may 16th for housing fix?

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Originally Posted by DamianFatale

That's a smart and sound decision. Simulating the results even after they think they are sure, just to know that they are sure, is an absolute win for the community. People will whine, but it really shows the dedication the devs have to getting it right. If only they cared this much about Hrothgar hair.

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I dont mind the simulation. It's more the fact that they do not yet have the environment set up to simulate. That should have been set up with testing before the lottery was ever rolled out. It should have been started a week ago when they said it was. Taking an additional 2 weeks to set up a sim enivronment is insane, when there has been also 2 weeks since the issue was raised, and it should have already existed to properly test in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

For all we know, it had been tested thoroughly prior to 6.1's release and it was the emergency maintenance that introduced whatever caused the bug.

Either way, it doesn't matter what should or shouldn't have happened in the past. We're stuck with what did happen. Pursuing blame doesn't help anyone because it doesn't fix problems.

Let's get the problems fixed.

The last thing we need is for them to rush out a fix that introduces a new set of problems.

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If you think it wasn't pushed out that far to line up with another update to the game with more content as to not produce more downtime than needed, you're delusional.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

If you think it wasn't pushed out that far to line up with another update to the game with more content as to not produce more downtime than needed, you're delusional.

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What on earth does the release date have to do with anything? There's always a release date set for content that lines up with other content and we've known for a year that the release date would be the release date for patch 6.1.

So how is that supposed to be relevant to fixing what has gone wrong?

I think this would probably have been done already is it wasn't for the effort to account for those who already claimed refunds. It's better they take their time then run into another problem. Everyone wants it over and done with but with no additional issues to have to deal with.

I haven't personally gotten the 0 bug but I have two friends who have one who has taken her refund and another who hasn't.

Yeah it sucks having to wait but it would suck a lot more if they mess this up trying to fix it.

small indie dev pls pay sub.

Oh hey look, another delay. Great, it's becoming a trend.

Keep in mind most Japanese businesses are going to be closed for 9 days, starting Friday, for the Golden Week holidays. The May 16th date accounts for that and isn't simply laziness on their part.

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Originally Posted by Pablomaldito

With this timetable it is now 100% guaranteed that a horde of RMT shell FCs will be mature in time for round 2 of lottery. 18 wards worth of small houses will now be handed to shell FCs with virtually no competition.

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Interesting - how are they going to avoid the lottery and/or competition from regular players? Are you suggesting that they will just overwhelm the lottery with thousands of bids? Did that happen in the first lottery?

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

Keep in mind most Japanese businesses are going to be closed for 9 days, starting Friday, for the Golden Week holidays. The May 16th date accounts for that and isn't simply laziness on their part.

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Thank you for this reminder. While I'm extremely irritated by the, IMO, overly extended delay, I had forgotten about the holiday. I'm still disappointed an environment that mimicked an actual housing environment still is not established - as should have been for testing. And tbh, extremely frustrated by it.

I do want them to enjoy holiday. I just wish it had been set-up and tested correctly to begin with.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

This is pretty absurd, ngl. They told us already that they were already testing it. Now they are "building" something ot test further? Come on. This should be around the clock work. Saying business days is kind of a joke considering our subs don't revolve around business hours. And to the person saying Housing is a small aspect. I wanna see your numbers. Because from the amount of complaining about availability to the number of housing threads that were on the JP servers complaining and on Twitter, I think you're not only clueless but you're also just backing Square up on something that shouldn't take a company as large as Square another 2 weeks to fix.

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I have been following your posts and mostly disagreeing with them but now I have changed my mind and see you as being completely right the whole time. I'm sorry

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Originally Posted by Pablomaldito

With this timetable it is now 100% guaranteed that a horde of RMT shell FCs will be mature in time for round 2 of lottery. 18 wards worth of small houses will now be handed to shell FCs with virtually no competition. That's more than the entirety of housing available from personal wards. They're hard at work fixing a lottery that was never going to fix the broken housing system. In fact, because of the delay caused by the lottery's failure and repair, the housing system is going to be even more broken.

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I agree, now RMT shells have had the time to get ready because it's taken to long. Round two is going to be interesting and I will stay tuned to the forums for the fallout with popcorn in hand.

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

Keep in mind most Japanese businesses are going to be closed for 9 days, starting Friday, for the Golden Week holidays. The May 16th date accounts for that and isn't simply laziness on their part.

