Dramatic times in FFXIV

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

Word on the (Fanfest) street is some of the senior developers got personally upset at forum comments :)

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I always find it ironic that people don't know the difference between a constructive criticism and insults. Calling something garbage doesn't qualify as constructive criticism.

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

Word on the (Fanfest) street is some of the senior developers got personally upset at forum comments :)

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Amidst the chaos there can be, and there usually is, honest feedback. Sometimes that honesty isn't sugarcoated, but that's usually because an issue (or at least something that is perceived as an issue) has gone unaddressed for far too long. Some obviously take things too far and that is never okay. However, we aren't entirely to blame for this situation. Perhaps the language barrier does no one any favors, which I would completely understand. But there's a lot of little things that sort of piled up over time, and I know from personal experience that it can be frustrating, hence my break from the game some months ago. Most criticism comes from a place of caring. Some people don't really understand this, and I feel that applies to the forum goers and developers alike.

The forums was mostly filled with drama and a army of alts that necro threads and insult people and each of the persons alts seems to have a different rp type personality to try to seem like its different people when everyone knows it's the same person lol. And would do multiple hot topic threads to incite the drama/hate on the forum knowing that they would get a reaction.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

The forums was mostly filled with drama and a army of alts that necro threads and insult people and each of the persons alts seems to have a different rp type personality to try to seem like its different people when everyone knows it's the same person lol. And would do multiple hot topic threads to incite the drama/hate on the forum knowing that they would get a reaction.

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To be fair everyone on the forums feeds them.

Maybe if people ignored anything they considered an alt and behaved themselves things could go back to normal. Instead people get worked up to the point of witch hunting for alts and generally making just as much of a nuisance of themselves. I've seen plenty of posts that I personally disagree with or think are awful ideas, but I don't immediately attack the person claiming that I'm going to rip off their face and reveal them to be the 100th Titanmen alt. I read through, dissect it and respond based on the content.

At this point it doesn't matter if Titanmen ever returns. They won a long time ago with how the general forums act.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

To be fair everyone on the forums feeds them.

Maybe if people ignored anything they considered an alt and behaved themselves things could go back to normal. Instead people get worked up to the point of witch hunting for alts and generally making just as much of a nuisance of themselves. I've seen plenty of posts that I personally disagree with or think are awful ideas, but I don't immediately attack the person claiming that I'm going to rip off their face and reveal them to be the 100th Titanmen alt. I read through, dissect it and respond based on the content.

At this point it doesn't matter if Titanmen ever returns. They won a long time ago with how the general forums act.

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I agree people complain about titanmen and tell him to go away but respond to him which is what he wants. And it seems whenever someone disagrees with an opinion or a disagreement in general they scream that there a titanmen alt. So far i been claimed to be alt once over a disagreement/criticism. You cant have criticisms or disagreements now without being accused of being a stormpeaks or titanmen alt or taking sides.

As someone who only recently started posting on the forums these comments probably explain a lot. Sounds on par with my initial assumption this is just WoW Forums 2.0 with alt armies sockpuppeting. Looking around, I think some people here are serial posters from the WoW forums trying to go for another round of reacts.

Do these forums have "Sunday" posts where trolls try to post extra hard when employees are off the clock as well?

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

I agree people complain about titanmen and tell him to go away but respond to him which is what he wants. And it seems whenever someone disagrees with an opinion or a disagreement in general they scream that there a titanmen alt. So far i been claimed to be alt once over a disagreement/criticism. You cant have criticisms or disagreements now without being accused of being a stormpeaks or titanmen alt or taking sides.

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I feel like I'm missing forum lore, since I don't know those names.

Plot twist: What if instead of a mass IP ban wave, it turned out it was only one person who just so happened to be alts of all of those characters.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

I agree people complain about titanmen and tell him to go away but respond to him which is what he wants. And it seems whenever someone disagrees with an opinion or a disagreement in general they scream that there a titanmen alt. So far i been claimed to be alt once over a disagreement/criticism. You cant have criticisms or disagreements now without being accused of being a stormpeaks or titanmen alt or taking sides.

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From my observations, it's usually because when sides are seemingly taken, it has been done so displaying it with just as much passive aggressive vitriol as the flagged posters. This leads to accusations when tact in a reply is lacking. After awhile, these critic influencers were setting an etiquette example for others to follow that usually created a hostile echo chamber. That's why people began to take the criticism less seriously because it got hard to look through the rage and hate after awhile. People really need to reevaluate how they communicate. Though I know that's hard to when dramatic hostility attracts a stronger upvote which further enables toxic behavior.

