World of Warcraft died because the developers only catered to casuals and world prog

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Originally Posted by Erik501

Sorry but I see this "story" repeated over and over again and it is very very far from an accurate description of Yoshida's answer. No, that was not the answer at all. He first provided a quite substantial explanation about what their purpose was, that we were in the first patch, that they wanted everybody to have an easy go in the first tier, that things would get a bit harder as the patches roll and then, after he gave his complete answer he added, clearly in a joking tone, that you could "play ultimate and suffer" IIRC. You may agree or disagree with his reasons to keep it as easy as it is (meaning the reasons explained before the actual joke), of course, but completely ignoring the important part of the answer, I mean, the real answer, and then quoting the irrelevant part of it completely out of context as if it was the only answer is not only unfair, it is dishonest.

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The problem is this is not a new complaint this is a complaint that has been going on since Stormblood. It shouldn't take several patch cycles for a healer to play and feel like a healer. So when you have complaints that span almost 5 years, and you joke and say to go play ultimate it's easy to see that as sincere. And it is funny because in the past Yoshi P has said healers are healers they are not meant to dps at all they are meant to heal. I don't think Yoshi has a clue, because the game has been designed with DPS requirements requiring healers to DPS, and small sections of AOE healing to give the healer a purpose for those healing spells. The jobs aren't designed well as healers, they aren't designed well for dps, and the content now is not designed well for them at all. So I wouldn't consider it unfair or dishonest I would consider it a distasteful joke.

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Originally Posted by Y2K21

The major issues with difficulty were within that Heroics had a super low barrier of entry, but were tuned hard. Then they got nerfed to be faceroll.

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They weren't nerfed to be faceroll until after the mass exodus occurred. By then, it was too late. All the midcore players had left, and everyone remaining either became a hardcore raider or an ultra casual. From then on Blizzard kept going more extreme on both sides. The hard content got harder, and the easier content got easier and ever less rewarding.

You're also missing a crucial detail. Even though heroic dungeons were tuned to be harder than normal raids, their gear rewards were still 25 item levels lower than normal raid gear drops. Blizzard clearly sent a message that they wanted us to raid or quit. Most of us quit. I was an idiot who adopted a harecore style of play and stuck around a couple more years, but I eventually got tired of it because the lifestyle wasn't doing my wife or kids any favors. I resubbed at the end of BFA because my kids had grown and I actually had time on my hands again, but I quit a couple of months into Shadowlands when I saw how much worse it had gotten.

Troll Heroics were hard, but at least the timer was an optional one-off activity that awarded a fun mount. Now your loot quality is entirely dependent on that timer. I personally enjoy the challenge of running with newer players who are learning mechanics, but I hate the fact that this style of gameplay in WoW deprives players of progress and meaningful loot rewards. I'm sure I'm not alone.

Thankfully FFXIV doesn't do that. If it did, you'd never see any party finder listings with "learning" or "practice" in the title.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

Watching the world first race I am honestly just confused most of the time, it's so hard to see what's actually happening.
Things look like they're going fine but then suddenly the tank and whole group just dies to seemingly nothing, the game rly does a terrible job at telling you what's going on.

At least in FFXIV I think even if you don't play the game you can still with some common sense see some tells and at least know that something is going to happen even if you don't know what.
In WoW it so often just looks like the boss is auto-attacking and then BANG, everyone is dead.
I actually remember this now thinking back to it too when I used to raid especially with my guild in Cata, I always felt like things were going fine but then we just died and I'd have no clue what happened.
And we weren't horrible or anything we did clear the content but I still remember being left with the feeling that deaths were a mystery too often.
In FFXIV I can see exactly what happens and why we wipe, it's very rare that the group wipes and that I don't know why it happened.

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Too right.
Quite literally everything in boss fights are just ?????
RLs in WoW who took on content on the first day were usually naturally talented strategists and could figure these things out and explain it to the group. I was honestly quite envious and at the same time not envious of my RL who could figure out strats without waiting on vids/guides.

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Originally Posted by Erik501

Sorry but I see this "story" repeated over and over again and it is very very far from an accurate description of Yoshida's answer. No, that was not the answer at all. He first provided a quite substantial explanation about what their purpose was, that we were in the first patch, that they wanted everybody to have an easy go in the first tier, that things would get a bit harder as the patches roll and then, after he gave his complete answer he added, clearly in a joking tone, that you could "play ultimate and suffer" IIRC. You may agree or disagree with his reasons to keep it as easy as it is (meaning the reasons explained before the actual joke), of course, but completely ignoring the important part of the answer, I mean, the real answer, and then quoting the irrelevant part of it completely out of context as if it was the only answer is not only unfair, it is dishonest.

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Why would he in a serious note talk about stuff that takes all jobs in consideration when only healer did ask him about what they think about changing healer and make them more interesting ?.

