So, where's the Sun on the Moon?

The sun can be seen in the zone preview trailer shown before release. It looks great! I have to think this is a bug of some sort, and would encourage others to submit a bug report reporting the missing sun from the sky box.

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Originally Posted by Lurea

It absolutely is, the moon is only visible when umbral wind is the weather as seen in this screenshot. I've submitted this as a bug report, I'd encourage others to do the same.

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I'd be more inclined to agree if not for the fact that the weather the moon is visible in also happens to be the only elemental weather present on both the moon itself and in Ultima Thule.

That and the very specific timing with which the moon appears/disappears seems deliberate.

Though on the flipside, if it gets marked as "not a bug" that would basically soft-confirm it as some manner of foreshadowing.

Just to add/throw this out there:

We are lead to believe Venat created the actual moon, but it is possible that...
A) They only meant she created the moon base/Zodiark Prison elements (adjusted an existing moon) or
B) There was some mistruth or misunderstanding or even
C) Venat created the moon long long long before the sundering as an entirely unrelated project, and it existed at the time of Elpis.

To me it seems strange that Venat would create such a huge stone/lifeless structure when something more mechanical/magical in nature would have done the job. If it was truly meant to carry all of mankind, why make it desolate? Surely it could have been greener.

Personally (tin foil hat time) I believe Labyrinthos was originally meant to be the lunar interior, but the story got reworked.

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Originally Posted by kaynide

Just to add/throw this out there:
To me it seems strange that Venat would create such a huge stone/lifeless structure when something more mechanical/magical in nature would have done the job. If it was truly meant to carry all of mankind, why make it desolate? Surely it could have been greener.

Personally (tin foil hat time) I believe Labyrinthos was originally meant to be the lunar interior, but the story got reworked.

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It's already been explained ingame that Hydalyn is the Goddess of Stasis. In order to keep Zodiark in check, she had to have the astral nature so the moon just happens to be barren, like the First, because her powers lack umbral energies to balance it out.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

I'd be more inclined to agree if not for the fact that the weather the moon is visible in also happens to be the only elemental weather present on both the moon itself and in Ultima Thule.

That and the very specific timing with which the moon appears/disappears seems deliberate.

Though on the flipside, if it gets marked as "not a bug" that would basically soft-confirm it as some manner of foreshadowing.

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Umbral wind is also present as early as the sea of clouds, it's used for rare fish appearances while fishing. I suspect the weather isn't all that relevant and just chalk it up to ham-handedness.

Quick Google search is not showing anything, but what is the lore cause of Umbral wind?

If the moon is/was housing Zodiark and a gigantic mother crystal equivalent of dark energy, it being the source of umbral weather could be interesting.

Well, the weird Elpis moon is still around at the present time, so they don't seem too keen on fixing it if it is a bug.

The elemental weathers were vaguely described as just being a product of fluctuations in the ambient aether IIRC, though that makes presence of umbral wind even in Ultima Thule seem...strange.

We don't really know the physics of space in-universe, it's never exactly been important until now. In real-life there are solar winds in space--they're essentially shockwaves from solar flares--which would actually translate pretty well as something like umbral wind in FFXIV's universe, but that's just me taking a guess.

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Originally Posted by Kirika-

If it is modeled per our real Earth, Moon, and Sun, then due to the lack of an atmosphere on the Moon, the "sky" would always be dark and would be like night time on Earth in general appearance even at "high noon". The Sun would appear as a "larger" star in the night sky, bright enough to "light up" the surface and cast shadows, but it's apparent size would be smaller than say a full Moon as seen from Earth.
Remember, the only reason we see a "bright blue sky" on Earth is due to our atmosphere refracting and being illuminated by the Sun light and without it we would see what the astronauts see outside of our atmosphere, a field of darkness with small light points from stars/galaxies.

I don't think the game explained fully why we can walk the surface of the Moon in game and not suffocate (and irradiate), but lets chalk it up to magic :D

To add, in real life due to the rotational speed of the Moon, a full day/night cycle last about 4 weeks, so the changes through out the "day" and "night" are very small compared to a typical 24 hour day/night cycle on Earth

This website shows a video of what it is like from the Moon surface having a sunrise:
https://earthsky.org/space/how-often...from-the-moon/

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Spoilers-ish:
I believe its magic or magitek of sorts. While the Moon and the unrealistic stuff about it isn't explicitly explained, the Loporrits explain a few things that imply that its all magic and technology. For example, it not being a moon at all, but a giant space ship masquerading as a moon, and explaining how they generate a breathable environment with the "tree" like structures. Which allows them to not have to explain or think about realism, its all technology and magic beyond anything we could understand.

He wouldn't be on the moon. He's at the Dawn Throne in Azim Steppe.

Well there is no sun from the 13th's moon either.

https://i.imgur.com/W3DQlmv.png

There are stars though.

