Housing update 3 is up.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

They've always had the numbers. But since 2.1 Yoshi has addressed and stated that housing is still primarily for FC's. It benefits them the most. Workshops, Company rooms for purchase, buff wheels, etc.

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Well i'm not really sure they do given many didn't even bother to try. I think this lottery opened up the willingness of many to put in a bid rather then FFA a house or click a placard.

does this mean all the affected player who have claimed their refund needs now to have enough Gil in case they are the winner ?

Im guessing for those who claimed their money, the system will just require you to input the gil again when you go to the plaque to accept the win.

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Originally Posted by Lecru

They've always had the numbers. But since 2.1 Yoshi has addressed and stated that housing is still primarily for FC's. It benefits them the most. Workshops, Company rooms for purchase, buff wheels, etc.

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They should have never introduced personal housing then. Once you open up that Pandora's box, there is no going back. Housing is something that has a visceral feel to a great many players. Not all but certainly a good many. I'd go as far as to say it may be ingrained in our social conscience...the need to have a home, whether in real life or in game. If there are no homes to be had, then nobody is hurt, but if personal housing is made available that opens up all manner of problems if you can't provide it to everyone.

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Originally Posted by Palslow

does this mean all the affected player who have claimed their refund needs now to have enough Gil in case they are the winner ?

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Short answer, yes, since it seems like they will be working out a process to reclaim the funds at a later time. But perhaps not immediately following the winning of said plot.

Probably a grace period of some sort. Or they may code something new into the client where it checks if you won, and if you did, checks if you withdrew the funds and if yes, asks player to deposit funds.

If I was one of those who'd actually won a plot normally, I'd be a little nervous reading all about backup restores and the like.

i am actually beginning to think the limited amount of private homes was intentional as they may already be looking into replacing it with something else for solo players who want homes of their own to decorate which that honestly would be fantastic to hear if that is indeed the case an i know some have said that the island sanctuary thing is kinda a step in that direction but we still dont have enough info on that yet to draw a conclusion.

I think the ward system was an ok idea for free companies but its just not sustainable long time for private ownership so if they are filtering out individuals into a new solo only home instance that would be a good thing for the longevity of housing cause they can jut scontinue to expand the number of reserved plots over time for individuals an occasionally add a new district to fc housing as the need necessitates

Right on, great response

Are you people happy now? all you needed was a bit patience, I doubt most game developers would have a fix up this quickly.

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Originally Posted by Listrella

Are you people happy now? all you needed was a bit patience, I doubt most game developers would have a fix up this quickly.

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They'll just attribute the quick response to their vitriol, which... /eyeroll. The devs have been pretty good on updating players over the years, yet people conveniently forget this and would rather screech into the void. I mean, I get the frustration (I got the 0 bug too), and there's nothing wrong with saying you're disappointed (or pushing for proper instanced housing), but good grief, the garbage frequently posted on here... This is why I avoid the forums in general and actually play the game...

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

It's expected. Remember, only people who like the game are toxic.

And I say this as someone who has wanted an ishgard house for close to 8 years now. And lost the lottery (and I expect every plot on jenova to be gone with the bug fix, almost every plot had bidders)

Yet I'm not here moaning and groaning. I accepted the results like an adult and moved on.

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As a fellow Adamantoise loser, mind if we cry out together?

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Originally Posted by Mika_Zahard

As a fellow Adamantoise loser, mind if we cry out together?

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I lost my bid as well. It was a fair run though and I wish the winner all the best as that person settles in to becoming a home owner. I will keep trying as long as there are plots. Maybe someday. Maybe not. All one can do is keep trying and wish those who have won, good fortune.

Still showing 0 participants at the plot the FC bid on, so it's not really "fixed". It's no different than it was the day prior.

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Originally Posted by Greyhawk

Still showing 0 participants at the plot the FC bid on, so it's not really "fixed". It's no different than it was the day prior.

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I think it was a translation issue. It's been updated. They meant for people who currently have the lottery results working, they can proceed to buy housing, the 0 glitch will need a patch to fix.

Glad for those who exp the issues and hope they fix it soon. I wasn't one of them since I lost the ishgrad large to someone else. Guess Im forever be in the goblet with its bad large placement and design(the cafe house you have to walk thought the flower plots since its right infront the damn gate). Ill keep trying but with most the wards being FC only there are only two open large private larges now, one in shino and the other in lav bed.

