DESPERATION for INNOVATION: "FFXIV's DOWNFALL"

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Originally Posted by AnaviAnael

I agree! On WHM, I'm expected to just heal, heal, heal like every other WHM. Where's my diversity? I want light based magic so I can be a nuker WHM!

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that was the system we HAD

now jobs are ROLES, whm plays the role of a healer

you were being sarcastic :) my bad

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

Stone, Stonera, Aero, Aeroga, Holy, Cleric Stance
I had people expect me to nuke for fights even though I was just expecting to sit an be the healer.
Maybe not too much light magic, but white mage is not a nuker, and if your nuking your not healing which means people are dying. (unless shits under control)
Now if youll turn your attention to my guide in the Conjurer section, youll notice a job called geomancer which would make conjurer a nuker/debuff.

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I was being sarcastic, bud. ^^ However, I do love the idea for geomancer. It was one of my favorite jobs in tactics!

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Originally Posted by AnaviAnael

I was being sarcastic, bud. ^^ However, I do love the idea for geomancer. It was one of my favorite jobs in tactics!

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lmao you know how sarcasm can be on the interwebz

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Originally Posted by Rykan

Does anybody, besides me, still think this Armoury System is gonna end up being SE's Achilles' Heel?

They've worked it, and reworked it, from DAY ONE....and it is STILL an abomination. I mean...what the heck is supposed to set me apart from every other 50 WHM, WAR, and PLD....my armor choices? (unlikely, since every time new gear comes out, it's so easy to get)

So, is it my sub class? (nope...those are PRE-DETERMINED). Where is the versatility? Where is the DRG subbing "whm" so his wyvern can healing breath....Where is the SAM subbing DNC, so he can solo a damn Sky God lol....where is the thf subbing war for berserk, and so on....

What is it going to take for SE to realize that no1 wants to be a carbon frekin copy of everyone else with their job...a handful of actions that anybody can simply swap onto, is NOT helping the situation.


AND PLEASE.....do not give me that whole "that's what classes are for" spiel. Classes perfectly epitomize the terms "BORING and GENERIC."

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So, you don't want things to be boring and generic, but you request that everything should be a FFXI rehash? You sir, are a logical genius.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

lmao you know how sarcasm can be on the interwebz

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Oh you. ^_^

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

I have to agree that everyone is the same, but thats kinda the point. Its a game, and every game functions the same for everyone, no exceptions. Now if we want to see diversity, we can read my job speculation guide and support it because there are 11 classes and 33 jobs in that guide which enough to make any player feel unique enough. Besides xi had what 20 jobs that everyone subbed the same shit on? Yeah real unique.

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Yeah, I think a lot of the issues of being like "Ughhh everyone else is the same as everyone else" would probably be fixed with a wide variety of jobs to play, allowing for everyone to find their specific niche.

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Originally Posted by Zyph

Yeah, I think a lot of the issues of being like "Ughhh everyone else is the same as everyone else" would probably be fixed with a wide variety of jobs to play, allowing for everyone to find their specific niche.

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Or they just do what they did with SCH in XI. When it was released people considered it a gimp RDM for a very specific reason, it played exactly like a RDM without solid WHM/BLM spells to use or refresh or haste or anything significant beyond weather and storm spells.

They adjusted it and it's now a powerful healer, nuker or support (you can't do all 3) and an excellent crowd controller, due to being able to turn most control spells into AoE thanks to Manifestation. So working with what they have now they can 'separate' things further which they already started to with Traits and skill selection, but as we go we'll get more spells/abilities and when new jobs come out hopefully the community will stop running with a one track mind since even if they release RDM or SMN, people will still stack BLM and BRDs if they can.

So throwing more jobs won't solve much compared to working with what they have now to try to rectify some of the problems preset and sorry to say but the original intent of the system is why it's not easy for them to balance things properly, because they tried to give us too much freedom which people like but is precisely why other mmo developers strayed away from it outside of a talent tree.

OP, if you don't like jobs, then just use classes.

Sure. Let's go back to setting your own attribute points to be a special snowflake which has no role in group efforts, eliminating the past 2 years worth of adjustment to the game.

I think you guys killed him because I don't see his trolling posts anymore. :P

That's a shame. I wanted to see if he'd take my second lesson on proper forum posting to heart. He was making excellent progress.

Did he cry himself to bed. Poor guy

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Originally Posted by LlenCoram

That's a shame. I wanted to see if he'd take my second lesson on proper forum posting to heart. He was making excellent progress.

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http://www.memestick.com/images/MULT...ou%20tried.jpg

I just d'aww'd so hard I think I woke the neighbours up.

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Originally Posted by LlenCoram

I just d'aww'd so hard I think I woke the neighbours up.

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ikr? I thought it was too cute to not share.

I like tails.

They should add tails for Roegadyn.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

Okay then my I apologize for saying you must be new to this.

Please rip me apart, go ahead by all means. Hit me with your best shot.

And I didn't establish any points other than saying that your new and you've already corrected me there. Now Please do me that favor and read my guide and understand something new like I said, this is not ffxiv.

