Incentivize More People to Queue for Leveling Dungeons

As long as lvl sync and stat squashing are a thing, you'd have to do something major for me to want to run the leveling roulette.

I play mmos to progress doing anything that takes stats and levels away doesn't make sense to me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nims

As long as lvl sync and stat squashing are a thing, you'd have to do something major for me to want to run the leveling roulette.

I play mmos to progress doing anything that takes stats and levels away doesn't make sense to me.

---

Heck you can be in lvl 80 content, in lvl 80 gear, with lvl 80 appropriate melds but if you outlevel the sync by ONE ilvl, every meld in that piece is gone.

It's an asinine system.

They really need to figure out a way to sync melds down.

Got a pentamelded 450/460? Sucks to be you if you're in Amaurot. You just lost ~240 substats per piece

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by linay

A queue time for 10-15 minutes for a leveling dungeon is fine. I queue for 1-2 hours almost daily for alliance raid/roulette.

---

That sounds like a lot. Do you have your duty finder language set to "all languages"? It can affect queue times a lot. Or is that normal for alliance roulette on your data centre?

Hmm , I have no problem queuing it as a tank.

It's mostly insta pop.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Iscah

That sounds like a lot. Do you have your duty finder language set to "all languages"? It can affect queue times a lot. Or is that normal for alliance roulette on your data centre?

---

When I created this character for this expansion, I chose not to unlock ARR and HW alliance raids, so I only have the three Ivalice raids and the one Yorha raid for the roulette. Still, I've been able to do the roulette almost every day, mostly as DPS, but sometimes even as Tank as well, so it's all good.

During Stormblood, when I had everything unlocked on my previous character, it was usually almost instant to about 15 minutes for DPS, maybe 10-30 minutes for Tank, and most of the time I got ARR raid.

SE has done two things in the past to incentivize levelling roulette.
The Adventurer in Need bonus - but by now, the gil reward is tiny, and the materia7 crystals often aren't even worth converting.
At 80, making poetics and goetia tomestones valuable. But with other methods rewarding more tomestones for less investment - and Eureka removing the relic weapons tomestone from the game - there's little reason to care about these past the 1st or 2nd week of each patch. Their use in crafting doesn't cut it.

Myself, I'd suggest following the tank-mount model, and give out rewards for completing X levelling roulettes while at level 80; or Y levelling roulettes as an adventurer-in-need. Something cosmetic - a mount, glamour, title.

I like doing leveling roulette. If I also need quick gil(haha), I'll jump on whatever is "in need".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Iscah

That sounds like a lot. Do you have your duty finder language set to "all languages"? It can affect queue times a lot. Or is that normal for alliance roulette on your data centre?

---

I think they changed it where that has 0 effect on queues now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rasikko

I think they changed it where that has 0 effect on queues now.

---

I've heard that it was changed specifically for leveling roulette, but not other roulettes.

I got someone the other night who said he'd been queuing for over an hour to get in Snowcloak, which sounds improbably slow even for the 50/60/70 roulette, and it had gathered an all-English-speaking party (a rarity on the JP servers). So it definitely still seems to be in effect for that roulette at least.


Edit: Forgot to say - in this particular case it would be because linay hadn't unlocked the earlier roulettes, rather than an issue with the system, which is going to cut down the amount of people available to be paired up with them. I assume they have to reach the very top of the queue before the system starts gathering players eligible for the Lv70 raids.

I am of the opinion that letting people level up different jobs than they enter the roulette with might be the best solution for more balanced queue times.

Also the adventure in need bonus could be changed so that the daily reward can be received repeatedly.

I actually think awarding EXP for the "adventurer in need" bonus could be counterproductive - at least on the assumption that the majority of players will level all classes. Constant bonuses for tanks and healers means that they need less roulettes than a DPS class to gain the same amount of EXP.

Additionally, there are proportionately more DPS classes than there are tanks and healers - ie. if you had one player of each class and divide them up into parties of tank/healer/2xDPS, you'll have DPSes left over.

In short, the system is set up to require you to do more leveling roulettes as DPS than as tank and healer combined, even before you approach the fact that tanks level faster AND less people want to play them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by linay

When I created this character for this expansion, I chose not to unlock ARR and HW alliance raids, so I only have the three Ivalice raids and the one Yorha raid for the roulette. Still, I've been able to do the roulette almost every day, mostly as DPS, but sometimes even as Tank as well, so it's all good.