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Originally Posted by Greyhawk

Still showing 0 participants at the plot the FC bid on, so it's not really "fixed". It's no different than it was the day prior.

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... As they said in their post, that will require a few days to fix. For some it was more of a display issue, but for the proper "lel nobody bid!" 0 bug, it will require more time. I'd like to know if I won or lost too, but they can't just snap their fingers and then it's magically done. I would expect at least a week, as they mentioned 3-5 business days to verify fixes.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

I think it was a translation issue. It's been updated. They meant for people who currently have the lottery results working, they can proceed to buy housing, the 0 glitch will need a patch to fix.

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Thanks, yeah I had to go back and read this chaotic mess of updates and that's what it appears to be. I know the only other bidder also took their gil refund, before we both knew WTF was happening.

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Originally Posted by Mirhd

... As they said in their post, that will require a few days to fix. For some it was more of a display issue, but for the proper "lel nobody bid!" 0 bug, it will require more time. I'd like to know if I won or lost too, but they can't just snap their fingers and then it's magically done. I would expect at least a week, as they mentioned 3-5 business days to verify fixes.

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Yeah, the issue is with either their translations, or a crap way to communicate. Proper communication would include previous information in the latest update to differentiate between those issues. Presenting it how they did shows the fix in one update, and the more recent update reads that it has been fixed. They actually took down Update #4, then replaced it.

As you can see in just one example here, that others have the same issue that I do with the shit communication: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...-Now-Displayed

There was a small post mentioning the display issue which they tweaked slightly and changed the title of, which is what that thread refers to; there was no proper Follow-up #4 hours ago. #3 mentioned the days required already, that wasn't edited in. Again, I maintain people were looking at the wrong thing. I had zero issues understanding what they meant in that small post, since it never even addressed the zero bug, as that was mentioned in #3. I'd argue it's not "shit communication", but good for them regardless for clarifying the smaller post I suppose.

This is a joke, i already was wondering when the next lottery round will be and now you cant even buy/bid anymore because they broke the system. Dont say have some testservers to try out bit changes like that before they go live?

So the lottery was still BS as even the numbers that won and a real person did not get Zero the fact that the number Zero was a Factor in the lottery means the winning person won well competing with the number Zero so if there was no number Zero in the drawing another person could have won.

Bottom line those who won the house are not real winners and they should be stripped of their house and a redo must occur.

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Originally Posted by MrJPtheAssassin

Glad for those who exp the issues and hope they fix it soon. I wasn't one of them since I lost the ishgrad large to someone else. Guess Im forever be in the goblet with its bad large placement and design(the cafe house you have to walk thought the flower plots since its right infront the damn gate). Ill keep trying but with most the wards being FC only there are only two open large private larges now, one in shino and the other in lav bed.

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The person didn't beat you or really win. The lottery was bugged and they should loss the house. Bottom line the lottery used the number 0 in the draw which meant even the houses who went to a person that draw also used the number 0 to factor it in. So if the number 0 was not in the drawing someone else might have won.

If I throw in the numbers 0 through 10 in a drawing there is a chance 0 will be chosen, but it will affect it will lower the chances for the other numbers to be chosen. If we remove the number 0 from a drawing and have the numbers 1 through 10 the chances of the other numbers to be drawn will be different.

Even for those who won the houses it is not legitimate due to the factor of including the number 0 in the draw.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

So the lottery was still BS as even the numbers that won and a real person did not get Zero the fact that the number Zero was a Factor in the lottery means the winning person won well competing with the number Zero so if there was no number Zero in the drawing another person could have won.

Bottom line those who won the house are not real winners and they should be stripped of their house and a redo must occur.
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Where did you get that nonsense from? Not true any of it.
There was no competing with the number Zero. The lottery itself ran correctly, and those who won it did so correctly.
The problem was that in many cases the results of the lottery weren't communicated to the game servers, at which point they displayed that the winner was "Player 0". SE has records to figure out who actually won in those cases, so no redo is necessary.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

So the lottery was still BS as even the numbers that won and a real person did not get Zero the fact that the number Zero was a Factor in the lottery means the winning person won well competing with the number Zero so if there was no number Zero in the drawing another person could have won.

Bottom line those who won the house are not real winners and they should be stripped of their house and a redo must occur.