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Originally Posted by SquishyPlushie

Do these forums have "Sunday" posts where trolls try to post extra hard when employees are off the clock as well?

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No, it's any day really.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

The forums was mostly filled with drama and a army of alts

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Is (has some alts, not really drama).

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

At this point it doesn't matter if Titanmen ever returns.

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They are still posting regularly on numerous accounts. A lot of the recent ones have been freshly boosted characters that were still climbing to 90 at first.

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people get worked up to the point of witch hunting for alts

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Sometimes people accuse others of being an alt when they are not, but I think most of the time people are spot on. It's not very hard to figure out from the account creation date and looking up the character normally, so I don't understand why some people do this without even looking them up.

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I don't immediately attack the person claiming that I'm going to rip off their face and reveal them to be the 100th Titanmen alt. I read through, dissect it and respond based on the content.

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Same. A lot of their topics lead to constructive debates, actually, but some of them are just jokes, sarcastic or discussing other games or content creators. Easy to ignore those.

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Originally Posted by Avoidy

Better just hope you're not banned for it. Seems the general discussion forum has a moderator now. Recently I got a 10 day ban for "Posting aimed to create a negative impact on the community or its members" when I called the new headphones garbage. Well within their rights, of course. But just so you know. This broad categorization can be used for pretty much any post containing a scathing critique, so if you ever see a lot of heavy critics disappear that's likely why.

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These are garbage is not a critique, saying they are disappointing and they don't wear in a way that makes sense on a number of models is one. You wouldn't call it a critique if someone said you were garbage.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Sometimes people accuse others of being an alt when they are not, but I think most of the time people are spot on. It's not very hard to figure out from the account creation date and looking up the character normally, so I don't understand why some people do this without even looking them up.

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Forum account creation date? Doesn't that start from whenever you first make a forum account? I don't think it makes much of a difference, especially at this point. I wouldn't advise anyone to use their main character's name on these forums given the tendencies of certain people.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

Forum account creation date? Doesn't that start from whenever you first make a forum account?

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Yes and by "account" I was referring specifically to "forum account".

They are gone? It's safe to come out now?

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Originally Posted by Bonoki

They are gone? It's safe to come out now?

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https://media.giphy.com/media/TJaNCd...PCge/giphy.gif

https://media.tenor.com/wmEPrw0ouQcA...er-popcorn.gif

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Originally Posted by BaconBits

My brother in Christ nobody took these forums seriously before he pulled up lmao.

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Patently false.

Go back far enough and you'll find plenty of posts with actual conversation and constructive criticism on how to improve things. Wasn't until Stormblood when they really stopped hard moderating the boards that things went widely unchecked.

If people are really upset the trolls are finally being dealt with...then by all means be the change you want to see in the forums and pick up the mantle...follow like a good lemming right into the ban zone.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

If people are really upset the trolls are finally being dealt with...then by all means be the change you want to see in the forums and pick up the mantle...follow like a good lemming right into the ban zone.

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Arent you already doing that every day ? Picking up that mantle ?

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Originally Posted by Kyuuen

Patently false.

Go back far enough and you'll find plenty of posts with actual conversation and constructive criticism on how to improve things. Wasn't until Stormblood when they really stopped hard moderating the boards that things went widely unchecked.

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I wonder if it was at about the time people brought up to Yoshi P that the mods at the time were power tripping hard on the forumbase, come to think of it.

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Originally Posted by WeebPolice

Yep. These forums and /r/ffxivdiscussion are the only places where players can truly speak freely about the game without fear of being banned/censored/downvoted to oblivion.

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To be fair, that's just the reverse.

FFXIV discussion often downvotes to oblivion positive posts about the game (or anything that doesn't largely comport with the hivemind there), and this place has a similar effect with negative posts getting massive Likes and positive posts being brigaded.

So you're really just trading one form of hivemind/collectivism/banning/censoring/downvoting for a second.

The only thing these forums have going for them that other venues don't is that there's not a downvote feature, so you can't outright silence people. Which is why bullying and brigading is so prevalent here, instead, to browbeat people into silencing themselves since they know if they don't, they'll be faced with incessant harassment.

EDIT:

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Originally Posted by Renalt

II'm no Roe but I'll help defend the wall if conscripted.

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Is that what the kids are calling it these days?

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

He'll be back soon enough if he isn't already.

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"Sandpeople are easily startled, but they'll soon be back. And in greater numbers." -"Old Ben" Kenobi

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

Arent you already doing that every day ? Picking up that mantle ?

