SE, the concept of "Limited Jobs" is a really bad idea, turn back now

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Originally Posted by Acidblood

So basically you never want them to do anything new? Just stuff every job into one of the extremely limited DPS / Tank / Healer boxes that 'group play' (specifically raiding) in FFXIV demands.

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The entire concept of final fantasy has always been about group play. Taking a group and destroying giant monsters for various world saving reasons. I also think it's a bit inaccurate to refer to the archetypes as a limiting factor. By setting the specific roles, it allows them to create a solid structure to work around and iterate upon. So yes, every job should be a dps or a tank or a healer but that doesn't mean they shouldn't try new and interesting ways to change up the moment to moment gameplay to make it fun and engaging. I honestly don't think the very clear role and archetype structure is a weakness.

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Originally Posted by SDaemon

Yoshi in an interview mentioned; "With the Trust system, these players can experience the story of Final Fantasy XIV and learn party dynamics by playing with their favorite NPCs. Then, once they feel ready, they can shift into playing with other people. The challenge level of content using Trusts will steadily rise, and so it will not always be the easiest option to play with them exclusively."

Seems odd if they restrict it to Shadowbringer content if part of the purpose is to expose players to party dynamics. By the time a player gets to Shadowbringer content if they haven't been exposed to and learned party dynamics something has functionally gone awry.

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They specifically mentioned Trusts will be Shadowbringer only upon initial. While I imagine this will change at some point, they aren't exactly swift.

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Originally Posted by Acidblood

Again, do you really want those jobs in name only?

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Better they not bother at all and put those resources into something that will see far more use. Call me a cynic, however I fully anticipate Blue Mage being Hildebrand-esuqe, which sees updates every odd patch. Regardless, they could implement any of those jobs if they showed come creativity. Say what you will about Red Mage, but they did a pretty solid job making it work. The recent addition of Bahamut could mean positive things for Summoner if they continued down that trend. There is no reason they couldn't make Blue Mage work even if it's not precisely how other games did it. As for keeping Blue Mage restricted. This whole "Limited Job" nonsense implies it will, indeed, stay forever restricted. If they can't balance it for raids, then they aren't going to allow it into Roulettes. It'll just stay a side activity.

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Originally Posted by Granyala

I'm afraid I have to agree here.
The whole concept of people arbitrarily being locked out just doesn't make any sense in an MMO.

Rework BLU (yes that means somewhat limiting it) and make it a proper class people can have fun with in endgame (which is the content that actually matters for most players).

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Masked Carnivale is Blue Mage's endgame. It's not endgame raiding, but that doesn't disqualify it.

It will probably be playable with party raids etc in the next expansion when it hits level 80?. Just my good guess.

I mean, blue mage really isn’t for solo players because you will need pre formed groups to access content to unlock skills. Not really sure who this job is aimed at tbh, because it’s not great for very social players or for those who like to lone wolf content. Just being able to queue for things in duty finder is much easier. Being forced into trying to use party finder to get the most of this “solo job” just sounds annoying to me tbh. I too wish they had just done whatever they needed to do to make this a real job.

But hey, people are always complaining about just getting the same old stuff over and over, so this is a bit different. I’m a boring creature of habit and am giving this the one eyebrow raise at the moment, but I’m still interested to see how it actually is once it comes out. Continuing to release limited jobs like this doesn’t seem like something they’d be able to sustain the game on, so I doubt this is going to become the new norm to the exclusion of all else.

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

If you're getting carried, it wouldn't take many people. If you're doing it all at level, sure you may need to line things up a little more. But then there's also things like friends? Linkshells? Human interaction?
And, for the record, I'm loving how the thought that it's a solo class is falling apart here. Their endgame is solo, the build up is collaborative.

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The build up for blue mage is sitting on your hands for 2-6 minutes as a red mage nukes whatever you want an attack from and not being able to stand on its own feet in group play for 49 levels, not very collaborative.

What human interaction are you poking at? For this game the average human interaction for duties is saying hi and maybe thanks for the run due to party finder description getting the point solidly across for blue mage. And if its with your friends then interaction was already there.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

They specifically mentioned Trusts will be Shadowbringer only upon initial. While I imagine this will change at some point, they aren't exactly swift.

