Guide to fixing PLD

I'd honestly like to know how the PLD's here gearing up for DEX/VIT/MND/Block/Etc are keeping hate against Melee/BLM's that get 100+ DPS on boss fights.

PLD can tank everything in the game, this is a given. However, they are pretty much useless when your party has HIGHLY capabable Melee/BLM DPS. Before you even say it, don't give me the "Well hold back dumb melees" argument, that is just a horrible concept that was only used in FFXI.

To "fix" PLD they need to do 3 things IMO:

1) Increase amount of enmity gained from actions, maybe give them some trait that will let them receive more enmity from Voke/Flash/Etc over a WAR.

2) Change the way their cures work, too many times you are either Sileneced/Paralyzed/Stunned/Knockbacked/Made to run or move, making it harder for PLDs to effectively use their healing skills. Like it has been suggested, instant cast Holy Succor would be pretty nice.

3) Increase their DPS capability. Yoshi-P already stated there will be modifications to PLD DPS which is nice, I doubt it'll be enough though. Having higher DPS WILL increase your enmity, much more than increasing your damage mitigation will.

The problem I see whenever we have someone try to tank on PLD is that they can't keep hate off our Melee/BLM. It is NEVER a problem keeping hate off of WHMs, which is why I feel gearing for Damage Mitigation is almost pointless. I can only see a "turtle tank" PLD working if they make their Actions/Cures give an exorbitant amount of enmity, while also making Boss mobs have extremely high Def/M.Eva.

To "fix" PLD, they need to focus on enhancing enmity generation, rather than damage mitigation, simply put.

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Originally Posted by Rexus

To "fix" PLD, they need to focus on enhancing enmity generation, rather than damage mitigation, simply put.

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Focusing on just one aspect that needs attention won't make PLD any more viable than if they solely focused on damage mitigation, because in the end if PLD can't do both they have no advantages over WAR or can't keep up with hate control and both aspects are still somewhat lacking even though they've improved.

hmm, hate control isnt hard. again, realy dont mean to insult anyones inteligence, but If you cant keep hate in a boss fight on PLD Im not sure why... onlything that comes to mind is if the PLD is using simple af gear and everyone else (dd) have invested into their gear... or the PLD just is clueless about how to play the job. Honestly if WAR is the only job you can tank on then stick to it, but to proclaim that PLD cant tank just because YOU personally can not do it is ignorant. Anyways when we get the opertunity to get everyone out there , gona try to take garuda with 6 wars 1pld as main tank and a whm.

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Originally Posted by SwordCoheir

Focusing on just one aspect that needs attention won't make PLD any more viable than if they solely focused on damage mitigation, because in the end if PLD can't do both they have no advantages over WAR or can't keep up with hate control and both aspects are still somewhat lacking even though they've improved.

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Right, but what I was saying is that I don't think PLD has the need for anymore damage mitigation to make them useful. Sure, it would be nice, but it isn't really harder to keep a PLD up over a WAR. If they had better enmity generation, that'd be the advantage you would think about using over a WAR. Use a tank that can produce great enmity and lower DPS, or one that can produce good enmity and good DPS?

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Originally Posted by Aceofspades

hmm, hate control isnt hard. again, realy dont mean to insult anyones inteligence, but If you cant keep hate in a boss fight on PLD Im not sure why... onlything that comes to mind is if the PLD is using simple af gear and everyone else (dd) have invested into their gear... or the PLD just is clueless about how to play the job. Honestly if WAR is the only job you can tank on then stick to it, but to proclaim that PLD cant tank just because YOU personally can not do it is ignorant. Anyways when we get the opertunity to get everyone out there , gona try to take garuda with 6 wars 1pld as main tank and a whm.

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Like I said before, I'd like to know what people are doing to keep hate on Miser/Coincounter/Chimera using PLD when their DPS are very well geared and pushing as hard as they can. Yes, PLD can keep hate fine on Ogre, Batraal, Ifrit, and sometimes Moogle. Those cases are different from what I'm asking though, as they all contain transitional phases that lower overall DPS of your Melee/BLMs and let the tank produce more Enmity.

Also, if you haven't already, I'd refrain from using your 6 WAR Garuda strat...

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Originally Posted by Aceofspades

Yes PLD needs to land its attacks, no acc shouldnt be on the priority list. top 5 should always be def>vit>mind>block>hp, sounds more like reaching for excuses to justify replacing tank stats for dps stats.

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Right now, it's more like Enmity = HP = Acc >>> MND > everything else.

When PLD got Atonement in FFXI, managing hate became all about having high accuracy and haste gear to reduce cooldowns and get to 100 TP asap.

Similarly, because Flat Blade has such a powerful enmity bonus and low cooldown, I feel like the optimal method of holding hate on PLD will be getting that 1000 TP to spam the Flat Blade combo as much possible in between your other combos and ability cooldowns. You should never be in a situation where you have more TP than you know what to do with. To maximize TP gain, you will need Accuracy.