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It's unfortunate timing, but it's good long-term for SE (and all game companies for that matter) to not require staff to work over holidays. Though presumably regular operations of the game servers have to continue regardless. I imagine it's even more of a disappointment to any JP players who were hoping to spend time off decorating their new houses (assuming they were lucky enough to get one.) Fortunately there's stuff other than housing to do in the game.

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Originally Posted by sagacious

I agree, now RMT shells have had the time to get ready because it's taken to long. Round two is going to be interesting and I will stay tuned to the forums for the fallout with popcorn in hand.

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Yep. This next round is going to be a crap show. And easily every round from here on out. Good job, dev team. Keep up the good work. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

Keep in mind most Japanese businesses are going to be closed for 9 days, starting Friday, for the Golden Week holidays. The May 16th date accounts for that and isn't simply laziness on their part.

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If this is just a display error like they say it is, then this doesn't feel like something that should have gone into Golden Week for fixing...

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

If this is just a display error like they say it is, then this doesn't feel like something that should have gone into Golden Week for fixing...

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From my understanding of what they've said so far, it sounds like the largest hurdle is finding a way to get the people who won, but refunded their Gil, in possession of their plot. I'm in no way a programmer, but can see coding a new system for this single event from scratch taking a while; especially accounting for how interconnected MMO systems are.

I work in life sciences research and while we do everything we can to reduce unwanted variables, we can't always account for everything. Sometimes these things are happy accidents and sometimes the ruin an entire cadre of samples. I can see this being the case with the current situation; they did what they could do to control variables and test ahead of time, but something unexpected happened and borked the system requiring them to essentially modify the test method, run a proof of concept on it, then restart the experiment.

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Originally Posted by localareanetwork

Are we getting additional wards in compensation for Housing being disabled for basically a month?

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It might be functionally disabled for longer, considering that most houses are going to get bought up on the next lottery and with demolition disabled indefinitely, there's going to be exactly 0 new houses for sale for the next few months.

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

From my understanding of what they've said so far, it sounds like the largest hurdle is finding a way to get the people who won, but refunded their Gil, in possession of their plot. I'm in no way a programmer, but can see coding a new system for this single event from scratch taking a while; especially accounting for how interconnected MMO systems are.

I work in life sciences research and while we do everything we can to reduce unwanted variables, we can't always account for everything. Sometimes these things are happy accidents and sometimes the ruin an entire cadre of samples. I can see this being the case with the current situation; they did what they could do to control variables and test ahead of time, but something unexpected happened and borked the system requiring them to essentially modify the test method, run a proof of concept on it, then restart the experiment.

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But in the latest notice there is no mention of how they will do this for the affected lottery winners who have collected heir refund. If they are testing it already surely they should tell us how they will proceed....

I also notice that a lot of the 'empty' FC housing wards have a lot of the error of saying "No participants" when there's actually 2 or more? I checked about 10 plaques and about 8 of them had the error. So it gives the illusion that there's going to be more FC housing to bid on than there really is, it seems. Was FC housing hit with way more errors than individual plots?

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Originally Posted by hydralus

I also notice that a lot of the 'empty' FC housing wards have a lot of the error of saying "No participants" when there's actually 2 or more? I checked about 10 plaques and about 8 of them had the error. So it gives the illusion that there's going to be more FC housing to bid on than there really is, it seems. Was FC housing hit with way more errors than individual plots?

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I dont want to say it is exclusively an FC error, but there are very few unclaimed personal plots on Siren, disproportionately so from FCs. Where as it seems half-3/4 of FC plots are vacant in a sud-division/ward, most of the personal wards are full (maybe 5-10 houses total unclaimed)

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Originally Posted by GeminiReed

FC tags are not unique. What you're seeing is 30 different FC's with the same tag. Kinda blatant and kinda stupid tbh. That's just asking to be put under a microscope.

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It has been going on since housing launched. So I don't think the microscope has even been ordered yet.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Yep. This next round is going to be a crap show. And easily every round from here on out. Good job, dev team. Keep up the good work. :rolleyes:

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Exactly why I created a separate thread to complain about it.

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Originally Posted by DayDreamer18

Exactly why I created a separate thread to complain about it.

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does anyone from SE actually look at our comments in this forum?

Testing does not and will not catch everything. Sorry not sorry reality hurts.

