Zepla: Endwalker is the Worst FFXIV Expansion I have played

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Originally Posted by Stasya

You don't need to shill for yoshi so much. He doesn't care about you just like he doesn't care about ff14 growing in any way at all (as long as you stay subbed and give his company money to waste time on other games)

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I think you are misunderstanding - I am neither exclusively agreeing nor disagreeing with either Zep or Yoshi P, I am only stating what they each do and have done in a reductive sense.

Zep's complaints about the game are perfectly valid and I agree on a ton of points and Yoshi P simply gave a "well if it currently isnt fun for you take a break" sort of advice. Does this seem like shilling to you? The main point of this post is criticizing the OP for playing human newsletter to stir already confirmed emotions and opinions without actually providing any additional takes from themselves, which I saw no point for.

Call me a shill all you want, but if I actually were to unpack how much there is to criticize about the game I'd need to take three days off from work to be done in reasonable time.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

The main point of this post is criticizing the OP for playing human newsletter to stir already confirmed emotions and opinions without actually providing any additional takes from themselves, which I saw no point for.

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Yep. That is exactly what I was doing. The OP themselves aren't even making a point. Zepla is, and I agree with her myself. This redundancy, along with their obvious intentions based on other threads they've made, sort of makes anything the OP says irrelevant in my eyes, regardless of the threads they create.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

I think you are misunderstanding - I am neither exclusively agreeing nor disagreeing with either Zep or Yoshi P, I am only stating what they each do and have done in a reductive sense.

Zep's complaints about the game are perfectly valid and I agree on a ton of points and Yoshi P simply gave a "well if it currently isnt fun for you take a break" sort of advice. Does this seem like shilling to you? The main point of this post is criticizing the OP for playing human newsletter to stir already confirmed emotions and opinions without actually providing any additional takes from themselves, which I saw no point for.

Call me a shill all you want, but if I actually were to unpack how much there is to criticize about the game I'd need to take three days off from work to be done in reasonable time.

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Except Zepla actually addresses Yoshi-P's comments on "playing another game" in her video with a quote from Ion Hazzikostas of all people. MMOs are social games and you reach a critical mass of people logging in or not based on how many other people are playing. A new patch or expansion brings players in much like the current irregular tomestone event but likewise it goes the other way. There's been less content this expansion and less replayability in the content we have received. At some point enough people don't log in that the game feels dead or people that would log in quickly log off when they see all their friends offline.


Yoshi-P's "play another game" comment is always used to deflect criticism and at this rate it'll be what kills the game, everyone will leave to play other games and a critical mass will be reached that starts a downward spiral. Why even earn an Endwalker relic in this expansion when it'll be quicker to buy with poetics in 7.x? Likewise, why even bother gearing unless you play savage without a relic zone to play? Do the raids once for a story and dip. In fact, just wait until the x.55 patch and binge the entire MSQ/story content at once. I'll play other games alright, I'll even document and encourage the most cost effective way to do this so other people can easily copy. We'll soon see how many other games Yoshi-P and Square Enix want us to play when we're only subscribed for 2-3 months out of a 24+ month expansion cycle.

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Originally Posted by Johners

Except Zepla actually addresses Yoshi-P's comments on "playing another game" in her video with a quote from Ion Hazzikostas of all people. MMOs are social games and you reach a critical mass of people logging in or not based on how many other people are playing. A new patch or expansion brings players in much like the current irregular tomestone event but likewise it goes the other way. There's been less content this expansion and less replayability in the content we have received. At some point enough people don't log in that the game feels dead or people that would log in quickly log off when they see all their friends offline.


Yoshi-P's "play another game" comment is always used to deflect criticism and at this rate it'll be what kills the game, everyone will leave to play other games and a critical mass will be reached that starts a downward spiral. Why even earn an Endwalker relic in this expansion when it'll be quicker to buy with poetics in 7.x? Likewise, why even bother gearing unless you play savage without a relic zone to play? Do the raids once for a story and dip. In fact, just wait until the x.55 patch and binge the entire MSQ/story content at once. I'll play other games alright, I'll even document and encourage the most cost effective way to do this so other people can easily copy. We'll soon see how many other games Yoshi-P and Square Enix want us to play when we're only subscribed for 2-3 months out of a 24+ month expansion cycle.

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I agree with everything except 24+ implies it's minimum 24, actually it's minimum 30 now, it's really that bad, and it's probably 32 or 33 for 6.x.

