and for fun, not for money.
Now the fun aspect of it is kind of gone, which is a shame. So we will continue to get our crafters to 60, I've got 3 at 60 atm and MIN, so Im behind the curve, and we will make sub 60 foods, and the old X-pots, and life will go on.

Its not like these changes to crafting progression ruined the game for us, but it is a bit sad that "worthwhile" crafting progression ends shortly after you hit 60. I am sure that soon SE will introduce new foods and pots and so forth that will magically be "required" for raiding and will be 3 star recipes demanding full Red Scrip gear in order to make crafting "relevant again"... but we'll make it through somehow.

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Originally Posted by cearka

after checking snugglebutts characters in lodestone, I'm not entirely sure he's not just trolling.

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...and you would be wrong. Just because my characters on this account are still in the process of grinding levels does not mean I am incapable of listening to my friends who are doing it, reading how it works and understanding the system or unlike some here whom lack common sense.

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Originally Posted by Snugglebutt

...and you would be wrong. Just because my characters on this account are still in the process of grinding levels does not mean I am incapable of listening to my friends who are doing it, reading how it works and understanding the system or unlike some here whom lack common sense.

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for all to see, here is the troll who has no crafts leveled posting this nonsense cheerleading for the scrip system;
http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/1513237/

here is me:

http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/8074011/ (btw these melds can be copied by all to surpass requirements for 2 star)


I rest my case that this person is merely blathering whatever comes to mind (akin to either a pathologically lying narcissist or, a person doing this for their own amusement aka 'troll')

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Originally Posted by AnimaS

for all to see, here is the troll who has no crafts leveled posting this nonsense cheerleading for the scrip system;
http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/1513237/

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Yet again you show your lack of common sense. You link my bard when I have multiple characters and my bard is not my crafter. Your lack of attention to detail and your apparent incompetence is really showing. It is either incompetence or your just continuing your trend of spreading misinformation in order to progress your propaganda just like you have with half the things you have said on the topic. You use fallacies and hyperbole in order to promote your beliefs and your stance.

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Originally Posted by Snugglebutt

Yet again you show your lack of common sense. You link my bard when I have multiple characters and my bard is not my crafter. Your lack of attention to detail and your apparent incompetence is really showing. It is either incompetence or your just continuing your trend of spreading misinformation in order to progress your propaganda just like you have with half the things you have said on the topic. You use fallacies and hyperbole in order to promote your beliefs and your stance on this topic.

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I think his point is still pretty valid though
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/1514966/

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Originally Posted by PotatoWafflez

I think his point is still pretty valid though
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/1514966/

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It is no more valid than assuming a person cannot place a square peg in a square slot just because he or she might not have yet put it in. Intelligence and understanding of something is not limited to experience so while I have partial experience in that mine are yet to reach 60, do not assume for one second that I am neither intelligent enough to understand how it works or wise enough to understand the implications. My main issue with the OP and most of the things he says are not limited to the fact he has issues with it but more so in how he is expressing his feelings on those issues through his click bait titles, extreme melodrama and hyperbole plus logical fallacies. Here is an example of a well thought out, reasonable and logical criticism of the system that I read today of which he could do well to learn from as a way of expressing his concerns.

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Originally Posted by Snugglebutt

It is no more valid than assuming a person cannot place a square peg in a square slot just because he or she might not have yet put it in. Intelligence and understanding of something is not limited to experience so while I have partial experience in that mine are yet to reach 60, do not assume for one second that I am neither intelligent enough to understand how it works.

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I did not bring your intelligence into question only that he is right in that you have not actually experienced the system in regards to crafting.
You haven't earned blue scripts and you haven't unlocked the ability to earn red scripts, I spent the whole day handing in frozen spirits just to earn my books because it has been such a pain to turn anything else in all week due to the mat requirements; it was neither fun nor rewarding.
Just because something is fine on paper doesn't mean its fine in practice.

But I'm not here to argue with you.

My opinion is the script reward is too low for the mat costs and unless they increase it or add some kind of daily bonus it only benefits those with large amounts of time and gil to amass a stock pile of mats, and screws over the guys who don't have as much time to run around grabbing 15 adamantite ore every time its up.

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Originally Posted by PotatoWafflez

My opinion is the script reward is too low for the mat costs and unless they increase it or add some kind of daily bonus it only benefits those with large amounts of time and gil to amass a stock pile of mats, and screws over the guys who don't have as much time to run around grabbing 15 adamantite ore every time its up.

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I have never said the system was fine or not in need of some fixing and is not the main issue I have with the OP and his spamming of click bait style hate threads of which I explained earlier.

For example I agree that the cap is a little too low, the cost of materials bought from scripts is a little too high. Certain skills need improving in their importance and use, some stats need further balancing alongside some very minor tweaks to things like favors etc. The price of script gained materials placed on the market board will however balance itself out. All these things are minor and none of them warrant the waving of the end is nigh banner brigade currently infesting these forums. I even gave an example of someone expressing their concerns the right way in my previous post link.

One of the major difference of opinion between myself and some others will come from people who think crafters should be able to craft BiS DoW/DoM gear of which I do not agree and neither did a hell of a lot of people prior to 3.0. Those against it back then put forth reasonable and valid reasons for their stance and I agreed with it. SE also agreed with those people and changed it so now those who disagreed with those other people are whining about that change. If SE changed it back then those who were against crafted BiS gear would then take the place of those whining only this time about the change back.

I am also highly in favor of the specialization system and want it further expanded upon even at the cost of omni-crafting. The difference between me and the OP despite both having certain concerns about the system is unlike him I am not acting like a petulant child in expressing them, I am not using extreme hyperbole and fallacies to back up my concerns.

Just to reiterate. Snugglebutt is very much the minority here. No matter how loud he talks.

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Originally Posted by Alwaysatodds

Just to reiterate. Snugglebutt is very much the minority here. No matter how loud he talks.

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Feel free to keep grasping at straws in your attempt to silence someone of an opposing position. First the attempt to dismiss via linking my (wrong) character to which I responded to already and now the old fashioned minority/majority or silent majority/vocal minority form of argument. All we need now is some Hitler references or irrelevant and flawed real life comparisons followed by some insulting memes directed at your opposition then this thread will have run the traditional full circle of internet argumentation. :p