FFXIV: Do you think Square Enix will put more money and resources into it?

We don't know how good the Crystal engine is or what the limitations of this engine are. But an engine rewrite or a migration to an other engine is a very bad idea in most cases.


https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/...ver-do-part-i/


Cheers

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Originally Posted by Crowzer

WoW is almost 17 years old. And you clearly see that the visual upgrade trough expansions.
In FF14, I feel like there are no upgrades and even a downgrade. ARR zones were far superior for me.

Furthermore, and speaking about BDO, the game released just one year after FFXIV ARR.

But as I said, 100% agree with you for a downloadable texture pack for PC/PS5.


The game can be beautiful :

https://i.imgur.com/TXTSi9L.jpg


And sometimes, I don't know what ground textures meant to be :

https://i.imgur.com/P6Cp3Vb.jpg


>>> https://i.imgur.com/P6Cp3Vb.jpg

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They could probably do it for ps4 as well. They’ve stated previously ps4 hasn’t limited them and they’ve barely scratched the surface of what it can do. Considering something like the ff7 remake can run on it, i’m sure ps4 could handle an engine upgrade or texture pack.To answer the overall question though, i dont think they will. Theyve kind of shown they just want to milk this game for all its worth while putting only the most necessary of effort and time/resources into it.

Money is not the issue the issue is time. There’s a lot they want to do but cant because the game is built on a lot of garbage code from the original rebuild.. they could hire an outside company to fix this but it would require taking the game offline for a period of time in which they would lose a massive amount of subscriptions and those players may never come back. It’s risk vs reward.

As for team hires and such, its more a matter of finding the proper talent with the proper experience and skills than an inability to afford such talent.

The game is growing in popularity at a healthy rate, so hopefully it becomes a more appealing destination to aforementioned talent, and hopefully they can find a work around to remove the remaining junk code so they can build what they truly want to build.. its not so much a new engine is needed its just remove the scrap code and replace it with better structure to do things easier and more efficiently.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

They could probably do it for ps4 as well. They’ve stated previously ps4 hasn’t limited them and they’ve barely scratched the surface of what it can do. Considering something like the ff7 remake can run on it, i’m sure ps4 could handle an engine upgrade or texture pack.To answer the overall question though, i dont think they will. Theyve kind of shown they just want to milk this game for all its worth while putting only the most necessary of effort and time/resources into it.

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Its not so much milking as much as they’d want to just upgrade min specs but doing that would cost them pc players that are playing on dated equipment.

Easier to make FFXVII than new engine FFXIV

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Originally Posted by Kleeya

There was an already old interview in which Yoshida talked about how throwing more money and people at a game will not magically make it better, and that there is other limits involved. I am too lazy to find it again though, since with the game becoming more and more popular, Google is showing me an awful lot of different interviews.

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I remember that, but he also keeps using the excuse that they're understaffed. So which is it?

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Originally Posted by Aluja89

I remember that, but he also keeps using the excuse that they're understaffed. So which is it?

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Both, and neither. It's complicated. Go ask a friend who works for a media company that produces books, videos and videogames for more information.

If they don't, our final days will come sooner than expected.
Honestly, FFXIV reputation just increases and we already facing lag spikes, among other issues.
We can only hope that FFXIV don't turn into a WoW: a mere source of earnings for a different project.

Doubtful. Ps3 limitations, server limitations, small indie dev, older hardware limitations, code limitations, ps4 limitations, and now chip limitations.

Money is not an issue. The real issue is chip shortages. They also have been hiring for over a year.

I don't think throwing more money at the game will solve it's problems. MMO's are expensive as is - it's already a well funded game just to have survived as long as it has.
How much better can they really make it while using the same engine? And, honestly, an engine upgrade is no small task.

Nope. They'll keep funneling it into other games. They claim the player base has been expanding, yet we get less and less content with each expansion.

Hope so as they’re still getting overwhelmed even after the hot fix regarding server caps. World travel is a mess and I’m currently 20 minutes into a queue to get back to my home server. I dread to think what it’s going to be like with data centre travel.

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Originally Posted by MrPresident

Hope so as they’re still getting overwhelmed even after the hot fix regarding server caps. World travel is a mess and I’m currently 20 minutes into a queue to get back to my home server. I dread to think what it’s going to be like with data centre travel.

