Reverse WoW exodus

Dawntrail has the exact same gameplay roughly for all classes. And not enjoying the story here is fine, but that's not going to be anywhere close to better over there.

Not sure why anyone thinks the world revolves around which MMORPG they play. I'm a wow player! Now I hate wow with a passion and love ff14! FF14 did me wrong, now I love wow again! Play what you want, play them all, play nothing. Who cares, really?

ftr I play wow, ff14, gw2 and eso occasionally as well, they're just games, you don't need to make a game (made by a company that doesn't actually care if you personally play or not) your whole identity. Like TWW actually looks pretty interesting, I played the beta, it was really buggy though and it doesn't appear they've fixed those bugs either. I'll be playing it nonetheless, doesn't mean I have to suddenly HATE ff14 in order to switch to wow for a bit. They're not political parties or religions, you don't have to vote or devote your life only to one of them.

BDO much better than FFXIV. I would go there.

I did make a "Vacation" in WoW during EW, was a nice change of pace....ignoring the horrendous experience as Dungeon Healer.
But hey after that i tried to spread some FF14 friendliness in WoW Dungeons. Which lead to confusion and appreciaton. xD

how many of these people actually stop paying square enix? they wont change anything if people just stay subbed

Never ceases to amaze me how many rude replies posts like these get. You're not cute by being rude to someone expressing their discontent with the game.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Yes, because integrating the cash shop even more is REALLY what this game needs now.

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where is this integrated cash shop button in FFXIV?

cannot seem to find it.

Well, from what I saw the bulk of the WoW refugees returned to WoW during Endwalker because Dragonflight was in a much better spot than Shadowlands+BFA. I wasn't a refugee as I started FF14 back in Heavensward, but I'm not going anywhere. I'm personally enjoying Dawntrail and I'm also looking forward to War Within, so I plan on playing both games. It's a good time to be happy with both games. But when the inevitable content lull happens in both of them I'll probably just work on my backlog some more. Nine Sols and Lies of P are high on the list of things I'm going to finish when I have more time. Maybe play Nioh 2 for the 3rd time because I need to do an Odachi run.

I would completely understand if someone wanted to take a break from the game. Sometimes a game isn't in a state you find fun, and sometimes you just get bored and want a break. Unless WoW has a drastic change in its design philosophy I cant ever see myself playing it again. The time gating/wasting systems, endgame design, and general lack of casual and horizontal content make the game terrible for me. I just accepted it as the way of MMO's until I found this game.

If I find myself wanting a break, I plan on replaying all of the Witcher games. I may also check out ESO (I've heard good things, but never played it). Also my wife bought the new Luigis Mansion on switch and it looks like alot of fun.

Just play both lol
thats what i've always done. Wow gets boring i hope over here, this gets boring i hop over on wow
why limit yourself? (other than money, which, understandable.)

bobby kotick was never punished so why would i go back lol

heard blizzard unionized though goodd for those dudes, proud of that

I just came back from WoW....

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Originally Posted by 4clubbedace

bobby kotick was never punished so why would i go back lol

heard blizzard unionized though goodd for those dudes, proud of that

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Yep, the entirety of the WoW team unionized :)

For anyone that didn't see the news https://www.wired.com/story/world-of...e-games-labor/

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

Just play both lol
thats what i've always done. Wow gets boring i hope over here, this gets boring i hop over on wow
why limit yourself? (other than money, which, understandable.)

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I played WoW on and off since launch for 15 years and can't really see myself going back anytime soon. Plus, hopping from one MMO to another doesn't have the same allure it did when I was younger.

you have fun doing that.

play monster hunter world

You will find love

WoW has the next expansion coming out in a couple weeks. I do wonder what will happen to activity levels in FF14 around then.

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Originally Posted by Mr_Gyactus

we reap what we sow.

Anyway, do you think the ffxiv cash shop IS integrated? Because when you write "even more" I think "it is already", but I don't find a single button of this integration.
On the other hand, wow has a button close the inventory, the help, the skill list page... a missclick is really easy if you use the mouse instead of a shortcut.

Great job Microsoft-Blizzard.

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The only things I can think of are the ads in the launcher...

And the dream fitting option at an inn bed, where you are able to try on the cash shop clothing.

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Originally Posted by Rolder50

WoW has the next expansion coming out in a couple weeks. I do wonder what will happen to activity levels in FF14 around then.

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More or less what's happened in wow when FFXIV released DT.

We are uhhh.. herrings! We congregate in large schools called discord servers and we swim here and there crossing the ocean.

The story ends when we become oil.

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Originally Posted by TaranTatsuuchi

The only things I can think of are the ads in the launcher...