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You know when that was mentioned specifically? Playing back videos now and didn't see it on the live reddit update. Seems contradictory to his interview answer.

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Originally Posted by Rysir

The build up for blue mage is sitting on your hands for 2-6 minutes as a red mage nukes whatever you want an attack from and not being able to stand on its own feet in group play for 49 levels, not very collaborative.

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If you want to just get carried, that's on you. Nothing's stopping you from finding people willing to do things at level. Though that you assume the job will be non functional for 49 levels tells me you don't really care in the first place.

Inna words of a great sage, "I expect nothing, and I'm still let down".

I see BLU as less a job and more some interesting side content. Banding together as BLU in a group, some taking skills to be a tank, some as healer and some as DPS, farming for enemy skills and having some cool, really hard single player arena battles in the end sounds actually really nice. This has a lot of potential imo.

I haven't read most of the posts in this thread yet so I don't know what other people are responding to the OP, but my response is 'please don't listen, SE'. I'm really excited about BLU, it's a proper Blue Mage not something cobbled together and called Blue Mage that isn't really. It also fits my preferred play style. I've been playing this game since 1.0, and I've seen the 'community' degenerate to such degree that you're lucky if folks say hi at the start of a duty. Few care about being friendly or helpful because reputation doesn't matter a jot, unless it's those high numbers on fflogs. So I no longer run dungeons any more or do any kind of group content except in premades. I don't run the alliance raids or the current raid tier except maybe once when I can talk myself into it because story. So I'm thrilled by BLU and can't wait for my XI favourite BST to be the same

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

If you want to just get carried, that's on you. Nothing's stopping you from finding people willing to do things at level. Though that you assume the job will be non functional for 49 levels tells me you don't really care in the first place.

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Getting carried is the most effective option considering the entire community is time cautious and is the most likely path anyone would find success in getting help considering synced ARR content on the party finder is as popular as a lead balloon. And the job starts with absolutely nothing so youd just have a walking stick of questionable auto attack power to start your move collecting career so you already kick it off as dead weight and will need to slog though the various weak aoe attacks most enemies have as your options before you can get your chance to RNG a more decent move into your list.

This causes any blue mage to directly ask others to take time out of their day to do very old content thats not guaranteed to have pay off as blue mages learn moves after watching and defeating enemies rarely as stated in the info dump so good luck getting people to agree to grind ARR duties for an unknown amount of time.

If you want to limit these jobs, make them 1 per party or something like that.

Please don't make jobs that simply can't participate in the majority of the game's content. Nobody wants that.

Like it or not, FFXIV is not a game people come to for the open world. Being able to play that open world content in a new class will not change that.

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

Solo focused, not solo only. It still needs groups to get some of its stuff. You're getting things wrong right off the bat, and you repeatedly get that point wrong.
You also argue that because it's not what raiders would want it's a waste of resources that should've gone into making them happy. Not everything in an MMO is raiding, so no not all content needs to be for them.
The only "dangerous precedent" would be caving to this kind of tantrum.

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Thank you. You just said everything I feel about this "issue". To the seven hells with the haters. I had no interest in blue mage, untill now. And utterly broken class to mess around with while I do MSQ quests, hunts, beast tribe dailies and hunt for special FATE monsters. Oh and all the PVE group content with premade groups. What's not to like?

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Originally Posted by Helixagon

If you want to limit these jobs, make them 1 per party or something like that.

Please don't make jobs that simply can't participate in the majority of the game's content. Nobody wants that.

Like it or not, FFXIV is not a game people come to for the open world. Being able to play that open world content in a new class will not change that.

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Majority of the content? Lolwut? It is only banned from PVP and Deep Dungeons. Hardly the majority