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Hotfix can only do so much when it comes to server capacity. The only actual fix is more servers, which at the moment are overpriced (thank you chip shortage), and you typically don't want to add capacity in a knee jerk reactions to a population surge.

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Originally Posted by TroySoFab

Doubtful. Ps3 limitations, server limitations, small indie dev, older hardware limitations, code limitations, ps4 limitations, and now chip limitations.

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No.

SE is a multinational corporation with offices worldwide, stop it. XIV is no underdog.

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Originally Posted by Nothv13

Hotfix can only do so much when it comes to server capacity. The only actual fix is more servers, which at the moment are overpriced (thank you chip shortage), and you typically don't want to add capacity in a knee jerk reactions to a population surge.

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True though it should atleast be a consideration on their end since we do have a new expansion dropping in a few months and those usually result in a very heavy increase of users trying to get online between new players and returning ones that reactivated their subscriptions to see the new story.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

True though it should atleast be a consideration on their end since we do have a new expansion dropping in a few months and those usually result in a very heavy increase of users trying to get online between new players and returning ones that reactivated their subscriptions to see the new story.

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I imagine they will add capacity for Endwalker, just it will never be enough for the reason that you don't over buy servers for a population surge.

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Originally Posted by Wavaryen

Sadly money is not the issues the game is having right now. It is chip shortage, and just the state of the world.

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FF14 is designed in a way to be self sustaining. They could stop development right now and we would always have 7 years of content to do in some way shape or form. The main issue is the console limitations placed on this MMO and the chip shortage issues.

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Originally Posted by Nothv13

I imagine they will add capacity for Endwalker, just it will never be enough for the reason that you don't over buy servers for a population surge.

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FFXIV had the same servers issues back in 2014...i'm skeptical rn

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Originally Posted by Elissar

FFXIV had the same servers issues back in 2014...i'm skeptical rn

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Pretty much every single MMO release has this issue. It is not some special issue and it is not one that can go away unless you want to spend an extremely wasteful amount of money on servers that will ultimately not be used beyond the initial surge.

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Originally Posted by Nothv13

Pretty much every single MMO release has this issue.

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Thats not true. Nor justifies it if that's the idea.

If they mess up this time with servers, is entirely on the developers and the lack of resourcing flowing from us to the game and instead to the investors. There is nothing more to it.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

We need a game engine upgrade, with better graphics and way less technical limitations. New mmos coming out like pso2 new genesis and new world, ashes of creation are looking a lot more updated. We gotta keep up.

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Who knows...? Once the 6.0 Endwalker tale is concluded, the reward for players could be a transfer to a more graphically upgraded world.

Yoshi is always full of wonderful surprises like that.

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Originally Posted by Alexandre_Noireau

Thats not true. Nor justifies it if that's the idea.

If they mess up this time with servers, is entirely on the developers and the lack of resourcing flowing from us to the game and instead to the investors. There is nothing more to it.

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Servers are a finite resource. Data Center space is a finite resource. If you want full control over your system environment, you purchase servers to accommodate current load, and project the number that are going to be needed in some number of years from now. If you predict things correctly, server acquisition is smooth. If you don't ...

Hypothetically speaking, if you're a multinational corporation, whose primary source of income is not a single video game, you ask those in charge of that part of your corporation that makes video games to provide numbers for annual budgeting. You then factor in cost over time for things like servers and the things associated with running them: electric bills, lighting bills, power and air conditioning bills, data center floorspace charges, network charges (not just in the data center, but worldwide). Did I mention taxes and maintenance?

(We'll skip all the other things you budget for, as it really doesn't make a difference to our hypothetical).

Now, say you've budgeted X dollars, because you've got 8 years of data about how many people play this game, and how the cost per player per month to accommodate them to play simultaneously is a positive number, not a loss, and some projected growth curve based on experience. And lo, another gaming company has made such a complete botch of their current title that their players are seeking someplace else to do pretty much the same thing. They choose your video game.

Whoops!

Have you budgeted for that growth? Nope.
Should you have anticipated that growth? Nope.

