Please make the Seraphism model swap optional

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Originally Posted by fulminating

https://i.imgur.com/Tl9RU8V.png
Got bored and doodled some alternatives.
As you can probably tell, I have nearly no artistic talent. Hopefully the point is presented intelligibly though.

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Being surrounded by Chain Stratagem screens for the duration of the buff would be an absolutely inspired design choice. I would WANT to cast the ability as often as possible.

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Originally Posted by Lesan

Or someone has been daydrinking on the job since the development for ShB started, that is where the Angelfication began.

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The Angelfication of Scholar began with the release of HW, when they gave it the LB3 Angel Feathers. It's still not as well incorporated as the military and fairy motifs for sure, but it's been a part of the job identity since 2015. Not really fair to call it a new change.

Just add a toggle to be able to disable it and call it a day.

This looks like someone got stuck with the SCH job design and got their revenge by crossing a nun with a chicken. The end result isn't pretty.

So much for the SCH class fantasy. Really thinking of retiring healer.

https://i.imgur.com/qMWSvKn.png

Now I'll be forced trade military gear for robes.

I hate it.

I spend a lot of time to make my character look how I like with a glam that I want. Don't force me to wear a halloween costume because I pressed an ability button.

Will probably swap back to using AST as my main healer if it stays.

I feel like if this ability sticks, along with Enshroud, it's setting a stupid precedent for all kinds of dumb costume changes. I stopped playing a shaman during Cataclysm in World of Warcraft because it turned you into one of their edgy new elemental master character models for the duration and I absolutely hated it.

I don't dislike the idea of "Upgrading" your fairy to an Angel. That's fine. I saw it as a "supercharged" form. What's stronger than a little fairy? A little angel. Fine, cool.

I don't want to wear a white gown and silly angel wings on my back though. That doesn't look like I am "powering" up. Recitation feels more powerful. Even Emergency tactics feels more powerful. How am I being empowered by wearing long white robes and crown? What does purity and chastity have to do with Scholar. What happened to my mortarbard? My glasses? My medals? I'm not a priest, I'm not a religious figure. I'm a military tactitian that made a pact with an aether construct to defend an old coastal city.

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Originally Posted by fulminating

https://i.imgur.com/Tl9RU8V.png
Got bored and doodled some alternatives.
As you can probably tell, I have nearly no artistic talent. Hopefully the point is presented intelligibly though.

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I saw similar outfits on reddit a couple hours ago and I think even if Seraphism does not go in the direction of Fairy Wings, the additional hat and cloak would be a great transformation effect. It adheres to the Nymian Marine theme as a high ranking military tactician as per Scholar's lore. The translucent military outfit that goes on top of your character billowing outwards would have been a great addition in contrast to WHM's Temperance. I find it to be a more tasteful 'magical-girl transformation' that doesn't directly overwrite all of your outfit glamours or racial features.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fulminating

https://i.imgur.com/Tl9RU8V.png
Got bored and doodled some alternatives.
As you can probably tell, I have nearly no artistic talent. Hopefully the point is presented intelligibly though.

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The Chain Strat screens would go so hard. Please CBU3.

It’s already bad enough that the majority of healer gear is a fairly generic white robe. I’ve worked hard to avoid the look they specifically want to thrust upon us. Most of my glams share a reasonably close vibe with the artifact gear, just a bit less busy.

Plus, if they were going to have a visual transformation, the logical one would be to give Eos’s wings during dissipation, sans robe.

I find the idea of becoming a angle funny.
But, it should be a skill of the summoner.

I mean, aside of the allways growing horns is the second most common thing for them, to have wings at the back. A form, that gives them wings, looks fitting.^^

A capstone skill of shoving all 3 fairy iterations into canons to strategically set off at allies/foes would be appalling, but at least more thematically consistent with the class than whatever left turn is going on with Seraphism's forced outfit change.

I spend a lot of time finding looks that I like that aren't robes robes robes for my scholar. I like seeing my character proudly wearing Nymian green clothing. The Seraphism change is none of that.

Another issue with the model swap, which I've only seen mentioned in a couple places, is that some people purposely glamour their character in ways to help them with precise visual positioning, which throwing a robe over makes more difficult.

Continuing on that thought of positioning, having your character change visuals in a crowd makes them harder to see and to know where you are. I already felt bothered by how easy it was to lose sight of my Scholar when using Art of War in a large group of people or enemies since the character ducks down to hit the ground. Having my green outfit wearing Viera disappear and become some generic robed white figure amongst a bunch of other classes that already wear white and/or robes is not great for visual identity. Visual identity is the whole reason we aren't allowed to even glamour outfits across jobs/roles, despite how often NPCs are allowed to, so why is Scholar being given a White Mage/Astrologian cosplay?

