I can't connect with the Memories of Vanadiel

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Originally Posted by Catwho

I can't speak for other XI fans, but to me it feels like visiting old friends that I hadn't seen in a decade.

I'm sorry that it's not doing anything for those who didn't play XI, but it's a giant nostalgia bomb for me in a good way.

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You're motivating me to get a move on unlocking this content.

I kinda been taking my time with this since returning, but your input on the raid is honestly moving .:)

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Originally Posted by Kranel_San

I really just wish FFXIV would drop the Nostalgia bait and start focusing more on an original, exciting content and lore. (The exciting because myths raids were an original but not exciting)

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I was one of the people actually excited for Myths of the Realm when it was announced.
I thought we would get more information on the twelve, maybe some new revelations and lore implications, because they were still quite the mystery at the time.

Imagine my disappointment when it just turned into a boss gauntlet with us fighting the actual supposed gods, they turned out to just be ancients again because everything is just ancients in the post-Endwalker era, and at the end they just peaced out of existence.
It managed to kill the "myth", the established lore of the deities and any mystery that was left, actually left me baffled with how bad that storyline was.

Same goes for this XI nostalgia trip.
Not necessarily because it draws from XI, the Ivalice raids also drew inspiration from older titles, but because there is 0 effort to integrate it into the wider world of XIV.

It's just electrope-ex-machina to deliver maximum "Hey, remember this older FF game you played?"

What's it gonna be in 8.0, use the power of Dynamis for a weekend trip to Midgar or Zanarkand?

I did not find this second Alliance raid that interesting story-wise, especially compared to the 7.3 MSQ. I do enjoy having more voice acting though!

The last boss seemed out of nowhere. It is based on lore from the source game and a little bit of it during the cutscenes but it still felt a bit random.

Honestly, I think the issue is that there's not enough exposition or setup to make us care or understand better and I don't think playing FFXI would improve on that part besides recognizing the original characters and places. Nier felt more involved in this regard, imho, as a someone who's never played those games but has watched some playthroughs and cutscenes.

Additionally, we barely got any extra information on the raid's storyline and the characters; the plot points are mostly the same as when Jeuno was released. However, this is usual of FFXIV side storylines, in which the vast majority of relevant information is always kept for the very end.

Mechanically speaking, I think it's a good raid but we were skipping mechanics. Granted, several players of my raid were BiS-geared raiders but mechanics should not be skipped before the boss mechanical loop starts on release day. The first boss was at like 4% on our first ever pull before the adds were summoned and the fights felt short besides the third boss, which wiped us once. I found the second encounter quite nice though.

It does become tiresome for the nostalgia bait being pushed so hard when they don't blend it in well at all. I only know it's the XI raid or something and I don't care at all because I'm not interested in playing other games. I play FFXIV for FFXIV... and yes, I'm well aware they take writing from their other games and at times totally ruin a patch (looking at the horrible end of Endwalker postpatch, I hate it so much), but they could put effort into actually blending it and being original. Sigh.

Granted myths of the realm came up and the conclusion to that story was also super abysmal too :/ But there's things like the Sorrows of Werylt series that are really well written all the way through.

I only played FFXI briefly on-and-off, and it was longer after the dreaded level 75 Abyssea changes that I think invalidated relics or something idk. Seekers of Adoulin had just come out I think.

I loved FFXI, if not just for how weird and unique it was to play. Even the ‘clunky’ UI of everything had a certain charm to it. Subclassing was so much fun (even if it was mostly prescribed in party content).

The XI raid content hasn’t done anything (yet) to invoke any of the same feelings I had when playing the actual game. It just feels like ‘Generic FFXIV 24-Man Raid Structure #243’ with an XI skin thrown over the top for nostalgia-baiting and generating interest through trailers/visuals/etc over the actual gameplay. There’s a brief ‘oh yeah it’s [crossover area #35] (which is effectively just a backdrop)’ then back to the usual DDR and lacklustre job mechanics lol.

I miss XI lol; I don’t have a PC/Laptop anymore or I’d probably still play it. At least it was honest about what it was, hilarious entry requirements to parties and all lol.