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

I agree with everything except 24+ implies it's minimum 24, actually it's minimum 30 now, it's really that bad, and it's probably 32 or 33 for 6.x.

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Seriosuly though, Endwalker is £30 on Steam which I assume is the same price for the standard edition on PlayStation, Windows standalone and macOS versions of the expansion. If you wait until Janaury, more than two years after the release of Endwalker and when 6.55 is due to release, you'll likely be able to buy the expansion for 50% off and buy three months of subscription at front for a reduced price. It'll be around £50 to get both of those which gives you more than enough time to play all the story content and get relatively decent last patch gear, maybe get a relic weapon and do some DoH/DoL before ignoring the game until 7.55 sometime in 2026.

What we really need are one or more of the big XIV content creators clearly explaining this casual playstyle on their social media channels. I'm sure Square Enix would very quickly change their tone on "playing other games" and how they approach end game content design if we openly encouraged a playstyle that destroys the underlying business model of the subscription MMO that carries Square Enix's financials every year.

It's ok to weaponise the monthly subscription fee against against Square Enix, Blizzard or any other MMO developer.

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Originally Posted by Johners

Except Zepla actually addresses Yoshi-P's comments on "playing another game" in her video with a quote from Ion Hazzikostas of all people. MMOs are social games and you reach a critical mass of people logging in or not based on how many other people are playing. A new patch or expansion brings players in much like the current irregular tomestone event but likewise it goes the other way. There's been less content this expansion and less replayability in the content we have received. At some point enough people don't log in that the game feels dead or people that would log in quickly log off when they see all their friends offline.


Yoshi-P's "play another game" comment is always used to deflect criticism and at this rate it'll be what kills the game, everyone will leave to play other games and a critical mass will be reached that starts a downward spiral. Why even earn an Endwalker relic in this expansion when it'll be quicker to buy with poetics in 7.x? Likewise, why even bother gearing unless you play savage without a relic zone to play? Do the raids once for a story and dip. In fact, just wait until the x.55 patch and binge the entire MSQ/story content at once. I'll play other games alright, I'll even document and encourage the most cost effective way to do this so other people can easily copy. We'll soon see how many other games Yoshi-P and Square Enix want us to play when we're only subscribed for 2-3 months out of a 24+ month expansion cycle.

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Again, I agree with you and this isn't the reason why I responded. I agree with Zep on many points and I called Yoshi P's statement a "sort of" advice which I personally do not believe in. So I am unsure why you explain the gravity of Yoshi P's statement impacting the growth of the game as a response to me.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

The main point of this post is criticizing the OP for playing human newsletter to stir already confirmed emotions and opinions without actually providing any additional takes from themselves, which I saw no point for.

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So true. In FFXIV, it's not about the content of a post, but the person who's making it. If someone's been canceled, they're no longer allowed to dislike the game. You have to meet our social standards before being granted special status as controlled opposition. Otherwise, you're just a troll and a shill.

Right?

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Originally Posted by caffe_macchiato

So true. In FFXIV, it's not about the content of a post, but the person who's making it. If someone's been canceled, they're no longer allowed to dislike the game. You have to meet our social standards before being granted special status as controlled opposition. Otherwise, you're just a troll and a shill.

Right?

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Exactly, and you're also Titanmen !

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Originally Posted by caffe_macchiato

So true. In FFXIV, it's not about the content of a post, but the person who's making it. If someone's been canceled, they're no longer allowed to dislike the game. You have to meet our social standards before being granted special status as controlled opposition. Otherwise, you're just a troll and a shill.

Right?

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...please stop. I am not sure what part of your post is satire as your footnote implies and I'd prefer to not be wrapped into anything involving cancellation, meeting arbitrary social standards or other things. I said what I said, there is no hidden values that need to be met.

I'll repeat what I've said before: She will very likely be invited to be a part of Dawntrail's Media Tour:

Unless she brings these issues directly up to Yoshida's face, videos such as these don't really mean anything.

This applies to any content creator being invited to the Media Tour that has made videos about issues with the game. They have the very unique opportunity to bring all of these concerns directly to the director and producer of the game. if they don't, then they're nothing more than another random voice lost within an ocean of comments that could go either way and it doesn't matter.