The person didn't beat you or really win. The lottery was bugged and they should loss the house. Bottom line the lottery used the number 0 in the draw which meant even the houses who went to a person that draw also used the number 0 to factor it in. So if the number 0 was not in the drawing someone else might have won.

If I throw in the numbers 0 through 10 in a drawing there is a chance 0 will be chosen, but it will affect it will lower the chances for the other numbers to be chosen. If we remove the number 0 from a drawing and have the numbers 1 through 10 the chances of the other numbers to be drawn will be different.

Even for those who won the houses it is not legitimate due to the factor of including the number 0 in the draw.

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Incorrect. No one lost to zero - that was a display issue in not showing the winner of the lottery. It had 'zero' to do with the bidding entries themselves. C WUT I DID THAR?!?!?

... I wouldn't pay HisShadowX any mind, really. Dude shows up from time to time to troll, though is hardly the only one. Better for ones' mental state to not engage at all.

A staged rollout probably would have helped catch and mitigate this problem, as much as players wouldn't have liked it. It does indeed seem like it comes down to a difference between their testing environment and production environment that prevented them from catching the error in QA.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

Even for those who won the houses it is not legitimate due to the factor of including the number 0 in the draw.

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The error was not related to the draw itself. It was a communication error that prevented the true results from propagating to the housing server. 0 was likely a placeholder value that was chosen to appear in the case that such a thing happened, which would prevent the house from being awarded to anyone in the case of such an error.

In other words, in cases where someone acquired a house the lottery functioned as intended.

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Originally Posted by Missbone

This is a joke, i already was wondering when the next lottery round will be and now you cant even buy/bid anymore because they broke the system. Dont say have some testservers to try out bit changes like that before they go live?

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They test stuff but testing does not reveal everything. A patch can work fine in testing but develope a bug the moment it goes live. Or develope a bug when a patch is applied or a server restart happens.

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Originally Posted by Mirhd

... I wouldn't pay HisShadowX any mind, really. Dude shows up from time to time to troll, though is hardly the only one. Better for ones' mental state to not engage at all.

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Careful, he'll say you go around to all threads he posts in 'attacking' him because you want to get high off 'righteous indignation'! Or something equally inane.

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Anyway: to that one poster mentioning "lol none of the complainers show up now that things are answered" - here I am, a 'filthy complainer', saying I'm appreciative of the communication and attempts to fix the issue.

I'm also here to say it never should have occurred in the first place. QA testing should have caught this issue early on before it ever went live, or at the very least they should have tested this under expected conditions such as emergency maintenance or server crashes. Their looking into this particular issue also does not negate the plethora of others that have been going on for years untouched, nor the poor response to players being understandably upset by various issues since EW's release.

I don't really know what you expect of people who are dissatisfied and unhappy with all of these issues (not just housing) to do? Throw ourselves on the ground going "oh thank you based Yoshi-P for saving the lotto system! thank you for fixing one singular issue! Thank you for acknowledging a problem exists and not sweeping it under the rug like so many others"? Most are probably appreciative of the notice and the fact they are going to endeavor to not just fix the issue but reimburse people who should have fairly won a house but didn't. But them fixing one singular issue doesn't exactly negate the existence of all other issues, nor is enough for people to forget about them.

It also doesn't make this entire housing system any less horrid than it is. They've had ample time to fix it, improve it, allocate resources and server space to it, and have continuously chosen to bandaid fix it over, and over, and over, and over. Forgive us if we're running out of understanding when this has been an ongoing issue for years, that players have repeatedly voiced displeasure over.

While this is great for the players who received the "0" bug and are getting a good resolution, it still doesn't address the issues player housing have had for 10 years now, namely that most player are locked out of owning their own homes due to the limited supply. This "0" issue wouldn't even be an issue if there were plenty of houses to go around for everyone. I really hope that after this uproar SE finally takes notice and does something that allows EVERYONE to partake in the the housing portion of the game and not be limited by the limitations of apartments or FC housing (where only the top people get to do stuff). Maybe Island Sanctuaries will fulfil this role. Hopefully SE illiterates on what these will actually allow in the near future.

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Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

Careful, he'll say you go around to all threads he posts in 'attacking' him because you want to get high off 'righteous indignation'! Or something equally inane.