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Ill take his random light hearted Humor any day, over Direct Harassment of people, and the Community, and all of the nonsense thread Necros and Bait Threads.

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Originally Posted by BaconBits

My brother in Christ nobody took these forums seriously before he pulled up lmao.

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These forums have been mostly on life support since at least SHB release times. Titanmen tries to keep them alive and sparkly.
Might be that proper forums where everyone has voice are thing of a past. Kids these days like to use reddit and discord where they can have that herd mentality and shut down any "wrong" opinions with help of the corrupt mods.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Ill take his random light hearted Humor any day, over Direct Harassment of people, and the Community, and all of the nonsense thread Necros and Bait Threads.

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Ok, to each their own. That humour got old on the very first day for many of us

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

Arent you already doing that every day ? Picking up that mantle ?

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Not really a fair comparison. Renalt shitposts a lot and I don't really find him funny personally, but it's not the same as Titanmen/others running around trying to incite and bait arguments.

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Originally Posted by Jin-

Ok, to each their own. That humour got old on the very first day for many of us

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Fair enough, I like his humor, and its Still better then outright harassment and thread Necros & low-effort bait threads.

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Originally Posted by Jin-

Ok, to each their own. That humour got old on the very first day for many of us

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It's interesting how this could apply exactly to Titanmen.

Also, not sure how your love letter of a thread has anything to do with the game.

You want titanman back? Youre straight trippin g, I hope those overused reddit politics spam threads never come back. When i see those political posts I just roll my eyes theyre so cringe.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Ill take his random light hearted Humor any day, over Direct Harassment of people, and the Community, and all of the nonsense thread Necros and Bait Threads.

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You mean just like when he stalked Aveyond on his discord with a few other forum people and planned thread derailments, and even complained because of the daily quota because he couldnt derail more of his threads and he had to wait ?

Yeah I remember

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

Not really a fair comparison. Renalt shitposts a lot and I don't really find him funny personally, but it's not the same as Titanmen/others running around trying to incite and bait arguments.

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Same answer to you as I just wrote to Ronso

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Originally Posted by Darkobra

It's interesting how this could apply exactly to Titanmen.

Also, not sure how your love letter of a thread has anything to do with the game.

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Ever so cold, lighten up some and use thr anniversary fireworks to bring up smile in your face.

There is trolling, and then there is spiteful attention seeking...

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

There is trolling, and then there is spiteful attention seeking...

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I'll take someone doing a few bait threads over someone stalking, derailing threads on purpose and hiding from people to watch them ERP, that's my personal choice though

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

I'll take someone doing a few bait threads over someone stalking and hiding from people to watch them ERP, that's my personal choice though

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We could also, I don't know, have standards and not accept either of these things.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

We could also, I don't know, have standards and not accept either of these things.

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I agree with you, but one gets all the blame, and the other apparently is doing "le funny" so it's okay to have done what he did, so there has to be some fairness to it too, one is not better than the other.

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

I agree with you, but one gets all the blame, and the other apparently is doing "le funny" so it's okay to have done what he did, so there has to be some fairness to it too, one is not better than the other.

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I've been gone a while and apparently missed some things. lol

Based on what I'm hearing though...oof.

Who the heck is titanmen and how did I miss this?

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

I agree with you, but one gets all the blame, and the other apparently is doing "le funny" so it's okay to have done what he did, so there has to be some fairness to it too, one is not better than the other.

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True, although I think its gonna be unlikely that balance will ever be achieved. The trolls will often go unreprimanded due to baiting popular complaint topics, the fact they do so in rude and at times offencive ways does not matter to those regulars who heartedly agree. Also I think its unfair to judge to those who oppose trolls akin to Titanmen, with support the poster you are referring too. I would say many of us, if not most, think stalking is all kinds of messed up and unacceptable, although I admit I do not know the facts outside of what has been said in such topics. We are not, as far as I can tell, approving said behaviour by simply taking a stance against trolls that they may also have. Must we give an affidavit eveytime we post on this topic dissmissing them?

Although I do think that frankly most of these pure troll threads deserve to be derailed, esspically when it comes to the threads that do not even touch upon actual topics, of which Titanmen and others often started.

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

You mean just like when he stalked Aveyond on his discord with a few other forum people and planned thread derailments, and even complained because of the daily quota because he couldnt derail more of his threads and he had to wait ?

