I think its time BRD get some loving

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

what about BLACK MAGES?

convert : utility
Apocatastasis : utility
manawall : utility
freeze: spell that never gets used...useless
flare : spell used only on aoe/burst

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You're comparing apples to oranges. Tell me how a single-person utility spell is similar to four party-wide support spells. Please, enlighten me.

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

That is why Parses have never and never will be a full true and accurate representation to what someone brings to the party. That the damage that has been boosted by the BRD shows on a parser for the BRD is irrelevant and shows on edimensional thinking inregards to what they bring to the party. No BRD or no Paeons means no increase in the overall parties damage. That is what support abilities do as opposed to self buffs.

So yes it is yours, your the reason why the overall party DPS increased. Because with out it there is no DPS increase

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Except, that would also mean, the 10% piercing damage from dragoons I get as a bard, goes to them. 10% of slashing damage from NIN/WAR would compliment each other and the paladin.. The argument still lies in the fact, it's a utility people provide to other jobs in your party. Generally, people self buff their damage in this game. It's not OUR damage. We're just providing them with a utility to do more damage. Just like other jobs provide utility to do more damage themselves.

If only parses showed the DPS gain from bard's party buffs for the bard instead of everyone else, I'm sure there'd be a lot less complaining. Oh wait, you're one of the SEVEN bards in WoD that aren't using Requiem? Sigh.

Oh and don't forget, Requiem is helping your healers' DPS as well (yes, our healers DPS in FCOB, yours should be too). If I'm not mistaken, it works on a few Ninja abilities too.

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Originally Posted by Galdous

No matter what theories people come out with it does not work because we went through this in 2.0. Bards were above all other dps jobs when our dps was boosted. Your proof that bards do not need buffs are pretty blatant if you log in and see the 50 bards standing around you vs every other job. Bards are so overplayed for a reason. Because they perform at the higher dps echelon with less skill required and have high mobility for having 90% of the dps of the other jobs. Please SE do not make us more OP then we already are.

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The people you play with seem pretty bad if you feel OP.

The only way bards out DPS is if other jobs are screwing up, over-dodging, refusing to use gap closers etc. Thats only because our AA can hit from far away.

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Originally Posted by TheWaywardWind

You're comparing apples to oranges. Tell me how a single-person utility spell is similar to four party-wide support spells. Please, enlighten me.

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Apocathasis was DRGs best freind pre buff. Countless DRGs lives were saved by this in T13.

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Originally Posted by GalkaBikini

If only parses showed the DPS gain from bard's party buffs for the bard instead of everyone else, I'm sure there'd be a lot less complaining. Oh wait, you're one of the SEVEN bards in WoD that aren't using Requiem? Sigh.

Oh and don't forget, Requiem is helping your healers' DPS as well (yes, our healers DPS in FCOB, yours should be too). If I'm not mistaken, it works on a few Ninja abilities too.

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It doesnt matter. WAR slashing debuff, Goad, TA, Disembowel, blunt debuff is all the same or better depending on party.

And yes, there are way too many ARCHERS that dont sing. (not bard) I hate it when our random party doesnt get another foes when my mp is dry

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Originally Posted by Airashii

Except, snip

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Because you are still thinking linearly, and not in regards to what you bring to the party overall. If no BRD, no Foes, so caster damage is lower. If BRD caster damage is increased because of the BRD. Supprt or hybrid support, are to compliment and increase the effectiveness of the party. Thats their strength, not some arbitary figure on parser that doesn't show the full story.

Stop talking parsers as gospel. Its like watching parts 1, 5 and 11 of a 15 part series. Gives you a general; idea, but you dont get the full picture. Ive been using parsers since EQ1 so fully aware of how much they display and don't display.

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

Because you are still thinking linearly, and not in regards to what you bring to the party overall. If no BRD, no Foes, so caster damage is lower. If BRD caster damage is increased because of the BRD. Supprt or hybrid support, are to compliment and increase the effectiveness of the party. Thats their strength, not some arbitary figure on parser that doesn't show the full story.

Stop talking parsers as gospel. Its like watching parts 1, 5 and 11 of a 15 part series. Gives you a general; idea, but you dont get the full picture. Ive been using parsers since EQ1 so fully aware of how much they display and don't display.

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I'm aware what each damage buff does for the group. I'm just stating you shouldn't start "adding it to your DPS." To me, it's the groups DPS. All I care about for my DPS is being able to push my best numbers possible while doing my job.

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Originally Posted by DoubleD

It doesnt matter. WAR slashing debuff, Goad, TA, Disembowel, blunt debuff is all the same or better depending on party.

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How many of those debuffs are applied to ALL enemies in area with the click of ONE button? None. All of those debuffs are applied to SINGLE targets AFTER using a few other abilities beforehand. The two add phases in T10 and phase 3 of T12 come to mind. What happens when you increase caster damage of 4 or 5 mobs by 10%, then increase that to 20% per mob with Battle Voice?

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Originally Posted by TheWaywardWind

And Mage's Ballad. And Swift.
And Battle Voice. 80% of your job abilities are pure support. Only one is a DPS action.

Other classes, however, are nowhere near this. Also, see above.

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Did you really just throw swiftsong out there?? lolol

3 songs that support the party, and each of them only benefit partial party members.

Paeon 5/8 supported
Ballad 3/8 supported
Foes 3/8 supported

Every other dps class has at least 2 party support abilities as well. With just about the same weight in terms of value. This is what really gets me, its the fact that everyone seems to love ignoring this fact.

Not to mention every song that we have is only played for MAYBE 30seconds at a time (FOE's being the exception) and even that is pushing it. So tell me why its such a big deal to remove the debuff from it?

Do You think a bard is going to play ballad all day long now because of it?? WRONG
Do you think a bard is going to play Paeon all day long now because of it?? WRONG

The fact that you think this is what bards would do if it was removed tells me you know absolutely nothing about the bard job at all. Do you think that all of a sudden you are going to see FC's stacking 4 bards to plow through content, you must be out your mind.