I guess it doesn't matter that my Viera won't look right in 7.0 since I'll be looking at this generic Hyur model in a costume so often when playing my main. That graphics update sure is exciting -_-

Spends years redoing the games graphics and making character appearance better only to immediately make it so that you cannot enjoy said new character appearance.

Doing my civic duty and voicing my distaste for Seraphism. I don't like my character's outfit being changed, especially to a look that doesn't even match their job. If I want to wear holy robes I would be playing WHM.

I am also going to throw my disappointment hat into public commentary.

I don't even play SCH, but after the benchmark hinted at maybe getting an Alexander ability, I was hyped for SCH finally developing some sort of job cohesion AND getting some cool new summons. I believe Alexander, Warring Triad, and Eden would all very reasonably fit within Scholar's aesthetic; even Athena/Ultima or Omega could possibly stretch as well. It has so much potential as a strategic/scientific counterpart to SMN.

Seraphism is like the pure antithesis of what I was hoping for. It doubles down on by far one of the more baffling and auxiliary introductions to Scholar's kit (Seraph), is not flavorfully on point with the job fantasy at all, and is ugly as sin. By far the biggest disappointment in the 7.0 job actions. Just delete it already Yoshi-P if you still haven't figured out what it can do.

It would have really been nice to pair the new dot with more analysis based effects for SCH. It's the vfx package I've really found lacking in recent SCH design. The angel muumuu is just a misstep in the direction of the fairy theme, without the fairy theming.

So...it's clear everyone hates the priest look with discount accessory wings but out of pure curiosity, has there been any footage of how that form looks from the front?

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Originally Posted by Allegor

has there been any footage of how that form looks from the front?

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None yet, we have to wait for the media tour stuff to be released for a better look at other angles.

I fully expect that it'll look even worse from the front, since the wings are the part that the people who 'like it' are all talking about, and they'd be obscured from the front. In fact, with how robe-y some of the raid sets are (E4S comes to mind very heavily):

https://pro2-bar-s3-cdn-cf.myportfol...0007ae8fe05f29

...From the front, will we even be able to tell that Seraphism was activated, if we're wearing a set like that?

I'd much rather (like almost everyone, it seems) see a capstone that reinforces the theme of 'battlefield tactician, giving orders to faerie companion'. If they want to increase GCD healing again (bad idea, since it'd just mean 'Spread Adlo is stronger again'), they could do so via something like:

Synchronization Tactics, 120s CD
Orders your faerie to move in lockstep with yourself. Each time you cast a spell, the faerie will also cast the same spell, at 25% effectiveness, on the same target. If the cast spell is AOE in nature, the faerie will cast it at her location.
Duration: 30s

That way, if the faerie applies a shield because you cast Adlo on someone, that 'Fey Adlo' or whatever it'd be called, would be exempt from Deployment Tactics, keeping SCH's ability to 'delete raid mechanics' in check

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Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe

Synchronization Tactics, 120s CD
Orders your faerie to move in lockstep with yourself. Each time you cast a spell, the faerie will also cast the same spell, at 25% effectiveness, on the same target. If the cast spell is AOE in nature, the faerie will cast it at her location.
Duration: 30s

That way, if the faerie applies a shield because you cast Adlo on someone, that 'Fey Adlo' or whatever it'd be called, would be exempt from Deployment Tactics, keeping SCH's ability to 'delete raid mechanics' in check

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There was an iteration of PvP SCH that acted similar to this, and I found it pretty fun. Your Summon Eos button would have her hover over your shoulder and cast Embrace on anyone you healed. Each heal drained the fairy gauge.

Current PVP Summon Seraph is good. It can be implemented in PVE for as long as it will not remove your current pet. Then bring back Rouse.

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Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe

I fully expect that it'll look even worse from the front, since the wings are the part that the people who 'like it' are all talking about, and they'd be obscured from the front. In fact, with how robe-y some of the raid sets are (E4S comes to mind very heavily):

...From the front, will we even be able to tell that Seraphism was activated, if we're wearing a set like that?

