Primal battles in 2.0

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Originally Posted by Jynx

Fixed that one for you.

http://i1.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/...Untitled-1.jpg

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It's alright :[ I'm here too...

EDIT: And I was greatly disappointed upon meeting Reinheart. Not a single subligar in sight until I asked him to put it on >:L

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In 2.0 there will only be one of each primal per world. So one Ifrit, maybe one Shiva maybe one Ramuh, per world.

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http://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/2012/06...cks-and-rocks/

I think one has a definite meaning to it, not "One but there are still the other instanced versions that you can always do."

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

you are STILL taking things out of context, no where did he say primals are going away

when he said things will change, he wasnt even refering directly to primals themselves

and as you said, its possible for multiple versions to exist, so again, why cant it be possible for the instance endgame fight, AND the free company instance fight exist? there is no reason at all

you are backing up the opinion you have, with no proof

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Maybe you're right, maybe I've just been playing the wrong FFXIV and read incorrectly that anything related to the 7th umbral era won't be around in 2.0.

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when we have proof, we will have it, til then, its a rumor

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You're right, the director and producer of the game will spread rumors about 7th umbral era content not existing in 2.0 and rather than completely axing the fights he'll simply just change them...

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why cant it be possible for the instance endgame fight, AND the free company instance fight exist?

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Except the fact the current fights are related to the 7th umbral era, which comes to a conclusion in 1.23, therefore why would they contradict everything they've stated about this being content only current players will ne able to participate in?

We have proof (read interviews) that primals will be roaming and claiming them will take you to an instance.

We have proof (read interviews, dev responses) that if you don't play 1.x you will not be able to do the content related to it as it's a one time only scenario, we have more than enough proof that when e says things will change he's clearly referring to Ifrit Hard/Garuda Hard/Moogles as they have ties to the one time only storyline that will disappear.

You can't take that out of context at all.

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your fighting for people to just believe you.

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It seems more like people are fighting against what the guy in charge of the game said.

Ifrit (Hard), Moogle and Garuda (Hard) do not have connections to the 7th Umbral Era event, it's the prequests that do. All they have to do is change the prequests.

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Originally Posted by Alkar

Ifrit (Hard), Moogle and Garuda (Hard) do not have connections to the 7th Umbral Era event, it's the prequests that do. All they have to do is change the prequests.

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Exactly, it's intertwined. That's exactly why they said it's going to be changed. In order to access them, you have to do 7th UE related quests, which the ending cutscene (especially Garuda's) is pretty tied to the overall scheme of things. So that's why there's a lot more proof that they're changing the format of these fights than there is "no proof of it".

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Originally Posted by Dawiichan

http://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/2012/06...cks-and-rocks/

I think one has a definite meaning to it, not "One but there are still the other instanced versions that you can always do."

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this was refering to how many free companies can own it at a time, in other words, if one has ifrit already, no one else can get him etc etc

I see it as hard will be roaming. And easy and X will be like they are now.

It would be cool if when you engage the roaming primal it looks like it teleports you away to fight in privacy. That would be ok with me. Like Ifrit could take you away to the bowl of embers. That way to the spectatores it just looks like he used his power to rape you on his turf. Like the cloyster trails in 11.

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Originally Posted by Kazai

I see it as hard will be roaming. And easy and X will be like they are now.

It would be cool if when you engage the roaming primal it looks like it teleports you away to fight in privacy. That would be ok with me. Like Ifrit could take you away to the bowl of embers. That way to the spectatores it just looks like he used his power to rape you on his turf. Like the cloyster trails in 11.

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naa the fight should be where you touch him. It would make the fight more dynamic in always changing the environment. It would be awesome to walk through the forest and see fire from a distance to only see a group of people fighting ifrit in the bowl of embers.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

naa the fight should be where you touch him. It would make the fight more dynamic in always changing the environment. It would be awesome to walk through the forest and see fire from a distance to only see a group of people fighting ifrit in the bowl of embers.

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Yea that would be awesome. But would that be instanced?

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Originally Posted by Kazai

Yea that would be awesome. But would that be instanced?

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yes and no, instanced in a sense that one group is fighting it. No, because you are not in a desolate world where some how nobody can see you even if they are in the same area.

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

this was refering to how many free companies can own it at a time, in other words, if one has ifrit already, no one else can get him etc etc

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You say that, but he distinctly says that there will be one of each primal per world. No matter what way you see it, it's blatantly stated there.

