[dev1206] Class Reforms & Action Lists

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Lol how can you assume so much without even playing it yet? How do you know they aren't changing how elements damage do to mobs that are weak against it? If I'm not mistaken, we are also getting stat redistribution to an extent, so who's to say you can't focus on one type of element?

I mean sheesh, you just keep b*tching
just keep b*tching
just keep just keep just keep b*tching
What do we do when we don't like change? B*tchinggg B*tchinggg

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Are you Dumb or do you not realize that the point of these forums is to give feed back on the Game?

I think these changes are awful. I'm not going to keep that from the Devs. They have a right to know these changes are awful.

I honestly believe that implementing these class changes in this way will do irreparable harm to this game. MMO players these days are lazy. They are not going to play an MMO in which soloing is a chore.

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Originally Posted by PrettyPrincess

....says who?

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Yoshida did actually, way back when he took over. He said something to the effect that he's only got one chance to really drastically change things.

While I may not agree with what Kiote's saying or how he's saying it, he does have a bit of a point. Right now is the time to start giving feedback and letting the developers know our concerns. If we can spot an issue a mile away that they might have missed or that they can monitor before release, it'll save us all a headache in the long run.

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Originally Posted by Krausus

MRD Abl. 3 - Grants Absorb HP effect to next attack.

PUG Abl. 1 - Restores HP.

PUG Abl. 2 - Makes your next attack a crit when executed from behind the target. Traits may trigger INT bonus.

ARC Abl. 2 - Reduces enmity and increases TP generated by next action.

CON Mag. 1 - Restores a portion of the target's HP.

CON Mag. 5 - Creates a barrier around the target that prevents a fixed amount of damage.

THM Abl. 5 - Reduces MP cost of next attack magic spell by half, and restores MP when cast is complete.

are some of the cross class abilities I will be using for party AND Solo play

fundamental play styles are not changing at all, you are just looking for something to bitch about.

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So you will give your self a couple heals..

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Originally Posted by Kiote

YOu have describe the Party roles of every Class. Solo Combat is what classes are for and they operate completely differently. You cannot honestly believe that Conjurers Soloed by "Mostly Healing"

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How has the solo style of CNJ really changed? You still have nukes. Nuke, cure, nuke, cure. Your means of soloing has not changed.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

Gladiators specialized in Reactive WSs and Shutting down enemy abilities. They now have No offensive Skills

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The only "reactive" weaponskill Gladiator had was Phalanx I/II. The only real damaging abilities they have are Riot Blade (Which shouldn't be used as a DD WS) and Circle Slash I/II. These are not definitions of the fundamentals of the job. Tanking is.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

Lancer was a Tactical fighter with a steady defense. They are now all out DD with no Tactics or Defense

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The combo systems negates your entire "no tactics" argument. And it's good that they don't have high defense capabilites, or else we get into the problem XI had where any melee job could tank and the actual tanking classes are passed over. Also, LNC is still retaining it's class fundamental of "Damage Dealer"

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Originally Posted by Kiote

Conjurer was an Run and Gun nuker who specialized in mitigating Damage and elemental magic. They now heal.

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Maybe back in the day when mage jobs could solo anything becaue of Emulate, but since then CNJ has been a primarily healing class. The fundamental job of healing and party support has not changed.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

Thaumaturge specialized in Enfeeballing and Nuking to take down enemies and absord spells to boost their skills. Now they nuke.

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I believe some of the spells have additional effects as well. And really? You used Absorb Attack/Accuracy/Evasion to boost your mages stats?

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Originally Posted by Kiote

Archer was a heavy ranged DD that specialized in precision and control. Now they are an abomination that dont even get to chose the rate at which they expend there arrows.. Infinite quiver is just a step away.

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They are gaining even MORE control abilities when the job updates. Also, if you don't want to shoot an arrow, turn away, close your action bar, enter passive mode, or (if it's implemented as such) disable the toggle for auto-shooting. And Archer is still retaining it's fundamental role as a ranged damage dealer.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

MRD and PUG are the only two classes that have escaped most unscathed. Except now PUG has the useless ability to attach fire to its melee attacks. A skill that will do nothing considering very few enemies in this game are weak to fire and elemental dmg does nothing to increase potency without elemental weakness.

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You should read up on a Monk ability from XI called "Formless Strikes". Have you considered the possibility that besides elemental weakness, there may be enemies who take more damage from magic attacks? Take less physical damage? Have a physical barrier that causes only elemental attacks to deal damage?

You can still use every single job in a solo situation and light parties. Hell, you can use all of them effectivley in a full party, raids and bosses until jobs come along.

You're arguing a point that has no validity. The fundamentals of the classes are remaining intact and the means of performing that fundamental purpose have simply been adjusted.



EDIT: Also, it was mentioned classes are for Solo AND Light Party play. Not just solo.

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Originally Posted by Arcell

Yoshida did actually, way back when he took over. He said something to the effect that he's only got one chance to really drastically change things.

While I may not agree with what Kiote's saying or how he's saying it, he does have a bit of a point. Right now is the time to start giving feedback and letting the developers know our concerns. If we can spot an issue a mile away that they might have missed or that they can monitor before release, it'll save us all a headache in the long run.

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but he's basically saying they destroyed soloing with these changes when they obviously did not and he's bitching just to bitch.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

So you will give your self a couple heals..

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yeah because lancer already has everything else it needs to be great at solo play

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Originally Posted by Arcell

Yoshida did actually, way back when he took over. He said something to the effect that he's only got one chance to really drastically change things.

While I may not agree with what Kiote's saying or how he's saying it, he does have a bit of a point. Right now is the time to start giving feedback and letting the developers know our concerns. If we can spot an issue a mile away that they might have missed or that they can monitor before release, it'll save us all a headache in the long run.

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Yea, Kiote's acerbic comments aren't helping matters. But now is the time to put together a list of concerns for the Reps to take back to the Dev team for further clarification.

I too would like to complain about things that I don't yet understand fully and haven't had a chance to try out. Everyone listen to the opinions that I formed in the last few minutes after skimming the announcement!

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Originally Posted by Arcell

Yoshida did actually, way back when he took over. He said something to the effect that he's only got one chance to really drastically change things.

While I may not agree with what Kiote's saying or how he's saying it, he does have a bit of a point. Right now is the time to start giving feedback and letting the developers know our concerns. If we can spot an issue a mile away that they might have missed or that they can monitor before release, it'll save us all a headache in the long run.

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Agreed. I'm not a fan of a good amount of these changes, so I, like the Dev's, would be interested in hearing the potential issues that alot of these changes may cause.. BEFORE they are implemented. It is somewhat exciting to be able to try out some new abilites, but we seemed to LOSE a helluva lot more than we gained.. I'da been happier with them just incorporating some of the new abilities/combos while keeping the majority of abilites we already had, there was no need to wash out everyones action list completely, and then turn around and give us fewer options to customize our playstyles.. We'll see how this all goes in a month I suppose..

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Originally Posted by DNO

hahahha so true. read my sig!!. i need to add this to my sig also.

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I feel honored :p. But its true.. Peoples head buttexplodes on every announcement... "WTF MAN ARE YOU F'IN KIDDING ME" Type attitudes is what I hear out of the handful of complainers :/. At least other Complainers had Reasons to complain about... this Nothing really changes, Just "actually defining the roles of the classes, while still be able ( to a degree) cross-class. This argument is so Idiotic its not funny :/.