Zepla: Endwalker is the Worst FFXIV Expansion I have played

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ivtrix

Lol lmao 10

---

I did a search after BeaVeR talked some shit about my post history and did my post where I said that get deleted?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ChonkGoblinSuprem

I did a search after BeaVeR talked some shit about my post history and did my post where I said that get deleted?

---

My very own insult :*
Welcome to the ignore list

One does not simply post in these forums. There is mockery there, which never sleeps. Not with ten thousand alts could you change anyone's mind. It is folly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AngelCheese77

I feel the complaints and feedback given are from those players who have done everything in the game (or say they have). Or those bored saying there is nothing more to do tey refuse to touch certain aspects. We’ll never be able to please everyone, and the only complaint/feedback I agree with is healers need their damage skills back.

---

You hit the nail on the head there. Newcomers still have plenty of old content to do but this expansion has been lackluster for veterans.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

But the post is so long, he even started it with a "preface." That's when you know you are in for a novel. Cracked me up- it's very Ren.

---

The preface he started with wasn't his. It was Zepla's own preface - but he cut it down in size.

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments. Evidently the generation raised on social media can't handle that.

It is what it is. It doesn't help that we're generally on opposite sides of the fence in a discussion, which makes them even less interested in trying to understand the other's point of view.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rolder50

Too long and with a known history of spouting BS, you bet imma skip it.

---

Then why did you watch Zepla's video? Most of what he wrote was things she actually said though he summarized it. A few times though he wrote what she said word for word.

Are you sure you watched her video, or did you just have it playing in the background while you were watching Netflix on another monitor?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

The preface he started with wasn't his. It was Zepla's own preface - but he cut it down in size.

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments. Evidently the generation raised on social media can't handle that.

It is what it is. It doesn't help that we're generally on opposite sides of the fence in a discussion, which makes them even less interested in trying to understand the other's point of view.

---

I could hit 200 words each post easily with that much gaslighting

different educational background lmaoooooooo

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BRVV

I could hit 200 words each post easily with that much gaslighting

---

Challenge for you - pull up Zepla's video and watch it again. Put Ren's post to the side so you can compare.

Which is the long winded one?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OgruMogru

different educational background lmaoooooooo

---

I went to school in the 70s. When did you?

Trust me, the education system these days is very different from what it was for my generation. Ask your parents or your grandparents.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CidHeiral

When a game developer says something is "impossible" they rarely mean it literally cannot be done by any means known to man. Typically what they're actually saying is they are unable to dedicate the time and resources to it for whatever reason. Over time many things can change such as the team's size and composition, budget, available technology, board directives, etc, and thus something that was once "impossible" becomes possible.

---

Thats what it is for real. Just dont like how the word "impossible" tends to get overused between them and the audience. Like of course the resources and coding arent up to par but saying "its impossible" is not the answer they should give.

Its ok to just say, "its currently improbable but we may or will work on it".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most

---

There is actually no words for this other than just wow.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Challenge for you - pull up Zepla's video and watch it again. Put Ren's post to the side so you can compare. Which is the long winded one?

---

lol the forums have a limit on text per post, how much longer do you think his posts would be if there wasn’t a limit.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

The preface he started with wasn't his. It was Zepla's own preface - but he cut it down in size.

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments. Evidently the generation raised on social media can't handle that.

It is what it is. It doesn't help that we're generally on opposite sides of the fence in a discussion, which makes them even less interested in trying to understand the other's point of view.

---

So you essentially think people on the forums are uneducated morons because all of us don't write 100k word responses and think your more educated and above everyone else.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BRVV

My very own insult :*
Welcome to the ignore list

---

Thank the Twelve. I am free.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nebelheim

So you essentially think people on the forums are uneducated morons because all of us don't write 100k word responses and think your more educated and above everyone else.

---

Hilarious. I'm also probably the wrong person to try to use education on lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

The preface he started with wasn't his. It was Zepla's own preface - but he cut it down in size.

---

Yup, he corrected me in a shorter post that I did read lol. That said, can you really blame me for assuming - his post was long enough it very well could have used a preface.