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Originally Posted by Absurdity

I was one of the people actually excited for Myths of the Realm when it was announced.
I thought we would get more information on the twelve, maybe some new revelations and lore implications, because they were still quite the mystery at the time.

Imagine my disappointment when it just turned into a boss gauntlet with us fighting the actual supposed gods, they turned out to just be ancients again because everything is just ancients in the post-Endwalker era, and at the end they just peaced out of existence.
It managed to kill the "myth", the established lore of the deities and any mystery that was left, actually left me baffled with how bad that storyline was.

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THIS THIS THIS

We literally blitzed through two of the biggest plot points since 1.0 which were technically established before the Ascians. Their reasoning was that they just wanted to conclude everything and start fresh. Fine, I suppose. But now after patch 7.3 and knowing that it's Ascians AGAIN, what was the damn point? Are they really that incapable of writing an original story? Like good lord what is actually going on at SE? They could have made an entire expansion out of the Void AND The Twelve by themselves.

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Originally Posted by Ephremjlm

THIS THIS THIS

We literally blitzed through two of the biggest plot points since 1.0 which were technically established before the Ascians. Their reasoning was that they just wanted to conclude everything and start fresh. Fine, I suppose. But now after patch 7.3 and knowing that it's Ascians AGAIN, what was the damn point? Are they really that incapable of writing an original story? Like good lord what is actually going on at SE? They could have made an entire expansion out of the Void AND The Twelve by themselves.

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Hide your spoilers, homie.

Another reason I'm actually vibing with this content is because the "Walk of Echoes" was a real zone in XI, and that's the angle they took with the integration. The raid series being named "First Walk, Second Walk" and the NPCs, zones, and bosses all being "echoes" means it's NOT just shoving XI into XIV, it's properly doing a call back to XI.

https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Categor...s_Battlefields

Even in XI, the Echoes that you fought were creatures generated from other realities, iirc.

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Originally Posted by SeriousPan

Personally the questlines failures are mostly not utilising Prishe properly and making the absolute weakest Mamool Ja character possible the main antagonist. For some reason we don't just gut this level 50 dude like a fish and be done with it and it's a bit too much. I know that doesn't make for great story telling but letting us get bossed around by a comparatively weak and all around pathetic character isn't much better.

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I have to agree that a weakling bossing us around that's standing 5 feet away from our faces and not getting wrecked is problematic. I yelled at my screen, "just punch his stupid face already!"

When an enemy is overpowering? Sure, listen to what they have to say. When an enemy is a weak dumb-arse? Punch him in the face.

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Originally Posted by Veritas-Ancora

I have to agree that a weakling bossing us around that's standing 5 feet away from our faces and not getting wrecked is problematic. I yelled at my screen, "just punch his stupid face already!"

When an enemy is overpowering? Sure, listen to what they have to say. When an enemy is a weak dumb-arse? Punch him in the face.

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The fact that he survived Zoraal throwing him into a bottomless pit at all made me close my eyes and contemplate closing the game back in 7.1. Why make the framing the hallucinations of a lizard realized through electrope when Shantotto and Iroha have already shown up before?

They view the game as a Final Fantasy themepark and have expressed extreme enthusiasm for bringing together the different final fantasy games in FFXIV. I'm not talking about Yoshi-P either; their various designers have talked about this as well.

Their reasoning is that everyone's definition of Final Fantasy is different. If they made it like FF9, people would say it's not like the "true" FF7. If they made it like FF7, people would say it's not like the "true" FF9 or FF10 etc. So their answer is to have isolated references to different ones throughout the game.

I agree that taking inspiration and outright copying are different things. That was part of why the Star Wars 7-9 films were bad. They couldn't tell the difference between inspiration and copying. It seems they aren't the only ones to fall into that storytelling pitfall.

In SE's defense though, if they flat out copy the lore entirely, I tend to think it's so that they can say "here is this boss again, but in 2025 with modern graphics and fast combat". It's a world of difference to how they could make bosses in a 2D or partially 2D game.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

The fact that he survived Zoraal throwing him into a bottomless pit at all made me close my eyes and contemplate closing the game back in 7.1. Why make the framing the hallucinations of a lizard realized through electrope when Shantotto and Iroha have already shown up before?