What can you do? I refer you to the information provided by the Producer of this game about what they're going to do, and when. Note that the time frame for expansion was projected to be performed over the next two years, rather than prior to the 6.0 expansion, through no fault of SE's budgeting process.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...0acb6c23ccd07f

Another word about that hypothetical company. I don't know where people get the idea that Square Enix's responsibility to stockholders is somehow lower priority than to players of this game. They have to oversee more than just videogames. They develop more video games each year that are not based on the Final Fantasy franchise. The money goes into a big pot called "net sales", not "Final Fantasy 14 sales".

There are over 20 subsidiaries within SE, and I think that publishing the next chapter of Black Butler is almost as important as the next patch release for FFXIV. Your mileage may vary.

they have already said that the graphics upgrade is not a problem of money,
but a problem for the development of the game, because they will have to put a huge amount of resources into it,
to update the engine and therefore change physics system, displays and other obsolete technology,
and most of the work is redoing the thousands of assets in HD, the actual graphics engine is not able without update to support hd assets.

And after this enormous amount of work,
they must ensure that the game runs correctly on all platforms
that there is no majors bugs, and rewrite the source code,
such work would necessarily have an impact on the content of the game .

for the future of the game it is indeed necessary to make a graphic update, and they are currently talking about it only it is not ready to arrive yet,
for the reasons that yoshida has already mentioned several times.

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Originally Posted by Ramesses

Who knows...? Once the 6.0 Endwalker tale is concluded, the reward for players could be a transfer to a more graphically upgraded world.

Yoshi is always full of wonderful surprises like that.

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Thinking like PSO2, just a new expansion world that they build the game off from, while keeping the classic areas 'classic', or like FFXI to FFXIV but connect far more this time (semi-related but not entirely).

Do you think they would keep all the levels and stuff though?

It'd be nice if they'd put more money into the game itself rather than a bunch of promotional items like watches and guitars and darumas. XIV has more than earned the increased budget and the time it'd take to train new staff, just wish higher ups at SE would realize that.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...0acb6c23ccd07f

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An excuse is just that. As pretty as you might put it, is just a excuse.
"The devil doesn't need any more lawyers"


If the servers keep failing and if the service is not properly guaranteed, you just are not doing your work right: As PUBLISHER you must make sure you have the resources to implement and maintain the services you are providing.
If the launch of Endwalkers fails as ARR launch did, this time the "we didn't expected it" excuse won't do, the first time i left it slide because it was a great effort non the less and was a sound argument.

2021 at the fourth expansion, nah my dude, you gotta step it up eventually.

So far we been:

ARR = Bad. (Excused!)
HW = Good. (Relatively low popularity?)
SB = Bad. (Who decided that Raubahn EX was a good idea?)
Shb = Good. (Apparently we learned!)

I hope they truly have learned. We are all watching the sea recede, we know a tsunami is coming. We all know Endwalker will be a massive launch. There is no excuse now.

I want to believe that they will continue to invest in this game. It’s become very important to SE and Yoshi’s methods are gaining popularity. Many of his staff have graduated to new projects and taken his teachings with them. So yes, I believe SE will continue to invest in more people as it will benefit their future.

If they were to add a dozen or more devs, even one hundred, it will take time for them to get up to speed. So any investments now will be seen in 7.x and 8.x

They have already shown that they are willing to dump a lot of money into the game had new servers been available to buy.

This game almost destroyed SE’s future and now it is their most important game for the foreseeable future. There is no doubt in my mind that they will continue to invest in their future.

rest asured that yes, for at least for next10 years or more, yoshi said so. devs have no plan to create another mmo of final fantasy so far. how do i know? He said it in last fanfest online.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

Many of his staff have graduated to new projects and taken his teachings with them.

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Just got a chuckle thinking of everyone at Yoshida, hand on book, in Yoshida we trust.

A-minstrel.

During crunch and you're down to the wire and need a win. WWYD? What would Yoshida do?

;)

I do find the guy very charismatic though, not much of a crier but watching him tear up tears me up sometimes, and as much as it gave me a chuckle I do agree it seems he's been a good influence on the whole (from an outside view at least).

Though ​I hope the internal image is similar to our external one. It would be a little sad "don't meet your heroes" moment if one found out he was like Steve Jobs in the office. . . XD.