Yeah I remember



Same answer to you as I just wrote to Ronso

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I have no knowledge of those things. I've only seen one vague apology thread from him which was taken down and I haven't checked his profile to see if more exist. If there was actual proof of these around here somewhere I'd be interested in seeing it though.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

True, although I think its gonna be unlikely that balance will ever be achieved. The trolls will often go unreprimanded due to baiting popular complaint topics, the fact they do so in rude and at times offencive ways does not matter to those regulars who heartedly agree. Also I think its unfair to judge to those who oppose trolls akin to Titanmen, with support the poster you are referring too. I would say many of us, if not most, think what they did/stalking etc was and is messed up, although I admit I do not know the facts outside of what has been said in such topics. We are not, as far as I can tell, approving said behaviour by simply taking a stance against trolls that they may also have. Must we give an affidavit eveytime we post on this topic dissmissing them?

Although I do think that frankly most of these troll threads deserve to be derailed, esspically when it comes to the threads that do not even touch upon actual topics, of which Titanmen and others often started.

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I think both are wrong, period, my only issue with the way people treat it is as if one is like an angel and hasnt done anything wrong, and another is getting treated badly because he makes bait threads, there has to be a middle ground imo, which there really isnt

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

I have no knowledge of those things. I've only seen one vague apology thread from him which was taken down and I haven't checked his profile to see if more exist. If there was actual proof of these around here somewhere I'd be interested in seeing it though.

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The entire thread got deleted so not like I'd be able to provide it, no wonder too it was an absolute mess

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

I think both are wrong, period, my only issue with the way people treat it is as if one is like an angel and hasnt done anything wrong, and another is getting treated badly because he makes bait threads, there has to be a middle ground imo, which there really isnt



The entire thread got deleted so not like I'd be able to provide it, no wonder too it was an absolute mess

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I agree one troll/harasser/derailer shouldn't be treated better then another just because one of them chose to apologize. Which they only apologized because enough people called them out and was against them to essentially force the apology for there actions and realize they were wrong. If they werent called out for being as bad as titanmen and doing extra for purposely inciting derailments and forum/ingame and discord harassment and creeping in apartments without permission they would have continued doing it.

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

I think both are wrong, period, my only issue with the way people treat it is as if one is like an angel and hasnt done anything wrong, and another is getting treated badly because he makes bait threads, there has to be a middle ground imo, which there really isnt



The entire thread got deleted so not like I'd be able to provide it, no wonder too it was an absolute mess

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I dunno if the person you are speaking about is treated like an angel as such. They may not get the same ire that the trolls do I agree, but I would say many do not even know of the accusations. I was blind to them for a long while, and again I only know the story from one side. It seems like a mess no matter what. The trolls at least have a more noticeable notoriety, especially in the past months when the mods where slow to act and such threads ran rampant for weeks without moderation for all to see.

Plus, when it comes to the troll in question, I feel that it was a bit more then just ‘bait threads’ personally speaking. They have a spiteful edge to their actions which goes unchallenged often. Most notably in months past when they constant started topics on social issues, with the sole aim to cause hate debates on real life topics. There is being silly and trolling within the confides of the game, and then there is that which… is just pathetic.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

I dunno if the person you are speaking about is treated like an angel as such. They may not get the same ire that the trolls do I agree, but I would say many do not even know of the accusations. I was blind to them for a long while, and again I only know the story from one side. It seems like a mess no matter what. The trolls at least have a more noticeable notoriety, especially in the past months when the mods where slow to act and such threads ran rampant for weeks without moderation for all to see.

Plus, when it comes to the troll in question, I feel that it was a bit more then just ‘bait threads’ personally speaking. They have a spiteful edge to their actions which goes unchallenged often. Most notably in months past when they constant started topics on social issues, with the sole aim to cause hate debates on real life topics. There is being silly and trolling within the confides of the game, and then there is that which… is just pathetic.

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Well, I can't really verify any of these accusations. They all seem to have taken place off the forums in private discords, or some supposed schemes that I wasn't a part of.

The trolls however I can see with my own eyes and judge from their direct actions outside heresay.

It's simple really. One is more annoying to the public than the other on a regular basis. Which makes it easier to move on and forget until someone brings it up again. The bait threads and hostility are constantly resurfacing with rarely any pauses though. This leads people to assume the "le funny" man is overlooked but it's more we quit giving attention to that because the bait threads cause it to become buried as they are the latest fresh news when compared. It's easier to forget when there is new bait every single day. Also it's hard to take someone who points the finger seriously when they are also guilty of annoying the public.

Also a lot of forum users just don't know about that incident but everyone knows Titanman. Even Mr. Happy knows who Titanman is. This is what happens when one makes more noise than the other. It's just how the internet works. The drama just eventually faded when other drama takes It's place. Titanman is the flavor of the month so to speak not "le funny man". And Titanman has been for many months.