What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

Tough luck then that the writers provided lore allowing for potential workarounds to the ancients' high aetheric density posing an issue for dynamis. I frankly don't care for arguments about what we're "supposed" to believe. The writers can try make the point and I can either take it or leave it depending on whether I find it persuasive. In this case, to me it is not at all persuasive. They have also gone on the record in the past on how different aspects of the story are open to interpretation. A character's opinion on the matter falls in that category to me.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Keep in mind this is the Emet that toiled centuries to being about a rejoining. The rejoining methods would not have brought them that far that is correct.

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That is actually a good point as well.

It also wasn't so long ago that Tempering was considered to be irreversible and something that could result only in slaying the Tempered as an act of mercy. Quite a few characters suggested as much only for a cure to be found at a later date. In itself, that is but one example of an established 'impossibility' later turning out to have some workaround.

I also rather suspect that the Ancients would stand a far better chance fighting against the Final Days had they not been dealing with a subversive traitor within their midst who deliberately withheld key information that would have served to aid in the investigations.

Furthermore, when increasingly contrived plot devices such as time travel and alternate universes are embraced to justify the continued existence of major protagonists, then it stands to reason that such methods could in theory be deployed in the case of the antagonists as well.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

It also wasn't so long ago that Tempering was considered to be irreversible and something that could result only in slaying the Tempered as an act of mercy. Quite a few characters suggested as much only for a cure to be found at a later date. In itself, that is but one example of an established 'impossibility' later turning out to have some workaround.

I also rather suspect that the Ancients would stand a far better chance fighting against the Final Days had they not been dealing with a subversive traitor within their midst who deliberately withheld key information that would have served to aid in the investigations.

Furthermore, when increasingly contrived plot devices such as time travel and alternate universes are embraced to justify the continued existence of major protagonists, then it stands to reason that such methods could in theory be deployed in the case of the antagonists as well.

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/cough ... Zenos...

In the end the truth is you have some people that loved Twilight and some people that hated it. Same here, you have some that loved it and some who think it was not up to the standard we have seen. That doesn't mean everyone will feel that way. Good on you if you loved it, I wish I had. I loved ShB.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

It’s as simple as having a minion made in memory of him.For either of them really. We don’t even have a dialogue option to thank Elidibus for what he did or to even bring it up to Emet despite Emet basically having a hand in his demise.

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The thing is, I could see there being no one who would care enough to make a minion in memory of Zodiark.

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There were statues of Zodiark before the final days even hit, in Akadaemia.

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Maybe Zodiark was based on those statues. Either way, I don't think we have anything that discusses the appearance of Zodiark or its origin, if any, before the summoning. If we do, please share.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

Emet wouldn't have done better:
https://i.ibb.co/t2KHGPM/3.png

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Yeah, kinda hard to when they didn't even know about Meteion, cause someone didn't bother telling them...

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Originally Posted by linayar

The thing is, I could see there being no one who would care enough to make a minion in memory of Zodiark.

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I don’t think they even say who made the Venat minion though. For Zodiark they could just chalk it off to it being one of the remaining sundered, or that it was found as an early concept in Amaurot. Easily done. We already have the little amaurotine minion that’s essentially a concept. It wouldn’t be very far fetched and it could at least go into some detail of him outright keeping the world safe.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

I don’t think they even say who made the Venat minion though. For Zodiark they could just chalk it off to it being one of the remaining sundered, or that it was found as an early concept in Amaurot. Easily done. We already have the little amaurotine minion that’s essentially a concept. It wouldn’t be very far fetched and it could at least go into some detail of him outright keeping the world safe.

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Easily done, sure, but also easily not done. Like I said before, I don't think it's that big of a deal. It doesn't add or subtract to the story/worldbuilding, just nice to have, but also doesn't need to exist.

I love how often that one line from Emet keeps being brought up as somehow proof the Ancients couldn't have done better. This is the same man who was flabbergasted in Elpis about there being another form of energy he'd never heard of before, he wasn't all knowing.

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Originally Posted by linayar

Easily done, sure, but also easily not done. Like I said before, I don't think it's that big of a deal. It doesn't add or subtract to the story/worldbuilding, just nice to have, but also doesn't need to exist.

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I think it’s fairly strange to drive home the idea that both sides are equal but to then constantly give one side far more attention than the other. Especially given how the themes have been recently. It’s especially strange how we’re given 2 graha minions in one expansion when we haven’t had any whatsoever for the ascians/ancients outside of the one that is tied to the angelic god of the game, who is also treated as benevolent and kind. I think the bias should be called out so that maybe in the future they see that there are people that care more for the other side as well and would like to see some equality for once.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

I think it’s fairly strange to drive home the idea that both sides are equal but to then constantly give one side far more attention than the other. Especially given how the themes have been recently. It’s especially strange how we’re given 2 graha minions in one expansion when we haven’t had any whatsoever for the ascians/ancients outside of the one that is tied to the angelic god of the game, who is also treated as benevolent and kind. I think the bias should be called out so that maybe in the future they see that there are people that care more for the other side as well and would like to see some equality for once.

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Ok, maybe this is at the center of our differing views. I don't understand what you mean by both sides are equal. Therefore, I must currently reject the idea of that point having been driven home.

Also, any story implication does not necessitate the treatment of minions one way or another. If they want to make a minion of something, they can. If not, they can choose not to as well.