During Stormblood, when I had everything unlocked on my previous character, it was usually almost instant to about 15 minutes for DPS, maybe 10-30 minutes for Tank, and most of the time I got ARR raid.

---

That's probably why it takes so long for you. I have everything unlocked and Alliance roulette often takes 15 minutes, but I get LotA nine times out of ten.

I tend to avoid the leveling roulette these days except when the healer in need bonus is active and even then I hem and haw about it because I already have a ton of combat materia with many options to get more. I'd be more inclined to run it if it gave non-combat materia tokens or something else useful. As they are right now though, its too much of a gamble for me to take my higher level (but not max) dps jobs into the leveling roulette only to get saddled with one of the less desirable dungeons. I level my tanks via beast tribe or, less often, trust dungeons, because I really don't like being in a leadership position or melee frankly.

If we had a new healing job to level I would be running the leveling roulette every day because healing is what I enjoy doing most in FFXIV. Sadly there are no new healing jobs in Shadowbringers and I have all the current healing jobs maxed. Tanking incentives don't work on me. Healing incentives do, but there's no real shortage of people willing to heal so there's less opportunity for such incentives to be offered. DPS jobs are often too complex for me to do well with in FFXIV, and as I mentioned earlier, I am really not a fan of melee. About the only ones I really excel at (and I use the term "excel" loosely) are RDM and BRD, so once those and the healers are maxed, that's really it for my incentive to run the leveling roulette. I end up just leveling other jobs via beast tribes or trusts for the sake of having them leveled. The other rewards offered by it just aren't enticing enough for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lodi

That's probably why it takes so long for you. I have everything unlocked and Alliance roulette often takes 15 minutes, but I get LotA nine times out of ten.

---

Funny, I got almost everything unlocked (except the lvl 80 ones), I did it the other day after years, and it took me 30+ mins to get in as adventurer in need, and I got Mhach. I was actually hoping for LoTA since it's been so long.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Treat your groups better. If I run Trust, it isn't for the rewards or efficiency. It's already far slower than a real group. You can throw whatever exp, tomes, materia that you like at leveling dungeons, but I'll likely avoid it because a Trust will never tell you to kill yourself, tell you to uninstall, kick you to bring a friend in, complain you pull too fast, pull too slow, pull for you, refuse to play properly, threaten to report you for advice, refuse to dps as healer, refuse to heal as healer, leave tank stance off and so on.

The incentive is there to run dungeons. Other players are the disincentive.

---

Wow I never had all those stuff to happen.
I did get randomnly kicked by a group of friends who was AFKing through the whole Castrum once though, but it was once.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Iscah

Edit: Forgot to say - in this particular case it would be because linay hadn't unlocked the earlier roulettes, rather than an issue with the system, which is going to cut down the amount of people available to be paired up with them. I assume they have to reach the very top of the queue before the system starts gathering players eligible for the Lv70 raids.

---

Interestingly enough, the majority of the time that I get in, I would see people claiming that they're new, which makes me think that people queueing for a specific duty in a roulette is a more determinant factor. Without them, my queue times would be even longer than it already is. It also amazes me that there are plenty of people newly running old optional content, whether it's a truly new player or even an alt.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lodi

That's probably why it takes so long for you. I have everything unlocked and Alliance roulette often takes 15 minutes, but I get LotA nine times out of ten.

---

Yep, I'm aware of that. It was a deliberate choice on my part.

Anyways, back to the topic, that's why I don't think there is any problem with leveling roulette. People say in this thread that they have no incentive to use leveling roulette, but plenty of people use it and I've always been able to when I need it on a reasonable queue time as DPS.

The problem isn't really incentivizing roulettes more than they already do; tanks get free mounts, healers and tanks get the adventurer-in-need bonus when applicable, they have a higher chance of more comms, etc. The problem is just A) too many people queue as damage dealers who don't want to tank or heal, and B) when applying to anything but Expert roulette, you risk losing all of the abilities you've been obtaining since you started your class, which just feels bad. These skills aren't even enhancements, they're integral to the job and make the playing feel so incomplete. For example, Gunbreakers get their Gnashing Fang combo at 60 and Continuation at 70. If I jump into roulette and get, say, The Vault, I'm stuck with a job that, under normal circumstances, feels fast-paced and dynamic, but now feels like a slog because I'm lacking the core burst combo that I'm suppose to have to make the job feel even somewhat fun. Even if I get into a SB leveling dungeon, I'm missing Continuation, a core mechanic of the class that gives it its fast pace.