I'd much rather (like almost everyone, it seems) see a capstone that reinforces the theme of 'battlefield tactician, giving orders to faerie companion'. If they want to increase GCD healing again (bad idea, since it'd just mean 'Spread Adlo is stronger again'), they could do so via something like:

Synchronization Tactics, 120s CD
Orders your faerie to move in lockstep with yourself. Each time you cast a spell, the faerie will also cast the same spell, at 25% effectiveness, on the same target. If the cast spell is AOE in nature, the faerie will cast it at her location.
Duration: 30s

That way, if the faerie applies a shield because you cast Adlo on someone, that 'Fey Adlo' or whatever it'd be called, would be exempt from Deployment Tactics, keeping SCH's ability to 'delete raid mechanics' in check

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I’ve been thinking 1 of 2 things with seraphism that I think is more likely than it just being a generic “20% healing up potency” because of the spreadlo problem

1) similar to what you say seraphism applies it’s healing up in a different way to a generic healing up. I can think of a few ways they could achieve this
A) Seraphism applies a secondary barrier independent of galvanise that is 10/20% whatever the buff percentage is on top of the galvanise (similar to how current catalyse works)
B) Seraphism changes adlos cast under it to a different skill that can neither be recited nor deployed. So something like Seraphism changes adlo to seraphic barrier which is 20% stronger than adlo but can’t be recited or deployed

2) they intend to delete deployment tactics and make it so if you want a strong AOE shield you need to recite succor. Right now Zoe e prog is 480 potency. Assuming a crit multiplier of 1.6 crit succor is 512 (current deployment is 864). If they deleted deployment that would still give SCH a decent edge (the biggest SGE can offer is 528 by adding physis healing up, if we assume Seraphism is a flat 20% then stacking it, dissipation and illumination would be 811. Still much stronger than SGE but lacking its current immense power) which would also reduce how overpowered reducing recitations CD is considering the equivalent skill they are reducing for SGE is the pathetic soteria

Either way if they just give Seraphism a flat 20% and nothing else SCH is going to be deleting mechanics in lesbian power ultimate like during DSR and SGE is gonna get a buff it doesn’t need to compensate

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Originally Posted by Allegor

has there been any footage of how that form looks from the front?

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I fully expect it to be this XD

I understand the value of keeping feedback funneled into a single, cohesive location, but I also feel like the length of my feedback usually ends up being way too much to jam-into the replies of a preexisting Thread, without being disruptive to the flow of discussion.

So, if anyone from the SE/CBU3/Community teams are actually reading this, the following linked Post summarises the feelings and feedback that I would like to convey to the designers about the planned "Seraphism" Action:

"Seraphism" is not the correct fantasy for Scholar fans

Otherwise, I would just generally like to offer my support for most of the feedback and opinions already-contained in this current Thread — especially, being much less concerned with what Seraphism "does", mechanically, than with how garish, tacky, incongruous and off-putting its "White Mage MogStation Cosplay" forced-transformation aesthetic comes-across.

I'm going to throw my comment in this thread:

Making Seraphism optional is not acceptable to me. It needs to be removed altogether. The design decision is that terrible.

Front profile of the new Seraphism.
https://www.4gamer.net/games/199/G01...015/SS/054.jpg
Whats the point of updating graphics if they're just going to cover our face with this awful tablecloth.

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Originally Posted by Rozeee

Front profile of the new Seraphism.
https://www.4gamer.net/games/199/G01...015/SS/054.jpg
Whats the point of updating graphics if they're just going to cover our face with this awful tablecloth.

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We should have gotten this instead. Tonberryism.


https://onlinestore-img.finalfantasy...ub1_detail.jpg

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Originally Posted by Rozeee

Front profile of the new Seraphism.
https://www.4gamer.net/games/199/G01...015/SS/054.jpg
Whats the point of updating graphics if they're just going to cover our face with this awful tablecloth.

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I wish I could know how many people install plugins for the first time just to disable this.

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Originally Posted by Rozeee

Front profile of the new Seraphism.
https://www.4gamer.net/games/199/G01...015/SS/054.jpg
Whats the point of updating graphics if they're just going to cover our face with this awful tablecloth.

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Why is that WHM holding a book?

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Originally Posted by Rozeee

Front profile of the new Seraphism.
https://www.4gamer.net/games/199/G01...015/SS/054.jpg
Whats the point of updating graphics if they're just going to cover our face with this awful tablecloth.

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Ugh. So digusting to look at.

I think I am just going to link this here https://gamerescape.com/2024/06/06/f...0the%20game%3F

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Originally Posted by Rozeee

Front profile of the new Seraphism.
https://www.4gamer.net/games/199/G01...015/SS/054.jpg
Whats the point of updating graphics if they're just going to cover our face with this awful tablecloth.

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Remind me on Seraphimon and Ophanimon.
Maybe a little changes around the legs had been nice (dont like long robes, who limits leg movement).

