Freaking gacha games respect my time more than Demiatmas, and that's sad

They are seemingly unable to find the middle ground between "Free Relic Weapon" and "Screw you grind for hours and hours praying for RNG to be kind"

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Originally Posted by Rolder50

They are seemingly unable to find the middle ground between "Free Relic Weapon" and "Screw you grind for hours and hours praying for RNG to be kind"

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Tbh...

Ideally they should just strip the RNG element from it, and make it a slow, steady progress-based grind...

It's even worse when you factor all subsequent relics are tomestone handouts (glorified tome weapons), which just completely dilutes the sense of achievement from the first relic.. Like, I ain't gonna remember or care much about that initial achievement when the game has just decided to hand me a free relic weapon every 2 days of roulettes.

the only thing I was sad about was no merchant to trade atma we have more then needed. other then thaty RNG was just crap so took me a week with work so around 40 hours? sure a small 5% would be nice but meh at least it's a one step only

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

Tbh...

Ideally they should just strip the RNG element from it, and make it a slow, steady progress-based grind...

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As you can see from this very thread: there are a lot of gambling addicts that take issue with deterministic progression.

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Originally Posted by Granyala

As you can see from this very thread: there are a lot of gambling addicts that take issue with deterministic progression.

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you are aware that most relic are RNG the one that aren't is eureka and ew but shb gave you a other way to have a guarantee way to have it but it was hw fates and have 20 of all three for one step. you also have a other step that's 15 time the CT raids or 5 time castrum in Bozja

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Originally Posted by Nero-Voidstails

you are aware that most relic are RNG

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I did every relic out there, since I play since the ARR days. So yes: I am aware that some steps were RNG bound.
Doesn't mean I agree with implementing unmitigated RNG in a game that is supposed to be fun.

Some RNG is fine but there needs to be a cap on possible bad luck. It is as simple as that.

Why are you playing FFXIV then? You're ready to leave for your great gacha heaven.

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Originally Posted by Granyala

I did every relic out there, since I play since the ARR days. So yes: I am aware that some steps were RNG bound.
Doesn't mean I agree with implementing unmitigated RNG in a game that is supposed to be fun.

Some RNG is fine but there needs to be a cap on possible bad luck. It is as simple as that.

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then it isn't as bad as the normal atma from arr took me a whole month to get all the one I needed. yes a pity system could be used but at least it's a one step only thing

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

1. People asked for relics to be grindy, including myself, because Endwalker's ones were not. This is good!

2. They are not even all that grindy. The droprate from CEs is 20%. On average, 5 CEs will get you an atma, and CEs spawn constantly.

3. You do not have to do it. Relic weapons are the exclusive priviledge of those willing to earn them. Endwalker was an exception to that, and people were not happy with it.

4. It's barely even been 2 weeks. This content is meant to be able to last months. Take your time - if you want (or don't, if you don't want, this is time-sink content).

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5. Relics aren't even as powerful as somewhat readily available tomestone weapons.
6. Relics become obsolete the moment 7.4 comes out.
7. Final upgrade relics become obsolete again in a few months after that when 8.0 drops

They'll just gather dust after you earn one and then replace it by running a fairly simple M-4 for a few weeks. I wouldn't stress the demi-atma drop rate. Yeah, some people earn them quick. Some earn them slow. Some might have the worst RNG ever and never get them. There really isn't a "relic questline." It is almost always the same. Players that don't get atma drops aren't missing out on anything. Gerolt has drinking problem. He sends you on a fetch quest for some annoying item. Rowena gets involved and you can trade tomestones for upgrade items. Rinse and repeat for every phase. If OC is what a player cares about, finish that story, get to 20 and wait for OC: Next Phase.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

5. Relics aren't even as powerful as somewhat readily available tomestone weapons.
6. Relics become obsolete the moment 7.4 comes out.
7. Final upgrade relics become obsolete again in a few months after that when 8.0 drops

They'll just gather dust after you earn one and then replace it by running a fairly simple M-4 for a few weeks. I wouldn't stress the demi-atma drop rate. Yeah, some people earn them quick. Some earn them slow. Some might have the worst RNG ever and never get them. There really isn't a "relic questline." It is almost always the same. Players that don't get atma drops aren't missing out on anything. Gerolt has drinking problem. He sends you on a fetch quest for some annoying item. Rowena gets involved and you can trade tomestones for upgrade items. Rinse and repeat for every phase. If OC is what a player cares about, finish that story, get to 20 and wait for OC: Next Phase.

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we should already have a other step to make it 760 so it stay good and not wait for a 7.3

I think a lot of complaints about this game are completely valid and for the most part right. This complaint however...I barely even played the game, and I got them all. So I'm confused lol. Did you want to be handed all of them immediately or something? I know people like to complete things as fast as possible, but this was really nothing. If I sat down and focused, I probably could have done it in a day or two. I got mine just running around with friends going everywhere for a little bit every other day, and then only focused at the very end for the last one. Now that I have it, nothings different. Like ok sure, I got my weapon. Tomorrow is garbage day, and I have a dental cleaning next week. Tada??