Right now I have 5-6 jobs that I intend to get to 80, but I refuse to go into leveling or alliance roulette with any of them just because I lose my skills by virtue of being level sync'd down. God forbid I get Sastasha or Copperbell for the thousandth time and am stuck to using 2-3 buttons the entire dungeon.

I’m finding little reason to run leveling roulette or 50/60/70. I’ve been leveling everything to 80 and I only have two tank classes left. I got DRK to 70 through HOH since I don’t particularly like playing that job. I was leveling WAR through the roulettes but since it’s below 70 it doesn’t get any of the materia rewards and since I constantly get dungeons under level 60 it doesn’t count for the mount. I’ve gotten nothing but HW dungeons that I honestly don’t remember if any other dungeons exist.

And when I do get that one non-HW dungeon I gotta go through my head what skills everybody in the group has and whether wall-pulls are a go, and of course you get someone who pulls ahead of you or doesn’t want to wait for the healer and other DPS to catch up. Tanking is so thankless, everybody wants wall-to-wall but then you get a DPS who never AoEs and a healer who never DPS. Tanks get called out for pulling too much or pulling too little, but man, never call out the non-dps healer or non-AoE dps.

Whatever, HOH and beast tribes to get WAR to 70. My DRK is level 74 and PLD was maxed with pixie quests and daily hunts. It’s slow but better for my sanity.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KalinOrthos

The problem isn't really incentivizing roulettes more than they already do; tanks get free mounts, healers and tanks get the adventurer-in-need bonus when applicable, they have a higher chance of more comms, etc. The problem is just A) too many people queue as damage dealers who don't want to tank or heal, and B) when applying to anything but Expert roulette, you risk losing all of the abilities you've been obtaining since you started your class, which just feels bad.

---

It is not just that. I personally don't have a problem with losing abilities when I queue for roulettes, but I'm not doing them because I feel the current rewards are just not worth it. I'm perfectly fine getting Sastasha in a Leveling Roulette, but only if I felt it was worth my time.

Currently the Daily Roulette rewards are the following:

• XP? Multiple other sources many with comparable XP/Time rates while also giving out other rewards that I am more interested in.
• Gil? It is a nice bonus but not a primary reason to run content.
• GC Seals? Gear turn ins far outweigh the paltry amount of Seals given by the Leveling and Guildhest roulettes. A single Trust run of the Grand Cosmos would give far more.
• Poetics? I already have full sets of i130, i270 and i400 gear and weapons for all jobs. Also a large number of alternative sources.
• Goetia? Locked to level 80 jobs and A and S rank hunts give plenty.
• Phantasmagoria? Same as Goetia, but cap out quickly.
• Stellaclusters and Planiclusters? A and S rank Hunts are a better source.

Phantasmagoria is the primary reason to do Roulettes at 80 but it is really easy to cap them out. 5 days of Expert Roulettes will do so or 2 days if you do every roulette but Mentor that gives Phantasm out. This is not even accounting for other sources of Phantasm like Beast Tribes (Pixies give 15 a day for 105 each week), A/S rank hunts and Maps. Someone who has either all 80s or only feels like leveling a few jobs to 80 currently has little reason to do roulettes once they cap Phantasm.

My suggestion on how to improve the roulette rewards:

• After reaching level 71 the several Roulettes should give out between 10 and 20 Bicolor Gemstones as part of their daily reward. This will still maintain FATEs as the primary source of Bicolor Gemstones, but give another incentive to run them.
• At level 80, a daily quest in Elumore or Crystarium would give out a Unique tradable solo Map that can be listed on the marketboard for completing a random non-Mentor/Frontline/Guildhest roulette. Map rewards would contain standard map rewards and a chance of getting a rare Unhidden Zonsureskin Map with a 100% of summoning a portal to Lyhe Ghiah.