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

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SE could easily still include this side content that's just for Blue mage in solo/open-world play. You can't even take them into level 50 or MSQ roulette despite those being options, nevermind the 24man content. And that's just at launch. None of that content is 'raider exclusive' either. It's casual content. Hell NORMAL RAIDs are casual content that was added so players could see the story of Raids and get a taste of those fights at a fairer difficulty level. It's not unreasonable for casual players to want to be able to use Blue Mage in ALL content. They would have to balance it against other jobs anyways just to get it into Duty Finder roulettes, so might as well go the whole mile and make them able to go into Savage. Even though I'm a raider I can see how a new player would start trying to unlock this job immediately but feel left behind because all of the extra content for this class doesn't overlap with what their FC & friends are doing. Anyone specifically looking to play Blue Mage long term is ultimately going to have to play something else for at least another year or two to unlock what they want to do still, given SE's poor pacing at actual fixes. I get the idea of keeping them at level 50 temporarily while letting the players test it. Hell I get that they didn't want to compromise on the Learn mechanic either, since that's part of their job identity, but this was not the answer. Anything that shows up in a roulette is casual content and Blue Mage, at the very least, should be able to queue for all of it, without needing a 'premade' group, squadron, or to unsync it in order to do it. It should be just as accessible and able to function in all casual DoW/M content as everything else. Whether you're an old player or new, no job or class should be regulated to side content exclusively. Even crafters and gatherers get relevant things to do, and there are plenty of people who HATE them and will never level one up.


Hell they've demonstrated they're able to do this stuff in instance without affecting the rest of the game too. SE finally got Eureka into a good place and basically did a bunch of whacky 'too broken for raiders' collectible actions reminiscent of XI in Pyros just for casual fun. You know what they 'could' have done with Blue Mage? Remake Eureka Pyros as part of 5.0, using Pyros as the baseline, and add all the whacky job abilities and mechanics people want to see, including Blue Mage's Learn mechanic, or SMN's multitude of Egi requests, or letting a Warrior go super berserk and tear into everything around them with a super blood bath ability, or anything off the rails like that. And then they could also address another issue people have, by adding an alternative form of gear progression that this game desperately needs every major patch, for raiders and casuals alike.

Your 'This isn't for you raider folk' attitude is shortsighted and elitist. Perhaps moreso than I've seen from the raiders on this very forum. This isn't even about raiders. It's about letting Blue Mages play the same game at the same balancing point everyone else already does. You know, the one that really needs more universal combat stuff to do? This is an overall mistake on SE's part. They've demonstrated they can do better on multiple occasions, but have failed to hit the mark in this specific instance. Calling it a 'tantrum' is just you pushing away honest and valid criticism. And even if people are mad, they have every right to be.

The good news, is it can be fixed, which is why people are getting on about it now, rather than 6 months down the line, in hopes that SE will fix some of it before the inevitable backlash.

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Originally Posted by Elladie

I haven't read most of the posts in this thread yet so I don't know what other people are responding to the OP, but my response is 'please don't listen, SE'. I'm really excited about BLU, it's a proper Blue Mage not something cobbled together and called Blue Mage that isn't really.

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I'm curious as to why Blue Mage must be omitted from content in order for it to be considered a proper Blue Mage. People aren't upset about needing to learn spells from fighting monsters or that it has too many spells. People just want to be able to play as Blue Mage in all content just like every other job.

I'll add this to what I've already said.
I'm OK with BLU being limited and how they intend to implement them, I also like how this could open up my desired job (Beast Tamer) of having a chance of making it in.
What it comes down to here is compromises, I don't see it as a lack of creativity they effectively wanted to be creative and create something unconstrained by the rules of the battle system, but that comes at the cost of it working both ways, if its designed to work outside of the system then it can't be part of the system, that is the compromise they've chosen, it may not be the one you want, but they tried to make it more then a Blue "flavoured" mage and this was the price.
However, if those of you upset with this or those who wanted BLU to be usable everywhere are OK with compromising the other way, them locking BLU to a smaller limited selection of it's abilities that they can and do balance for normal content then I see no problem with doing so and letting BLU do normal things, that may even be their plan, "Limited" could also eventually not just mean "limited in what it can do" but also mean "when used in normal play, parts of this job become limited or unavailable"
Voice your opinion on BLU let them know that even if limited from it's over-world state you'd like to see BLU usable everywhere but don't throw the whole idea they've presented under the bus, we just don't have enough information of their plans long term with "limited jobs."

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Originally Posted by Rysir

And the job starts with absolutely nothing so youd just have a walking stick of questionable auto attack power to start your move collecting career so you already kick it off as dead weight

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We don't know that it starts with absolutely nothing. And even if it did, it wouldn't take long to smack around some Cactuars for 100 Needles.

