Dont kill the lambs!

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Originally Posted by Rommelx

If you are going to be a troll at least be good at it. You knew that killing the lambs would upset people, you didn’t care and killed them fine. But don’t come crying here when you troll people and they didn’t like you for it.

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Actually it was the first time doing the thing, until after I knew, but because of what garbage people spewed out just because of one fate, be sure ill get people to go kill the lambs now.

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Originally Posted by Dorin

From now on I'll eventually go to that FATE when I'm bored just to kill the lambs and leave.

Gotta make those lazy automatons who can just brainlessly spam AOEs rage.

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This... So where is this FATE Located?? The most I read the most I want to go there and kill that Lamb...

Yes, you have the right to kill the lambs and end it early if you want. Of course you can, it is (as some people are so keen to keep reminding us) how the FATE was intended to be won.

But honestly, is it worth it? You know you're going to annoy dozens of people, and all for the sake of saving 10-15 minutes? Is it really worth the acrimony?

Of course, if you decide it IS worth the acrimony, nothing anyone says here is going to change your mind. People are gonna do what they're gonna do.

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Originally Posted by ashikenshin

oh look! we've got a badass over here

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Oh man, you're making me blush. I'll kill some lambs for you too :)

The way I see people freak out in chat I don't blame some for just killing the lambs There are people newly hitting 50 every day that don't know about it, just try be a little nice...

I bet a lot more people would hold off on killing them if the monster claiming was FATE wide. (So everyone shares kill exp, would need to probably reduce the exp a little per mob to prevent a huge boost).


Often times its people who can't get into a party will kill the lambs because there's really no reason why they should wait for your party to get all of the benefit- and QQ that you should wait on them even though there is no reason why you should.

Besides that I think FATE monsters should be FATE wide shared anyways since it will stop the silly strategies of claiming everything first and then often letting other people kill it for you. (Will promote people to play the class as it was intended rather than a claim machine lol)

Oh you're on my server. I'll blist you when I get home.

Thanks for letting me know.

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Originally Posted by MrSmiley

The way I see people freak out in chat I don't blame some for just killing the lambs There are people newly hitting 50 every day that don't know about it, just try be a little nice...

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Yeah, the ones sending abusive and/or threatening messages deserve to have their fun spoiled (actually they deserve to be banned, please report them). Just remember they're not all like that. My first time at DD i started killing the lambs, a few people got a little aggressive but others politely told me what was going on, and thanked me when I stopped. One actually invited me to their party.

So my advice is just to report the abusive ones, and either join the others or let them get on with it.

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Originally Posted by Dastard

Oh you're on my server. I'll blist you when I get home.

Thanks for letting me know.

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I'm happy you would blist someone who didn't know anything until after all the hate and ridicule by literally over 10 people.

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Originally Posted by AridElf

It profits the lazy people who do nothing but FATE farm all day in parties. Individuals who are not able to get into a party or like myself, do not see the point in it, gain no benefit from your skill-less AoE-fest, we want our seals.

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Now, I was always happy when I saw DD pop up because I used FATES to get from 48-50...And to get some seals too. I was anxious, not lazy and I have no trouble getting into parties. So, not everyone doing FATES and taking advantage of DD is like that. I think those people you see in dungeons that have no idea what to do probably would have been like that without FATES, they will never look at the tooltips or check out guides to help them get the most out of their class.

OP, I'm sorry people were jerks to you. But every time I've seen DD pop there's always other fates going on. Why not go to those while you wait for the next part? You get your seals, and everyone else gets their exp...Everyone wins!

Another reason people don't seem to understand is the DD fates, if finished quickly, net 40K exp each. That's why the "go do other fates" argument doesnt work.

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Originally Posted by Moheeheeko

Another reason people don't seem to understand is the DD fates, if finished quickly, net 40K exp each. That's why the "go do other fates" argument doesnt work.

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But from anywhere in the zone, you can look at the map and see how much time is remaining on the first part of DD, so it really shouldn't be hard to arrive at the end and get all the exp for the remaining parts.

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Originally Posted by ErBear

I'm happy you would blist someone who didn't know anything until after all the hate and ridicule by literally over 10 people.

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Surprised it was only 10. If you are new to something and someone says to not do something, maybe you should listen.

Here's some helpful advise. If you ever make it to HM fights, don't stand in red circles. But, I am sure with your attitude you will stand in them and run to the board to call for a nerf to the fight.