Turtle-style tank has never been viable in an efficient party. This game puts too much emphasis on landing combos while defensive stats have minimal returns. The only time a full on defensive build is useful is when you're just running through darkhold or strongholds and training everything.

If you ever try to tank Garuda on PLD without accuracy gear, you will see first-hand just how crippling missing all your combos can be.

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Originally Posted by kro

Right now, it's more like Enmity = HP = Acc >>> MND > everything else.

When PLD got Atonement in FFXI, managing hate became all about having high accuracy and haste gear to reduce cooldowns and get to 100 TP asap.

Similarly, because Flat Blade has such a powerful enmity bonus and low cooldown, I feel like the optimal method of holding hate on PLD will be getting that 1000 TP to spam the Flat Blade combo as much possible in between your other combos and ability cooldowns. You should never be in a situation where you have more TP than you know what to do with. To maximize TP gain, you will need Accuracy.

Turtle-style tank has never been viable in an efficient party. This game puts too much emphasis on landing combos while defensive stats have minimal returns. The only time a full on defensive build is useful is when you're just running through darkhold or strongholds and training everything.

If you ever try to tank Garuda on PLD without accuracy gear, you will see first-hand just how crippling missing all your combos can be.

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hmm Garuda seemed more magic resistant then actuall physical damage. Thus the reason I wana try with 6 war in a DPS set up. as far as acuracy and tp gose, I dont have any ACC gear at all, never have an issue landing combos in a timely manner or gaining enough TP do soo for that matter. And personaly I never stack HP over anything , it just dosent make any sense. Here people complain about block rate an how effective it isn't yet they stack HP, you realize, if you stack def/vit , even if you did block, you wouldnt notice much a differance. I use devine veil for two reasons, combo with out manuver or stone skin. As far as magical damage gose, if my rampart/sentinel/and or stone skin is not up in time, then my whm may actually be needed for more then just regen / buffs or simple cures. Only tank that NEEDs accuracy is WAR and even they do well with low acc gear.

I agree with damage reduction. WAR seems to have the monopoly on high HP.

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Originally Posted by heit

I agree with damage reduction. WAR seems to have the monopoly on high HP.

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as of now they do, after 2.2b pld should actually have more due to its naturally higher vit and access to max hp like war.

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Originally Posted by Aceofspades

hmm Garuda seemed more magic resistant then actuall physical damage. Thus the reason I wana try with 6 war in a DPS set up. as far as acuracy and tp gose, I dont have any ACC gear at all, never have an issue landing combos in a timely manner or gaining enough TP do soo for that matter. And personaly I never stack HP over anything , it just dosent make any sense. Here people complain about block rate an how effective it isn't yet they stack HP, you realize, if you stack def/vit , even if you did block, you wouldnt notice much a differance. I use devine veil for two reasons, combo with out manuver or stone skin. As far as magical damage gose, if my rampart/sentinel/and or stone skin is not up in time, then my whm may actually be needed for more then just regen / buffs or simple cures. Only tank that NEEDs accuracy is WAR and even they do well with low acc gear.

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Garuda is about as resistant to damage and m.damage as Ifrit, the main issue is she has high evasion/m.evasion making it easier for her to reduce the overall damage dealt to her. The Razor Plumes she summons as well as one of the clones (Chidara I think) are resistant to magic making it impractical for 5-6x BLM parties like in the past, however it's still relatively doable with some experienced and well geared players, since getting her to Ariel Blast ASAP is necessary for survival. GLA/PLD might have less issues in the Acc department due to the high-acc nature of some of their TP moves, however overall they still have the same fundamental Acc issues as any other jobs, it's just slightly less noticeable in some cases.

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Originally Posted by SwordCoheir

Garuda is about as resistant to damage and m.damage as Ifrit, the main issue is she has high evasion/m.evasion making it easier for her to reduce the overall damage dealt to her. The Razor Plumes she summons as well as one of the clones (Chidara I think) are resistant to magic making it impractical for 5-6x BLM parties like in the past, however it's still relatively doable with some experienced and well geared players, since getting her to Ariel Blast ASAP is necessary for survival. GLA/PLD might have less issues in the Acc department due to the high-acc nature of some of their TP moves, however overall they still have the same fundamental Acc issues as any other jobs, it's just slightly less noticeable in some cases.

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Oh , well thank you for the insite, will take that into account when developing a strat after patch. BTW, dose anyone know if we can find out the raw stats of the boss mobs. Reason I am asking is my goal is to match my raw VIT with their raw STR and my DEF with their ATK, I belive this will make taking damage on the bosses stupid easy, just need to know their raw stats to know where to set my goals. TY for any info on this subject.