And the dream fitting option at an inn bed, where you are able to try on the cash shop clothing.

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Not exactly "invasive".
If a ffxiv player wants to buy something he/she has to:
- open a browser,
- write the store address
- login in the store
- find the item (often fighting with the filters)
- place in the cart
- choose the character that receive the item,
- credit card information
- another "ok" button

not exactly compulsive shopping friendly

While we usually find:
- click the button to open the store ingame
- click the item
- click the "buy now"
Often a pop-up makes things faster.

A bit different huh?

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Originally Posted by Mr_Gyactus

More or less what's happened in wow when FFXIV released DT.

We are uhhh.. herrings! We congregate in large schools called discord servers and we swim here and there crossing the ocean.

The story ends when we become oil.



Not exactly "invasive".
If a ffxiv player wants to buy something he/she has to:
- open a browser,
- write the store address
- login in the store
- find the item (often fighting with the filters)
- place in the cart
- choose the character that receive the item,
- credit card information
- another "ok" button

not exactly compulsive shopping friendly

While we usually find:
- click the button to open the store ingame
- click the item
- click the "buy now"
Often a pop-up makes things faster.

A bit different huh?

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Worse than that, last time I bought something on FFXIV I logged into mogstation, clicked the link for the store, then had to login again, clicked the item to add it to the cart, and had to login a third time to be able to actually buy it. Which is a bit ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I'm not interested in WoW's aesthetic or the type of players that it would appeal to.

It's too complicated for new players to get into by all accounts, which is why it's riddled with veterans who know how to play it.

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I got into WoW during the EW lull and I was incredibly surprised by how great it was. The playerbase has a reputation, but I have not really experienced that at all. The first dungeons I joined I said I was new and was walked through them, politely told how I could improve my rotations, given tips on the bosses and just kind of cheered on. Then joined a guild and it has been absolutely fantastic. They help with old content, explain things and are happy to help when I am stuck. I actually have found the WoW players to be a lot more open, friendly and willing to help than in ffxiv. And as someone who really didn't care much for the aesthetic, it really grew on me quickly.

The game is really not that complicated at all. The rotations feel natural the mechanics are not hard to figure out, there are even built in guides that will give you tips on bosses and mechanics. Plus, like I said, the players have been absolutely amazing. I was incredibly nervous to start running dungeons due to that WoW rep and was surprised by how great the experience has been and how much fun it has been. Plus the Dragonflight story and msq, which isn't the best, was still leap and bounds over leaps and bounds better than what DT gave us. Not to mention the lack of pretty, cutesy and UwU in WoW has felt great. I love seeing ugly characters or more beastial races (love my Tauren!) and the lack of that super saccharine anime aesthetic that not only plagues glam but also some npcs is wonderful.

I just got notification that my sub was about to renew and ended up cancelling it due to quite a few reasons. I will most likely spend my time in TWW because, again like I said, the overall experience, from gameplay to community, has been better than I could have possibly imagined. I think the only way you would not get along with the players is if you are the type you just doesn't want to try and wants to just be carreid through, which is an epidemic in ffxiv, cause the players over there just will not put up with that. So it's not surprising when ffxiv players are so vehemently against WoW.

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Originally Posted by Kes13a

where is this integrated cash shop button in FFXIV?

cannot seem to find it.

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the closest I could find is when you lay in bed, in the games various Inns and try to log out, you have the option of checking the mogstation,

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Originally Posted by Derio

If the combat wasnt engaging then maybe, but Dawntrail does just enough to keep players engaged.

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Think the same. If the combat was shit...but the f*ckers created the funnest damn jobs for this expansion and I'm having an absolute blast playing picto and viper on trials and dungeons.

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Originally Posted by AnimaAnimus

I just got notification that my sub was about to renew and ended up cancelling it due to quite a few reasons. I will most likely spend my time in TWW because, again like I said, the overall experience, from gameplay to community, has been better than I could have possibly imagined. I think the only way you would not get along with the players is if you are the type you just doesn't want to try and wants to just be carreid through, which is an epidemic in ffxiv, cause the players over there just will not put up with that. So it's not surprising when ffxiv players are so vehemently against WoW.

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I don't think anyone with a bit of MMO experience does not know wow.
To base the experience about "a dungeon" is a naive opinion. You could go in raids "easy mode" to find players going afk during the boss fight, or being kicked in the same raid in normal/HC mode because your dps is 1% lower, and your dps is that 1% lower because you are unluck with RNG upgrade rolls, and doing mythic runs you could find the player who leave the run after you used the key to waste that.
WoW gives players the opportunity to inconvenience other players, and the other players use that opportunity. That's the reason of the most sponsored new feature "dungeons with NPC" (called followers). ring a bell? Something familiar?

