The artificial Eye reflection looks bad.

For my miqote, I noticed that the catchlights were odd, but it seemed like the change in contrast between iris and pupil changed the whole dynamic of the eye for me, the sparkles just made it muddier ;_;

I feel like the grey haze was unintentional.

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Originally Posted by Cheapshot

I feel like the grey haze was unintentional.

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Agree. At first I was praising the new eye lights but after I went through the benchmark itself outside of character creator all I see are hazy/foggy eyes; it looks really bad. But it looks like they didn't mean it for it to be like that since in character creator I don't see the hazy/foggy eyes in any of the scenes.

I just booted up the benchmark again to check and it doesn't look like there are any permanent catchlights. Some of them only move around when you adjust the camera vertically, maybe that's what you're seeing?

Either way, I think the new catchlights look awful. In the previous benchmark they were there but subtle. Now it looks like I have a solar system rotating in my eyeball.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...77cdc097c97c7&

I noticed something in the reflections, can anyone confirm?

https://files.catbox.moe/0rkmqx.png

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

I just booted up the benchmark again to check and it doesn't look like there are any permanent catchlights. Some of them only move around when you adjust the camera vertically, maybe that's what you're seeing?

Either way, I think the new catchlights look awful. In the previous benchmark they were there but subtle. Now it looks like I have a solar system rotating in my eyeball.

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They're 'permanent' in that they're lights attached to the camera, so you'll always see them if you point the camera directly at your eyes. I quite liked them in the first benchmark too, but the subtlety seemed to have caused quite a stir.

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Originally Posted by Astronis

They're 'permanent' in that they're lights attached to the camera, so you'll always see them if you point the camera directly at your eyes. I quite liked them in the first benchmark too, but the subtlety seemed to have caused quite a stir.

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Oooh I get what you mean now. Yeah I'm not a fan. I was totally mystified by the "soulless eyes" comments during the first benchmark. They behaved exactly as I expected them to given how light works.

The more I look at the new eyes the more I like tbem, specially up close. I think they should keep it, it's better than the 1.0 benchmark which had soulless eyes.

It just seems to really, really depend on the race. My fem face 3 highlander eyes got worse (foggy, lower rez iris?? almost cannot see her pupil in benchmark screenshots) but fem au'ra is completely fine, no haze. Both looked good in the first benchmark. On the other hand my fem face 2 highlander no longer has ink-smeared eyes, so its a relative improvement.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Oooh I get what you mean now. Yeah I'm not a fan. I was totally mystified by the "soulless eyes" comments during the first benchmark. The behaved exactly as I expected them to given how light works.

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Haha, right? They worked exactly the way I expected them to as well. But I can see why it was an issue 'in game' so to speak, and the first benchmark's old chargen really was a terrible way to show off the new work done on the player characters.

I like the new light too, though agree it's quite strong. Because the devs redid the lighting in chargen, it's much, much easier to see the environmental lights reflected in our eyes along with the 'permanent' camera light. I counted something like four or five environmental lights, and the 'permanent' light can split itself up into four or five reflections if you aim right, so yeah, I bet that looks overwhelming on characters with large, open eyes. There's no way to know for sure how it will look in game, but based on the actual benchmark and not the improved chargen, I suspect it won't be as overwhelming when we're running around playing. Hopefully it will just end up being a character creator trade-off--we got vastly improved chargen lighting along with impressively modeled and textured eyes at the expense of all those lights reflecting in them in a way that would look more natural if our characters were standing next to the lighting section of the hardware store and not in the Black Shroud.

(I am going to have so much fun in gpose when DT drops.)

I cant believe this community got filtered so hard by having to rotate their character in the character creator that they added this.

I like the new catch lights. They behave a little more 'realistically,' but are exaggerate enough to match the visual style of the game.

The static catchlight looks bad currently. I wish they had just upped the sensitivity on the dynamic lights instead of painting on a tacky dot because people can't let go of dated graphics.

What really gets me is the new fake catch light is fuzzier than the real reflections

https://i.imgur.com/4rv3DJc.png

https://i.gyazo.com/9ccbecb7c567e81a...3075ab25e2.gif
(The real reflections look amazing, but that sticker tho...)

What my character sees every time I look at their eyes
https://living.geico.com/wp-content/...600x400-LG.gif

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Originally Posted by coffeepotz

I just need to stay off OF for this. While there are still legit concerns, its becoming clear to me that some people just cannot handle the fact that updating the graphics will change how their character looks and they will fight tooth and claw to hold back graphical progress. Adding back the fake reflections is the perfect example of that

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This. I'm actually more than just worried that these people have so much influence on proceedings or rather the regression of it.

Agreed, I actually really liked how my eyes/eyebrows looked in the first benchmark.

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Originally Posted by Tahli

Agreed, I actually really liked how my eyes/eyebrows looked in the first benchmark.

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Same, the eyes are just worse now. I think I may have to fantasia my eye color to darker eyes if I can’t get used to the cataracts.

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Originally Posted by Angelivia

This. I'm actually more than just worried that these people have so much influence on proceedings or rather the regression of it.