I'm not completely sold on the whole idea myself yet, but one complaint just doesn't make any sense to me. People keep talking about how they can't use it for "anything" yet the only two things that have been confirmed as not accessible are the duty finder and Deep Dungeon.

Deep Dungeon is unfortunate, but the duty finder is the least interactive or social element of the game that could possibly be called "group content." Going with friends or even just organizing with people in the party finder are still available, and are much more actual group oriented experiences. The duty finder isn't even an actual piece of content that's locked out, it's just one way to get into stuff.

Now if they take forever to catch up with the regular player level cap, or lock them out of more things like all raids even when going preformed or something, then maybe there will be more to this argument. But for now it just doesn't seem anywhere near being locked out of everything like a lot of people are saying.

I already knew before it would be announce that it would never be viable,why ? his gameplay is not suited for MMO,
1000needle from pampa,when you're level 10 ? its great,when you're lvl 70 ? 1000dmg ? totaly useless,morbol breath ? boss are immune to 90% of abnormal status,so everything that make Blue Mage great if other FF can't be implemented,so yeah,good idea in solo game,bad in MMO because it wont scale good enough.

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Originally Posted by Acidblood

So basically you never want them to do anything new?

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I do want them to do something new: I want the FFXIV flavor of the old designs. The things they're doing with Blue Mage's unique leveling style, skill acquisition and solo content are great, but they also should make it capable of doing the normal group content because that's what 90% of the game content is about. I don't want them to force archaic traditions in a mold where it doesn't fit. I want to see interesting revisions on the old ideas. Red Mage is a good example of a well adjusted job, in my opinion. They managed to capture the nature of double casting and sword skills quite well, without making it a broken mash-up of black and white magic. Summoner is a less successful example, personal taste though, but I'm still glad that it exists as a complete battle class instead of being shoved into some random mini-game role.

If a job is literally so unfit for MMOs that they can't be properly adjusted, I'd just rather not have them at all or allocate any resources for their development, because even the current jobs have issues that haven't been fixed for over a year.

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Originally Posted by SDaemon

You know when that was mentioned specifically? Playing back videos now and didn't see it on the live reddit update. Seems contradictory to his interview answer.

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https://clips.twitch.tv/SnappyFlirtyPepperTBTacoRight

It's from the keynote. While they don't mention it being added to older content as well, I do imagine they will do so... eventually.

I actually LOVE the leveling and skill acquisition system. I think it's a great new addition and is exactly how I would have wanted Blue Mage to become more powerful. Traveling across the game world to hunt down your spells sounds fantastic to me.

But I want to be able to use those skills in content that matters. That's where the problem arises, and it's a huge one. Why should every single job in the game except for Blue Mage be allowed to experience all content?

As to the argument of casual players wanting solo content, I agree that this is a good addition. But don't exclude it from non-casual content. We could still have had a new and exciting leveling process for Blue Mage that ultimately ended with a complete job ready for endgame content. We don't need to have it be one or the other.

People don't understand that THIS IS Blue Mage, So if they change that it won't BE Blue Mage. so in my opinion its a nice alternate side content on a cool looking job, and I bet we will get 3 more Jobs in 5.0 including a Proper DPS.

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

I do want them to do something new: I want the FFXIV flavor of the old designs. I don't want them to force archaic traditions in a mold where it doesn't fit. I want to see interesting revisions on the old ideas. Red Mage is a good example of a well adjusted job, in my opinion. They managed to capture the nature of double casting and sword skills quite well, without making it a broken mash-up of black and white magic. Summoner is a less successful example, personal taste though, but I'm still glad that it exists as a complete battle class instead of being shoved into some random mini-game role.

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I guess that's where we differ, as I see RDM as a near failure. Sure it looks like a RDM if you squint hard enough, but it's 93% a DPS class with zero interactivity between its damage abilities and its (essentially) tacked-on healing spell and raise... a real Red Mage should be much more 50/50, and have an array of support abilities besides, but FFXIV's rigid role system and high-end encounter design doesn't allow for that, so instead we get a more different BLM with (names aside) only 2 real WHM abilities and 1 very limited (and DPS based) support ability.

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

In a similar vein, the things they're doing with Blue Mage's unique leveling style, skill acquisition and solo content are great, but they also should make it capable of doing the normal group content because that's what 90% of the game content is about.