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Originally Posted by Mr_Gyactus

That's the reason of the most sponsored new feature "dungeons with NPC" (called followers). ring a bell? Something familiar?

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Yeah. First Guild War Heroes and Henchman system why? (Yeah, they were the first to do it, and it was present at release 20 years ago)

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Originally Posted by Tunda

play monster hunter world

You will find love

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And then play Monster Hunter GU, 4U, 3U, Rise/Sunbreak, Frontier, and preorder Wilds. Monster Hunter is life.

Why exactly do you want this to happen?

While the MSQ is a mess, the gameplay is really fun

I firmly believe that the FFXIV exodus, along with people being dissatisfied with WoW at that time, was influenced by big content creators like Asmongold, Echo raiders and Method raiders.

We don't have such things around here.

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Originally Posted by MsQi

Rift is pretty good.

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Oh boy, it was actually pretty decent at launch and untill the end of the first expansion when it was still active one could say.

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Originally Posted by hynaku

BDO much better than FFXIV. I would go there.

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If BDO had a ever implemented dungeons/raids, it would have been my main game.

Last time I played WoW seriously (raiding) was in Cataclysm, I tried BfA but that was such a flop, but even then, I'm curious to see how War Within does because I'm exhausted of FFXIV ShB 3.0 combat.

MMOs are sort of the generational money generator for old IPs that millennial, early Gen Z, and Late Gen X players tend to engage in. It's in the same vein as TCGs and wargaming for the Gen X and Millenial generation. The main reason nothing new has appeared in the MMOs is that humanity hit a tech wall on what is possible without causing issues for players. Action MMOs have limited capability because of the need for low latency and tab target works across multiple spectrums but the space has been explored and figured out, so nothing much new can come from it. If SE made another FF MMO it would just be an iterative version of FFXIV, so they instead work on FFXIV.

I feel like the normal reasonable people left. I genuinely do. What we have left is the mmo equivalent of sloppy seconds.

It's weird because at one moment, 14 feels dead as hell. Maybe not in people afking, but like when you try to engage socially or try to be civil, this game is a corpse. I'm not talking about the 1000k people in a zone breaking the hunt train. I'm talking about the game. The queued up for frontline or msq or leveling. That game is dead. Anti-social. Anti new player, whatever you want to call it. Either out of contept or fear from moderation, this game is socially dead. Sure, your FC or your friend group are lovely, but your average player doesn't care. Your average party member is just in it for the reward. The joy of doing it is dead.

I just feel like if you told me 11 years ago, the community would devolve twice, I wouldn't believe you, but here we are. From the indistinguishable Wow/FF14 players of 2.0 to the heavily moderated players of today. Both kin in their contept for a social aspect. Both content with getting theirs while leaving you to twist. The passive aggressive arrogant sort. The "My game is the best game ever!" sort. The hypocrites and those who prop them up.

If there is an exodus, it's of the people who cared about the game. About its health and future. Because it's hollow now.

One problem every new MMORPG Faces is that they lack content and naturaly cant rival the amount of Content and things older games on the market can offer a new player.
Paired with the huge development cost and the once to keep it up its a risky buisness. But basicly those are also "game as a service games" and more and more of those get made against any reasonability.

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Originally Posted by Wildheaven182

I didn't buy Dawntrail because I didn't like how it looked and didn't have faith in the developers, I was going to wait. And sadly I was right, I'm not satisfied with what I'm seeing in gameplay or narrative.

My bf got it, hated it, and ended up putting it down at a certain point where you have to walk around a big empty places turning off things. He went back to playing WoW, even. Which is bad. He isn't a long time WoW player or anything either, but I also think I'm going to check it out too to play with him instead of on FFXIV.

So, how about a reverse exodus? To anywhere really, any game you'd rather play than Dawntrail. May as well make it a boycott. No sense in wasting my time forcing myself to play something I don't care for like Dawntrail. The FFXIV fanbase is pretty blindly loyal though.

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I'm glad Dawntrail tripped, because WoW newest expansion looks promising.

WoW have been trying to perform better these last few years to restore the players' faiths and the numbers. Now it's FFXIV turn to do the same.

Competition leads to quality, and quality leads to satisfaction. Dawntrail tripped, so that 8.0 can be much more successful, or another catastrophic disaster that might mark the second nightmare era of 1.0

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Originally Posted by Serilyn

I think the whole one game and nothing else mentality is really unnecessary, though I also understand it as MMOs are designed around you devoting all your time to just that game. But it is good to try other things. You wouldn't just watch one movie or read one book in your lifetime, so why resign yourself to only playing one game?