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Originally Posted by Palslow

does anyone from SE actually look at our comments in this forum?

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Who knows really, but it's better to say something than nothing at all. And it's more likely to be seen here than on Reddit.

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Originally Posted by Palslow

But in the latest notice there is no mention of how they will do this for the affected lottery winners who have collected heir refund. If they are testing it already surely they should tell us how they will proceed....

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Even though it's not specifically addressed, it seems to me the below quote encompasses that as it's part of restoring the player's lottery data. The game had to track who deposited and who withdrew their bid and they need to know how to get the database fully up to date, including if a player needs to deposit the Gil again to take possession.

Restoring Lottery Data
Currently, we are proceeding to construct an internal server environment that simulates conditions on the public servers so as to test methods for restoring players’ lottery data. However, the creation of such conditions is subject to factors beyond our control, and we therefore expect this phase to take approximately 8 business days. I sincerely apologize that this time extends beyond our original estimate for how long fixes would take, but as preventing further issues is our priority, it is necessary in order to ensure that data restoration procedures can be thoroughly tested.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

Testing does not and will not catch everything. Sorry not sorry reality hurts.

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Yes yes, let the complacency flow through you.

It's clear that testing in general has gone down hill since Yoshi has started working on XVI. Period. Not only was EW pushed back for a "Quality check", but we got 6.1 with PvP bugs, an entire race losing a facial feature, and a lottery system (which random lotto rolls are already a thing it shouldn't have been something hard to put in) completely screwed for a 'NEW AND BETTER SYSTEM!!". It's a joke. They announced the housing changes a year ago. They've had this entire time to put it through the hard paces. But keep patting that billion dollar company on the head. Oh and they'll take your 15 a month now, please and thank you

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Originally Posted by Palslow

does anyone from SE actually look at our comments in this forum?

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They have people who read the high post count threads and forward the info over, but I'm always skeptical of how much they pay attention to the non-JP forums considering a lot of issues unique to NA/EU that go unnoticed because they're not a problem in JP as well.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

Yes yes, let the complacency flow through you.

It's clear that testing in general has gone down hill since Yoshi has started working on XVI. Period. Not only was EW pushed back for a "Quality check", but we got 6.1 with PvP bugs, an entire race losing a facial feature, and a lottery system (which random lotto rolls are already a thing it shouldn't have been something hard to put in) completely screwed for a 'NEW AND BETTER SYSTEM!!". It's a joke. They announced the housing changes a year ago. They've had this entire time to put it through the hard paces. But keep patting that billion dollar company on the head. Oh and they'll take your 15 a month now, please and thank you

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Not patting their back but also not living i n your perfect world were nothing EVER goes wrong.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

Not patting their back but also not living i n your perfect world were nothing EVER goes wrong.

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World isn't perfect. But hey, I'm not the one that'll get completely bent over when they do start the new rounds of lottery because this entire time has given shell FC's time to make more money and more alt accounts to buy more plots.

If you think a year of testing this system wouldn't have helped this, you're delusional. Oh yeah and Dragons are real. I'm sure you'll believe that too

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

Not patting their back but also not living i n your perfect world were nothing EVER goes wrong.

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Mistakes do happen and do make it through testing but come on, housing has been an issue for almost a decade at this point. When a system has been broken for years on end you can't keep saying it's just a little mistake.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

World isn't perfect. But hey, I'm not the one that'll get completely bent over when they do start the new rounds of lottery because this entire time has given shell FC's time to make more money and more alt accounts to buy more plots.

If you think a year of testing this system wouldn't have helped this, you're delusional. Oh yeah and Dragons are real. I'm sure you'll believe that too

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I don't understand why people like to disagree with your conclusions. Right is right and no opposing debate will persuade me otherwise

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Originally Posted by Lecru

World isn't perfect. But hey, I'm not the one that'll get completely bent over when they do start the new rounds of lottery because this entire time has given shell FC's time to make more money and more alt accounts to buy more plots.

If you think a year of testing this system wouldn't have helped this, you're delusional. Oh yeah and Dragons are real. I'm sure you'll believe that too

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Lol I have seen things tested and planned for a year or more still go south. I never believe for a moment that things will ever go smoothly no matter the planning.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

If you think a year of testing this system wouldn't have helped this, you're delusional.

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Playing devil's advocate, if you don't think they did at least a year of testing or more on this, and it still wen to "production" like this, I'm not sure there is more to say.