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This I can agree on, but I cannot agree that this means the whole concept should be scrapped as per the OP. Yes it needs refinement, but it also needs time for both the players and developers to get used to the system (this is new for them too) so that it can best be determined what that refinement should look like...

For example:
- Should players be allowed into Duty Finder once they’ve 'proven' they than can handle Blue Mage by passing a set of solo challenges?
- Or should Blue Mage be forced to use a 'Duty' set of abilities?
- What level of duties should Blue Mage be allowed in to? Only dungeons? Normal raid? 24-player raid? (for all of which you could argue that 'balance' doesn't matter overly much)
- Or should Blue Mages be allowed into ALL content, 'balance' be damned? And is the community at large mature (and responsible) enough to handle that?

None of these questions I feel we can answer right now, as we don't know what abilities Blue Mage will have or how powerful they will be, and obviously the developers are (somewhat understandably) playing it safe, and you know what, that's fine, it's an MMO and the developers do (occasionally) listen to feedback...

All of this 'cancel blue mage' stuff though, it isn't feedback, it's whining, whining about wanting to be being able to raid or queue up for duties with randoms on a class called 'Blue Mage' (that's not actually Blue Mage), and for all the calls of 'give us something new' around here it's actually kind of sickening to see.

I actually like this concept of a limited job.
It allows for the implementation of jobs we wouldnt typically get. Something like Beastmaster would fit it quite well.
I've always been of the opinion that we'd never get Beastmaster, or Puppeteer, or Mime in XIV, and ive been dreading a Blue Mage that was little more tgan a RDM clone.

So long as it's in addition to main expansion jobs and not instead of, its fine, its in the same vein as new crafter/gatherer jobs, but far more interesting.

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Originally Posted by Gleipni

I already knew before it would be announce that it would never be viable,why ? his gameplay is not suited for MMO,
1000needle from pampa,when you're level 10 ? its great,when you're lvl 70 ? 1000dmg ? totaly useless,morbol breath ? boss are immune to 90% of abnormal status,so everything that make Blue Mage great if other FF can't be implemented,so yeah,good idea in solo game,bad in MMO because it wont scale good enough.

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I'm actually wondering about Bad Breathe, namely because the video shows it being used on Shiva, who you would think has Contractual Boss Immunity and therefore be worthless to use on them. Maybe it has something special for BLU, like maybe a temporary vuln down debuff. (Or does Bad Breath have that?)

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

I'm actually wondering about Bad Breathe, namely because the video shows it being used on Shiva, who you would think has Contractual Boss Immunity and therefore be worthless to use on them. Maybe it has something special for BLU, like maybe a temporary vuln down debuff. (Or does Bad Breath have that?)

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The poison DoT effect at the very least should affect her if none of the other debuffs do.

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Originally Posted by Igneel_DB

People don't understand that THIS IS Blue Mage, So if they change that it won't BE Blue Mage. so in my opinion its a nice alternate side content on a cool looking job, and I bet we will get 3 more Jobs in 5.0 including a Proper DPS.

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What *exactly* is Blue Mage? Not being able to be in the main party and only doing solo stuff? Uh... no. Being immensely overpowered compared to other characters/classes? Urm... not really? The essence of a blue mage is hunting around for enemy attacks and learning and using them. FFXI did the concept quite well without making the class too overpowered. Was it a strong class? Sure, but I don't really think it was overpowered and it worked with other classes in the game quite well. Could they have implemented a similar system in FFXIV? Probably, but they chose not to. They chose this option instead.

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Originally Posted by EusisLandale

We don't know that it starts with absolutely nothing. And even if it did, it wouldn't take long to smack around some Cactuars for 100 Needles.

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Possibly if RNG favors the blue mage and if its true that blue mage does indeed have access to caster dps role skills and so would have access to drain. To add to that, since blue mage gets more exp fighting in the overworld they would also likely have a decent time getting access to their quest gained abilities that would enable better overworld farming for exp and skills at least.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

I'm actually wondering about Bad Breathe, namely because the video shows it being used on Shiva, who you would think has Contractual Boss Immunity and therefore be worthless to use on them. Maybe it has something special for BLU, like maybe a temporary vuln down debuff. (Or does Bad Breath have that?)