Quote:

---

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments. Evidently the generation raised on social media can't handle that.

---

In my education, I was taught to be concise and to know my audience. This is a gaming forum, not a professional debate or a trial.

Some may have the attention span to read very long posts that have 20 points or however many there were; but more likely than not you will just lose your reader entirely if you don't choose your battles and prioritize the most important points.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

I went to school in the 70s. When did you?

Trust me, the education system these days is very different from what it was for my generation. Ask your parents or your grandparents.

---

I think that's quite the stretch. You don't really know anything about individual posters that you're making assumptions about in terms of their age, education level and which country they were raised in.

To say nothing of the fact that there's plenty of individuals who are essentially 'self taught' and pretty intelligent/eloquent despite not having a piece of paper from a fancy university.

It's also a video game at the end of the day, so a lot of people deliberately don't treat discussion of it as something to take extremely seriously absolutely all of the time. Especially when there's a historic trend of silence from the community representatives who - in an ideal world - would be active participants in the discussions themselves.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Challenge for you - pull up Zepla's video and watch it again. Put Ren's post to the side so you can compare.

Which is the long winded one?


I went to school in the 70s. When did you?

Trust me, the education system these days is very different from what it was for my generation. Ask your parents or your grandparents.

---

I know. You would know that i know if you would have read my long post but i guess you are not interested in that discussion. Never talking about the topic you claim to want to discuss

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments. Evidently the generation raised on social media can't handle that.

---

Oh sure. I'm also sure that everyone will appreciate the condescension and eventually just stop arguing with whatever you say because you had a "different educational background."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Challenge for you - pull up Zepla's video and watch it again. Put Ren's post to the side so you can compare.

Which is the long winded one?


I went to school in the 70s. When did you?

Trust me, the education system these days is very different from what it was for my generation. Ask your parents or your grandparents.

---

Ok boomer.

https://media.tenor.com/_rabzV-JjTIA...emperature.gif

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments. Evidently the generation raised on social media can't handle that.

---

Oh, please. I had my schooling before social media. It has nothing to do with educational background. They cannot get their point across without resorting to dissertation length posts. It's ridiculous and most people just aren't going to bother. The difference between that and Zepla, you can watch/listen to someone speak for 30 min, easy. Hearing someone talk is a lot different to reading through some verbose argument that doesn't actually add anything. Also, I would note, even though, I think, they agree broadly with Zepla, they still can't help but comment on on her personally.
Discuss the bloody point, not Zeplas tone or hand movements or some imagined psych 101 eval on her state of mind.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments.

---

My background is learning science, so I was taught the opposite (for writing summaries of findings): be concise and try to say the exact same thing but with less words.

If you go through what you've written, you can usually find a word that will sufficiently convey a whole sentence. In other cases, there can be sentences that are obvious to your target audience or a word you wrote will remind them of the entire context so that you don't have to write it. You can also find a lot of words that are flat out unnecessary, because the English language contains a lot of bloat that other languages don't such as "what are the directions to the station?" while in another language you could walk up to someone and say "station?" and the rest is kind of obvious.

Usually if I end up writing a lot here it's because the original post is large as well. I try to keep at about medium here at most.

Drama is definitely the mortar that holds these forums together.

https://reactiongifs.me/wp-content/u...iana-Jones.gif

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Ren and I will both get "wordy" at times but it's probably because we have a different educational background from most here in the forums. I was taught to be detailed in my arguments. Evidently the generation raised on social media can't handle that.

---

Uh, educational background is irrelevant. At any level of education and even at any point in time you're really taught about brevity and clarity in writing. Yes, you need to be detailed, but there is a fine line between being detailed and hyper-saturating points with an egregious word count. There's literally no need to write something that is 200 words when it can be concisely written in under 50.

People can handle it, they just have a greater appreciation for time.

It really starts to make sense when some people are the way they are when you learn about their age.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Thats what it is for real. Just dont like how the word "impossible" tends to get overused between them and the audience. Like of course the resources and coding arent up to par but saying "its impossible" is not the answer they should give.