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the writers are creatively bankrupt for one. for another, they also probably tossed the a.raid storyline to some junior writer 'cause side content' and it was the best they could come up with.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

Why make the framing the hallucinations of a lizard realized through electrope when Shantotto and Iroha have already shown up before?

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That's the part that annoyed the hell out of me. We know that the XI universe is out there and travel between Vana'diel and Eorzea is possible. But they just had to ham fist an easier way to describe things as "OH BRO, THIS ORE IS GOATED."

tbh I forgot what the whole story is because the patch cycle is so absurdly long.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They view the game as a Final Fantasy themepark and have expressed extreme enthusiasm for bringing together the different final fantasy games in FFXIV. I'm not talking about Yoshi-P either; their various designers have talked about this as well.

Their reasoning is that everyone's definition of Final Fantasy is different. If they made it like FF9, people would say it's not like the "true" FF7. If they made it like FF7, people would say it's not like the "true" FF9 or FF10 etc. So their answer is to have isolated references to different ones throughout the game.

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It's nice that they're enthusiastic about it, but at the end of the day I do not care.

In my personal opinion it is a terrible design idea.
If your game is just a bunch of disconnected "content islands" made up of different FF games I don't feel any kind of connection to your "world" and consequently your game either.

Why would I care about any of the characters if they are just going to be stuck in their small pocket universe?

It doesn't expand Etheirys, it's lore, history, politics, races or cultures.
It makes the world feel incredibly small and uninteresting.

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Originally Posted by Absurdity

If your game is just a bunch of disconnected "content islands" made up of different FF games I don't feel any kind of connection to your "world" and consequently your game either.

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They do technically join up the lore to FF14. Like how they joined up Ivalice to the Viera fighting Garleans, or explaining away Vana'diel as another shard that Sareel Ja saw due to being around the portal (which technically expands what we know of FF14).

But whether that's sufficient enough is up to you I suppose. Often they do just take bosses wholesale so they can show this is what a modern version of the boss would be like, in this game's battle system. I think they also want to pay maximum homage to it, so they don't bring in a character from another FF and it be hugely off and different, and huge disappointment to fans of that game.

In a way, proof that this is an issue lies in Dawntrail itself. They took FF9's lore almost wholesale, but because they dared to change it by covering it in "electrope" and leaving it in ruins, I am extremely disappointed as an FF9 fan and would have preferred it was taken wholesale than what it ended up being.

People need to stop with the homage bullshit, that's exactly what every hollywood studio has said to justify their slow decline into soft reboots and fan service. What kind of nauseating, anti artistic dystopian loop of thinking is this even?

I think the big problem with the FFXI raid series for non XI players is that XIV doesn't seem to make any effort to properly explain a lot of the context of the places/people that are brought up, definitely not enough in a way that would actually inform someone with zero prior knowledge. They also weirdly choose to have these bosses and events go completely out of order from how they happen chronologically in FFXI... like we have some CoP stuff presented BEFORE Zilart stuff and even within the respective expacs the order of events is all jumbled. I don't know why they couldn't have at least summarized and organized the fights so newbies could get even a smidgen of understanding of what the storylines were.

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Originally Posted by Gaddes

I think the big problem with the FFXI raid series for non XI players is that XIV doesn't seem to make any effort to properly explain a lot of the context of the places/people that are brought up, definitely not enough in a way that would actually inform someone with zero prior knowledge. They also weirdly choose to have these bosses and events go completely out of order from how they happen chronologically in FFXI... like we have some CoP stuff presented BEFORE Zilart stuff and even within the respective expacs the order of events is all jumbled. I don't know why they couldn't have at least summarized and organized the fights so newbies could get even a smidgen of understanding of what the storylines were.

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Didn't they try that with the Ivalice raids and the result was walls of text?

Which I didn't mind that much but I think others did. At least there seemed to be a coherent story that fit with XIV, unlike Nier.

