What's the point of Peloton now?

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Originally Posted by MsMisato

after you sprint the sprint icon turns to a jog icon. you are faster than a walk but slighty jogging speed not sprinting. until you zone out or take aggro. It works well as a gatherer though along with the new mount call XD

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not sure why you are telling me this? or just quoting me for this... because yes that's how it works. you sprint. it expires. not in combat? you get jog. enter combat? you lose jog. i've used it plenty by now as i said :confused:

what i actually asked was where others got the idea it's sanctuaries only which did get answered

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Originally Posted by SongOfTheWind

During live letter that is what Yoshi said when introducing the feature.

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thanks for the answer i've completely stopped bothering with the LL, even the digests, so missed that
though i do wonder if this was a mistranslation/misunderstanding of him saying this will be useful in cities or if he really did advertise it as sanctuaries only...

edit: i actually don't think this makes peleton completely useless, since this is tied to sprint, so there will be plenty moments to use it still i imagine

Maybe one change Peloton into a skill influencing attack speed, not movement speed? Basically granting "haste"? Alternatively it could only affect auto attack speed, more DPS without messing with cooldowns having to be in sync for the 2 minute meta.

Just a random idea, I am not a number cruncher for hardcore content though, I don't know if this would end up to be positive or not. And it probably wouldn't help with the speed boost items you don't want to wear in a battle because they don't have the right stats, (but I guess one could just raise the movement speed percentage they give you.)

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Originally Posted by Valence

I have no problem with Jog. My problem is with Peloton, that obviously needs something. It has always needed something, but now more than ever. Or just delete it and replace it with actually meaningful role actions that aren't just deep dungeon useful options (in fact I am a huge proponent of splitting role actions between deep dungeons / overworld and duty actions). Rphys role actions are really, really underwhelming in duties, and Peloton serves nothing of value today.

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Peloton is still better than jog, but it's nice that you now have a weaker variation of it, even if you don't have a Phy Range in your party. It allows you to keep the momentum.

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Originally Posted by Zakuyia

Wut u mean somewhat useful lol bard got a whole band going on XD at least that something unique

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Fair but pointless during instanced content. ;D Tho it'd be a fun addition to have a bard band performing a raidboss into the ground. Actually the thought of it is pretty funny, thank you ^-^

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Originally Posted by Kohashi

Peloton is still better than jog, but it's nice that you now have a weaker variation of it, even if you don't have a Phy Range in your party. It allows you to keep the momentum.

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1) What you gain out of it in a dungeon amounts mathematically to barely 5-10 seconds gained. All psychological.
2) If you argue that this is good and disagree with the former point, then it means this is indirectly harming rphys options by making the role even less useful for parties.

Peloton was shit, and it's even shittier now, and I'm standing by my words there until proven otherwise.

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Originally Posted by Minali

Maybe one change Peloton into a skill influencing attack speed, not movement speed? Basically granting "haste"? Alternatively it could only affect auto attack speed, more DPS without messing with cooldowns having to be in sync for the 2 minute meta.

Just a random idea, I am not a number cruncher for hardcore content though, I don't know if this would end up to be positive or not. And it probably wouldn't help with the speed boost items you don't want to wear in a battle because they don't have the right stats, (but I guess one could just raise the movement speed percentage they give you.)

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Jobs require specific GCD speeds for their rotations to work properly. This wouldn't be good.

Honestly make it a role action that is similar to scholars speed boost but only the speed part.

Physical ranged should have a lot more supportive capabilities Imo. I'd honestly add a lot to make physical ranged actually stand out as a valuable role.

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Originally Posted by Valence

1) What you gain out of it in a dungeon amounts mathematically to barely 5-10 seconds gained. All psychological.
2) If you argue that this is good and disagree with the former point, then it means this is indirectly harming rphys options by making the role even less useful for parties.

Peloton was shit, and it's even shittier now, and I'm standing by my words there until proven otherwise.

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Oh please, how is it harming them? The way I see is it's that it comes from a time when having Peloton was a lot more impactful than what it is now.