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Originally Posted by Batbrat

I think a lot of complaints about this game are completely valid and for the most part right. This complaint however...I barely even played the game, and I got them all. So I'm confused lol. Did you want to be handed all of them immediately or something? I know people like to complete things as fast as possible, but this was really nothing. If I sat down and focused, I probably could have done it in a day or two. I got mine just running around with friends going everywhere for a little bit every other day, and then only focused at the very end for the last one. Now that I have it, nothings different. Like ok sure, I got my weapon. Tomorrow is garbage day, and I have a dental cleaning next week. Tada??

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I think people are upset that the only alternative to EW's "tome weapon" relic was pure RNG.

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Originally Posted by Batbrat

I think a lot of complaints about this game are completely valid and for the most part right. This complaint however...I barely even played the game, and I got them all. So I'm confused lol. Did you want to be handed all of them immediately or something? I know people like to complete things as fast as possible, but this was really nothing. If I sat down and focused, I probably could have done it in a day or two. I got mine just running around with friends going everywhere for a little bit every other day, and then only focused at the very end for the last one. Now that I have it, nothings different. Like ok sure, I got my weapon. Tomorrow is garbage day, and I have a dental cleaning next week. Tada??

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I mostly just want less RNG.
If they want us to do a few hundred CEs and FATEs, then make the players do that instead of just having an incredibly low drop rate.

RNG has always been a hit or miss everywhere. The general rule is usually to have a look at the process said grind took place & assess one’s own tolerance or likes at the process itself. If you (general you) don’t enjoy the process, then the grind would be a nightmare. That being said, bad luck proof like adding a way to convert 5 unneeded demiatma into 1 needed demiatma would be a great way to alleviate the variance.

On a bit of unrelated topic of RNG, I still haven’t gotten the Geometry Urn’s field note despite been practically living inside OC since day 1 lmao. As people says, Lady Luck giveth, and Lady Luck taketh. It is what it is lol.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

1. People asked for relics to be grindy, including myself, because Endwalker's ones were not. This is good!

2. They are not even all that grindy. The droprate from CEs is 20%. On average, 5 CEs will get you an atma, and CEs spawn constantly.

3. You do not have to do it. Relic weapons are the exclusive priviledge of those willing to earn them. Endwalker was an exception to that, and people were not happy with it.

4. It's barely even been 2 weeks. This content is meant to be able to last months. Take your time - if you want (or don't, if you don't want, this is time-sink content).

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1. They did. What they didn't ask for was RNG that only acts as a stopgap to the exact same EW relic "grind"

2. Citation needed. Not to call you out, but I haven't seen anyone confirm the actual drop rate but merely speculate.

3. People have waited almost an entire year for there to be something to do in this game besides high end raiding and your suggestion is telling them to chill out and take it slow? At this point, people just want an actual reason to play XIV outside capping their tomes.

All they needed to do was up the amount of Atmas needed, but make it a guaranteed amount. Afterwards keep the atmas as a tomestone alternative. Heck, toss them in other content to and put the RNG in there! That way you incentivize other content while making OC the guaranteed option. Why do we have to keep settling on extremes?

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

2. Citation needed. Not to call you out, but I haven't seen anyone confirm the actual drop rate but merely speculate.

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I have been gathering data here: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...Farming-Method

My latest data is:
CE Data: 25.47% (27 Atma / 106 CEs * 100)
FATE Data: 4.28% (9 Atma / 210 FATEs * 100)

Unlike everyone else, I have been separating my CE and FATE tallies. This is important, since the rates are clearly different and it's not even close. There are lots of people in the thread who say "mostly from CEs" and others who say their FATE grinds outside Occult Crescent were consistent with my FATE rate.

So far, when I've done linear regression instead of division, the median is exactly 30% and 10% respectively, but I'm still gathering more data. I don't intend to hand in the Atma until I've leveled all Phantom jobs. I already have done over 200 FATEs. When this is over, my sample size will be decent, but it's way beyond the margin of error at this point. 27 Atma is way to much to be a mistake - the rate from CEs is high.

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People have waited almost an entire year for there to be something to do in this game besides high end raiding and your suggestion is telling them to chill out and take it slow?

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Yes. That is my suggestion. Because they have turned from "waiting for something to do" to being "overwhelmed by a grind" and "having too much to do and not enough time to do it". In order to solve that, they could pace their playtime better and take breaks. :) Instead of burning through it all day1, losing sleep and tearing their hair out over how hard it is to do a month's worth of content in 1 day.

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All they needed to do was up the amount of Atmas needed, but make it a guaranteed amount.

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Don't get me wrong, I am a fan of guaranteed amounts. Bozja's currency farm was perfect because I could farm what I wanted and plan it weeks before I did it and calculate how many hours it would take me.

But because CEs and FATEs (both in OC and out) give me lots of other rewards, it's not an issue. By the time I have all Phantom Jobs and all the gear, I will definitely have all the Atma. I actually am only missing 1 Atma that I need currently, but I'm not going out of my way to focus on a specific area of OC to get it, since I want to collect droprate data for everyone else.