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Anyway: to that one poster mentioning "lol none of the complainers show up now that things are answered" - here I am, a 'filthy complainer', saying I'm appreciative of the communication and attempts to fix the issue.

I'm also here to say it never should have occurred in the first place. QA testing should have caught this issue early on before it ever went live. Their looking into the issue also does not negate the plethora of issues that have been going on for years untouched, nor the poor response to players being understandably upset by various issues since EW's release.

I don't really know what you expect of people who are dissatisfied and unhappy with all of these issues (not just housing) to do? Throw ourselves on the ground going "oh thank you based Yoshi-P for saving the lotto system! thank you for fixing one singular issue! Thank you for acknowledging a problem exists and not sweeping it under the rug like so many others"? Most are probably appreciative of the notice and the fact they are going to endeavor to not just fix the issue but reimburse people who should have fairly won a house but didn't. But them fixing one singular issue doesn't exactly negate the existence of all other issues, nor is enough for people to forget about them.

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QA doesn't catch everything.

I work for one of the US' biggest telecoms. They ran extensive tests and certified a version of firmware for the NICs used on a server platform. Thousands of servers effected (physical, not VMs). This certified version randomly sees an active link as down, and the only resolution is a hard power reset. It didn't get found during certification because it's completely random and while the issue is frequent, it wasn't discovered during the certification process.

No QA system will ever find every bug. It's not possible or feasible.

SE at least, owns up to their mistakes (or at least the XIV devs do). It's why there is such goodwill.

You can point to all the negative threads here all you want, but generally speaking, they are all made by the same smallish group who all agree with each other. They made their own little echo chamber and anyone who disagrees is "white knighting".

They are just as bad, if not worse, than those who say SE makes no mistakes lol.

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Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

Careful, he'll say you go around to all threads he posts in 'attacking' him because you want to get high off 'righteous indignation'! Or something equally inane.

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He can do that all he likes. Doesn't change the fact that outside of the post you quoted and this here, I've mentioned him a grand total of twice. Also, considering how bland my post was... /shrug

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

QA doesn't catch everything.

I work for one of the US' biggest telecoms. They ran extensive tests and certified a version of firmware for the NICs used on a server platform. Thousands of servers effected (physical, not VMs). This certified version randomly sees an active link as down, and the only resolution is a hard power reset. It didn't get found during certification because it's completely random and while the issue is frequent, it wasn't discovered during the certification process.

No QA system will ever find every bug. It's not possible or feasible.

SE at least, owns up to their mistakes (or at least the XIV devs do). It's why there is such goodwill.

You can point to all the negative threads here all you want, but generally speaking, they are all made by the same smallish group who all agree with each other. They made their own little echo chamber and anyone who disagrees is "white knighting".

They are just as bad, if not worse, than those who say SE makes no mistakes lol.

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This. As nice as it would be for things to work perfectly 100% of the time... that's not physically possible (or even sane to expect). Things will slip through the cracks from time to time and/or only crop up in certain environments. Best one can do is own up and fix the issue.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

QA doesn't catch everything.

I work for one of the US' biggest telecoms. They ran extensive tests and certified a version of firmware for the NICs used on a server platform. Thousands of servers effected (physical, not VMs). This certified version randomly sees an active link as down, and the only resolution is a hard power reset. It didn't get found during certification because it's completely random and while the issue is frequent, it wasn't discovered during the certification process.

No QA system will ever find every bug. It's not possible or feasible.

SE at least, owns up to their mistakes (or at least the XIV devs do). It's why there is such goodwill.

You can point to all the negative threads here all you want, but generally speaking, they are all made by the same smallish group who all agree with each other. They made their own little echo chamber and anyone who disagrees is "white knighting".

They are just as bad, if not worse, than those who say SE makes no mistakes lol.

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You're right, it can't. But XIV's development team isn't a small indie studio with bare minimum funding and hardware; there are various ways they could have tested it before pushing it live. Even a staged rollout, as LittleImp mentioned, would have helped to catch the issue quickly before it affected so many people who are already tired and frustrated with this poor housing system as it stands. Owning up to your mistakes while continuing to consistently make them doesn't exactly breed much goodwill after 9 years of watching the cycle.

