Nael Van Darnus -- A Love Story

That's... actually pretty damn plausible, isn't it? I mean, I maintain that Bahamut was the one influencing Nael in the end; Nael wasn't using Bahamut's personal special attack (Megaflare) for nothing. But the rest of that... yeah, that's extremely possible.

If I were to take a more refined stab at it, I'd say that Nael originally intended to ...

Wait, wait, wait wait.... wait.

Wait.

Bahamut was never allowed to roam free. He was locked to the Labyrinth, and chances are he been stuffed right back into it by 5 years after his appearance, which is possibly what we're going to see in our unique openings and why it's so calm when we get there.

Xandes, was stored in some sort of hypersleep until he could be reawakened (a legend which became he died until he could be resurrected, over time). Tower of aetheric crystal under the center of the world as far as the planet's soul is concerned...

OH, HOLY HELLS!

What if Odin was related to the Allagan? For a time, Bahamut would have been locked in the Labyrinth until the power struggle became too much for the land to take, so the Allagan built a machine and exiled him. That has to be related to why Xandes is sleeping and why Odin reappears now. They have to be connected.

Perhaps Nael saw himself as fulfilling the prophecy by reawakening the Allagan to crush the short-sighted fools in Garlemald who would surely win this war and take over the Allagan's homeland, unimpeded? By calling back Bahamut, he would force Xandes and Odin to return and purify the situation...

Ohohoho, but if Odin has Bahamut's number so easily, who will stop Odin?

Let's bring that right back around to my theory that the Garleans are trying to create a bastard fusion of Primal essence and magitek... and we're right back to the golden Final Fantasy Online standard of Odin v. ALEXANDER. As the last-primal-standing on the elemental wheel, Odin would have to go up against something - why not the mechanistic creation of a force that seeks to wipe out the primals, perhaps by fighting fire with fire?

... Okay, so maybe that last part is a little out there...

Unless it's the other way around? Alexander might be the Allagan's; when Odin appeared in Final Fantasy XI, it was the Alzadaal that built Alexander to defeat Odin... similar names. Or maybe a red herring? Or maybe a crazy Moose?

Yeah... Alexander would probbably be better suited to defending a tower than Odin though plus.

"Housed on the Red Moon, the Giant of Babil is summoned to the Earth by gathering the Crystals at the Tower of Babil to activate a dimensional elevator. The connection with Alexander is cemented by the battle with Proto-Babil in the remake version, which uses Divine Judgment, Alexander's signature attack."

Maybe we already saw Alexander and we just didn't know it? The Allagan may have been forced to send Alexander up with Bahamut to make the plan work (the twelve failed to copy the Allag's success) or may even have just wanted to put him some where out of reach. I may just be looking at it too deepky though.. But i could totally see it going either way from what we've seen so far. Oh and Alexander is quite well placed if it is the case because he has fought both Odin and Bahamut in the past iterations. As well as Alexander fitting with Allag's purity and Odin could fit the sword of might. Though i want to see a Magitek Doom Train!

The other one in the picture is Fenrir, he has concept art but theres been no clues as to his part in all this if he has any at all. I could believe he might have some connection to the Allag given his usual affiliation with the moon, otherwise i have no idea what they could be planning with him.

Master Xande was originally one of Great Magus Noah's students, along with Master Doga and Master Unei. Both Master Doga and Master Unei were given great magical powers. Master Xande was given a much stranger gift, the gift of mortality. Unable to appreciate his gift, Master Xande was driven mad by the thought of dying. In a blind rage, Master Xande sought to disrupt the balance of light and darkness, by draining the crystals of their power. By doing so, the world would be flooded in darkness, and time would freeze. Thus, he would no longer have to fear death.

He set up base in the Crystal Tower, and successfully drained the Earth and Water Crystals. This created an imbalance of power, summoning a tide of darkness to cover the world. A portion of the world was ripped from the planet and sent into the sky above the tide, as time froze on the surface world. The two remaining crystals were on this new floating continent, but it mattered not to Xande: the surface was frozen, and immortality was his again. However, he became wary of the prospect that the floating continent's residents might some day return to the surface, and began sending monsters there to try and destroy the continent.

When the Warriors of Light manage to dispel the tide of darkness, they confront Master Xande in the Crystal Tower. He has managed to drain all the crystals now, but the tide of darkness has not returned. Though Xande catches them with the Curse of the Five Wyrms, the Warriors are rescued by the appearances of five pure souls. Without any more tricks to use, Xande fights the Warriors of Light and is killed, but his actions have had an unknown side effect. By creating such a huge imbalance in light and darkness, the Cloud of Darkness appears, revealing that it was commanding Xande all along wanting to return everything to nothingness.