Meh, I think posting XIV-based videos on the official XIV forums is fine. (*≧▽≦)ﾉｼ))

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Originally Posted by DiaDeem

I'll repeat what I've said before: She will very likely be invited to be a part of Dawntrail's Media Tour:

Unless she brings these issues directly up to Yoshida's face, videos such as these don't really mean anything.

This applies to any content creator being invited to the Media Tour that has made videos about issues with the game. They have the very unique opportunity to bring all of these concerns directly to the director and producer of the game. if they don't, then they're nothing more than another random voice lost within an ocean of comments that could go either way and it doesn't matter.

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Yes because this company is known for listening to its players and its streamers lmao, nah.

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Originally Posted by DiaDeem

I'll repeat what I've said before: She will very likely be invited to be a part of Dawntrail's Media Tour:

Unless she brings these issues directly up to Yoshida's face, videos such as these don't really mean anything.

This applies to any content creator being invited to the Media Tour that has made videos about issues with the game. They have the very unique opportunity to bring all of these concerns directly to the director and producer of the game. if they don't, then they're nothing more than another random voice lost within an ocean of comments that could go either way and it doesn't matter.

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I think whether she does or doesn't is largely irrelevant. There's individuals hired with the specific purpose of paying attention to what regular players and content creators alike are providing in terms of feedback. Just the other day we had a community representative post to introduce themselves in a thread, found here:

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ittle-spark%21

So far they only have one post, though hopefully that changes soon! After all, many posters - myself included - have requested that this place is patrolled with greater frequency and visibility so that feedback doesn't feel like it's falling into the void. I made this thread a few years back on the subject:

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...epresentatives

Why are we talking about Zepla? Is she begging for money again?

I can't say that I'm even a Final Fantasy fan any more. XVI nailed the coffin shut and I deleted the game. XIV is hard to quit mostly due to sunken cost; I'm not at the point of wanting to skip whole seasons and miss the FOMO items after 10 years of diligently collecting stuff on this character. It's a good trap. I've got OCD or some compulsion to finish what I started, in a game that never finishes.

Some of the stuff they make isn't bad, it's not a total waste of money, but it's too often disappointing. They aren't concerned with gameplay innovation. The community these days are worse than the games; I just had to mute all the FF-related subs on my Reddit feed because the sarcastic fanboys are making me want to find them IRL and choke them.

As for the rest of the series... Pixel Remaster is quite good, not sure why the Steam version doesn't have the updates that consoles got. Most games after that haven't been maintained well. VII, VIII and IX don't have AI-upscaled backgrounds unless you mod the PC version. XI and its supporting websites are horribly outdated, bad user experience. XIII hasn't been ported or remastered to PS4/5/Switch. That's my summary of the uneven state of the series.

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

Why are we talking about Zepla? Is she begging for money again?

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Say you're mad she's bringing real and genuine complaints about the game without saying you're mad

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

Why are we talking about Zepla? Is she begging for money again?

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Because when a youtuber says something bad about FFXIV, certain Posters immediately piggyback off of it and post it on the Forums for attention and Upvotes.
Not to say that many points against FFXIV aren't valid and need to be addressed, but it is funny that people are desperate for validation and act like it will change anything. Especially when some of these same people love to say feedback gets ignored.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Say you're mad she's bringing real and genuine complaints about the game without saying you're mad

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And then you get weird nonsense like this from people who need to go at people for no reason.
The Anti-FFXIV Defense Force I guess. lol

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Meh, I think posting XIV-based videos on the official XIV forums is fine. (*≧▽≦)ﾉｼ))

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I think thats fine too, although I am pretty sure the OP did so only to cause arguments and discourse, as is their usual MO (Or the one they have decided to adopt from the troll book).

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Because when a youtuber says something bad about FFXIV, certain Posters immediately piggyback off of it and post it on the Forums for attention and Upvotes.
Not to say that many points against FFXIV aren't valid and need to be addressed, but it is funny that people are desperate for validation and act like it will change anything. Especially when some of these same people love to say feedback gets ignored.