I imagine even if they do make a new MMO that this game will be supported multiple years there after just like FFXI, so regardless of what happens I doubt FFXIV is not going to have funding. Of course a big revamp to some core systems could be pretty wonderous too (memory for things like glamour, movement for less awkward space walks, better collision, and fluid feeling moves, and graphical engine improvement). For myself I'm not particular fixed on either one, just hope one of them happens. Both have pros and cons, seems like the latter is safer, while the former is potentially more liberating.

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Originally Posted by ApprenticeSmithy

Honest question. With FFXIV popularity booming as of late, do you think Square Enix will actually put more money into it? Give Yoshi P and team more resources, staff and the like. I would really hope so. Just think of what they could do with more teams, resources and time! Improve Viera and Hrothgar, improve animations (Elezen run anyone?), be able to create more content easier, due to having more people to work on it. Improve textures maybe (HDTexture pack perhaps?).

What do you guys think? Will Square Enix actually do this, or do you think they'll just keep things the way they are? I really do hope they give the FFXIV team more people and resources and the like. They deserve it for all they've done.

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Yoshi-P has spoken elaborately on this. The problems facing FFXIV cannot be solved by throwing more money or staff at it. It is highly unlikely that we are going to see XIV content increase in frequency or depth of features, not due to lack of ability or lack of funding, but rather due to lack of time. In order to maintain the steady patch cycle they have devoted themselves to keeping, they can't massively expand the amount of content per patch.

Think about it. Even if they added staff, and committed them entirely to doing some new and unusual piece of "extra" content, that would be more people for Yoshi-P to supervise, more QA time required, more work meetings, more music for Soken to compose, etc. SE has the money to do this, and there are many talented people who could take up these roles at SE's offices, and they have no end of people who would like to work for them.

But they simply do not have the time to cram more into the game than they already do without creating extensive patch delays.

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Originally Posted by Floortank

Yoshi-P has spoken elaborately on this. The problems facing FFXIV cannot be solved by throwing more money or staff at it. It is highly unlikely that we are going to see XIV content increase in frequency or depth of features, not due to lack of ability or lack of funding, but rather due to lack of time. In order to maintain the steady patch cycle they have devoted themselves to keeping, they can't massively expand the amount of content per patch.

Think about it. Even if they added staff, and committed them entirely to doing some new and unusual piece of "extra" content, that would be more people for Yoshi-P to supervise, more QA time required, more work meetings, more music for Soken to compose, etc. SE has the money to do this, and there are many talented people who could take up these roles at SE's offices, and they have no end of people who would like to work for them.

But they simply do not have the time to cram more into the game than they already do without creating extensive patch delays.

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I keep seeing people that appear to be under the impression that if you just hire more workers, that you can magically add more features to the game.
Especially since we're talking about an MMO, it's way way more complicated than that. Engine upgrades are really complicated, and you need to make sure that whatever you're implementing won't
cause players to lose things that they are earned. There's a lot of content in the game that does need to stay intact for it to continue to work on a fundamental level.
I wish it was as simple as getting a bigger budget and hiring more devs, but it's just not.

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Originally Posted by Commander_Justitia

If the money from mogstation/promotional items would be reinvested into the game, we would have a whole different game by now lmao.

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Word on the street is Mogstation is the only thing in 14 that is fully invested back in the game and a lot of the sub money is used to fund other projects in Squenix. Mogstation was supposedly a big asset in getting EU servers online after HW launch.

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Originally Posted by Gabadabs

I keep seeing people that appear to be under the impression that if you just hire more workers, that you can magically add more features to the game.

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Jepp, it is not really possible. Especially in the software industry. If a software project is delayed adding more developers will delay it further.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks%27s_law


Cheers

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Originally Posted by Alexandre_Noireau

An excuse is just that. As pretty as you might put it, is just a excuse.
"The devil doesn't need any more lawyers"


If the servers keep failing and if the service is not properly guaranteed, you just are not doing your work right: As PUBLISHER you must make sure you have the resources to implement and maintain the services you are providing.
If the launch of Endwalkers fails as ARR launch did, this time the "we didn't expected it" excuse won't do, the first time i left it slide because it was a great effort non the less and was a sound argument.

2021 at the fourth expansion, nah my dude, you gotta step it up eventually.

So far we been:

ARR = Bad. (Excused!)
HW = Good. (Relatively low popularity?)
SB = Bad. (Who decided that Raubahn EX was a good idea?)
Shb = Good. (Apparently we learned!)