In Overall is it a nice contrast to the enshroud Mode (and had maybe fit the whm more).

10

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Originally Posted by fulminating

I think I am just going to link this here https://gamerescape.com/2024/06/06/f...0the%20game%3F

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Naoki Yoshida: [...] looking at the jobs that are available throughout the final fantasy series, it would feel awkward say if a Black Mage jumped into an instanced dungeon with full plate armor. I think we want to maintain the image that we’ve depicted through these different jobs that are available in the series.

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Amazing.

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Originally Posted by Eorzean_username

10





Amazing.

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Me checking in with my healer speedo glam

It’s very thematic to the original intention of the final fantasy series

Probably isn't the right thread but since it got mentioned... but if that's what Yoshi-P says, I'd really like to know what do he and his dev team thinks about Male Characters on Striking job getting Neo-Ishgardian tops that literally has a effin' revolver. Do MNKs thunderclap the bosses to bang them or what?

If that's not laziness plus PR bs, Idk what that is.

WHY

DOES MY TACTICAL MARINE-HEALER

HAVE A CROWN OF THORNS LIKE JESUS HIMSELF ON THE CROSS

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Originally Posted by Rozeee

Front profile of the new Seraphism.
https://www.4gamer.net/games/199/G01...015/SS/054.jpg
Whats the point of updating graphics if they're just going to cover our face with this awful tablecloth.

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Looks like Scholar was promoted to a Theologian at level 100 after spreading diseases with biological warfare tactics in earlier levels haha

that somehow looks worse from the front than I imagined it could lol we really need cbu3 to sit down and develop a clear aesthetic and thematic direction for SCH. Idk what happened to “nerd and fae familiar research defensive battle strategies together”. “SCH gets a transformation that puts it in a white sheet with 2D silver embellishments” would not have been on my bingo card if it had infinite dimensions. i feel like this is a reference i’m not getting.

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Originally Posted by Eorzean_username

10





Amazing.

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Thank god we don't have mages running around in plate armor!
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...em/301a405801e
What's that link? How did that get there? Please ignore it!

Seriously...?

https://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/interview/1593842.html

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――学者がいきなり変身していて、びっくりしました。

吉田氏：　学者は「妖精食べた？！」など、色々な歴史があって、いよいよ自身がフェアリーに転身。でもデザインはバトル班とアート班が相当な回数のやり取りをして決まっていきました。ちょっと天使よりという意見もでるかもとは思っていますが、まずはじっくり触ってみていただけると嬉しいです。

――学者はいままで海兵魂！とか、結構武骨な印象だったので、落差がすごかったです。

吉田氏：　絵替わりは非常に大事なので、こういった大胆さはあって良いと思います！

――学者のセラフィム化やソルバハムートは、どちらも裏設定がありそうなアクションですが、今回それがわかるようなジョブクエストがあるんでしょうか？

吉田氏：　一連のジョブクエストは一回完結させているのと、ジョブクエストを作った場合、縛られてジョブ自体の改修に影響がでるため、本当はあった方が良いのかもしれませんが、今回用意していません。むしろ今後別の形でサイドクエストを作る時に、その中でロアが分かるようになるということはやると思います。

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I was surprised to see the scholar suddenly transform.

Yoshida:
The scholar has a lot of history, including "Did he eat a fairy?!", and now he has transformed into a fairy. But the design was decided after a lot of back and forth between the battle team and the art team. I think some people might say it's a little more angelic, but I'd be happy if you could just take a look at it.

Scholars have always had a pretty rough impression, with people saying things like "Marine Spirit!", so the difference was huge.
(Alternative from DeepL)
The art team has been a bit more “Marine Soul” and “Soul of a Marine” until now! The difference between the two was quite striking.

Yoshida:
Changing the art is very important, so I think this kind of boldness is good!

(Alternative from DeepL)
Yoshida:
I think it's good to have such a bold change of picture!

The scholar's transformation into a seraphim and [Level 100 Summoner's] Solar Bahamut are both actions that seem to have backstories, but will there be a job quest this time that reveals that?

Yoshida:
The series of job quests are completed once, and if we created a job quest, it would be tied down and affect the revision of the job itself, so it might be better to have one, but we haven't prepared one this time. Rather, when we create side quests in a different form in the future, we think we'll do something that reveals the "Lore" in them.

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Originally Posted by Eorzean_username

Seriously...?

https://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/interview/1593842.html

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A lot of back and forth eh? Sounds like dithering and second guessing again to me.