Materia System

Materia makes more sense than Magicite would, as Magicite is linked to two things in FF, in terms of major releases:

1. FFVI's Espers, which gave some stat gains but..it's main use was for summons.

2. FFXI was material created inside of the cermet spines and basically held memories of the beastmen past.

Materia, or even Evolith fits more, but it's not really trying to appeal to ffvii fans..it's a tenative name and it fits what purpose it seems to have, much like them calling moogles in xiv moogles is because that's what they are :P

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Originally Posted by Malakhim

See how easy this is? You should quit while you're ahead.

Calling it magicite makes even less sense because the whole "equip and unequip stones to your weapons/armor to increase stats n' stuff" fits more with the materia system, which was "equip and unequip stones to your weapons/armor to increase stats n' stuff". Magicite has much more to do with "magical creatures having their forms and power crystallized into a stone that you equip unto your character". That isn't what they're doing with this system.

Plus, materia rolls off the tongue much easier than magicite.

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In all fairness, Kefka's face wouldn't sell as well ;).

Also, Materia was about more then just stats, much more. They primarily added abilities, spells, or summons, and also happened to increase the stats that supported said new powers.

Magicite was, especially on the surface, mostly about summoning, granted. Yet each Magicite also increased a particular stat for the character it was equipped on if they leveled up with it on. Handled from early enough, you could create quite the buffed up characters, to the point where the Summons actually took a backseat.

Hence why I'm curious to see what, exactly, the system in XIV can do :).

sounds interesting but does have the potential of making people never wear their great gear, or having to use sub gear most of the time for materia farming.

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Originally Posted by Physic

sounds interesting but does have the potential of making people never wear their great gear, or having to use sub gear most of the time for materia farming.

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Maybe I missed something, but did Bay's post imply that the process is automatic? I kinda got the feeling it was more by choice than anything else.

Either way, I'm now a little worried, though I guess materia stacking won't equate to destroying the weapon or armor you're attacking it to...I hope. Too much history with that kind of equipment enhancing system.

You guys remember skill up parties in FFXI, right?

Well here they are again. That simple.

Also, gatherers are in THE highest position of power. No catalyst = no materia grafting, and who are the only ones who can collect catalysts again?

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Originally Posted by Malakhim

You guys remember skill up parties in FFXI, right?

Well here they are again. That simple.

Also, gatherers are in THE highest position of power. No catalyst = no materia grafting, and who are the only ones who can collect catalysts again?

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No way. They would shoot themselves in the foot by not AVOIDING grinding and farming for this system. It's poor game design, and archaic MMO content.

Just because gathering mats are required doesn't mean the gatherers who gather them will mean anything. See: the current crafting system in its entirety where gatherers are treated like common ants because their products are so oversupplied and common.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

Here's a running list of potential problems that would need attention given the info we have. This is made with the idea that the devs want feedback on this system from the players.

1. Matsui's new system focuses on rewarding the effort and innovation of players playing at their best, but this system seems to incentivize equipping low-grade equipment to battle. These focuses seem antagonistic to each other, and a player may be forced to choose between being at their best and getting materia.

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I see your point, but what are the alternatives? If you simply allow items to be turned into materia without the 'attachment points', a single crafter could EASILY flood the market with materia. Just think about how many walnut masks have already been vendored. In the end it's a somewhat messy compromise. It doesn't provide a complete item sink for the TONS of items being produced, but it also doesn't flood the market with materia from day one.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

2. Jobs that have already hit the level cap sustain massive reductions in the amount of hits they perform on a given weapon or in a given armor set, relegating attachment to gear to a "grinding" activity like levelling or farming, which are either impossible for some or not fun for most.

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I have seen any mention of how the attachment points are generated, just "by use". If it's a conversion of the old physical level xp system, then people at rank cap can just as easily (if not more so) generate attachment points.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

3. Materia growing appears to be an activity that favors current unaddressed problems in the game: players who farm shards with bots will now have more incentive to continue this activity. Let's not pretend that at this very moment, most players in those small caves and tucked away dungeon corners out there in Eorzea aren't actually there. If materia growing is grindable, there are already bots for that, and RMT will be all over it.