Then easy mode also wouldn't exist anymore because that is directly connected to the 7th umbral era and that was said to be gone in 2.0. I don't know what you're seeing, but it's more conflicting to keep these primal battles than it is to not keep them. I think moogle is probably the best chance since I don't think he's considered as a major primal, though that in itself is just speculation.

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Originally Posted by Dawiichan

You say that, but he distinctly says that there will be one of each primal per world. No matter what way you see it, it's blatantly stated there.

Then easy mode also wouldn't exist anymore because that is directly connected to the 7th umbral era and that was said to be gone in 2.0. I don't know what you're seeing, but it's more conflicting to keep these primal battles than it is to not keep them. I think moogle is probably the best chance since I don't think he's considered as a major primal, though that in itself is just speculation.

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he was refering to the summon versions

people are really taking everything out of context these days

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

he was refering to the summon versions

people are really taking everything out of context these days

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Or you just can't accept that it is more likely that they aren't going to be in 2.0? That just sounds like being stubborn.

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Originally Posted by Dawiichan

Or you just can't accept that it is more likely that they aren't going to be in 2.0? That just sounds like being stubborn.

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just like your being?

im going off what has been said factwise, im not trying to interpret things to mean what they "may mean" only what has literaly been said

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

just like your being?

im going off what has been said factwise, im not trying to interpret things to mean what they "may mean" only what has literaly been said

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Now with the primal battles, some plots are connected with the Seventh Umbral Era. I say that there is a good chance their appearance may change in 2.0. Some will remain the same, some won't. So basically, the current game balance and the current reward will only be available now. Some of those items already exist.

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ry-Released%21

It's quite obvious that moogle isn't considered as a major primal since it didn't relate to the 7th umbral era story whatsoever. We've also heard about how the primals are going to be different in 2.0. They've already said it would be a change, not an addition. The rewards are also not going to appear in 2.0, so I rest my case.


P.S.- For it to be literal, it would have to be what was actually written. What was written is that there is only going to be one of each primal per world. So no, you're not.

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Originally Posted by Dawiichan

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ry-Released%21

It's quite obvious that moogle isn't considered as a major primal since it didn't relate to the 7th umbral era story whatsoever. We've already heard about how the primals are going to be different in 2.0. They've already said it would be a change, not an addition. The rewards are also not going to appear in 2.0, so I rest my case.

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what you just quoted was a blanket statement that could refer to ANYTHING, it does not specificaly say pruimals anywhere in it

so that quote does absolutely nothing for your arguement

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

what you just quoted was a blanket statement that could refer to ANYTHING, it does not specificaly say pruimals anywhere in it

so that quote does absolutely nothing for your arguement

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Oh really?

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Now with the primal battles, some plots are connected with the Seventh Umbral Era. I say that there is a good chance their appearance may change in 2.0. Some will remain the same, some won't. So basically, the current game balance and the current reward will only be available now. Some of those items already exist.

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Now with the primal battles, some plots are connected with the Seventh Umbral Era.

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primal

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Originally Posted by Dawiichan

Oh really?

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ok, ill give you that, but for all we know the change will be the CUT SCENE ONLY


theyve made 1 clear statement in regards to changes/removals, and that is that a list is going to be coming out shortly, until then, anything people say is going, is purely speculation.....and that my friend, is the real fact

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

ok, ill give you that, but for all we know the change will be the CUT SCENE ONLY


theyve made 1 clear statement in regards to changes/removals, and that is that a list is going to be coming out shortly, until then, anything people say is going, is purely speculation.....and that my friend, is the real fact

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I'm not going to lie, it hasn't been officially stated that the current primals are going to be gone in 2.0. However you can't simply deny all the information that strongly points towards it.

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Originally Posted by Dawiichan

I'm not going to lie, it hasn't been officially stated that the current primals are going to be gone in 2.0. However you can't simply deny all the information that strongly points towards it.

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it points towards things changing, that change can easily be removal, it can also just as easily be a change in how its presented storywise/cut scenes etc etc

everything is speculation, but some people are coming off as if its a done deal already, and thats what im trying to debunk here

I think moogle king disappear with 2.0
It was only a replacement for Titan

Vedis is one of the most well-informed players out there. And I believe she is on the the right track here.