I also want to point out how most 'negative threads' on here are not in fact all the same 'small minority' (lol, sure Jan) who 'created an echo chamber' - I see numerous new posters with barely any posts chiming in their own feedback and displeasure. Not just with housing, but with many aspects of the game that have grown worse with every passing year, and issues which continue to go ignored. Perhaps you want to pretend they aren't there, or are just alts of the 'small minority echo chamber group', but the fact is - people are getting annoyed. People are seeing worrying trends. People who came over from WoW are noting similar red flags that signalled the slow spiral from grace of WoW and Blizzard.

I have an FC full of fairly casual players who love this game and the dev team, and even they're getting more annoyed every year, every patch. They're dissatisfied with decisions being made and the approach CB3 has towards this game lately. People have always voiced dissent over the years, sure (especially here), but I think it's quite telling how no matter which social media you check, more and more people are voicing displeasure and unhappiness with the state of things lately. Something is not right, no matter how much people like you try to act like it's just a 'small minority' yelling in their echo chamber.

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Originally Posted by SnowVix

would you look at that. every single armchair coder was wrong

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Who had "S/E over-engineered the lottery system and didn't have adequate checks in place" on their Coder Bingo card, really?

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

QA doesn't catch everything.

I work for one of the US' biggest telecoms. They ran extensive tests and certified a version of firmware for the NICs used on a server platform. Thousands of servers effected (physical, not VMs). This certified version randomly sees an active link as down, and the only resolution is a hard power reset. It didn't get found during certification because it's completely random and while the issue is frequent, it wasn't discovered during the certification process.

No QA system will ever find every bug. It's not possible or feasible.

SE at least, owns up to their mistakes (or at least the XIV devs do). It's why there is such goodwill.

You can point to all the negative threads here all you want, but generally speaking, they are all made by the same smallish group who all agree with each other. They made their own little echo chamber and anyone who disagrees is "white knighting".

They are just as bad, if not worse, than those who say SE makes no mistakes lol.

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Forgive this lala for pressing X to doubt the extensive Q&A done by US telecoms. Can hardly tie a set of Velcro shoes let alone deliver a stable service. Am hardly surprised a frequent failure to establish connection for certification bug slipped through that could likely have been handled by if failed to certify attempt again > reset > attempt again.

Am happy this is being addressed if that makes everyone else happy to hear. I can tell the friends who were thinking of quitting over this that they will receive their FC houses.

Perhaps in future times Square can perform most complicated tests such as;
"What if server A fails to communicate with server B?"

and

"What if account/character is falsely flagged as unable to purchase?" Can they still place a bet?"

Nah! Am only armchair coder with expectations most lofty who has not a clue what they are talking about. Thankfully this is not EA/Activision or we would be justified in frustration! May have to express that feist if it were not Square and the FFXIV dev team. Phew thank the twelve it is the FFXIV dev team, I can go back to being complacent now.

Carry on everyone! Is fix!

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Originally Posted by ijuakos_xqwzts

Who had "S/E over-engineered the lottery system and didn't have adequate checks in place" on their Coder Bingo card, really?

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*checks notes*

I had that as guess four on my checklist. Right next to "oops I nulled the tables" and "Hmm, probably failed server to client update." and not to far from "Am thinking bidder zero is system bidder - default state"

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Originally Posted by SnowVix

would you look at that. every single armchair coder was wrong

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There are a lot of things that can cause that kind of error, so there were bound to be many wrong answers.

There were a few people that did actually correctly predict that the problem was server communication related, for what its worth.

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Originally Posted by Isutowaru

My FC is finally getting their own large! Excited!

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same here we are also excited ...

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

So the lottery was still BS as even the numbers that won and a real person did not get Zero the fact that the number Zero was a Factor in the lottery means the winning person won well competing with the number Zero so if there was no number Zero in the drawing another person could have won.

Bottom line those who won the house are not real winners and they should be stripped of their house and a redo must occur.




The person didn't beat you or really win. The lottery was bugged and they should loss the house. Bottom line the lottery used the number 0 in the draw which meant even the houses who went to a person that draw also used the number 0 to factor it in. So if the number 0 was not in the drawing someone else might have won.

If I throw in the numbers 0 through 10 in a drawing there is a chance 0 will be chosen, but it will affect it will lower the chances for the other numbers to be chosen. If we remove the number 0 from a drawing and have the numbers 1 through 10 the chances of the other numbers to be drawn will be different.

Even for those who won the houses it is not legitimate due to the factor of including the number 0 in the draw.