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Originally Posted by Valence

People need to stop with the homage bullshit, that's exactly what every hollywood studio has said to justify their slow decline into soft reboots and fan service. What kind of nauseating, anti artistic dystopian loop of thinking is this even?

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Much easier to use the abomination of AI when there is already loads of extant text.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

The fact that he survived Zoraal throwing him into a bottomless pit at all made me close my eyes and contemplate closing the game back in 7.1.

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I didn't even remember who the guy was when he turned up in the Jeuno cut scene, had to google his name :)
It was so absurd. Zoraal Ja can basically fell a raging bull with one single swoop, but this nameless powerless guy survived getting backstabbed by Zoraal Ja /smh
One of the many narrative low-points in Dawntrail. But as in every sunday morning cartoon show, everybody comes back, all the time, over and over and over. Except the only well written character (Gulool Ja Ja), I'm sure he will stay dead forever.

Writing for Alliance Raids, particularly, is usually a step under the MSQ.

So... It's not surprising that it's awful this expansion. I'm honestly envious of people whose standards are different from mine. I wish I could enjoy what I consider to be EX level slop.

In truth, I love the nostalgia, the references, etc, that are -prolific- throughout the entirety of FFXIV. The problem isn't the reference to older content. It's the lack of a unique approach to writing that content in a sense where -anyone- can enjoy it. And I just don't think the mentality that wrote the script for Dawntrail is capable of that in current year...

Maybe next expansion? Who knows.

I didn’t play XI either, but I enjoyed Jeuno… I think it had a lot to do with Prishe’s character. I really connected with her for some reason. So when she got left behind, and we go on to San d’Oria, I just didn’t feel any connection there. Elf dude feels kinda flat to me, and the places were pretty, but beyond an appreciation for the setting, it just felt like Sareel Ja was summoning copies of random heroes for us to fight. Which I guess he is…

Maybe if I had that sense of nostalgia, it would’ve felt better, although there are a few FF titles I have missed. Most notably, I never finished 9, but I’ve still enjoyed the story bits based on that game.

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Originally Posted by Gaddes

I think the big problem with the FFXI raid series for non XI players is that XIV doesn't seem to make any effort to properly explain a lot of the context of the places/people that are brought up, definitely not enough in a way that would actually inform someone with zero prior knowledge. They also weirdly choose to have these bosses and events go completely out of order from how they happen chronologically in FFXI... like we have some CoP stuff presented BEFORE Zilart stuff and even within the respective expacs the order of events is all jumbled. I don't know why they couldn't have at least summarized and organized the fights so newbies could get even a smidgen of understanding of what the storylines were.

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I agree!

I also feel like the fact that so few people played 11 is something that sets the bar for many connecting and resonating with this content out of reach, and keeps it pretty niche. Unlike the single player Final Fantasy games that were played by millions upon millions of people. So when they throw references and content related to 4, 6, 7, 9, and etc in the game, the playerbase goes crazy. Because it plucks that nostalgia chord, and the players resonate and connect with that content from the start. The work to get players invested is pretty much already done, before they even take part in the content.

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Originally Posted by Khryseis_Astra

I didn’t play XI either, but I enjoyed Jeuno… I think it had a lot to do with Prishe’s character. I really connected with her for some reason. So when she got left behind, and we go on to San d’Oria, I just didn’t feel any connection there. Elf dude feels kinda flat to me, and the places were pretty, but beyond an appreciation for the setting, it just felt like Sareel Ja was summoning copies of random heroes for us to fight. Which I guess he is…

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Don't get me started on that filler sidequest after the raid with Prishe and that singer kid, it felt so tacked on just as an attempt to explore Prishe's character that I could just groan out of my mind. Seasonal event level of writing, literally.
If they have actual sidequest containers next to the alliance raid to use, they could at least put it to use in order for us to actually explore FF11 world, and perhaps BEFORE we get into the raids.