Its ok to just say, "its currently improbable but we may or will work on it".

---

I agree that would be a reasonable and more accurate response to give, but unfortunately players are often unreasonable. "We'll see what we can do" is twisted into "the devs PROMISED _____ !!!" We've all seen people whip themselves into a frenzy over something misconstrued or not said at all.

I don't blame any developer for wanting to just say they can't do a thing at all and then pleasantly surprise people later if the circumstances change. I've seen devs receive death threats for slightly changing the stats on a gun in an FPS. I would do the same thing in the dev's position.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CidHeiral

I agree that would be a reasonable and more accurate response to give, but unfortunately players are often unreasonable. "We'll see what we can do" is twisted into "the devs PROMISED _____ !!!" We've all seen people whip themselves into a frenzy over something misconstrued or not said at all.

I don't blame any developer for wanting to just say they can't do a thing at all and then pleasantly surprise people later if the circumstances change. I've seen devs receive death threats for slightly changing the stats on a gun in an FPS. I would do the same thing in the dev's position.

---

With Final Fantasy 14's engine code, yes, it's challenging, but to say it's impossible is purely an excuse.
What they've repeatedly told us was impossible actually became possible with the investment of money and time.

So yes, sometimes it's a major challenge, but nothing is impossible if they truly want it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by remiff

With Final Fantasy 14's engine code, yes, it's challenging, but to say it's impossible is purely an excuse.
What they've repeatedly told us was impossible actually became possible with the investment of money and time.

So yes, sometimes it's a major challenge, but nothing is impossible if they truly want it.

---

This was addressed previously in the conversation but it's easy to miss with how quickly the pages have been filling.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

??

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Renathras

??

---

https://media.tenor.com/nn_syhnljBMA...tarion-bg3.gif

Why would I trust the opinion of a mediocre content creator whose gripes with FF14 are entirely self-inflicted? No one asked for that 26 minute rant video, Xepla, everything you feel is entirely your own fault.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CidHeiral

This was addressed previously in the conversation but it's easy to miss with how quickly the pages have been filling.

---

"I understand, but I admit I haven't read all those messages.
It's progressing quickly, and many messages simply don't make me want to read them, between those who troll and those who post unreadable novels,
"I admit that the original topic was interesting to see various opinions, but the drift of some and the 105 pages just make me want to skim through things or even completely change the subject. :s

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Challenge for you - pull up Zepla's video and watch it again. Put Ren's post to the side so you can compare.

Which is the long winded one?

---

It's easier to watch or listen to someone say it than it is to read it. Different people absorb information in different ways. Some it's better reading, some are better auditory. This is some of the most basic understanding you can have.

The bigger point is that this is an internet forum, seeing a gigantic wall of text that can be summarized with the point made much shorter makes people not want to read it, especially when it's a constant. We're aren't here to read booklets overexplaining something that's brutally overanalyzed and gets us nowhere.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

I went to school in the 70s. When did you?

Trust me, the education system these days is very different from what it was for my generation. Ask your parents or your grandparents.

---

I try to not do this in a response, and if I do I usually edit it out or modify it in hindsight, but I'll just be blunt here. Literally no one cares, what years you went to school is completely irrelevant. Age is not an indicator of anything except how old you are. It does not bring wisdom, it does not by default mean you are more intelligent or better at anything as age on its own does not provide such, experience does.

Things changing in education and with the times is nothing new and is inevitable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

Why would I trust the opinion of a mediocre content creator whose gripes with FF14 are entirely self-inflicted? No one asked for that 26 minute rant video, Xepla, everything you feel is entirely your own fault.

---

Nobody said you have to take everything she says in her video as gospel, but there's nothing to suggest that she's the only one feeling this way about FF14 and that her feelings are solely her fault.

You certainly haven't read some of the points that some people, including myself, have raised about a shared feeling with her, without necessarily watching Zepla's content.

After all, it would be unfair to hold it against you, given that the threads has completely gone off the rails.