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Yes this what been saying from the very beginning with this and no one wants to acknowledge this at. Even if your plot did not get hit with the zero bug it still play a factor in which number which was draw from what I saw on my server the majority was single digit numbers such as 1,2,3 and 5 the highest I seen was a 8. I fully support a full roll back on all the house so that the proper system is working correctly. But they rather just tell folks that got jip out winning a house better luck next time.

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Originally Posted by Escence

Yes this what been saying from the very beginning with this and no one wants to acknowledge this at. Even if your plot did not get hit with the zero bug it still play a factor in which number which was draw from what I saw on my server the majority was single digit numbers such as 1,2,3 and 5 the highest I seen was a 8. I fully support a full roll back on all the house so that the proper system is working correctly. But they rather just tell folks that got jip out winning a house better luck next time.

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I agree with you in the multiple entries lottery, but I got a zero and was the only entry. You can run it a million times in a row with 1 to 10 and I still won ....but I lost to a zero ...

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

QA doesn't catch everything.

I work for one of the US' biggest telecoms. They ran extensive tests and certified a version of firmware for the NICs used on a server platform. Thousands of servers effected (physical, not VMs). This certified version randomly sees an active link as down, and the only resolution is a hard power reset. It didn't get found during certification because it's completely random and while the issue is frequent, it wasn't discovered during the certification process.

No QA system will ever find every bug. It's not possible or feasible.

SE at least, owns up to their mistakes (or at least the XIV devs do). It's why there is such goodwill.

You can point to all the negative threads here all you want, but generally speaking, they are all made by the same smallish group who all agree with each other. They made their own little echo chamber and anyone who disagrees is "white knighting".

They are just as bad, if not worse, than those who say SE makes no mistakes lol.

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I mean this should have been caught this was not some random bug that could happen in a blue moon this was in your face a end result of someone not coding properly and yoshi sign off on it to be ship.
The same can be said that by the group of people that defends when the devs finally listen after community drills it into their brain that hey we don't like something change it. Case in point DRK invulnerable look how long it took the to make it a decent ability. Same can be said for housing when yoshi made the call to let people own personal housing but instead of properly addressing it they chose to do band aid fixes instead of fixing the core issues which still is at the end of day having enough homes to accommodate anyone that interested but instead they choose a band aid fix of hey let's do a rng lottery. Now some say we'll they are doing another data center expansion with additional worlds and that will solve the housing issue. Wel it won't because if they keep on the design path that FC take up the majority of the wards while personal only has 2 wards allocated for them then we are going to becback where we started. Hold yoshi accountable for poor design choices and hold him accountable for doing band aid fixes instead of fixing the core issue.

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Originally Posted by MiaShino

Forgive this lala for pressing X to doubt the extensive Q&A done by US telecoms. Can hardly tie a set of Velcro shoes let alone deliver a stable service. Am hardly surprised a frequent failure to establish connection for certification bug slipped through that could likely have been handled by if failed to certify attempt again > reset > attempt again.

Am happy this is being addressed if that makes everyone else happy to hear. I can tell the friends who were thinking of quitting over this that they will receive their FC houses.

Perhaps in future times Square can perform most complicated tests such as;
"What if server A fails to communicate with server B?"

and

"What if account/character is falsely flagged as unable to purchase?" Can they still place a bet?"

Nah! Am only armchair coder with expectations most lofty who has not a clue what they are talking about. Thankfully this is not EA/Activision or we would be justified in frustration! May have to express that feist if it were not Square and the FFXIV dev team. Phew thank the twelve it is the FFXIV dev team, I can go back to being complacent now.

Carry on everyone! Is fix!



*checks notes*

I had that as guess four on my checklist. Right next to "oops I nulled the tables" and "Hmm, probably failed server to client update." and not to far from "Am thinking bidder zero is system bidder - default state"

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You know whats more annoying then errors and bugs in a game. People who use other peoples mistakes to grand stand and toot their own horn.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

You know whats more annoying then errors and bugs in a game. People who use other peoples mistakes to grand stand and toot their own horn.

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Sure wish that empty plot had a house on it right now and I could ignore that as easily as you could have ignored my post.

Nah, you had to make some snarky passive aggressive comment instead. Get labeled as doing something on these forums every time I post.

Now I am grand standing. Toot too, I suppose. I have every bit same right to call out big dumb mistakes as you do to mald over my doing so.