I hope they truly have learned. We are all watching the sea recede, we know a tsunami is coming. We all know Endwalker will be a massive launch. There is no excuse now.

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Actually it is called reality, not an excuse. It is a huge waste of money to purchase servers for temporary. You continue to show little to no understanding of both business and the realities when it comes to both coding and server space, let alone current exponentially higher costs and lead times for acquiring that server space.

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Originally Posted by Floortank

Yoshi-P has spoken elaborately on this. The problems facing FFXIV cannot be solved by throwing more money or staff at it. It is highly unlikely that we are going to see XIV content increase in frequency or depth of features, not due to lack of ability or lack of funding, but rather due to lack of time. In order to maintain the steady patch cycle they have devoted themselves to keeping, they can't massively expand the amount of content per patch.

Think about it. Even if they added staff, and committed them entirely to doing some new and unusual piece of "extra" content, that would be more people for Yoshi-P to supervise, more QA time required, more work meetings, more music for Soken to compose, etc. SE has the money to do this, and there are many talented people who could take up these roles at SE's offices, and they have no end of people who would like to work for them.

But they simply do not have the time to cram more into the game than they already do without creating extensive patch delays.

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It would be nice though if we could at least get the same amount of content we’ve gotten prior instead of downgrades seen in this expansion.

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Originally Posted by Nothv13

Actually it is called reality, not an excuse. It is a huge waste of money to purchase servers for temporary. You continue to show little to no understanding of both business and the realities when it comes to both coding and server space, let alone current exponentially higher costs and lead times for acquiring that server space.

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And you continue to show little to no understanding of what a service is.
There is no such thing as a waste of money when it comes to provide a good service for all your customers. A stable, fluid, service.
If the cost of such thing is considered a "waste" because it wouldn't profitable: Then the game and company must close and dedicate their careers to something else. Thats called being a professional.

You deliver or you don't. Make up all the excuses about "reality" you want, at the end of the day, they are just that: Excuses.


If Endwalker face severe server issues: Thats SE and Yoshida's F A U L T - Thus i expect compensation for it: Free Subscription days will do.
And i hope they recive all the good flak for it if it happens because we have all SEEN it coming. Unlike ARR.

In the end that post of Yoshida seems more and more like a bad excuse -as if a excuse wasn't good enough already, there are bad ones too!- a excuse before the fault.

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Originally Posted by Floortank

Yoshi-P has spoken elaborately on this. The problems facing FFXIV cannot be solved by throwing more money or staff at it. It is highly unlikely that we are going to see XIV content increase in frequency or depth of features, not due to lack of ability or lack of funding, but rather due to lack of time. In order to maintain the steady patch cycle they have devoted themselves to keeping, they can't massively expand the amount of content per patch.

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But what about the time saved from things being removed? No hildy, less dungeons, no Ultimate, consolidated Job/craft quests, no new deep dungeon. I know Covid has played a part but everything just seems lighter.

Where there's a will there's a way. I think a lot of people are far to prone to buy into excuses as to why X, Y and Z supposedly cannot happen so long as that excuse has been dressed up 'nicely'.

Let's not beat around the bush - the game has decided to embrace some strange priorities at a time when it is supposedly so strained for time and resources.

It'll be interesting to see how things proceed with the development in the future. Once the recent influx of new players are all caught up with what is on offer, there's going to be greater demand for things to do once the MSQ's are complete. Furthermore, it is a reasonable expectation for each new expansion to be bigger and bolder than what came before it.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Where there's a will there's a way. I think a lot of people are far to prone to buy into excuses as to why X, Y and Z supposedly cannot happen so long as that excuse has been dressed up 'nicely'.

Let's not beat around the bush - the game has decided to embrace some strange priorities at a time when it is supposedly so strained for time and resources.

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No it is just a reality. Throwing money and people at a problem doesn't mean it will be solved quicker. Nor is that really smart when it comes to business. Further decisions like expanding server resources tend to be planned out quite far ahead.

The decision to prioritize stuff other than expanding servers was made before the recent influx. This priority will not change to the immediate, though may be pushed up a bit.

To be blunt, it is unrealistic for them to just shift gears immediately like people think they can. Add in the current chip shortage caused lead times and there is no way for them to just switch priority.