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-...288-story.html

Gotta string along people somehow. ;)

I, for one, am completely asthonished how many computer programmers there are on the forums that know exactly what line of code caused the housing glitch.
I'm so glad they teach advanced debugging in kindergarden now.

I'm sure it would take all you armchair software developers only take 30 minutes to isolate, correct and thoroughly test the few lines of code in literally millions of lines of code and ensure it will run as expected on every different supported hardware and software configuration as advertised.

And when you get done with that, please do the same for my billion dollar vehicle manufacturer who had to recall my vehicle a second time because the PCM reprogramming for one issue caused another totally unrelated issue with my vehicle.

And while you're at it, please solve the world hunger problem and sustainable energy issue too.

It makes me so happy to know that I now live in a world where people always give 100% of effort 100% of the time at your jobs and never make a mistake. :rolleyes:

I must have been living under a rock for the last 60+ years to not know this.

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Originally Posted by Tyjacon

I, for one, am completely asthonished how many computer programmers there are on the forums that know exactly what line of code caused the housing glitch.
I'm so glad they teach advanced debugging in kindergarden now.

I'm sure it would take all you armchair software developers only take 30 minutes to isolate, correct and thoroughly test the few lines of code in literally millions of lines of code and ensure it will run as expected on every different supported hardware and software configuration as advertised.

And when you get done with that, please do the same for my billion dollar vehicle manufacturer who had to recall my vehicle a second time because the PCM reprogramming for one issue caused another totally unrelated issue with my vehicle.

And while you're at it, please solve the world hunger problem and sustainable energy issue too.

It makes me so happy to know that I now live in a world where people always give 100% of effort 100% of the time at your jobs and never make a mistake. :rolleyes:

I must have been living under a rock for the last 60+ years to not know this.

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That's one thing we do not lack in my generation (Millennial) which is why these same people have turned white collar work into the new blue collar work. Thats why computer engineers are paid crap money now a days so much available workers rather than demand and we are seeing a switch now for a need of blue collar workers with low amount of workers thus better pay. Its not helping the companies are allowed to now import H1-B Visas and claim they don't have qualified workers in tech lol

My son is 17 and already in a trades union and they are giving him work this summer.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

I don't really care at this point. Tbh I backed Square in the past. But clearly they took no prior actions to stop this from happening and only went into full "Test" mode AFTER they screwed things up. My Sub and yours don't have "Business Hours". And since we use the excuse for every other occurrence when it suits us. The same team that works on balance adjustments are not the same team that work on housing. Etc etc. This should not be taking as long as it is. They are now building something else to test further. Clearly they already have something they've used to test the fix. Use that. Stop wasting time building something else. I have 200mil in holding now for my FC because they couldn't be bothered to fully test this out the months prior to the lotto sytem. Further, as somebody stated, this doesn't address what happens if somebody who WAS in an FC ends up leaving in this large amount of time it's taking them to do this, etc. You wanna be complacent with things going on lately, fine that's on you. But i'm not. And i'll say it out loud instead of just patting the poor multi billion dollar company on the head from here on out

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Saying that the workers at a company deserve to have time to eat, sleep and relax outside of their workday isn't "patting the poor multi-billion dollar company on the head", and your demands of crunch to fix an entertainment product are frankly disgusting.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

That's one thing we do not lack in my generation (Millennial) which is why these same people have turned white collar work into the new blue collar work. Thats why computer engineers are paid crap money now a days so much available workers rather than demand and we are seeing a switch now for a need of blue collar workers with low amount of workers thus better pay. Its not helping the companies are allowed to now import H1-B Visas and claim they don't have qualified workers in tech lol

My son is 17 and already in a trades union and they are giving him work this summer.

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Cool story, bro.

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Originally Posted by SnowVix

Saying that the workers at a company deserve to have time to eat, sleep and relax outside of their workday isn't "patting the poor multi-billion dollar company on the head", and your demands of crunch to fix an entertainment product are frankly disgusting.

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Yeah. I'm not happy with the current situation, and their regular updates on this aren't making it any better for me. But no one is doing/fixing anything if they aren't fed or sleeping.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Yeah. I'm not happy with the current situation, and their regular updates on this aren't making it any better for me. But no one is doing/fixing anything if they aren't fed or sleeping.

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Bad enough Yoshi does not sleep much too began with.