As a former FF XI sub I think they did a good job - the modernized characters for stuff like the Zilart was well done; but given FF XI characters are nowhere near as iconic in the FFverse. Most FF players know characters like Cloud and Sephiroth - few if any have any clue who Pische is and thats understandable - the fact that the alliance raid referenced FF XI rather then another more noteworthy FF like maybe 8 or 1 is likely an issue - though most probably got little clue who Seifer or Laguna are just the same.

I didn't play FFXI and didn't really connect with this raid quest line. I quite like Prishe and Alxaal as quest characters, and can empathise with the more personal issues they have about what they are, and what feels to them like their home not actually being that, that sort of thing. Topics that get introduced specifically for this quest line within XIV and rely on human problems (in a fantasy way). But those are a few minutes out of everything. The overarching plot with the enemies I neither follow nor particularly care about. It amounts to "Here is the next bad guy. Fight!"
Jeuno is awfully pretty though; that's some nice design work they did. Now if it was a real hub town set down into the normal game world, that'd be nice.

But to compare with the Nier raids... I've played both Nier games and the first Drakengard and am a huge fan, but I didn't think the raid quest line's plot had much to do with it, nor did it manage to dip into what makes Automata great as a story or as a game or its sometimes unique story-gameplay integration. It was a cool-looking raid line with familiar aesthetics and did its job for that. But I enjoyed the dwarves. Those actually got closest to the kind of mundane somewhat satirical humanity Yoko Taro's games often show.

Prishe and Alxaal coming to terms with being artificial people and possibly facing "mortality" as their electrope batteries run out could be an interesting story that continues the themes of the expansion.

Sareel Ja throwing random bosses he found in a database at us isn't interesting at all. I mean the fights are interesting. But there's no story there yet and no moral to be told.

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Originally Posted by Gaddes

I think the big problem with the FFXI raid series for non XI players is that XIV doesn't seem to make any effort to properly explain a lot of the context of the places/people that are brought up, definitely not enough in a way that would actually inform someone with zero prior knowledge. They also weirdly choose to have these bosses and events go completely out of order from how they happen chronologically in FFXI... like we have some CoP stuff presented BEFORE Zilart stuff and even within the respective expacs the order of events is all jumbled. I don't know why they couldn't have at least summarized and organized the fights so newbies could get even a smidgen of understanding of what the storylines were.

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I wonder if anybody who didn't play FFXI is even interacting with the lore NPC in Lower Jeuno. Not that it's a great way to tell you about the bosses, but that's what they went with.

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Originally Posted by Valence

Don't get me started on that filler sidequest after the raid with Prishe and that singer kid, it felt so tacked on just as an attempt to explore Prishe's character that I could just groan out of my mind. Seasonal event level of writing, literally.
If they have actual sidequest containers next to the alliance raid to use, they could at least put it to use in order for us to actually explore FF11 world, and perhaps BEFORE we get into the raids.

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That's a shame, that was my favorite part so far. Although it's probably largely because of the instrumental/music box version of the song that was playing. We didn't get the orchestrion roll for it yet though, so I expect a similar cutscene next time too.


Also, Sareel Ja hinted that Elvaan Guy is actually someone else, so I look forward to the next raid's cutscene when he randomly transforms into Prince Trion and everybody who didn't play XI goes "literally who?" all at once.

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

Also, Sareel Ja hinted that Elvaan Guy is actually someone else, so I look forward to the next raid's cutscene when he randomly transforms into Prince Trion and everybody who didn't play XI goes "literally who?" all at once.

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And then out of all the hairstyles people would have wanted from FFXI, they would give us Trion's as a bonus raid reward.

Yeah, the ivalice raids were woven into ffxiv. With both the presence of Garlemald's 4th legion creeping around in the areas, to Ultima the high seraph who we now know is connected to something even bigger embedded somewhere on the planet.
While also populating south western Othard on the map.

These Alliance raids, that may or may not be the re-imagining of another shard?

And while the music isn't bad, it's tone doesn't match the pacing of FFXIV unfortunately.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

These Alliance raids, that may or may not be the re-imagining of another shard?