Why? Because she is saying she is unsure. Those who say she is wrong to be unsure are deceiving themselves. The very fact that there are multiple interpretations on the statements made causing this argument is alone sufficient evidence to support her case.

It's not like we're saying it won't be removed. I seem to recall a simmilar argument about which class would get the WHM job.

That, and people are taking this WAY too seriously. Chill out. More concrete info is coming.

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Originally Posted by Catapult

Vedis is one of the most well-informed players out there. And I believe she is on the the right track here.

Why? Because she is saying she is unsure. Those who say she is wrong to be unsure are deceiving themselves. The very fact that there are multiple interpretations on the statements made causing this argument is alone sufficient evidence to support her case.

It's not like we're saying it won't be removed. I seem to recall a simmilar argument about which class would get the WHM job.

That, and people are taking this WAY too seriously. Chill out. More concrete info is coming.

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Agreed with this sentiment. Any change could be really, anything. From location, NPC to start the quest etc.

Will ask though, if you had to chase ifrit for days just to fight other groups for a chance to get into the ifrit for a chance to win for a chance for an ifrit weapon with a chance its the one you want. Would you do it?

Could be fun a few times. But i wouldn't call that 7/7 RNG fun...

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Originally Posted by Viritess

Agreed with this sentiment. Any change could be really, anything. From location, NPC to start the quest etc.

Will ask though, if you had to chase ifrit for days just to fight other groups for a chance to get into the ifrit for a chance to win for a chance for an ifrit weapon with a chance its the one you want. Would you do it?

Could be fun a few times. But i wouldn't call that 7/7 RNG fun...

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This is one of the big reasons I suspect the existing fights won't be removed. XIV has been ear-marked as a fan-service game, so making the ability to encounter iconic and significant beasties rare and difficult kind of seems illogical to me.

But I really have no idea. My personal theory is that there could be 12 primals, 2 for each element where one is quest-fixed and the other roaming. Eg: Odin (umbral lightning) roams and Ramuh (astral lightning) is a quest. Though I admit this is a bit of a stretch.

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Originally Posted by Punainen

:C Oh, thats totally lame 'cause I can't find anyone yet to help me do primal runs because I've never done it yet. No one wants to let newbies join.

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Then red up on the event and don't mention it. WHM is easy to do on ifrit, less eruption to worry about, keep up heals, dot Ifrit keep tank moving and ignore everyone else.

Moogle is a bit harder to get pickup groups for, but again not that hard. Only issue is garuda thanks to SE fucking up, while the fight isn't super hard the old BLM exploit means so many people got their weapons and now don't want to do it.

This is what we were looking for:
http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com...0c9127bfe4e624

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Achievements
The following achievements will become unavailable upon release of A Realm Reborn:

Battle
La Noscea Big Game Hunter / Black Shroud Big Game Hunter / Thanalan Big Game Hunter / Coerthas Big Game Hunter / Mor Dhona Big Game Hunter / Shposhae Big Game Hunter / Bane of the Tribes / Notorious Monster Hunting / Had Me Some Fun / Most Adorable Death Ever / Where the Wind Blows

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With the achievements gone, I will take that as pretty much good as confirmation that the quest-based access to these primal fights will be gone.

Pity...

The dungeons achievements are going too, but the dungeons are confirmed to stay, so I'd say it's still confusing... ^^;

at this point i want a rep response if possible clarifying if its a removal of the achievment, or the content itself

it still didnt clarify that only that achievments would go due to changes

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

at this point i want a rep response if possible clarifying if its a removal of the achievment, or the content itself

it still didnt clarify that only that achievments would go due to changes

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Yes it does. Big game hunter if you don't know refers also to world spawn 'HNMs'..Highly unlikely that SE is removing them, merely changing things around.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

Yes it does. Big game hunter if you don't know refers also to world spawn 'HNMs'..Highly unlikely that SE is removing them, merely changing things around.

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it is unclear though in a way

it means for sure the achievemnts are gone

but is the content gone too or just changed?

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Originally Posted by Rokien

yes and no, instanced in a sense that one group is fighting it. No, because you are not in a desolate world where some how nobody can see you even if they are in the same area.

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devs probably aren't competent enough to figure out how to do that or it wasn't in WoW first.

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Originally Posted by bobbygunz

devs probably aren't competent enough to figure out how to do that or it wasn't in WoW first.

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Ironic, because Guildleves are instances on the open world which been around since the start.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

Ironic, because Guildleves are instances on the open world which been around since the start.

