Alphinaud

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Originally Posted by Claymore65

I remember when Conrad threw all the death flags he could, and declared Lyse as the one to take over his position as leader of the resistance. I could only think "Why?" Lyse didn't have the most leadership experience, M'Naago seemed to be his second-in-command.

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Very well put. I can't help but think this Conrad part of the story has some world history influence/perspective. It's not a modern-way thinking, but it has culture-bias for a very specific era. Way back after WW2 ended, there were many emerging new countries. Think of Ala Mhigo like one of those countries, divided land with many parts. "Where do we go from here?", that's the first question. I have no doubt M'naago would be a good leader, but she can't answer that as she spends her life in Ala Mhigo, just same as those youths who refused us/rebellions when we first got there. It's not about knowing your people, it's about building a nation. Nobody goes to president/king school, they just learn it on the job. Like the WW2 countries, Ala Mhigo needed a leader with connections and can make a starting point. Raubahn would make excellent choice too, but this was before he left Immortal Flames. Lyse is fine for a transitional leader as she can start things right away, and iirc Ala Mhigo choose to be a country with representatives so they'll have more leaders in the say. Including possibly Raubahn taking that position.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Alphinaud's great, though. Out of all of the Scions he undergoes the most drastic and meaningful character development.

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Brilliantly said, mate... brilliantly said. +1

I've mentioned a few times why I firmly believe Alphinaud is an excellent character... and once again, I'll reiterate that he actually got my respect back when both he and Aliasie helped us during the Coil story arc.

He has gone through his own trials and keeps evolving... even though he is Sensei Louisoix's grandson, he has repeatedly shown fortitude in securing his own achievements on his own rather than using the family name to just get by; and this is something I deeply admire because I can personally identify with that.

His mental perception, temperance and brilliance is exceptional... as I have said once before, he has a kind of Beautiful Mind when it comes to politics and it's great to see his progressive character development.

I honestly wish people would give him more credit.

Do you know who Alphinaud’s GrandFather is/was?

I can understand that it might be a bit annoying if you dislike the character but since we cant "speak" we need someone that does it and this is kinda Alphinauds place.

I am quite happy about that because he is one of the very few characters left that I really like and he feels like a little brother to my WoL. So hopefully he is one of those that will be with us till the end and even make it throught that.

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Originally Posted by ObsidianFire

The point of the difference between Yda's and Lyse's character was the Lyse was essentially pretending to be "someone else" the entire time we knew her. That someone else is "Yda". Once Papalymo dies, Lyse finds out everyone knew she wasn't Yda anyway.

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Well, almost everybody.

One of the big problems for me with having her be the main NPC of Stormblood is what her story arc says about the Scions and their relationship to the Warrior of Light. All of the Scions, apparently, knew that she wasn't Yda, which makes sense because unless they were completely identical twins, anyone who knew one would realize something was off. However, at no point did the Scions see fit to mention that to the WoL. I started in Limsa, so that kind of makes sense, but a WoL who started in Gridania, who supposedly knew Yda and Papalymo, never knew about the deception either. Especially after doing the 30-50 DRK quests, Lyse's deception and the fact that the rest of the Scions knew but never told the WoL, only reinforces the idea that they see us as the Weapon of Light, to be taken out and pointed at whatever primal happens to show up and then ignored until the next crisis. Lyse lied to us, and the other Scions were okay with that, and then we have to basically babysit her through Stormblood.

Omg SE why you have to go do what ya did in the 1st half of 4.5? I need an adult!

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Originally Posted by Songwillow

So you think it is a programming design restriction more than anything else? If that is the case, that is unfortunate.

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Not a programming restriction - a narrative restriction. Basically, the writers had to decide whether they wanted to keep the writing so vague that you could do any content in any order and it would still make chronological sense. This would, for example, require characters to treat you as if meeting you for the first time EVERY TIME THEY MEET YOU, if they appear in multiple sidequests. Instead, the designers decided to write the content so that, whenever you actually do it, it is assumed to happen alongside the content that was added at the same time.

Whether you do Binding Coil or Stormblood first, Binding Coil is considered to come chronologically first. The silent assumption made when doing any old content is that it is assumed to take place in the past. This was first highlighted at the end of ARR, when Nanamo was seemingly dead - and yet you could still serve her a banquet during the ARR CUL quests. Even if you were only getting around to leveling CUL after completing the 2.55 MSQ, it's still understood that the events you're witnessing ACTUALLY take place around the same time as 2.0 MSQs.

