Are you happy with the current raiding structure in this game?

The way Tera's lockouts worked was so bad and wonky.

You could only attempt Argon Queen, win or lose, about once a day. This made it so people only ever wanted to do Queen with people who had already cleared it. If you weren't attempting Queen on day 1 of it's release, you were SOL. Nobody wanted to waste their lockout on teaching someone new how to do Queen, especially since Queen had some mechanics that would make your average FFXIV player cry.

They later released a "Queen NM" which slowed down some mechanics so you could learn which didn't drop loot, but for some stupid reason it still had a lockout which completely defeated the purpose of using it as a practice mode for the real "Queen HM".

Tera's endgame was stupid. It's hardly a model for raiding in any MMO, period.

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Originally Posted by Meier

nope! that is why I am not playing much at all anymore. If things don't change by expansion I will just unsub and move along. :)

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You act as if SE will change their mind because you don't play or will unsub?

If that's not the reason why bring it up or mention it?

I think people who say they will unsub think SE will jump when they say jump they lose 1 subscriber they will gain another.

its a new game you already getting bent out of shape fast.

Yes FFXIV original is old this is a new idea concept is new.

Time will change it, just like FFXI and like other MMO's

SE Should have made coil unlimited entry for any turn.

however had a weekly loot lockout for each turn like in ST. (with tweaks obviously for dual drops a.k.a 1 accessory 1 main gear loot roll.)

solves every single problem people have in my honest opinion :|

I'm content. Just wish we had more raid material. Not the lolRaid CT and ST, I mean the real deal likie Coil.

In general, yes. But they need more content. 8 bosses every year just does not cut it. Also make the fights less scripted so that all it takes to win is not just to memorize a pattern. I also would like to see larger raids (coil difficulty) in future, 16-24 man so that fcs and alliances can play together. If this is not possible due to manpower/finance issues, then I hope to see them tune the same encounter in coil for 24 players, something like 10/25 raiding in wotlk.

Other minor details:
1) Remove the barriers after every turn so that coil is 1 long continuous journey from one boss to another. This would greatly increase the immersion.
2) Sprinkle more lore throughout the raid (i.e. give it more backstory like Tam-Tara). At the moment it just feels like we get the whole chunk of the lore at the end of the raid.
3) Spread the loot out more evenly or reduce the size of the loot table so that it's harder for people to get screwed by rng.

I like raiding in this game, only thing I regret is, that I wasnt playing for 6 months, so it was quite hard to kill T6 because of all the achivement/kill link groups. But I am not deuche, I understand that experienced people want to play with experienced people. (also this is not problem of game mechanics, its the only thing that I wasnt happy about previous month)

Fortunately after 1 month searching I finally have static and progress T7. :) Also this game has nice catchup mechanics, got i86-i100, atma and animus in one month. If there werent catchup patches I wont be even able to come back.

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Originally Posted by Dhex

Spent 9hrs in various pick-ups watching primarily DPS fail on Turn 6 this week.

The content isn't difficult from a complexity standpoint but if you have a single person fumble a mechanic the raid is over in most cases.

Content is not enjoyable when you can't do it with friends.
The lockout prevents this - and the unforgiving nature of the content even makes becoming friends harder; frustration is not good for that.

Personally I've come to the conclusion that Coil content is purely a frustrating endevor and worse; a waste of time.

I would like to raid and complete content but it seems to require a static. That's pretty harsh and it locks a lot of people out of Coil raiding by default.

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This is more a result of the small group focus they have for raiding. I guess they could try doing 8-man and 24-man versions of the same content, where yes the DPS and performance required (on paper) is greater in a 24-man raid but there's also more room for error and, depending how content is tuned, more opportunities to bring new people. Back when I raided in WoW we sometimes pulled people that were in other guilds we knew that didn't get to raid that week or had an alt they wanted to run a raid with. You had the "core group" for a 25-man and several people who sometimes made raids and sometimes could not, so spots tended to open up on raid nights for new people. Since this was done in-guild we took the time to explain mechanics and so on. Seemed to work pretty well and managed to get a lot of people to see the content and did this through Trial of the Grand Crusader. Icecrown Citadel happened to be tuned where the first four boss fights could be pugged, which when combined with catch up gear (stuff from the ICC heroics + some crafted gear) meant even non-raiders got to see the inside of the last major raid in the expansion.

You can't do something like this because a smaller group greatly diminishes the room for error and chance at recovery. Now take that and combine it with how Coil is tuned and you absolutely need a static in order to run it and have a chance of reaching the end.

tl;dr - The lockout is NOT the problem. The problem is the raid size.

For me at least 8 man content feels like just some dungeon, i honestly feel like there is no point in going to do it. When the game launched i was under the assumption that large scale raids would be the main stay of this games raiding content. As it stands at the moment i dont see it changing to be that way just the same pattern of 3 dungeons and 1 primal every few months.

With regards to the lockouts that simply so people dont consume the content to quickly im sure people arent argueing about this, for me at least its common sence. I think that the developers expected more people to complete turn 5 with echo but mechanics of the fight and the unstable nature of duty finder and then ontop of this the rewards from hunts have meant that people simply dont feel the need to do the 8 man content. If that wasnt enough the new coil is gated behind having a turn 5 win which most players dont have. While i dont think simply removeing the t5 block would solve the problem it would go along way into getting people into the new coil if thats through party finder or fc groups.

If the raiding structure doesnt change ill probably move on, i got this game for the fact it was at least in my mind a final fantasy style game with large raiding system so far it has yet to deliver this for me.

I don't consider myself a raider. Have yet to experience any of the coils. However, from a casual player's stand point, I appreciate the accessibility of the duty finder. It makes it easy to get dungeons run, especially for storyline purposes. This is a farcry from 1.0 where once you were behind, you could get really far behind due to having a hard time finding people to help me complete things for AF armor or Grand Company scenarios.

However, that accessibility has a negative edge. While players are typically friendly, there is a distinct different mentality amongst players than if you took the time to build your own party. Because players are randomly grouped, across a data center, there tends to be less compassion/loyalty extended to party members.

Now, what would get me excited about raiding in general are some dangerous open-world zones. Maybe keep boss fights themselves instanced... but large, dangerous areas that need the cooperation of a 4-man or 8-man teams would be great. Maybe some quests on the outskirts for the solo player or parties waiting to fill up? That would be awesome. Maybe even toss in some leve-quest style challenges so that groups are "directed" through the dungeon.

The next step would be a darkness falls style dungeon. An open world dungeon but with the added challenge of pvp. Maybe this could be the next step in Frontlines?

Why can't they just make it like daily roulette rewards, except weekly? That is, only your FIRST WIN OF THE WEEK grants you the bonus rewards (the loot). After that you are free to carry on playing but, for the rest of the week, you don't get that weekly first time reward (the loot). So you're only getting a chance at loot on your first clear, but you're allowed to continue to enter to help out your friends and linkshell and free company etc.