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His guide is preety good. Also i'll direct you thos the thread in where i reply, about some things that i think could help classes. http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ob-Speculation

Also, if FF14 did not have the armory system, i think i would be less interested in it then more. I like the idea, let them tinker. MMOs are in a constant change and flux around their base systems, thats part of the reason i like them ^^

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Originally Posted by Viritess

His guide is preety good. Also i'll direct you thos the thread in where i reply, about some things that i think could help classes. http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ob-Speculation

Also, if FF14 did not have the armory system, i think i would be less interested in it then more. I like the idea, let them tinker. MMOs are in a constant change and flux around their base systems, thats part of the reason i like them ^^

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the Armory system is older than you may think, or at least its design is.

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Originally Posted by Rykan

Does anybody, besides me, still think this Armoury System is gonna end up being SE's Achilles' Heel?

They've worked it, and reworked it, from DAY ONE....and it is STILL an abomination. I mean...what the heck is supposed to set me apart from every other 50 WHM, WAR, and PLD....my armor choices? (unlikely, since every time new gear comes out, it's so easy to get)

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http://xivpads.com/?13638349

Doesn't really look like you've done much endgame content (You haven't even cleared darkhold) and haven't read the posts fussing about low drop rates...

It's not hard regarding difficulty, but there is a reason why people are still running dungeons. Drops are fickle.

Also... please define "rework". I believe your definition is different than mine. If I recall correctly, I remember hearing of something called "play style".

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Originally Posted by Rykan

So, is it my sub class? (nope...those are PRE-DETERMINED PREDETERMINED).

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Not if you play a class instead of a job. I remember Yoshi-P saying something a while back about the importance of putting players into specific roles.

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Originally Posted by Rykan

Where is the versatility? Where is the DRG subbing "whm" so his wyvern can healing breath....Where is the SAM subbing DNC, so he can solo a damn Sky God lol....where is the thf subbing war for berserk, and so on....

What is it going to take for SE to realize that no1 nobody wants to be a carbon frekin carbon freaking copy of everyone else with their job...a handful of actions that anybody can simply swap onto, is NOT helping the situation.

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See again: Play-style.

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Originally Posted by Rykan

When are you going to realize that nobody wants a

AND PLEASE.....do not give me that whole "that's what classes are for" spiel. Classes perfectly epitomize the terms "BORING and GENERIC."

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What...? I think you just need to play this game.


...and stop trolling the forums.

I agree with OP.

+1

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Originally Posted by Lienn

I agree with OP.

+1

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-1

/10charisma

Are people disagreeing with the OP's message or the way it was delivered? Because I can't help but agree with him.

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Originally Posted by Sav

Are people disagreeing with the OP's message or the way it was delivered? Because I can't help but agree with him.

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Both, but I personally don't agree with him, He's basically telling SE, to dump everything that they put into FFXIV and go back to Launch status of 2010... Sounds like a Rokien. :P

I've said this before when the topic was brought up before, but I really can't understand why you guys want SE to take 1 step forward, then 5 steps backwards.

Not sure how many jobs were out for xi 20ish months after its first release but I dont think there will have been many. If I'm right in this assumption then there would have been a similar lack of options then. Certainly no SAM/DNC at that stage. With the limited number of jobs we have at the moment sure it is going to feel a bit samey. This will change when we have more jobs to choose from and more classes from which they might have cross class abilities.

I don't normally post in these forums. But upon seeing this thread, I decided it was necessary to reply. Bottom line: If you want to have more "sub job" freedom, play a class, not a job.

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Originally Posted by charlemagne

Not sure how many jobs were out for xi 20ish months after its first release but I dont think there will have been many. If I'm right in this assumption then there would have been a similar lack of options then. Certainly no SAM/DNC at that stage. With the limited number of jobs we have at the moment sure it is going to feel a bit samey. This will change when we have more jobs to choose from and more classes from which they might have cross class abilities.

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WHM, BLM, RDM, THF, WAR, MNK.

That was it.

There was a 'blog' of sorts in japanese that chronicled FFXI for about 2 years after release in JP. They had many same-such issues as what we've been going through, apart from an appallingly bad launch and total game remake.

It should also be noted that many of the jobs introduced to XI turned into something that the developers didn't intend. Like NIN becoming a tank.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

WHM, BLM, RDM, THF, WAR, MNK.

That was it.

There was a 'blog' of sorts in japanese that chronicled FFXI for about 2 years after release in JP. They had many same-such issues as what we've been going through, apart from an appallingly bad launch and total game remake.

It should also be noted that many of the jobs introduced to XI turned into something that the developers didn't intend. Like NIN becoming a tank.

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Thanks for the info. I wasn't sure which jobs were introduced when in the early days as I didn't start playing until much later.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

WHM, BLM, RDM, THF, WAR, MNK.

That was it.

There was a 'blog' of sorts in japanese that chronicled FFXI for about 2 years after release in JP. They had many same-such issues as what we've been going through, apart from an appallingly bad launch and total game remake.