You talk about Peloton, but what about Leg Graze and Foot Graze? I do agree that role actions of phy range should be reworked at this point as they serve little to no purpose aside from Peloton, second wind, and arm's length.

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Originally Posted by Daudream

ok can i ask where you all are getting jog only working in sanctuaries from????

it was never mentioned anywhere from what i can tell, the patch notes also just mentioned it being a out of combat buff too, so again where???
jog works wherever that is not a pvp area (since sprint is a toggle there) and i know this for a fact as i've had it work no matter where i am

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From a side comment of Yoshida's where he said "I think it only works in Sanctuaries?" Which he was promptly corrected on when he ran out of the border of the sanctuary he was in.
They've clearly not read patch notes and don't realize it works everywhere as long as you aren't in combat... which they could, you know, just test...?

https://i.imgur.com/G3lcz0J.png

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Originally Posted by Kohashi

Oh please, how is it harming them? The way I see is it's that it comes from a time when having Peloton was a lot more impactful than what it is now.

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I don't think it is harming them? Like I said, I think Peloton has always been a pretty useless gimmick. You're the one that seems to think it has good uses, so if Jog starts stepping on what Peloton brings, then it by definition harms rphys indirectly. How can I make this clearer?
The way you see it is wrong. Peloton comes from Swift Song, which was a bard unique ability that was usable exactly like Peloton is right now. And when I say it was a gimmick, that's because it has always been, but as a BRD unique, it was whatever, just part of the job's flavor. It wasn't a role action. The mistake was to make it a role action when it didn't have the qualities to become one in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Kohashi

You talk about Peloton, but what about Leg Graze and Foot Graze? I do agree that role actions of phy range should be reworked at this point as they serve little to no purpose aside from Peloton, second wind, and arm's length.

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Leg Graze and Foot Graze are very dusty and could be better, but they do have uses in non standard pve like deep dungeons or field exploration (notably Eureka but you'll have to remember that at release mounts weren't usable in there until you elemental level capped the area, and mobs of the same level were probably going to delete you if you caught aggro, so having those crowd control options was often the difference between life and death).

I wouldn't mind combat Peloton, but the duration and cooldown would need adjusting obviously.

I don’t think Peloton should be in the game at all—it’s more of a nuisance at this point. But the weird thing is, it still has more utility than actions that inflict Bind, Heavy, or Sleep, which are only relevant in solo content.

Stun is another mechanic that used to have more uses, and interrupts are so rare that you can’t really blame players for missing them, after seeing thousands of casts that can’t be interrupted. SE could and should do a lot more with role actions

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Originally Posted by Valence

I don't think it is harming them? Like I said, I think Peloton has always been a pretty useless gimmick. You're the one that seems to think it has good uses, so if Jog starts stepping on what Peloton brings, then it by definition harms rphys indirectly. How can I make this clearer?
The way you see it is wrong. Peloton comes from Swift Song, which was a bard unique ability that was usable exactly like Peloton is right now. And when I say it was a gimmick, that's because it has always been, but as a BRD unique, it was whatever, just part of the job's flavor. It wasn't a role action. The mistake was to make it a role action when it didn't have the qualities to become one in the first place.

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Honestly, I don't care where Peloton comes from or how it got into the game. It's useful in between trash mob packs, and it was really useful in older dungeons where you had to walk all the f-king way back if you wiped at one of the bosses. Thank god they scraped that shit, even if it took them 10 years to do it.

What Jog does is provide a weaker version of it for when parties don't have a phys Range, which happens a lot because yeah, RNG distribution.

However, it doesn't mean that phy range lost its place and purpose or identity. what an unhinged take..

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Leg Graze and Foot Graze are very dusty and could be better, but they do have uses in non standard pve like deep dungeons or field exploration (notably Eureka but you'll have to remember that at release mounts weren't usable in there until you elemental level capped the area, and mobs of the same level were probably going to delete you if you caught aggro, so having those crowd control options was often the difference between life and death).

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Fair point, I completely forgot that even existed as I never engaged with it. I started playing when that was long dead anyway.

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Originally Posted by Aidorouge

Not just Peloton either. I've been playing the game for over two years and I've yet to find a use for Leg Graze or Foot Graze, and even Head Graze feels under-utilized.