So it’s fine for dps roles to be actually difficult and fun too play but for healer it’s for getting easy in the game ? At lvl 90 ??? Whm has the moment he reaches lvl 4 his full damage rotation. You can actually with serious face tell me that healer gameplay is good and not sleep inducing? And I don’t take that as a funny joke anymore after over 5 years getting neglected as old healer player who jumped too Meele, so it hurts my soul seeing other healer player suffer so much. Like you can tell me what you want but when you even as a joke say “go play ultimate” at the end of healer question a role like I said that was ignored for over 5 years then I have no idea what you think is good way too treat a big part of the community.

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Originally Posted by IdowhatIwant

The problem is this is not a new complaint this is a complaint that has been going on since Stormblood. It shouldn't take several patch cycles for a healer to play and feel like a healer. So when you have complaints that span almost 5 years, and you joke and say to go play ultimate it's easy to see that as sincere. And it is funny because in the past Yoshi P has said healers are healers they are not meant to dps at all they are meant to heal. I don't think Yoshi has a clue, because the game has been designed with DPS requirements requiring healers to DPS, and small sections of AOE healing to give the healer a purpose for those healing spells. The jobs aren't designed well as healers, they aren't designed well for dps, and the content now is not designed well for them at all. So I wouldn't consider it unfair or dishonest I would consider it a distasteful joke.

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Don’t forget the man told us back in heavensward that whm heals more then scholar in raids when the entire opposite was happening because sch had good ogcd healing tools and whm had jack. Or stormblood lily system were the whm player base told them it’s garbage and that they should pls change it only for the devs too go “ go playtest and see” and like they said it was so useless it was sad.

I think WoW is killing itself even further with the horrendous conclusion of the story. The majority of streamers I've seen reacting to the newest cutscenes seem to have extremely negative reviews of it.

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Originally Posted by kpxmanifesto

I think WoW is killing itself even further with the horrendous conclusion of the story. The majority of streamers I've seen reacting to the newest cutscenes seem to have extremely negative reviews of it.

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Thats and its awful patch cycle pacing. The whole Zereth Mortis zone and the last raid felt like it shouldve been there since launch day due to its relevancy. This is something I praise FFXIV's expansion content launch, it at least tells a completed story with post expansion patch content just giving us an expanded aftermath.

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Originally Posted by kpxmanifesto

I think WoW is killing itself even further with the horrendous conclusion of the story. The majority of streamers I've seen reacting to the newest cutscenes seem to have extremely negative reviews of it.

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It was hilarious to watch the world first streamers kill him and then when the cutscene ended one of them said loudly '' well that was shit '' xD...
Tbh the level of incompetence is hard to believe, it's not just the overall story either it's also the dialogue itself it's horribly written.
It really does seem as if it was written by studio executives or something.

It's quite telling when I heard people say that the intro cutscene was great I just...
Is that really how low the bar is for WoW?
It feels like they're just trying to be '' cool '' and not tell a story, queue the dramatic orchestral score and generic villain monologue.

Edit: It's really sad too because I do love a lot of the characters, there actually was some good stuff with Jaina too in BFA imo.
It's not just WoW either tho, I hated what they did with Starcraft and especially with Kerrigan.
She was such an incredible character in Starcraft 1 and Brood War and in Starcraft 2 they went back and forth with her going from Zerg to Human and they turned her into space Jesus fighting bio Reapers from Mass Effect ( hated what they did with the Zerg too, turned them into beasts instead of a parasite type of alien ).

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Originally Posted by Mortex

Why would he in a serious note talk about stuff that takes all jobs in consideration when only healer did ask him about what they think about changing healer and make them more interesting ?.

So it’s fine for dps roles to be actually difficult and fun too play but for healer it’s for getting easy in the game ? At lvl 90 ??? Whm has the moment he reaches lvl 4 his full damage rotation. You can actually with serious face tell me that healer gameplay is good and not sleep inducing? And I don’t take that as a funny joke anymore after over 5 years getting neglected as old healer player who jumped too Meele, so it hurts my soul seeing other healer player suffer so much. Like you can tell me what you want but when you even as a joke say “go play ultimate” at the end of healer question a role like I said that was ignored for over 5 years then I have no idea what you think is good way too treat a big part of the community.

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Good, if you want to address his answer that is the way to do it: you explain why you believe he is wrong in his real answer and don't use the joke to make a straw man. Thank you. I can't say if I agree with you or with Yoshida, I am not in Endwalker territory yet, so I lack the information to make an honest opinion about that.

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Originally Posted by kpxmanifesto

I think WoW is killing itself even further with the horrendous conclusion of the story. The majority of streamers I've seen reacting to the newest cutscenes seem to have extremely negative reviews of it.

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20 years Warcraft ... for this. :( I guess, the WoW devs are too fixated on metrics. The majority of the players does not read the quest texts. So i guess, the devs thought, that the story is not so important because the players simply ignore it. But they are wrong. And i am curious what WoW 10 will bring to the table. It will be "Danuser's baby" (Danuser is the story lead in the WoW team). And Asmongold meant, if this is "Danuser's baby", then he wants an abortion. :X



Cheers