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Oh im not one game and nothing else at all and i dont like that either. But when it comes to subscriptions im not going to have more than 1 game sub at a time just to be responsible.
People who are like one game nothing else are probably the toxic mindless FFxiv fanboy purists that are like "how dare you criticize my perfect game!?"

I always roasted wow and blizzard before myself despite having never played it, and was very resistant to trying it out. But I'm enjoying just questing with my bf in dragonflight. Neither of us have any interest in anything like savage or whatever either.
We like dragons, and it's sorta also a vacation arc like dawntrail only... not pointless. Things are happening all the time in every little quest that feel relevant and interactive.

We havent played wow before so i get people's complaints about stuff. I dont know what legion is but if people say its like a second job, well that sucks and i wouldnt like that either. Neither of us are super big on lore or story, though we do like FFxiv's lore better. He knows more about wow lore than i do, i know practically nothing.

It's just, what would we do together in dawntrail? Walk around skipping cutscenes for 22 hours? To play like 7 instanced dungeons or boss fights?
I just like that i get to play the game in wow. I get to hit things with stick. The skills are way more interesting too tbh because there's variability, and I think ffxiv cares way too much about balance at the cost of fun and still fail at it anyway.

Play whatever game makes you happy; that said, as someone who thinks Dawntrail's MSQ is one of the worst FF14 has served up, I find it humorous that someone would go to WoW for a better story experience. In all my years playing WoW, I can't remember any good narratives from their main plots. WoW has plenty of juicy lore, but its moment-to-moment stories are almost entirely on-par with ARR*.

*There are of course exceptions to that in certain side quests (I will never forget Red Like My Rage), but the same is true for Dawntrail.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It's too complicated for new players to get into by all accounts, which is why it's riddled with veterans who know how to play it.

Despite how WoW players have talked up the graphics and even dared to say they are better than FFXIV... I am not impressed by any video I've seen of it..

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Ah, i seem fine in casual stuff so far. But i have heard about the difficulty to entry but thats probably for getting into end game stuff that i dont care about anyway.

Honestly, i used to think the same that the graphics arent as good, but i think FFxiv just has the fancy glowy particle effects and WoW is way superior in every graphical aspect. Everything is moving and aninated and not stiff, and the animation is the absolute worst in ffxiv. Plus with all the new clipping, weapons floating a foot off of your back sometimes like on hrothgar... FFxiv looks unbearably horrible after playing wow myself. And wow the voice acting makes ffxiv english voice acting look like a complete amateur joke xD

I gotta say it... because it makes me sad. I want ffxiv to be a better game.

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Originally Posted by Abigars

Not sure why anyone thinks the world revolves around which MMORPG they play. I'm a wow player! Now I hate wow with a passion and love ff14! FF14 did me wrong, now I love wow again! Play what you want, play them all, play nothing. Who cares, really?

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Yeah, ive never been big on mmos. Im just not going to pay multiple subs at a time. ill go from one to the other just to save money.

I dont know why everything is assumed to be the most extreme. Like i dont hate ffxiv, i love ffxiv, but i dont like dawntrail enough to play it and i wanted a game to play with my bf.

I hate blizzard immensely for many reasons that everyone else does.

I dislike square enix for their lack of originality, creativity and risk taking, which is ironic for the game's roots in the 1.0 calamity.

I will probably have to maintain that I hate wow on principle but boy is it a lot more fun and interesting. FFxiv has always... had this feeling that it's just designed specifically to waste your time. Dragonflight gives me a game to play in my time.

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Originally Posted by Ardeth

I feel like the normal reasonable people left. I genuinely do. What we have left is the mmo equivalent of sloppy seconds.

It's weird because at one moment, 14 feels dead as hell. Maybe not in people afking, but like when you try to engage socially or try to be civil, this game is a corpse. I'm not talking about the 1000k people in a zone breaking the hunt train. I'm talking about the game. The queued up for frontline or msq or leveling. That game is dead. Anti-social. Anti new player, whatever you want to call it. Either out of contept or fear from moderation, this game is socially dead. Sure, your FC or your friend group are lovely, but your average player doesn't care. Your average party member is just in it for the reward. The joy of doing it is dead.

I just feel like if you told me 11 years ago, the community would devolve twice, I wouldn't believe you, but here we are. From the indistinguishable Wow/FF14 players of 2.0 to the heavily moderated players of today. Both kin in their contept for a social aspect. Both content with getting theirs while leaving you to twist. The passive aggressive arrogant sort. The "My game is the best game ever!" sort. The hypocrites and those who prop them up.

If there is an exodus, it's of the people who cared about the game. About its health and future. Because it's hollow now.

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I despise how much I felt this.