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Originally Posted by ErBear

Actually it was the first time doing the thing, until after I knew, but because of what garbage people spewed out just because of one fate, be sure ill get people to go kill the lambs now.

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In your original post you should clarify that you didn't know that people farm this FATE by not killing the lambs. It seems from your OP you knew what you were doing by killing the lambs. With a lot of people turning shouts off because of the RMT spam I can understand why you may not of seen people shouting to not kill the lambs.

If you made an honest mistake and admitted it, I am sure you got a lot of hate from people that you didn't deserve, after all the FATE objectives state to kill Lambs, if you went there with the intention to troll people by killing them to specifically not allow people to farm the FATE, then I can't feel sorry for you. Either way I would just forget it and move on, you could go kill them to be a jerk just because other people were jerks to you. But why pay for a game just to be hateful, move on, most of the people that rage that hard over a little mistake and have to be asses about it, are not people you want to play with anyways.

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Originally Posted by Andrik

But from anywhere in the zone, you can look at the map and see how much time is remaining on the first part of DD, so it really shouldn't be hard to arrive at the end and get all the exp for the remaining parts.

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And if it is the only FATE in the zone?

SE should create side mission of objectives in FATEs if they want what is happening to DD to be intentional. That and sharing claims to everyone taking part in the FATE, since there is little reason to sit and watch another party gorge themselves on EXP and cry to you while they feast that you should just watch and starve (if no other party is available or if they just happen to have the claim classes (some classes claim better than others)).


(Purpose of side objectives would be bonus exp and such of course (items, easier main fate completion.. ect), and they would be listed on the FATE box making them clear- like kill 150 of these guys before finishing the FATE)

More elaborate examples could be made on a Red Belly / hamlet like FATE where say the gates get an hp buff and you can do a side objective as a botanist to gather wood and then craft battering rams to accelerate knocking down the doors- if you go fast enough instead of the boss fleeing perhaps you get a kill and a special item. (crafter/gather FATE example just to show it could happen)

It's a bit selfish to want to end an event right away just because you don't feel like waiting 10-15 minutes. I'm sorry, but it is. People get more experience for prolonging it, and the rep's on the forum have already stated that this is by design - they're made in a way that you can rush it or keep at it for more of a reward. Thing is though, if a lot of people are obviously prolonging it, it's kinda rude to just.. end it without caring about anyone elses wants or needs. There are other things you could be doing and other places you can be if you honestly don't have the patience for it, otherwise I don't know what to tell you..

I'm not the type of person to yell or name call, I never would do that to anyone ingame for much of any reason.. But if I have a party in a FATE like that, and we ask you not to do something, and you do it anyway because you don't feel like waiting.. yeah, I'm going to lose respect for you and probably not party with you again.

So which fate is this you all are talking about?

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Originally Posted by Jaine

So which fate is this you all are talking about?

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Dark Devices in Northern Thanalan.

Also, feel free to participate in whatever content you want to do and do it how you want to. If someone's really gonna blist you b/c of some missing exp, then obviously you're better off not having to deal with that individual in the future ^^

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Originally Posted by Antanias

Also, feel free to participate in whatever content you want to do and do it how you want to. If someone's really gonna blist you b/c of some missing exp, then obviously you're better off not having to deal with that individual in the future ^^

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Truer words never spoken.

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Originally Posted by Antanias

Dark Devices in Northern Thanalan.

Also, feel free to participate in whatever content you want to do and do it how you want to. If someone's really gonna blist you b/c of some missing exp, then obviously you're better off not having to deal with that individual in the future ^^

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The same can be said the other way around honestly.

And more so, since seriously.. 99% of people do it on purpose just to troll

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Originally Posted by Shougun

And if it is the only FATE in the zone?

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Well, I don't really have a solution to that. I suppose it just boils down to the question of whether you're willing to annoy dozens of people to save yourself a bit of time. I do like your idea of side missions though.

Not going to post again on this subject because honestly, I think it's been argued to death several times over now. I've seen so many arguments about it, both sides think they're right (and both sides are right, in a way), no-one ever seems to change their mind, and nothing is really accomplished.

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Originally Posted by Moheeheeko

Truer words never spoken.

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No that's terrible advice. " I play how I want" cannot
And shouldn't be applied to everything when there's roles to play. You're in the minority if you think supporting a for example;
BLM who thinks he can tank better than a job built for tanking is a good idea. Allowing him to proceed with a cheesed on smile
of support is effectively hindering the Mage.