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There is updating graphics and then there is changing the artsytle.

What they have done in some cases, like the eyes is to change the artstyle.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

I cant believe this community got filtered so hard by having to rotate their character in the character creator that they added this.

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And i can't believe the amount of people who can't bother to look up why that catch-light is there instead of being obsessed with realism.

Even movies with actors uses catch-lights.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

And i can't believe the amount of people who can't bother to look up why that catch-light is there instead of being obsessed with realism.

Even movies with actors uses catch-lights.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

There is updating graphics and then there is changing the artsytle.

What they have done in some cases, like the eyes is to change the artstyle.

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The problem is that the current catch lights are neither realistic nor consistent with the previous art style. Our old models didn't have 800 bright catchlights swirling around their eye at all times, and neither do real people. It looks bizarre.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

There is updating graphics and then there is changing the artsytle.

What they have done in some cases, like the eyes is to change the artstyle.

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I don't think it has anything to do with "artstyle" - The static catchlight simply got painted on due to graphical limitations; natural lightning and reflections weren't possible at that time so they needed a solution to make it less apparent. It might not have been ideal but it did the trick. It's not like it was intentional from the beginning. Now they have the means to update said graphics, so of course they're replacing poor compromises with far better design choices. And it saddens me to see they're going back on it because the vast majority seriously got attached to the makeshift method of flaw-concealment.

Next thing they say is that low poly corners and angles are the "sharp features" they're missing with the high poly even lines.

I think one of the biggest issues is the contrast issue with both lighting and changes to the iris/pupil definition. The current implementation seems like a muddled compromise that appeases nobody.

For my miqo, mesing about even more, the lighting changes and the weak fuzzy catch light reflections make the eyes sorta blur into the face, its got less impact, less presence. Other races/eyes/color combinations have less of a problem, but for my colors, its really noticeable how boring it looks. If they boosted the catch light contrast against the eye (and fixed the milk-iness) I think it would look way better, because right now they look like dull marbles, at least on my miqo.

1.1 Bench with slight hair+eye color change | Live

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...960&height=416

And this is what happens when you ask for them to change stuff that doesn't need to be changed.

Has everyone learned their lesson?.... Yea I thought not..

I think adding the artificial light -before- we'd even got to see how the lighting in the eyes looked with the updated benchmark is classic FFXIV dev overcorrecting tbh.

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Originally Posted by Angelivia

I don't think it has anything to do with "artstyle" - The static catchlight simply got painted on due to graphical limitations; natural lightning and reflections weren't possible at that time so they needed a solution to make it less apparent. It might not have been ideal but it did the trick. It's not like it was intentional from the beginning. Now they have the means to update said graphics, so of course they're replacing poor compromises with far better design choices. And it saddens me to see they're going back on it because the vast majority seriously got attached to the makeshift method of flaw-concealment.

Next thing they say is that low poly corners and angles are the "sharp features" they're missing with the high poly even lines.

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As mentioned earlier, the whole eye got changed style wise. From clear looking with sharp pupils to more washed out, with a notable material change in how the light reflects from the eye as seen when you turn the camera to the side to look at the sclera.

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Originally Posted by OgruMogru

I think adding the artificial light -before- we'd even got to see how the lighting in the eyes looked with the updated benchmark is classic FFXIV dev overcorrecting tbh.

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Did they change much about the lighting in the benchmark beside adding the catch-light? The lighting issue was mostly about inconsistent lighting between the character creator and game/benchmark as well as the absence of catch-light.

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Originally Posted by Fjarrisky

I think one of the biggest issues is the contrast issue with both lighting and changes to the iris/pupil definition. The current implementation seems like a muddled compromise that appeases nobody.

For my miqo, mesing about even more, the lighting changes and the weak fuzzy catch light reflections make the eyes sorta blur into the face, its got less impact, less presence. Other races/eyes/color combinations have less of a problem, but for my colors, its really noticeable how boring it looks. If they boosted the catch light contrast against the eye (and fixed the milk-iness) I think it would look way better, because right now they look like dull marbles, at least on my miqo.

1.1 Bench with slight hair+eye color change | Live

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Would be better to have a clearer camera-catch light and more faded ambient catch-lights As well as making the eye features look sharp again.

Also don't use discord for linking images those links expire after a while.

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Originally Posted by coffeepotz

I just need to stay off OF for this. While there are still legit concerns, its becoming clear to me that some people just cannot handle the fact that updating the graphics will change how their character looks and they will fight tooth and claw to hold back graphical progress. Adding back the fake reflections is the perfect example of that

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Most people wouldn't want to admit that the limitation of old downsized Luminous Engine
Is what make their character... their character.

And the tricky things is art is both objective and subjective at the same time.

What CBU3 could do is just simply increase the polycount across the body without changing the current character features and options at all.

And then add some new character customization feature as well as options that became possible due to increased polycount of character.

But we all know due to technical debt of 2.0 FFXIV's downsized Luminious Engine, it was too time consuming to be prioritized to add these feature.

The biggest mistake Yoshida-san has done to FFXIV is release FFXIV within the life-span of PS3. And now this development decision is starting to bite them back now.