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Originally Posted by JepMZ

It's already been explained ingame that Hydalyn is the Goddess of Stasis. In order to keep Zodiark in check, she had to have the astral nature so the moon just happens to be barren, like the First, because her powers lack umbral energies to balance it out.

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Originally Posted by Necrotica

Quick Google search is not showing anything, but what is the lore cause of Umbral wind?

If the moon is/was housing Zodiark and a gigantic mother crystal equivalent of dark energy, it being the source of umbral weather could be interesting.

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We getting our Astrals and Umbrals mixed up again guys?
Astral = Dark = Zodiark/Bahamut/13th
Umbral = Light = Hydaelyn/First

Astral Elemental Lore

Astral energy is the light-based polarity present in all six elements (see Chapter 4 of Essences & Permutations - A Treatise of the Six Elements). The opposite of Astral energy is Umbral energy. Astral energy can exist in all 6 elements, as demonstrated by the odd-numbered months of the Eorzean Calendar. Likewise, The Twelve associated with Astral energy are Halone (Ice), Thaliak (Water), Llymlaen (Wind), Byregot (Lightning), Azeyma (Fire), and Nophica (Earth). Astral energy is most heavily utilized by Disciples of Magic, such as the Thaumaturge.
pulled right off gamer escape

also umbral litterally takes from the latin word umbra which means shadow

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

We getting our Astrals and Umbrals mixed up again guys?
Astral = Dark = Zodiark/Bahamut/13th
Umbral = Light = Hydaelyn/First

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You are completely correct.

for those that don't remember.
All is said in Shadowbringers when Urianger explains Umbral and Astral to us in IL Mheg. Plus explained by the watcher in Endwalker when talking to him on what happened during the final days and with the loporrits when they're explaining the crystals and why nothing can really grow on the surface of the moon as well as why they need those giant Skittle crystals... All in rewatchable cutscenes from the Journal in the Inn room or, if you have it, as a furniture item in your room or house.

The rewatchable portions are with the Watcher and Urianger...

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Originally Posted by dragoelete

Astral Elemental Lore

Astral energy is the light-based polarity present in all six elements (see Chapter 4 of Essences & Permutations - A Treatise of the Six Elements). The opposite of Astral energy is Umbral energy. Astral energy can exist in all 6 elements, as demonstrated by the odd-numbered months of the Eorzean Calendar. Likewise, The Twelve associated with Astral energy are Halone (Ice), Thaliak (Water), Llymlaen (Wind), Byregot (Lightning), Azeyma (Fire), and Nophica (Earth). Astral energy is most heavily utilized by Disciples of Magic, such as the Thaumaturge.
pulled right off gamer escape

also umbral litterally takes from the latin word umbra which means shadow

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Incorrect, as Rannie said, Urianger and The Watcher each retcon this "lore".

Umbral is not dark simply because it has real world connotations with 'shadow', nor is Astral light simply because of the real world meaning of 'star'.
These were misconceptions made by scholars on the Source, basically naming things on if something is literally 'bright' or 'dark'.

The revelation came from Black Rose, and the conundrum of how 'dark magic' could trigger a 'flood of light'. Black Rose was considered 'Umbral' and it halted the flow of aether.

Umbral is linked to stasis, and a stagnation of aether, which manifests as 'light' in huge quantities, because that aether isn't going anywhere, it's concentrated.
While Astral is linked to energy and entropy, and this aligned with more dark magic and the void, because that aether is going everywhere, and dissipating rapidly leaving nothing in it's place, and thus an absence of aether is a signature of Astral alignments.

Everything post Shadowbringers has supported this, for example Hydaelyn's EX totems being Umbral and Zodiark's Astral.

If this offends your intellect, consider the following:
Umbral: Light causes shadows, there is no shadow without a light source. A shadow is not simply the absence of light, it needs the light to cast it.
Astral: Stars are pure entropy, burning fuel and kicking that energy out into space until they starve and die a cold death.

It all stems from the fact that it's not actually how that twist works in Japanese. Synodic Scribe described it to me once and it's... honestly probably even more confusing than what we got and didn't exactly stay in my head because of it, which might be why they changed it, but it instead tries to go for the angle of the Scions realizing they were being overly prescriptive regarding what light and darkness could do.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Everything post Shadowbringers has supported this, for example Hydaelyn's EX totems being Umbral and Zodiark's Astral.

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Now I'm curious if they ever patched the debuff descriptions for Astral/Umbral Effect in Eden 7 (Eden's Verse Iconoclasm). There, the dark-coloured effect is called Umbral Effect, and the light-coloured effect is called Astral Effect.

This caused me a few issues dealing with the mechanics.

I kind of wish they never even brought up that information when they aren't/can't utilize it consistently due to the Source's general understanding of the elemental alignments being unchanged.