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See M7 couldve be a good spot for the grazes get adds into a good spot place for petrify or something. Maybe savage? Prolly not...

NIN and phys ranged both got a bit shafted by it, but I always hated having to swap jobs so much to move optimally through cities. Overall it's a fantastic change that facilitates more ease of access to new players and saving time in general.

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Originally Posted by Kohashi

Honestly, I don't care where Peloton comes from or how it got into the game.

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Why did you bring up its origin then?

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Originally Posted by Kohashi

It's useful in between trash mob packs, and it was really useful in older dungeons where you had to walk all the f-king way back if you wiped at one of the bosses. Thank god they scraped that shit, even if it took them 10 years to do it.

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It's not, because people just sprint between trash packs.
It was "useful" in older respawns in the same way that it's gimped, where the mathematical gain is counted in a handful of seconds. If you find this useful, I do find it mostly psychological with no incidence whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by Kohashi

What Jog does is provide a weaker version of it for when parties don't have a phys Range, which happens a lot because yeah, RNG distribution.

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Jog is irrelevant in dungeons. People sprint between pulls.

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Originally Posted by Kohashi

However, it doesn't mean that phy range lost its place and purpose or identity. what an unhinged take..

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Then it makes it your unhinged take. Once more, you're the one that is arguing that both peloton and jog are useful. I am not. I've been saying since the start that they're useless in dungeons.
By logical extension, if you think they are useful, and I'll say it one last time but it seems that you cannot wrap your head around that concept: if peloton is useful, and jog is a lesser version of it but still useful, then job now encroaches on a role action that's part of the support brought by rphys as a role, which lessens by extension its value for the role to have.

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Originally Posted by Valence

You get Jog after finishing a Sprint. It goes at the exact same speed, and like all speed buffs, the game only chooses the fastest active, so they do not stack in effect.

Perhaps it is time to rethink what this ability does? It's never been more than a gimmick... But now it's a useless gimmick.

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imo it was very unfair psy ranged even had this skill, it meant if you wanted to do msq or anything else involving running youde play a bard/dancer/mch i would legit do this during msq to make the running fro A-B easier, i am glad this has been added. i dont care about peloton. it was a bad skill that needed constantly refreshed.

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2) If you argue that this is good and disagree with the former point, then it means this is indirectly harming rphys options by making the role even less useful for parties.

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L O L

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Originally Posted by Raim

The new Jog effect only works in safe spots like cities and towns with aetherytes. It doesn't work in instances, field zones, etc.

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This is going to be the new "just watch the pre-boss-fight cutscenes in the journal in the inn", isn't it? Love this fandom's relationship with misinformation.

Sprint has a cooldown. Peloton does not. Jog also disappears when you generate any enmity. Peloton is just as useful as it was before.

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Originally Posted by Bibine_Bine

Sprint has a cooldown. Peloton does not. Jog also disappears when you generate any enmity. Peloton is just as useful as it was before.

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It's also for those who are too lazy/forgetful to use Sprint in order to get Jog, so you have the whole group on the same speed when it comes moving around with Peloton.
Unless, of course, you have those spiteful ones who even klick that away as well for some reason.

After running a few dungeons: If you press Sprint right away it will run out when you reach the first pack of mobs. You will be in fight then and Jog will not trigger.

With Peloton you can move faster to the first pack of mobs, press Sprint, and then run faster to the second pack of mobs. And then of course when Sprint is on cooldown afterwards you can run with Peloton faster to the boss.

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Originally Posted by YukioKobayashi

I rather have them remove peloton completely than them making it usable in combat. This is smth that should stay unique on scholar imo.

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I partially agree. "SwiftSong," the predecessor to Peloton, has traditionally been a Bard-specific utility. I think it's fine to return it to Bard, but it shouldn't be given to every Physical Ranged job.

To answer the question posed, Peloton in dungeons is for getting to the trash mobs. Sprint is for mitigation running past them. Same as it ever was.

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Originally Posted by Alpheus

I do feel peloton should stack with Jog

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There is not a single movement speed boost effect in this game that stacks.