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I see your point. I really do. However, as has been pointed out many times before, not every design decision made by SE can revolve around limiting botting / RMT activities.
I would really hope that this the materia production is not controlled by botters and RMTers, but I can't think of another permutation of the system that doesn't do so in just the same way.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

4. This system will eventually settle out to what outcome is common and what is rare as a means to distinguish materia on gear. For battlers, that rare event seems to be HQ'ing materia as their mechanism for power. For crafters, it seems to be that rare double materia attach. Where is the power-outcome for gatherers to give them equal weight?

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Well, I haven't seen an answer as to my question about whether crafters and gatherers can gain attachment points for the tools and armor that they use. So far everyone is assuming (perhaps correctly) that the gaining of attachment points and creation of materia is a combat-only thing. So far the only thing I've seen pointing in that direction is the use of the word 'weapons' instead of 'weapons and tools'.

I really do see your points, and they definitely are valid points, in my personal opinion :). I guess I'm just not seeing the alternatives.

If crafters can turn items into materia without the 'attachment' point system, it puts all the power into the crafters hands, and gives nothing for the combat classes to do at all. With the rate at which crafters can turn out items (and hence materia), the materia market would be glutted further. Said system would still benefit botters and RMTers. Further, while attachment point forming may be 'grindy', it does provide some motivation / ability to continue progressing after reaching the rank cap. Finally, while conversion of weapons does provide incentive to use "less then optimal" gear, it also provides an actual use for that gear, and the game definitely needs some form of item sink.

What are the alternatives?

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Got some new tidbits regarding the upcoming Materia system implementation to share with you straight from the dev. team!


We're looking forward to hearing feedback on this! :)

*Rep note: Similar to "affection" not "attaching" something.
(Please note that some terms may not be final and may be subject to change in the future.)
(*Updated: 5:30pm PST to clarify)

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Here is my feedback:

First of all this is awesome. I have to say thie devs have outdone themselves with this approach to materia.
Secondly, Keep the name Materia.

I also have an indirect bit of feedback that I'm also putting in that new repair thread.
Crafters are worried about being relevant. From what I have read, Bam! problem solved.
Now that crafters will have a never ending source of usefulness and most likely gil, this gives the devs the perfect opportunity to get rid of or greatly reduce the rate of durability or other ideas involving increasing convenience of repairs such as repair kits and more NPCs that repair all gear, etc etc.

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Originally Posted by Duelle

Maybe I missed something, but did Bay's post imply that the process is automatic? I kinda got the feeling it was more by choice than anything else.

Either way, I'm now a little worried, though I guess materia stacking won't equate to destroying the weapon or armor you're attacking it to...I hope. Too much history with that kind of equipment enhancing system.

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its just because, lets say that while you have an item equiped you get attachment, and you have some good item that you want to add materia too, The system would encourage you to wear the gear that needed to level, and not the one that you wanted to make powerful.
hence you would be using your gimped attachment gear most of the time rather than your god armor of the heavens. It makes a lot of sense while your leveling, to give your new gear some boost from your old, but high level, it means wear gimp gear, equip god gear for boss only maybe.

soooo they got to figure how to balance that urge

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Originally Posted by Physic

its just because, lets say that while you have an item equiped you get attachment, and you have some good item that you want to add materia too, The system would encourage you to wear the gear that needed to level, and not the one that you wanted to make powerful.
hence you would be using your gimped attachment gear most of the time rather than your god armor of the heavens. It makes a lot of sense while your leveling, to give your new gear some boost from your old, but high level, it means wear gimp gear, equip god gear for boss only maybe.

soooo they got to figure how to balance that urge

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Another way of putting this (same thing, just different spin), is that now players have an incentive to actually USE those NQ and +1 items that the crafters turn out, so that they don't just end up as NPC-trash.

Those items can turn into something useful that the player wants, he just has to put some love and attention into it.