Xande is mentioned by a Gulgan in Replito when it is stated that someone is attempting to create an imbalance of light and darkness, not knowing that this will destroy the world.

Source:

From Like Father, Like Son:

Cid: These changes across Eorzea of late - The deaspected crystals, the red stain of Dalamud, the Garlean offensive. All of this is part of the Empire's grand scheme. They mean to harness the Meteor magic of ages past, and with it the power to cast down the stars and visit vast ruin upon this world -- a world they believe tainted by the primals. In the twisted minds of men like van Darnus, it is an act of deliverance. Should they succeed in resurrecting that great power, they will turn it on Dalamud and lay waste to all of Ul'dah... I mean Eorzea.


.....Freudian slip... >.>

... I wonder if Xandes is a portmanteau of Xande and Golbez.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

How did the Allag become to tied into Dragon gods? Who knows... (Yet.)

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This is an interesting question, but I'm going to respond to it with another question: How do we know that Nael was aware it was Bahamut? To me it seems more likely that Bahamut fed Nael abstract ideas telepathically, without ever giving his actual name. Nael continued to refer to the presence as Dalamud, when he was otherwise so candid toward the player about his plans. Perhaps the word "He" came from an abstract awareness that the presence within Dalamud is male, alongside an equally abstract awareness that the presence needs Aether, just like any other "god" in Hydaelyn.

As far as I can tell, Bahamut, from within Dalamud, sought a man with Allagan blood and fed him only enough information to carry out his escape from Dalamud. But I haven't pored over the dialogue nearly as much as you have.

While I'm here pestering you, Mr. Moose, do you have any thoughts on the Paladin job quest NPC who exclaims "Bahamut's Fang!" when you happen to have the soul stone?

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Originally Posted by Alaltus

Jenovah's

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That's an unfortunate misspelling.

Still trying to read through all of this, y'all are too fast for me. x.x

Thanks fixed that hiccup.

(Forgive me if a lot of this may have already been discussed, I haven't had a chance to read up on everything yet)

This is all just speculation (but a lot of this is),

I've often considered Nael to be just crazy, pure and simple. A guy who lost his mind and thought that burning the world would purify it, but I half wonder if there was almost a much greater (and almost, noble?) purpose to it? Like others have talked about him being Allag, and I know this was confirmed, and him fulfilling the prophecy of his people.

I've also found it slightly unbelievable just how quickly Eorzea seems to recover (only five years) after experiencing what would certainly seem like the world's end. Five years really isn't much time at all for Eorzea to recover from all that Bahamut unleashed on the planet, at least not plausibly to me. From the alpha videos we can see that a lot changed in the Shroud, in terms of the canopy being not nearly as thick, but compared to what could have been, it seems to be doing relatively alright. I think it was dicussed in a Japanese magazine and I don't have the source but I believe Yoshi-P said this was intentional, and that there is a reason why Eorzea recovers so relatively quick.

So the question becomes, why does Eorzea come back? Why is the realm reborn? I have a theory that, perhaps through catastrophe, the land must bounce back. If the Mother Crystal is really at the source of it all, perhaps for Eorzea to usher in a new age, a new rebirth, something terrible had to happen to land for the Mother Crystal to step in and pump god loads of aether back into the planet, changing it entirely. Like a human body taking a severe wound, the body would allocate more resources to rebuild it.

The question becomes, did Darnus know this would happen? Did he know that razing the planet would prompt a response from the Mother Crystal, to give birth to a better, more powerful Eorzea? Because I don't think Bahamut is around in quite the same capacity; something happened to him (He's stuck in a Labyrinth and fightable? Sounds like he got his power drastically turned down somehow...). Perhaps the Mother Crystal struck him directly? Curious too where Dalamud chose to fall (in the Mor Dhona/Carteneau Flats region).

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So the question becomes, why does Eorzea come back? Why is the realm reborn?

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Papalymo: Channeling even a tiny portion of a deity's strength will tax you greatly.

Papalymo: Fortunately, no more than that should be needed to stay the red moon's advance. At the very least, it should be sufficient to nullify Dalamud's power and ensure Eorzea's preservation.

Papalymo: For an added blessing, the process should see some aether returned to the land─aether that Dalamud had absorbed from the primals.

Papalymo: There is yet a future for Eorzea. I, for one, believe this to be true.

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The question becomes, did Darnus know this would happen? Did he know that razing the planet would prompt a response from the Mother Crystal, to give birth to a better, more powerful Eorzea?