It should also be noted that many of the jobs introduced to XI turned into something that the developers didn't intend. Like NIN becoming a tank.

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Did you mean this? http://zeusls.llima.net/download/ffxiupdatehistory.html ? It's a long, tragic and at times, very funny read. Amazing how many of the same mistakes were repeated with XIV.

Topic name gave me cancer. Ugh.

First post ever on these forums...

Honestly, in pretty much every mmo out there every job has a role and optimal gear. I dont see the big problem here. Say one gear set is the best in the game for a white mage. I'm sure all white mages are going to want that set. Why do you search for a white mage in a party? To heal. Why do you search for a tank? To tank. Why do you search for DD.... you get the idea.

Sure 11 had subjobs, but every job still had an optimal subjob and role to play for most party situations. There isn't too big of a problem with 14's job system the way its looking now.

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Originally Posted by Rykan

Does anybody, besides me, still think this Armoury System is gonna end up being SE's Achilles' Heel?

They've worked it, and reworked it, from DAY ONE....and it is STILL an abomination. I mean...what the heck is supposed to set me apart from every other 50 WHM, WAR, and PLD....my armor choices? (unlikely, since every time new gear comes out, it's so easy to get)

So, is it my sub class? (nope...those are PRE-DETERMINED). Where is the versatility? Where is the DRG subbing "whm" so his wyvern can healing breath....Where is the SAM subbing DNC, so he can solo a damn Sky God lol....where is the thf subbing war for berserk, and so on....

What is it going to take for SE to realize that no1 wants to be a carbon frekin copy of everyone else with their job...a handful of actions that anybody can simply swap onto, is NOT helping the situation.


AND PLEASE.....do not give me that whole "that's what classes are for" spiel. Classes perfectly epitomize the terms "BORING and GENERIC."

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. . . . next!! You ppl need to get over that crap.. give SE time to get 2.0 out -_- and try reading the road map and you know there working on it.

biggest issue with the games is its going to be focused on instance content which is pertty much a grind for gear and when everyone already gets everything there not doing it again, SE seems to want and keep it at that and not trying to expand on it. they really need to make some content in 2.0 that you can do constantly with anyone at anytime or by your self or the game is gonna dry up fast. im so bored right now with the game im waiting for the AF weapons to be released before i log back in.

SE get your stuff together because its your last chance coming up in just over 6 months.

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Originally Posted by indira

biggest issue with the games is its going to be focused on instance content which is pertty much a grind for gear and when everyone already gets everything there not doing it again, SE seems to want and keep it at that and not trying to expand on it. they really need to make some content in 2.0 that you can do constantly with anyone at anytime or by your self or the game is gonna dry up fast. im so bored right now with the game im waiting for the AF weapons to be released before i log back in.

SE get your stuff together because its your last chance coming up in just over 6 months.

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I don't understand it when people talk like you because you just precisely said when things are going to be fixed, as we all have well known for 7+ months. Just wait for 2.0, as they've stated time and time again that they're going to give a whole bunch of content for different level ranges, since right now they are only giving us, in our current version, endgame content. The reason for this? They're not pushing for nor expecting new players at the moment. Since our current build is such a hot mess, then they can only do this slowly and without much depth to it.

You should read the above with a tone of patience and silent hope more than blind whiteknighting.

Ever since the welcome back campaign we've been getting so many of the old FFXI nostalgia driven whiners back we had when the game was F2P.

Drop your subscription. If the game isn't for you right now.... it's not going to be for you in the future.

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I don't understand it when people talk like you because you just precisely said when things are going to be fixed, as we all have well known for 7+ months. Just wait for 2.0, as they've stated time and time again that they're going to give a whole bunch of content for different level ranges, since right now they are only giving us, in our current version, endgame content. The reason for this? They're not pushing for nor expecting new players at the moment. Since our current build is such a hot mess, then they can only do this slowly and without much depth to it.

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2.0 fix in how many months after it goes live?

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Originally Posted by Rykan

Where is the SAM subbing DNC, so he can solo a damn Sky God lol....

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Yeah that's fun, completely OP classes. You shouldn't ever be able to solo a "sky god".

It's like that video of the corsair one-shotting some endgame dragon NM. Yeah we sure are missing out on a lot.

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Originally Posted by indira

2.0 fix in how many months after it goes live?

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This sounds like three different questions in one.

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Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

Ever since the welcome back campaign we've been getting so many of the old FFXI nostalgia driven whiners back we had when the game was F2P.

Drop your subscription. If the game isn't for you right now.... it's not going to be for you in the future.

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Well it is kind of SE's fault for Scored Earthing FFXI.

Then making a soft balled sequel by hinting at entering FFXIV through your mog house in FFXI.

Then using the same Races.


Quakes like a duck. Waddles adorably like a duck. Annoying hides Evangelyne's fun bits like a duck. Don't get surprised or even upset when people are confused when you call it a Rigid Air Ship instead.

Gotta say. The kneejerk reactions in this thread are kinda dissapointing.