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Its impressions of a different shard with Sareel Ja's fanciful exaggerations as the electrope amplifies his magic. Like the Gulool Ja Ja they have is exaggerated to look like the source version, but its not the Gulool Ja Ja we know. As the beastmen of Vana'diel are warlike and only really seek one thing, to crush the civilizations of the five races. The five races are basically the same as what we had in ARR with some minor differences, that of their own equivalents to Lalafell, Elezen, Roegydan, Miqote, and Hyurs.

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

Also, Sareel Ja hinted that Elvaan Guy is actually someone else, so I look forward to the next raid's cutscene when he randomly transforms into Prince Trion and everybody who didn't play XI goes "literally who?" all at once.

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I might be way off the mark, but there have been indications that Alxaal might somehow actually be the player's Adventurer character... he couldn't remember his own name, he's constantly referring to wanting to explore/adventure in this new unfamiliar land to him so he definitely has the Adventurer's wanderlust, and Sareel Ja makes a point of saying his performance was unexpected. So this is an atypical character that has no clear visual comparison to established story NPCs. What I don't understand is: what is their end-goal by having the Adventurer (or a copy of them) in this? Are they either going to somehow try and corrupt him to fight us (I hope not) or instead use it as a narrative moment to show his similarity/parallels with this game's Warrior of Light?

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Originally Posted by Gaddes

I might be way off the mark, but there have been indications that Alxaal might somehow actually be the player's Adventurer character... he's constantly referring to wanting to explore/adventure in this new unfamiliar land to him so he definitely has the Adventurer's wanderlust, and Sareel Ja makes a point of saying his performance was unexpected. What I don't understand is: what is their end-goal by having the Adventurer (or a copy of them) in this? Are they either going to somehow try and corrupt him to fight us (I hope not) or instead use it as a narrative moment to show his similarity/parallels with this game's Warrior of Light?

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Yes, and also the main giveaway very early on was he knows Prishe for example but Prishe doesn't know him which would echo how player characters know npcs but npcs wouldn't necessairly recognize players.

So my theory about the overall raid story is that I think Sareel Ja is actually dead, and his soul got isekai'd through the portal into a MMORPG for the Endless in Living Memory. That's why the raids are full of notes written from the perspective of players, as are the shades in Jueno... they're echoes of Endless who were in the game when it was shut down by us turning off LM. Perhaps Alxaal is one of them, but somehow a bit more complete than the others, the last person in a dead MMO.

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Originally Posted by Loggos

From what I've heard the Zero story line was a complete rehash of FF4 and now the same appears to be happening with FF9?

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Neither is the case, the only people saying 6.X are rehashes of FF4 are people who've never played FF4 and streamers trying to rage bait. It has a lot of homages to it in terms of character names but they're completely different characters and their arcs are different. Golbez isn't a mindcontrolled slave of the real villain, nor the hero's sibling like IV, he's a fallen hero trying to live up to his friend's legacy. Zero isn't the adopted child of a king who one day changes and starts warmongering and whose journey is about seeking forgiveness, she's a traveling warrior and the last of her kind whose journey is about learning to trust in others in a world that hadn't taught her that. Zeromus isn't the manifestation of the main villain's hate after death she's a manifestation of the grief of Azdaja and her want to return home. And so many other things, like the one thing they share is that Zero and Cecil both change from a dark themed job to a light themed one, big wow, much copy.

And the same thing for DT, I've read a great comment on this once but DT is insanely respectful of FF9 because of how it remixes its themes into something wholly original. Sphene (QE) is a twisted version of both Garnet and Zidane, Zoraal Ja has something similar going on to Kuja but not the same, the role of Garland is split between Gulool Ja Ja and Calyx (the former for his connection to the Kuja expy, Zoraal Ja, the latter for his connection to Sphene). But nothing is lifted wholesale from previous FFs. Yes, XIV is an FF theme park but the rides are stuff we've never scene in the exhibits they've put up. And for that matter would we call 1.0 a blatant copy of FF7? What about Sorrows of Werlyt? Did Eden rip wholesale from FF8? Its pretty disingenuous to see folks with takes like these, imo.