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Originally Posted by TeaTimeBear

No that's terrible advice. " I play how I want" cannot
And shouldn't be applied to everything when there's roles to play. You're in the minority if you think supporting a for example;
BLM who thinks he can tank better than a job built for tanking is a good idea. Allowing him to proceed with a cheesed on smile
of support is effectively hindering the Mage.

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haha exactly, "play how you want" and make people leave your parties because you suck

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Originally Posted by ashikenshin

mod said it's not an exploit: "Hello,

Since there seems to be a lot of questions and concerns as to whether this is an exploit, I wanted to clarify that the way this FATE functions as well as others similar to it are working as intended and it is not an exploit."

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...15#post1329015

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Thank you Ashikenshin.

Until they make it where players can't attack the lambs, no one has a right to complain about jack.

Practically every facet of an MMORPG (or anything that involves interaction with others) calls for something called "cooperation". Now, many of you may not realize this, but cooperation is not exclusive to verbal interaction, nor is it exclusive to being in a party with someone. You can just be someone in the area, and there could be a necessary level of cooperation going on. All involved parties are required to "cooperate" if you want a mutually beneficial experience. I have to point out that "mutually" does not mean 50/50. It means that all involved parties accept each other in whatever goal there is to accomplish. Someone is very likely going to get the short end of the stick, in some way.

So for the people who want to end DD early, ask yourself why? Ignoring the trolls, is it because you want to get it done ASAP, ignoring the majority of players' goals? If so, you're just showing that you're not a cooperative person, and really, should be looked down on. It's not like that FATE prevents every other from appearing, and you'd just be taking away from the majority for your own benefit. You're not the only person playing an MMORPG, and if you really think so, or believe that your playing is more important than others, you don't belong here.

http://img.pandawhale.com/45021-will...g-you-yd3a.gif

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Originally Posted by PsychologyPhD

Yep, and now because of your poor judgement you have been blacklisted by who knows how many people. You may want to reroll so your character doesn't become the most hated person on the server. Next time don't kill the lamb, that type of behavior will not be tolerated!

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I'm thinking this is a case of Poe's Law, because you cannot be fvcking serious.

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Originally Posted by Balaur

I'm thinking this is a case of Poe's Law, because you cannot be fvcking serious.

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When i read his post, i saw the sarcasm dripping off it. Who knows, maybe im wrong.

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Originally Posted by Welsper59

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Really have to disagree. Its just as selfish to be in a group and tell people who cant get in a group to just stand around and watch as they don't accelerate their own exp.

In one scene you are a person not getting any benefit while not ending the FATE even though you can't get significant claims ("one or two mobs every now and then" is just the same as killing mobs randomly, its not FATE worthy). Or in the second scene you end it quickly and everyone is still getting the FATE end reward.

A table-
scenario 1:

group 1 (gets all the kills for the whole timer)
solo 0 (gets zero to only a couple kills and makes the time/exp ratio not worth your time)
winner group 1

Scenario 2:
group 1 (gets some kills (endless adds till solo wins) and fate end exp)
solo 1 (gets some kills (killing lambs) and fate end exp)
winner everyone

Whos really being selfish?

I'm not quite sure how people can do the "My benefit outweighs your loss speech" and then call that person selfish lol.


Optimally of course the person solo would get a group and everyone takes maximum advantage, this is however sometimes impossible. Also when too many people are there even in groups then group with the classes best for fast aoe claim grabbing will see significant benefit, while the other parties again are having near solo pitiful exp. Not condemning players wanting to eat at the endless buffet, makes sense, but these selfish speeches make none.

If you are on a feeding frenzy and others are not- and you are calling them selfish.. what?

Edit: I use solo as example because in my experience of doing DD its almost always a solo person who kills the lambs (4/5 times they even asked for party first), and in the case it wasn't it was a group full of long animation casting classes that couldn't get the claims as fast as flash tanks and long range short animation timed instant cast classes. Haven't actually seen someone end it and at least explicitly say they were ending it because they wanted people to miss out.