And then you get weird nonsense like this from people who need to go at people for no reason.
The Anti-FFXIV Defense Force I guess. lol

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As much nonsense as "haha she made a 30 mins video, talking about her personal complaints about the game, but haha ! she needs money again, who cares about her complaints !"

stop shilling you aint getting anything in return I promise

when it comes down to it most players aren't going to have any real constructive criticism and honestly it can come down to multiple reasons a big one normally is the developers misunderstanding of complaints or straight blatant not caring when someone says hey this one thing is a big issue and the devs go we know just the thing and either doubles down on it or just adds more to the part players particularly dont like it makes them not care about being specific or giving real feedback when all it does it get you nowhere.

with that being said the game is heading in the same direction it always has it hasnt changed since ARR and its not changing anytime soon. the game is nowhere close to dying, and will have many many more years to come without problems. players who have been sitting on the fence hoping SE will change their game to be different than it is, will slowly over the years finally accept it wont happen and either decide to play less or not at all.

this doesnt mean the game is dying or in bad shape it just means the players who always wanted something else has finally given up. everyone in that boat has a limit and it will be reached eventually.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

stop shilling you aint getting anything in return I promise

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Another person who doesnt even know what a shill is...yet constantly uses that word against people who dont echo the same messages.
Uses it against people who have spoken against FFXIV, and even in their last post said that there are points against the game that are valid and need to be addressed.
Carry on Defense Force, Im sure you will get headpats.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I think whether she does or doesn't is largely irrelevant.

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Then so is this thread.
These content creators: Either what they say is important enough to bring up directly to Yoshida, or this might as well be "Another Forum Post" but that's not how it's framed and I don't think it's unreasonable to expect people with these platforms to make use of them when it actually matters.

Edit: Not that they shouldn't reach out more to the common player, but that's got nothing to do with a person with a platform that we know they will invite deciding to say nothing when directly in front of the man with the power to change things.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Say you're mad she's bringing real and genuine complaints about the game without saying you're mad

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I got about six minutes into the video and stopped watching because she's whining her spoiled ass off about solo play having options and bringing up halo cars again. Let me know when she gets to a genuine complaint.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Defense Force

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Eorzean Defense Force?!?

EDF! EDF! EDF! YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

I got about six minutes into the video and stopped watching because she's whining her spoiled ass off about solo play having options and bringing up halo cars again. Let me know when she gets to a genuine complaint.

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Yes because FFXIV is a singleplayer game right ? Oh wait it isnt

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Originally Posted by DiaDeem

Then so is this thread.
These content creators: Either what they say is important enough to bring issues up directly to Yoshida, or this might as well be "Another Forum Post" but that's not how it's framed and I don't think it's unreasonable to expect people with these platforms to make use of them when it actually matters.

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Cool, not like it matters anyway, Yoshi P doesnt give a crap, he has enough people on this forum to defend him for years, if not until the end, because yall are doing unpaid work for him.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Once again...calling me a shill despite me not shilling, and even spoken against the game.
Must be desperate for upvotes or something.



HECK YEAH
EDF! EDF! EDF!

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Yeah I care so much about upvotes, look at me go, clearly that's my goal lmao

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Yes because FFXIV is a singleplayer game right ? Oh wait it isnt

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You're talking to the one that made a complaint thread about pretty much any group activity in the game, what did you expect?

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Because when a youtuber says something bad about FFXIV, certain Posters immediately piggyback off of it and post it on the Forums for attention and Upvotes.
Not to say that many points against FFXIV aren't valid and need to be addressed, but it is funny that people are desperate for validation and act like it will change anything. Especially when some of these same people love to say feedback gets ignored.

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You're not wrong.

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Originally Posted by DiaDeem

This applies to any content creator being invited to the Media Tour that has made videos about issues with the game. They have the very unique opportunity to bring all of these concerns directly to the director and producer of the game. if they don't, then they're nothing more than another random voice lost within an ocean of comments that could go either way and it doesn't matter.

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Many issues were brought up in the interviews last time and every other time, although they only have a limited amount of questions they can ask usually. He was even asked about minimum item level content being rewarding like Faux Hollows or WT and although he understands, nothing much came of it.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Yeah I care so much about upvotes, look at me go, clearly that's my goal lmao

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You have yet to prove otherwise.
Calling me a Shill for no reason has the opposite effect you must be aiming for.

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Originally Posted by Absurdity

You're talking to the one that made a complaint thread about pretty much any group activity in the game, what did you expect?

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True tbh, not sure what else I expected

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

You have yet to prove otherwise.
Calling me a Shill for no reason has the opposite effect you must be aiming for.

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Why in the world would I care about upvotes ? Do you ? I personally dont care if what I say is liked by people or not, I say what I personally think.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Yes because FFXIV is a singleplayer game right ? Oh wait it isnt

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Really? I've done quite a lot as someone who is mostly an independent player and prefers to keep to themselves. Not everyone is a social butterfly, you know.

