Do you think the devs intended multi-flare blm?

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Originally Posted by Gormogon

In Brayflox HM I'd rather stick to Fire 3, Fire 2x3, triple flare than use that rotation.

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The rotation in full I would add is as follows

Fire 3 for initial Astral 3 and allowing Tank to gain initial threat with flash
Raging + quelling
Flare
Convert
Flare
MP Potion
Flare
Transpose
Flare Flare
Transpose
Flare Flare

Pulls wont last very long. By not using this rotation you are conceding to do less damage at no gain aside from possible reliability if you are not very well practised at the timing. But that is down to the individual not putting in time or effort to be optimal.

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Originally Posted by Urielparadox

You should be using hq mega/hq x-pot of int with that instead of x ether for higher damage(multi target scenario at least).

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Negative. I've tested that, the X Int will put maybe 2-300 extra damage per hit, a little more on a crit, but prevents me from pulling out that third flare because of the mp issue. A third flare on AF3 w/Raging is far better than the boost from the higher int.

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Originally Posted by Zozor

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......if your mobs are not dead by the fourth flare, your output is, well..less than optimal as you said.

My rotation in Brayflox is Fire3>Fire2xwhatever it is until it's too low to use another>Raging>Flare>Convert>Flare>Mp>Flare. Using Flare with all that MP after Fire3 still available is silly. On average, if I'm with another BLM, the first large group (all mobs pulled up to the bridge) at the end of that rotation everything is dead. Outside of that, mnk/drg in the party, yeah there's a moment where another couple fire 2s on AF3 is needed to take down the stragglers, because occasionally things move out of Flare's pathetically small aoe range.

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Originally Posted by Zozor

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It's Transpose Flare Flare wait Transpose Flare Flare. Yet if you're doing Transpose Flare Transpose then you're doing way less damage since you aren't doing a Astral Fire 3 Flare which gimps your overall damage. Also please use Quelling before Raging.

I prefer to use

Fire 3
Quelling + Raging
Fire 2
Fire 2
Fire 2 (3rd one isn't needed if you have another player that can do their AoE rotation reliably)
Flare
Convert
Flare
MP pot
Swiftcast
Flare

The first full pull in Brayflox is dead and it does way more than your suggested rotation.

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Originally Posted by Urielparadox

I have major issues with this and mixed feelings.

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Yeah I personally wouldn't recommend it because it's not only an exploit but it's also a gamble that's less efficient to use that the legit ways Black Mages have to Flare already. So trying to shove this exploit method of Flare into people's rotations especially the casual crowd it will only serve to make things worse.

Also for Black Mages in this thread.

Super Double Flare does the most damage in your rotation and has the least amount of down time as well. (Bard + Int pot Required)
Triple Flare is your next alternative yet it takes longer overall to do. (an additional 4 seconds)
Mini/Baby Ancient Flare spam is way more reliable than the gamble that is Transpose Double flare (Bard + Scholar Required)
Poor Mans Flare is your last thing you do if you don't have any cooldowns up and you need to AoE.
Quad Flare only if the enemy is low.
Quint Flare with a bard help is nice too.

All these are decent alternatives.

Yet doing the transpose double flare method is an exploit on mana regen mechanics and above all the initial Flare is under the Umbral Ice 1 which is gimped AoE damage. So that initial Flare is basically a Fire 2 that grants Astral Fire 3 damage wise and then your next flare is legit Flare damage.

People that suggest the transpose double flare exploit method should not misguide BLM the way they do in making them believe that they are doing more damage because they are not.

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

And to think, BLM's are complaining that they are gimped compared to other classes, begging for tweaks to make them "more viable"...

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Do you have any idea what you are talking about? Have you ever seen a blm parse in any boss fight against a Drg, Mnk, Smn, or even a Brd that isn't singing the whole time? Its pretty pathetic. With the exception of T4, a well played BLM is going to struggle against a well played almost any other DPS. Its been proven with actual numbers time and time again.

I think SE intended BLM to deal damage, I don't see the issue here.

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Originally Posted by NyneAlexander

Do you have any idea what you are talking about? Have you ever seen a blm parse in any boss fight against a Drg, Mnk, Smn, or even a Brd that isn't singing the whole time? Its pretty pathetic. With the exception of T4, a well played BLM is going to struggle against a well played almost any other DPS. Its been proven with actual numbers time and time again.

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I'll say this again.

Only reason we Black Mages don't parse as high as them is because we have consistent downtime in our rotation. If we didn't have that downtime then our damage per minute wouldn't look as low as it is on parsers.

The moment a BLM cast Blizzard 3 and by the time we cast that Fire 1 after Fire 3 it takes enough time to drop our DPS significantly on a Parser. Yet in no way is a Black Mages single target dps god awful as people make it out to be. Parses wont ever say this yet people are being overly dramatic about it because they don't top single target parsers.

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Originally Posted by Akujin

Negative. I've tested that, the X Int will put maybe 2-300 extra damage per hit, a little more on a crit, but prevents me from pulling out that third flare because of the mp issue. A third flare on AF3 w/Raging is far better than the boost from the higher int.

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In braflox/haltial(I use both depending on mob group) the int potion nocks a whole cast off of MY(my situation though not yours) the rotation so I guess just take your pic I can either do a full rotation double flair and kill them all or I can do a rotation and a triple flair to kill them all. a dif of like 3 seconds not that big, however I feel like i'm wasting a cast when that final flair with an ether is really only being used for like half the damage.

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Originally Posted by Gormogon

I'll say this again.

Only reason we Black Mages don't parse as high as them is because we have consistent downtime in our rotation. If we didn't have that downtime then our damage per minute wouldn't look as low as it is on parsers.

The moment a BLM cast Blizzard 3 and by the time we cast that Fire 1 after Fire 3 it takes enough time to drop our DPS significantly on a Parser. Yet in no way is a Black Mages single target dps god awful as people make it out to be. Parses wont ever say this yet people are being overly dramatic about it because they don't top single target parsers.

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I dunno... after extensive experience inside of Turn 8 with multiple people parsing with different programs, its safe to say that blm needs a buff. This is an 11 min. dps check with very little movement. I mean, we basically get to turret the entire time with the exception of hitting a tower or a landmine. And over 11 min, we're gonna get out-parsed by almost every single dps job in the game. This is with using bliz 1 during the Umbral ice III downtime, and choosing the right thunder to cast based off of mp left over when entering umbral ice. Add movement into a long fight like that and there's no chance.

IMO, it was the scathe debuff that put us at the bottom. It used to be a feasible method of maintaining dps during movement. But because of the pvp-related nerf, our PvE was dramatically effected. As item level gets higher, the dps gap between us and other jobs will grow exponentially bigger, unless SE adds some balance.

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Originally Posted by Gormogon

Yeah I personally wouldn't recommend it because it's not only an exploit

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It's not an exploit to cast a spell the moment the regen tick occurs. It's part of the mechanics of the system used in a novel way, but not an exploit.