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Originally Posted by Welsper59

So for the people who want to end DD early, ask yourself why? Ignoring the trolls, is it because you want to get it done ASAP, ignoring the majority of players' goals? If so, you're just showing that you're not a cooperative person, and really, should be looked down on. It's not like that FATE prevents every other from appearing, and you'd just be taking away from the majority for your own benefit. You're not the only person playing an MMORPG, and if you really think so, or believe that your playing is more important than others, you don't belong here.

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Sorry, you don't want people to finish it early then don't do it yourself. Devs said its working as intended, either way, so just stop it with that argument. :P No one is forcing you to exploit the fate like that (yes, you're exploiting it, no matter what the devs say)

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Originally Posted by Amyas

(yes, you're exploiting it, no matter what the devs say)

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this doesn't make any sense

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Originally Posted by ErBear

So I have to sacrifice my fun for others? Ok!!!

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No, you are negatively impacting other peoples fun for your own selfish purposes. If you don't understand that, prepare to be continually berated by players as you interfere with their xp/hour.

FYI, there are plenty other fates out there around that level with less people participating, how about you do those instead. Then you have your fun, and do so without ruining other peoples.

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Originally Posted by ErBear

So I have to sacrifice my fun for others? Ok!!!

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Why not do FATE in another area rather then stomp on people who do want the extra xp gain out of DD? There are other 48-50 FATE out there that you can farm seals from and what not.

I think it's all a bit stupid, to be blunt. You cannot berate someone for completing a game objective, that is, as the name would imply.... the objective. The objective of HM Ifrit is to ya know, kill Ifrit, but if 7 of the 8 people wanted to spend 30 minutes sitting around chatting about why Lala's with pink hair are disproportionately cute compared to everything else then well, that 8th player can be a bit "HUH?!". And let's face it, it's not as if getting 100k's worth of XP in this game is difficult. (I earned, let me do the maths..... 2.5m XP in a couple of hours without even trying earlier)

Personally, on Durandal I've never seen anyone farming DD, it's straight in, complete objectives, get it over quick before rushing on to the next Fate, I'd be pretty annoyed if the Chimera Fate popped and everyone was down at DD when the fun one pops.

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Originally Posted by Lexxuk

falacy

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did you really think it through before posting? really spending 30 mins inside ifrit doing nothing is equal to 100k xp in 10 mins?

It's exactly the same, you're wasting the time of the people who want to complete the objective (killing the lambs), you don't want to do the objective, they do, the comparison stands. This is a task based game, you're complaining that people are doing the tasks.

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Originally Posted by Lexxuk

It's exactly the same, you're wasting the time of the people who want to complete the objective (killing the lambs), you don't want to do the objective, they do, the comparison stands. This is a task based game, you're complaining that people are doing the tasks.

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Those who engage in a rewarding behavior, even if it is inimical others around them, are always going to forward self-serving arguments designed to excuse their behavior. It's predictable.

In every instance, all you really need to ask yourself is: 'Cui Bono?'

I personally hate the idea of finding game exploits, in order to skip through the normal content/leveling process. Feels cheap to me. So, I finish these when I find them, could care less about those who threaten to blist over such things...

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Originally Posted by ashikenshin

this doesn't make any sense

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Exploit doesn't mean it has to be against the ToS. I could exploit players for a ton of gil if I was the only one capable of x meld, for example. Don't blame people for playing the game how it was meant to be played and 'ruining' your xp when that is how it was meant to be played.

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Originally Posted by Amyas

Exploit doesn't mean it has to be against the ToS. I could exploit players for a ton of gil if I was the only one capable of x meld, for example. Don't blame people for playing the game how it was meant to be played and 'ruining' your xp.

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By definition, an exploit in a video game is the use of a mechanic that the developers did not intend. They say they've intended this. Ergo it is not an exploit. The developers have said it's not an exploit, it is working as intended, and this is how it is meant to be played.

Don't blame people for playing the game how it was meant to be played and 'ruining' your xp.

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Originally Posted by cainejw

By definition, an exploit in a video game is the use of a mechanic that the developers did not intend. They say they've intended this. Ergo it is not an exploit. The developers have said it's not an exploit, it is working as intended, and this is how it is meant to be played.

Don't blame people for playing the game how it was meant to be played and 'ruining' your xp.

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I'm quite sure then, you support not blaming/blisting people for just finishing up the FATE? After all, they are ALSO playing the way it was intended - even if it does 'ruin' YOUR xp. Right?

From the responses in this thread, it seems like most wouldn't agree with your position that we should hold those who are using normal game mechanics blameless for doing so.