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

Really? I've done quite a lot as someone who is mostly an independent player and prefers to keep to themselves. Not everyone is a social butterfly, you know.

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You're playing an MMO my dude, maybe dont play an MMO if you dont like people ?

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

no one asked

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Must be a slow day over at Asmongold's subreddit is Ms. Hot Take is dropping another reaction bait video

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Originally Posted by DiaDeem

Unless she brings these issues directly up to Yoshida's face, videos such as these don't really mean anything.

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Videos like this are symptom, indicating that community malcontent has progressed to a new stage.

While a video like this may have no impact on the game itself, effects on the community can certainly be more substantial. In other games that have gone into decline, you'll frequently see it heralded by a deluge of videos like this, where people who were once champions of the game change tunes and become uncharacteristically critical.

FFXIV's recent success is largely the result of it inheriting players from one such game.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

yall are doing unpaid work for him.

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It's people like you that often remind me why I shouldn't bother with the Forums... I've voiced my personal grievances with the game in the past, and I try to be as reasonable as I can, but it doesn't really matter when some people have this kind of attitude. Whatever...

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Videos like this are symptom, indicating that community malcontent has progressed to a new stage.

While a video like this may have no impact on the game itself, effects on the community can certainly be more substantial. In other games that have gone into decline, you'll frequently see it heralded by a deluge of videos like this, where people who were once champions of the game change tunes and become uncharacteristically critical.

FFXIV's recent success is largely the result of it inheriting players from one such game.

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Except one listened, WoW listened to its players, the proof is with the massive drop after they wanted to drop flying all together in new areas, money hit them and they had to change plans immediatly, but in FFXIV ? No need, people just eat it up and keep going on anyway, why would they even want to improve? And if people DARE complain, they literally get attacked for it

Yoshi P doesnt need to listen to its players, he actually doesnt need to, because of its own community that will accept anything and everything and be happy with whatever they get.

I would say Endwalker has probably got the worst balance with respect to content and giving people a reason to actually log in for that expansion exclusively, at least when you compare it to previous expansions. It seems that they always go too far in 1 direction when acting on some feedback, e.g., if people complain about grinds, then the solution they seem to have is to strip grinds entirely. I think the only one we've had is the Wivre Mount and the fashion accessory?

On a little tangent, I do see some irony in how the perception of content creators seems to change depending on whether people do or don't agree with them.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Yoshi P doesnt need to listen to its players, he actually doesnt need to, because of its own community that will accept anything and everything and be happy with whatever they get.

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this doesnt make sense? if the current path of the game is going to kill it then the players wont accept it and leave? if they will accept it, that means he is giving the players what they want, and they are going to stay.

either players do want something different and will quit or they dont and will be happy with the continued patch cycles.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Except one listened, WoW listened to its players, the proof is with the massive drop after they wanted to drop flying all together in new areas, money hit them and they had to change plans immediatly, but in FFXIV ? No need, people just eat it up and keep going on anyway, why would they even want to improve? And if people DARE complain, they literally get attacked for it

Yoshi P doesnt need to listen to its players, he actually doesnt need to, because of its own community that will accept anything and everything and be happy with whatever they get.

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Not really, it was the exact same thing in WoW. Until the player cataclysm (pun intended) that was Shadowlands you constantly had people, especially on the forums, pretending that everything is fine, the game is doing great and you're just a sad hater. The player numbers however painted a rather different picture until Blizzard couldn't ignore it anymore and had to listen.


I expect things to go the exact same way in XIV. Certainly not now, but maybe in 6 months, maybe in 7.0, maybe in 8.0.
If we're currently in XIV's "Warlords of Draenor" it might take until 9.0 for things to reach critical mass.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Videos like this are symptom, indicating that community malcontent has progressed to a new stage.

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Yeah, absolutely.

I still wanna see the author take it directly to Yoshida when it matters. I used to play a lot of League of Legends back in the day, and we had this big thing when Riot removed Solo Queue and implemented a Dynamic Ranked Queue instead. People in the community were making videos about it, Gbay99 coming to mind. You know what he did when they brought him in for a direct conversation with the devs? He challenged them on the Solo Queue issue directly on camera in a reasonable and respectful way. Why can't we have the same with XIV creators and Yoshida?

Didn't Preach challenge WoW devs before? Why can't Zepla tell all these things directly to Yoshida?