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[Nael Van Darnus:Ah, yes! The song of life resounds!

Nael Van Darnus: Its joyous strains herald the coming of a new world─a world free of man's creeping corruption!

Nael Van Darnus: In the name of House Darnus, I shall bring the wisdom of ancient Allag to bear and make ready a feast in honor of the divine!

Nael Van Darnus: Bear witness as the curtains rise upon new creation! Ahahahaha!

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I don't think what happened is what he had in mind though.

I have a question if the Ala Mhigo has any connection with Allag since it's just a few letters difference and the god of Ala Mhigo is Rhalgar whose symbol is a streaking Meteor. Ala Mhigo was a very strong country when the Garleans ran it over.

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Originally Posted by Molic

Edit: Meh came back and realized it was actually sil'dih that did the zombification thing, wrong civilization D:

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Where does it say this? I read that on a website but it sounded so ridiculous I thought it was fanfic!

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Originally Posted by Yrusama

Where does it say this? I read that on a website but it sounded so ridiculous I thought it was fanfic!

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You have to speak to the NPC fromt he Monk Quest called "Erik"

He talks about Sil'dih and how they tried to make a cheap war by reviving dead soldiers. But it went wrong and they ended up having an FF version of the Walking Dead.

It's all ingame text. :)

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

(A) Bahamut is the dragonkin's primal
(B) Bahamut's existence is bad for Hydaelyn
(C) As long as dragons exist, Bahamut will be summoned
(D) Eradication of the dragonkin is nigh-on impossible
THUS Bahamut must be sealed.

But it just doesn't sit right quite yet - Bahamut is oft considered ancient and wise; he's someone you must prove your worth to for one reason or another. I'm wondering if there's anything to that this time around, or if in XIV he's just all out of gum.

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Does anyone remember that story in the Alchemist quest about a dragon saving a little boy? A Gridanian says it's dangerous to speak favorably about the dragons in case Ishgard is listening, but the story exists nonetheless. I wouldn't be at all surprised if this was passed down from Allag. I also wouldn't be surprised if the Allagans who sealed Bahamut went on to found Ishgard.

You bring up an interesting point about Bahamut needing Dragons to exist. Perhaps Bahamut's destruction was Ishgard's original goal, but they lost sight of it over the centuries.

As for why they needed a callback device for Dalamud, here's my thinking:

Bahamut is a Primal, and Primals manifest only by taking from the planet's Aether. If they really wanted to "get rid" of Bahamut, they would have sent Bahamut a lot farther than a lunar orbit (ideally the sun, but that could be cataclysmic as far as we know). But that could be problematic, because sending Bahamut away is the planetary equivalent to discarding a whole lot of your own blood. They might not have known what would happen if so much Aether was completely removed, and might have wanted an "abort" mechanism in case things went wrong. Could you imagine what would happen if we kept using this method? "Whoop, new Primal! Put it in a Pokeball and throw it off the planet!" Eventually we'd have so little Aether left the planet itself would probably crumble!

The other (and probably more likely) idea is that Bahamut wasn't meant to be merely contained. The Allag may have intentionally weaponized Dalamud, but never had the chance to use it before they died out.

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The other (and probably more likely) idea is that Bahamut wasn't meant to be merely contained. The Allag may have intentionally weaponized Dalamud, but never had the chance to use it before they died out.

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I agree with this. You know something that his confused me a lot was the fact that they referred to "Meteor magic" to call down Dalamud, not a summoning spell. The magic was supposed to make the stars fall which they did, if you observed the weather, streaks in the sky were constantly falling. Dalamud itself was a nice weapon, obliterating soldiers long before the primal burst out of it.

They trapped Bahamut in Dalamud after weakening him... if they simply killed him the dragons would be able to re summon him and they wouldn't want that to happen now would they??

Pretty much it was a way to take the dragons elder primal out of the loop... they possibly used Odin to weaken Bahamut since Odin would also wish to have him out of the picture possibly for a long long time. This was probably done to weaken the dragons foothold... but I wouldn't know...

I love these threads! Always such great reads.

The cat is amused =^.^=

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Originally Posted by NadienKirisame

They trapped Bahamut in Dalamud after weakening him... if they simply killed him the dragons would be able to re summon him and they wouldn't want that to happen now would they??

Pretty much it was a way to take the dragons elder primal out of the loop... they possibly used Odin to weaken Bahamut since Odin would also wish to have him out of the picture possibly for a long long time. This was probably done to weaken the dragons foothold... but I wouldn't know...

I love these threads! Always such great reads.