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

I wonder if anybody who didn't play FFXI is even interacting with the lore NPC in Lower Jeuno. Not that it's a great way to tell you about the bosses, but that's what they went with.

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I did actually. I'm a rabid loremonger and that's what kept me in the game originally. I click and explore every questline, I talk to NPCs even when they don't have a quest icon above the head.

It was a good idea to have but ultimately it gave me nothing more. Some vague explanations of the basics of the lore, which like for Ivalice, was welcome, but it didn't make me CARE about the world or the story. How could I? There may be a story for XIV with Sareel Ja going on (which has been pretty poor so far), but I haven't been through the XI actual story to care about the world, nor that this makes me want to do it either. Most were also written clearly from a nostalgic perspective that felt an obvious attempt at "selling me on XI" more than anything. "Look how cool it was to be adventuring there, or how funny it was when a summoner was born and a rainbow appeared". It's exactly like when your best friend can't stop gushing about a book/movie/game they hold very dear but you never went through it and have no idea what they're talking about.

People from another MMO would feel the exact same if they suddenly had a XIV crossover in one of their raids, and they were suddenly got told to care about Ishgard, Haurchefant or Emet Selch. And when going through the hallway modeled after Amaurot with Close in the Distance blasting in the background they'd be told in a few lines how this was a turning point of the story.

If only it were just the memories of Vanadiel that I can't relate to. But there's also the Arcadion.
There isn't a single place in DawnTrail that triggers something in me. There isn't a single NPC that stands out in my memory.
Not a single emotion that I could say was funny, sad, or whatever. And there isn't a single song or specific piece of music that I remember that was particularly good.
BUT there was one monster that stuck in my mind: Drowsie, because it was so cute. I have never felt so alienated from my character and the world as I have in this expansion.

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Originally Posted by Aneshda

If only it were just the memories of Vanadiel that I can't relate to. But there's also the Arcadion.
There isn't a single place in DawnTrail that triggers something in me. There isn't a single NPC that stands out in my memory.
Not a single emotion that I could say was funny, sad, or whatever. And there isn't a single song or specific piece of music that I remember that was particularly good.
BUT there was one monster that stuck in my mind: Drowsie, because it was so cute. I have never felt so alienated from my character and the world as I have in this expansion.

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Yoshida said that this is the kind of expansion and story he's wanted to make ever since he got the reins, so it's actually our fault for liking the preceding decade and thinking that was the game's identity.

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Originally Posted by Valence

I have been an avid Final Fantasy fan since basically forever. I have played all of the mainline titles, but there is still a handful of games of the franchise I haven't touched, notably FF Tactics or FF XI. I do understand....
Or am I the only one feeling like this by now?

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While I didn't enjoy or care much about the 1st alliance raid, I was having a blast with the 2nd. I even started to enjoy some of the characters and their struggles. But I admit, it's very little story we are getting and maybe that stems from the aspect that 11 has a pretty rich story and to fully attach itself to that would mis-represent some canonical events and they wanted to avoid that as much as possible?

The thing is I didn't particularly enjoy my time doing any of the Endwalker raids beyond the first go, after that they were just a chore, most of the fights were barely interesting. The only thing going for it was the connection to other ancients, but if you took that away and it was literally JUST the 12 gods, it would feel pretty blatant fanservice as well, but because theres this underlying notion of the 12 being something else before you sort of connect with them in a more meaningful way. But do I want to go beat mr.bowman more than I would like to go do the current alliance raid bosses? Not really. Halone was the only one that was like peak cinema.

Generally I like the current Alliance raid, atleast this new one with 7.3 and it isn't nearly as boring aswhatever the storuline with Ivalice was, cause god damn was I bored out of my mind reading that stuff.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

Yoshida said that this is the kind of expansion and story he's wanted to make ever since he got the reins, so it's actually our fault for liking the preceding decade and thinking that was the game's identity.

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If this is the future of this game, and if this is Yoshida's deepest wish to completely destroy everything from its predecessor, then so be it. But money speaks louder than he could imagine. Another expansion like DT, and the remaining player base will be halved.