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Such leve fights don't really have the complexity of a primal fight though.

Does that mean no more chance to get Ifrit , garuda or Moogles weapon ???? cos its if become random NMS ...mean no more chance to kill it. Will have NMS farmer...and when search to kill it after 5hour search see it being kill be a party and have to wait and try to figure where he will appear next ..or after few our found it and got to go work.

That's so lame. When they don't do a levels quest and its appear at a randoms place in all world.To not have to much farming on that leves make that leves appear once a day.

Me too No one wanted to have me in party to kill any of them

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Originally Posted by bobbygunz

devs probably aren't competent enough to figure out how to do that or it wasn't in WoW first.

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Or the fact that the way the fight is done would completely change depending on where you fight him, which would require impossible balancing for the dev team. You may not know this, but terrain can drastically change a fight.

Example: 13 nails in ifrit extreme. However your are in a forest and the amount of space to spawn those nails at the right proportions would be impossible because there are trees taking their location. Then when you want to aoe 3 nails, your aoes can't hit all 3 because there is an obstacle from the open world that doesn't let you position yourself correctly.

Now this is just one problem that could happen and could easily be fixed if it were by itself, but there are countless possibilities for where the balance of the fight could be broken because of the terrain you fight him. The outcome of all this being constant bitching similar to the hate about the fight being instanced.

This is why you fight primals in a certain location and not in a random location at thanalan or the black shroud, because the terrain works well with each primal's mechanics.

I'm still unsure even from those list they post, it's just Achievements and stuffs, not confirmation on "real content"

I have a few questions and I hope someone has a "real" answer, reps, devs, user, player anyone.

Is Instanced Primal contents gone with it's drops in 2.0 ?
If so, what will "Happen" to future Primal Battles like Titan and Leviathan ?
Instanced Ifrit and Garuda is staying for Relic, is it the only exception?

Will Faction leves stay in the New Leve system ?
Will Skirmish and its' drops stay ? Will Faction drops stay ?

In 2.0 will Old Sidequests, Job Quests and Class Quests for all(DoH, DoL, etc) be gone ?
If so, will the means of obtaining Crowns and Achievements be changed ?

It was mentioned that you will be able to change Grand Companies in 2.0.
Will we start from scratch ? or will we start from being a recruit in all GC ?
Will we be able to take on other GCs previous Quests ?

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Since Open World Primals is confirmed, will Moogle be in too ? :p


Assuming Dungeon and Hamlet is staying, so does their drops I guess 0.0

The so called Achievement are more tie-in to the story, and we all know that the Moogles won't be smashing down those Magitek Airshiprobot in v2.0, because if you look at trailer and concept arts etc. even the Garleans are going through aesthetic change (no more stick figure magitek). They will still be there, they will still be instanced, they will have a different battleground and a different story. For instance you will no longer see Darnustroll (teleporting every 5 sec for a whole 10 minutes, best Primal troll ever) during the cutscene for Easy Ifrit, nor Easy Garuda.

Dungeons achievements (not dungeons) are gone, why? Because Toto-rak, Darkhold and Aurum Vale is tie-in very closely to current Garlean invasion, or more specifically Darnustroll's VII Legion. The VII Legion will mostly like be wiped out during Dalamud descend.

Im hoping they introduce 2 versions of the primals. 1 that roams around on the world maps that free companies have a chance at defeating and summoning and 1 in a situation similar to XI's avatars, where you had to travel into a dungeon to fight and these would drop loot like weapons and maybe even primal themed gear. For them to have put a fair amount of thought into the Garuda fight only to wipe it out of existence in 2.0 doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense.

ok so after reading it 50 thousand times, ive come to a conclusion

they refer to the gobbue mount as content being removed
but only to the achievemnts for everything else

therefore...the content is staying, the achievemnts are going.

my thoughts conclude that they will probly be introducing new achievemnts for all the fights/dungeons
this will be to reflect having done it pre 2.0 versus post 2.0, due to the battle mechanic changes that will be taking place, which could make all content very different in just that regard

With regards to the camps and aetherytes, I do recall them talking about how with the maps changing, this would result in a completely new set of aethyrial gates across the game, which would have their own set of achievements. So those aren't much of a stretch.

If we... extrapolate, it means the purple aethers won't be there any more. Of course I am still drawing a slightly long bow if I wanted to tie that all the way to primal fight access.