The cat is amused =^.^=

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Now that is very likely. Just imagine how many times as a SMN in XI you hit a summon macro by mistake and saw "<Player> already has a pet." I bet the dragons kept getting that error message, but were up in arms as to why.

As far as Odin's involvement, I don't think we know enough about him to make any assumptions.

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Originally Posted by Soul_Blackstar

also from an external source about Dalamud:
http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Dalamud

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Whew! Good thing I just went and made that whole page past-tense and updated some of the info. It still needs some work, though.

Please, people, PLEASE help us with XIV coverage on the FF wiki! I'm maybe one of two people editing for it, and I admit I'm not as knowledgeable as I'd like to be.

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Originally Posted by Yrusama

As far as Odin's involvement, I don't think we know enough about him to make any assumptions.

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Actually Odin being involved is simply if you look at what Ifrit says about other primals and how Garuda is as well. They want all the aether to themselves. If Odin could use the Allags to get another elder primal out of the way so he could have all the aether to himself why wouldn't he.

The only issue is if Allag had the ability to trap Bahamut why wouldn't they do the same to Odin if they had the chance... Odin and Bahamut are probably close in power or something so if they did fight each other it would have weakened Odin as well... If they didn't have Odin helping them they would need something to stop Bahamuts power as it would lay waste to a large area if not focused on a main target. Maybe the Allag used the Twelve?

The can is amused =^.^=

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Originally Posted by NadienKirisame

Actually Odin being involved is simply if you look at what Ifrit says about other primals and how Garuda is as well. They want all the aether to themselves. If Odin could use the Allags to get another elder primal out of the way so he could have all the aether to himself why wouldn't he.

The only issue is if Allag had the ability to trap Bahamut why wouldn't they do the same to Odin if they had the chance... Odin and Bahamut are probably close in power or something so if they did fight each other it would have weakened Odin as well... If they didn't have Odin helping them they would need something to stop Bahamuts power as it would lay waste to a large area if not focused on a main target. Maybe the Allag used the Twelve?

The can is amused =^.^=

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Ah, yes. Aether competition. On top of that, Ifrit seemed to want to be a supreme being above all others, and I doubt Garuda wouldn't want the same.

I'm really curious who Odin is tied to. He's a non-elemental humanoid, so maybe he's our Primal! Shiva and Ramuh can be tied to elementally-biased beast tribes, much like Ifrit to the dragon/tiger/demon Amalj'aa, and Garuda to the birdmen Ixal.

He may also preside over the other 6 Primals. Isn't he a Terrestrial Avatar in FFXI, just like Bahamut?

I could be very very wrong...this was really just a random question/thought...so please just keep that in mind.

Could Nael have somehow become Odin? I only ask because have we actually heard about him (Odin) as a Primal pre. Dalamund falling? Maybe Releasing Bahamut also releases Odin and Nael became the catalyst for that. After all, he did absorb what basically amounted to a lot of primal (aether) energy.

Yes, I know Odin is an Iconic primal and would in theory be part of a FF series game...so I know we assumed he'd be introduced. But he doesn't seem to blatantly belong to a Beastmen tribe like Ifrit or Garuda do. Not only that, he seems to be the Yin to Balamut's Yang. So maybe you need one to release the other...

Again, just random thoughts...please don't eat me.

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Originally Posted by Kinseykinz

Could Nael have somehow become Odin?

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I don't want to say he couldn't have for sure, because the rules of the universe would fold in on themselves to make me look like an ass in the next trailer, but:

a) It seems implied that Odin was the primal the Garleans bumped into shortly after the 1557 conquering of Ala Mhigo, long before the children of that city were indoctrinated into the Empire and used to staff the legion that Nael would later be assigned to lead into that theatre.

b) During an interview, when asked of van Darnus, Yoshida-san gave a pretty confident, "He's dead." and left it at that.

If anyone has become Odin, I suspect it is actually Louisoix, but I don't intend to dig too far into that one today. I also think Alexander is Bozja Citadel, but again, I don't see a need to re-hash that idea right now. You guys have been talking about Darnus while I've been away on an Easter vacation, so I seem to have a backlog on commentary to clear.

Interpreting historic texts in Eorzea is annoying. Just look at the seventh verse of the prophecy by Mezaya Thousand Eyes. It wasn't until after the fact that we properly understood what was meant.
I suspect Nael is a victim of his own lineage in a simmilar way.