So, Alisae isn't going back to wearing her old clothes when you run Coil. You're just witnessing events from the past, when she still dressed like her brother.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

My issue with Lyse is that her naivety and stupidity led to a number of people getting Tempered.

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I presume you're speaking of Lakshmi's summoning at the leadership meeting? You're not giving her nearly enough credit. The text dialogue made it crystal clear that all involved - INCLUDING Lyse - expected the Qyalana might try something. They took proper precautions, confiscated their crystals, and so on and so forth. The Qyalana outmaneuvered them, but that doesn't indicate any sort of naivety or stupidity.

If you're arguing that the very concept of peace with the tempered is absurd, I disagree. Peace, at least a temporary peace, is VERY MUCH something that can be beneficial to the tempered (gives them time to consolidate their resources, and such), so it's entirely reasonable to assume that the Qyalana were genuine in their desire to have it. Tempered aren't mindless and endlessly predictable. They can strategize and prepare (heck, they wouldn't have pulled off the betrayal that they did without careful forethought). For the Alliance's part, having the Qyalana behave themselves for a while would have been very beneficial; the Garleans are a serious problem, and the more resources they could bring to bear against them, the better.

So, no, inviting the Qyalana was not naive or stupid. It was tactically desirable so as not to divide the Alliance's forces, and had a reasonable chance of being genuine since the Qyalana benefit as well (plus, refusing them would have given the Qyalana an excuse to step up hostilities). Measures were taken to guard against treachery, and even thought they turned out to be inadequate due to insufficient intelligence regarding enemy activities, they still imply the Alliance knew the risks of what they were dealing with.

Lyse is not my favorite character, to be sure, but holding this against her is quite unfair.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

What I would like to avoid is getting a "NPC from there" leading 5.0 MSQ (namely what we got with Lyse). It was ok for Stormblood, but I don't want for instance Cid as a main MSQ buddy for 5.0 if we go to Garlemald for instance. I prefer the outcast/lonely feeling we had in Heavensward. But it's just a matter of taste I guess :)

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We had Estinien in HW though...

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Originally Posted by burpinflyz

Do you know who Alphinaud’s GrandFather is/was?

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*(Raises a quizzical eyebrow)*

Do I know who Louisoix the Valiant is/was? I'm the bloody Warrior of Light and his most spiffily ardent student who has "avenged" him sevenfold per the conclusions in the Coil story arc. I've ran missions for him when I should have been celebrating Starlight...

https://i.imgur.com/kEOvcVn.jpg

And was with him till the end prior to Bahamut being unleashed at Carteneau...

https://i.imgur.com/1iXMYV1.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/6USY6gd.jpg


Perhaps the question should be do you know who he is?

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Originally Posted by Alleo

...And he feels like a little brother to my WoL.

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Is that not Yoshi's quote from the interview back in 2017 regarding his choice of adding Alphinaud as a protagonist in NT Dissidia?

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Originally Posted by DarthSanguine

We had Estinien in HW though...

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True. And I could not really explain why it did not bother me that much (same for Aymeric and Haurchefant). Maybe just because they are better characters than Lyse ;D

I feel like the characters in Heavensward had more actual character to them. They had their own goals and personalities, sometimes at odds with each other.

I would have to go through Stormblood again to be sure, but I feel like our companions spent a lot more time telling us our next quest objective than talking about their own thoughts on things.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I feel like the characters in Heavensward had more actual character to them. They had their own goals and personalities, sometimes at odds with each other.

I would have to go through Stormblood again to be sure, but I feel like our companions spent a lot more time telling us our next quest objective than talking about their own thoughts on things.

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Well, if we were talking about characters in general from both expansions, I'd say I like the SB ones better (particularly the antagonists), except Lyse, who I don't really care about, but in terms of traveling companions, I'd agree that the dynamics between Estinien, Ysaile and Alphinaud was much more interesting than what we had with the SB traveling companions. I'd say it's not really that characters lack personality as much as they don't complement each other's as well as the HW team. I think Hien, Gosetsu and Yugiri have cool personalities, but those personalities are almost never at odds with each other and the other WoL companions, so there's not a team dynamic as interesting as the HW one.

Maybe not to us or around us as much but to and with each other there was a lot of that. Gosetsu and Hien at the Mol dinner, Lyse and Hien while we were made to go check out Sadu, the drinking scene that we get invited to. Then there's the Yugiri really wanting Zeno dead bit that allowed us a peak into how her mind works as she walks the line of the good shinobi/servant watching from afar but once in awhile seeming to want to be closer.