I think the bustling activity on the thread kind of proves the original point. After all, if people had stuff to keep them busy in game, they wouldn't have time to argue on the forums!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rolder50

I think the bustling activity on the thread kind of proves the original point. After all, if people had stuff to keep them busy in game, they wouldn't have time to argue on the forums!

---

Especially for some people who say they just post while waiting for dungeon queues etc... those must be some pretty lengthy queues given the posts in question.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I think that's quite the stretch. You don't really know anything about individual posters that you're making assumptions about in terms of their age, education level and which country they were raised in.

To say nothing of the fact that there's plenty of individuals who are essentially 'self taught' and pretty intelligent/eloquent despite not having a piece of paper from a fancy university.

It's also a video game at the end of the day, so a lot of people deliberately don't treat discussion of it as something to take extremely seriously absolutely all of the time. Especially when there's a historic trend of silence from the community representatives who - in an ideal world - would be active participants in the discussions themselves.

---

Please stop making me nod in agreement and I do like your very articulated and considered responses as I have mentioned before, please try and refrain from taking forum breaks :)

--------

Meanwhile a streamer I don't watch caused a forum post, so listened to it along with the the follow up. She has an opinion which is as valid as anyone else, whilst a streamer and making a living from it I did take that into consideration whilst drawing my conclusions. I agreed with some of what she said it and disagreed on other points she mentioned. When this game based on my own personal measure of simply when the fun stops, stop. Now Theodric doesn't share my love of G'raha in fact I would say the very opposite, won't speak for him though, but doesn't stop me reading his thoughts and considering his perspective to keep myself informed and see another view and always in the spirit of good banter. In fact if we chatted about at e.g. fanfest, it would be a great conversation and I would part from it having had a good chat.

I do hope though very unlikely that these posts do cause some conversation and debate back in HQ and with those specifically involved in the game, though any outcomes are impossible to please all parties I suppose.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jojoya

Challenge for you - pull up Zepla's video and watch it again. Put Ren's post to the side so you can compare.

Which is the long winded one?

---

It could take less time to read Ren's posts, yeah. That doesn't mean that everyone has the desire to. Personally, I can enjoy a lengthy read so long as I'm not trying to navigate some pretty serious mental gymnastics or if there's actually a point to be made. I'm not talking about Ren specifically there, only in general. Still, that is comparing apples to oranges. The arguments that both of them have put out there are nothing alike.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ChrysOCE

Ok so, just for you, you say complete in 3-4 weeks. What content in EW holds over for 2-3 months? What content is going to hold over for 6.5-7.0? And you say, once you have done that, you point to a proverbial laundry list of stuff... from previous expansions?! That's what is being argued! There's nothing to hold long term interest in EW so, for people who are current, we either have to go back to previous expansions to find content or we just hang about or we just not login. The game design in EW patches has been sub-par and, my personal view, nothing seen yet (and yes, understand early days) in DT speaks to any real kind of change of course.

---

See, thank you for proving my point. This is why you don't get useful feedback, because you either just ignore it, attack the people providing it, or stuff lies in people's mouths and then attack them for it. For the record, my "laundry list" also includes the latest Variant Dungeon and Island Sanctuary, both of which are from EW and which I haven't started yet. I didn't even think about the new deep dungeon. But hey, I happened to pick one particular thing that's from a past expansion, and you immediately claim that's my entire list and then try to jump down my throat for it...and then you wonder why the doomsayers on this forum are ignored by anyone who actually matters (i.e. the dev team).

Of all the things going on in here, Jojoya getting ragdolled along with Renathras was definitely one of them lmao.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BaconBits

Of all the things going on in here, Jojoya getting ragdolled along with Renathras was definitely one of them lmao.

---

To be fair jojoya generally holds opinions that I don’t agree with but is mostly respectful, but defending quite possibly the longest post I have ever seen of ren’s with “we are just smarter than you” was always going to be a recipe to get dogpilled

New challenge: watch the video and shorten it as much as possible without losing viewpoints.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BaconBits

Of all the things going on in here, Jojoya getting ragdolled along with Renathras was definitely one of them lmao.

---

I'm guessing both of their next series of posts are about to get particularly spicy.