If House Darnus guarded the secrets of Ancient Allag, their libraries would be difficult to decipher at best. A warning of "be prepared for when Dalamud breaks" could have easily been misinterpreted as "prepare the breaking of Dalamud."
Now combine this with a brutally ambitious man who wants to ride his knowledge to the top, and you have a recipe for danger. What begins as a "let's drop the bomb" theory then slowly changes as Nael gets his hands on a rosary and Bahamut starts getting into his head, doing the dragoon thing to him. His mind is slowly taken over, although his ambition and naïvite made him susceptible in the first place.

The restoration of the land after just five years still buggs me, but we do know that this part of the story was delivered to us incomplete. We're supposed to learn about the events between our sending-off and the end of Lou & Bahamut's battle while exploring the labyrinth, so I'm witholding judgement here for a while.

What I want to do is pull out that Elemental prophecy and take another look at it. Swethyna's analysis may have been premature.

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When white wings hie from distant east, a maid of steel to bear,
Shall darkling sky shed tears of fire, and veiled ones know despair.

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The white wings from the distant east can easily be considered Van Darnus from Garlemald, who has advanced suddenly and swiftly from the east.
Bearing a maid of steel could refer to their magitek weaponry, but I'm not sold on that interpretation.
A menacing sky emitting meteor fragments - that third part slots in well.
Veiled ones? Are they the elementals, or possibly even the Twelve themselves?

Either way, it is a very morbid prophesy those elementals brought. More of a message to prepare for the worst, rather than a call to arms.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

I don't want to say he couldn't have for sure, because the rules of the universe would fold in on themselves to make me look like an ass in the next trailer, but:

a) It seems implied that Odin was the primal the Garleans bumped into shortly after the 1557 conquering of Ala Mhigo, long before the children of that city were indoctrinated into the Empire and used to staff the legion that Nael would later be assigned to lead into that theatre.

b) During an interview, when asked of van Darnus, Yoshida-san gave a pretty confident, "He's dead." and left it at that.

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Yeah, I didn't mean Nael was technically around anymore... but rather that his lifeforce was consumed to re-awaken Odin somehow... It just seems to me that Odin and Bahamut are somehow joined. In my brain that means it's either Nael that connects them or Louisoix. And while maybe Louisoix could also become Odin...his 'astral-ness' or goodness doesn't seem to fit. In the CS trailer they released (the one that joins the fall of Dalamund events to this new era), when we see Odin, he's in the woods...and I don't know why I think this, but it seems like he sees the player in an 'I know you sense' He's not really attacking us. He just stops to look. Most other primals are shown in a battle context. This+ reading through this thread is mostly where my random thought came from...I totally agree it's probably crazy talk.

But if Nael was 'consumed' in order to bring Odin back into the world, it would be true that as Yoshi P says 'He's dead.'. Cause, he is. As to Odin being a Primal bumped into before by the Garleans...something made him go away, and something made him come back.

Again, it was just a random 'what if...' I fully expected there would be reasons why that was an absolutely retarded thought I had...just didn't know what those reasons were (figured I'd at least be told why if I suggested it). Which I was

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Originally Posted by Catapult

What I want to do is pull out that Elemental prophecy and take another look at it. Swethyna's analysis may have been premature.

The white wings from the distant east can easily be considered Van Darnus from Garlemald, who has advanced suddenly and swiftly from the east.
Bearing a maid of steel could refer to their magitek weaponry, but I'm not sold on that interpretation.
A menacing sky emitting meteor fragments - that third part slots in well.
Veiled ones? Are they the elementals, or possibly even the Twelve themselves?

Either way, it is a very morbid prophesy those elementals brought. More of a message to prepare for the worst, rather than a call to arms.

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The maid of steel is the Gunhalberd.

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[Van Darnus's] Weapon: Bradamante―a gunhalberd said to be named for a warrior maiden he slew.

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Source

I'm inclined to agree with Cata, though for a different reason. Odin has blue eyes and has a blue aura in the forest concept art. In mythology he fights for the gods and in Eorzea the Twelve are the gods and the Twelve are blue!. To me that aligns him closer to that of Louisoix than Nael. Anyone wanna bet he will show up close to the Gelmora ruins? after all he loves ruins and abandoned castles =P

"a maid of steel to bear" oooo i bet it's refering to Gaius, A maid of steel (an Empire airship) to bear(to bear witness)

edit: no fair hiir =(

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Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

You have to speak to the NPC fromt he Monk Quest called "Erik"

He talks about Sil'dih and how they tried to make a cheap war by reviving dead soldiers. But it went wrong and they ended up having an FF version of the Walking Dead.

It's all ingame text. :)

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*late response* WOW! I thought the whole thing was some elaborate fanfic! That's really interesting!