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or they could make the exception and allow what bosses get the full effect from bad breath, i mean, on the blue mage trailer we see shiva getting stunned, when she is inmune to it

Instead of "Limited Job". Square Enix could take the opportunity of the Blue Mage to do something better and more engaged for the community, concept of "Expert Job".

- For exclusion of Duties : Make that Blue can only join instance content while they have finished (or doing the majority) of the Carnival. So they have learn much of the useful Actions.
- The uniqueness of Blue : he could change Roles depends on wich sets of actions he chose : DPS (Mix Physical and Magical), Tank and Healer. I have a good thoughts about sets of skills he could use within the limitations of 24 Actions.
- Balancing issue : Crowd Control doesn't work on many of the bosses, Death in Eureka doesn't work on Bosses. So yeah, it's more difficult to balance it, but I think it can be done. Especially if you "Ban" some skills from Instance content. Cannot use it at all or just some Damage done or something like that.

I like BLU without being a great fan but I think it's a miss opportunity to truly innovate in the MAIN game. As it is, BLU will maybe share the fate of Lords of Verminions, since it's not useful AT ALL for the main game, Ressources are throwing away, and it will be the perfect excuses for Square Enix to do "less" content in patches since they need to patch BLU as well. Unfortunately, this content will only target fan of the jobs and not a majority of players (like Updates on PVP/The Feast as well)

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Originally Posted by Igneel_DB

People don't understand that THIS IS Blue Mage, So if they change that it won't BE Blue Mage. so in my opinion its a nice alternate side content on a cool looking job, and I bet we will get 3 more Jobs in 5.0 including a Proper DPS.

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But Dark Knight soul eater in other game is known for sacrificing hp to deal high dmg yet here in 14 it was changed. And they implemented their own version of Dark Knight as a tank instead of DPS. Does that mean it wouldn't be dark knight and dark knight should be side content only too? Dragoon jumps in other games prevents you from taking dmg but in 14 it gets you killed yet we have dragoon as playable job to raid with.

Berserk is known for having increased atk power, can only auto atk and cannot be controlled yet here in 14 we can still control warrior under berserk. Won't that mean it cannot be warrior like and should be side content only too?

BLM in this game is completely different in 14 from other ff games as well as the rest of the jobs in 14. Why is it with blue mage suddenly they cannot implement one to raid/do current stuff with?

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Originally Posted by Igneel_DB

People don't understand that THIS IS Blue Mage, So if they change that it won't BE Blue Mage. so in my opinion its a nice alternate side content on a cool looking job, and I bet we will get 3 more Jobs in 5.0 including a Proper DPS.

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DRK, RDM and SMN aren't true to their past, so are they NOT DRK,RDM,SMN? Should they now be Limited Jobs and be unable to do certain content? I think not. There were a multitude of ways to add blue to XIV properly without sacrificing anything major, they just didn't do it.

I see a lot of people that actually have not played Blue Mage wanting it to be just a watered down boring 1 2 3 job same as the other ones.

It's a new thing, didn't you all get to experience the awesome leveling experience of roullete with 15 jobs already? need to be 16? As if you all will be unable to play Blue Mage because of the Limited aspect. Just don't play it then. It is Blue Mage, and that's the most important thing. You can party up, you can do instanced content, that's enough.

They can't initially do Palace because players will get to Lvl 50 without any ability and queue roullete to be useless.

I can't believe that this "limitation" will be forever, they just didn't have the time to code it, they need to produce the content for 51~60, 61~70 and 71~80, and I think that there will be A LOT of abilities. I'm sure when 5.0 is out they will have the time to start developing and changing these limitations. The systems sounds really good to me, I will be able to play as Blue Mage canon to the franchise concept without any "you can't do that because gameplay balancing".

please make it a normal job and not a limited job. in fact, get rid of this limited job idea completely

I don't see why they couldn't incorporate BLU into the raiding scene down the road. Just make the boss immune to status effects like DEATH and Bad breath. If they have 26 abilities to play with making them put ones that will only affect said boss. It's the key to what a blue mage is - finding the weakness. Most endgame groups might not even take BLU because they will be like oh we beat the x tier without the gimmick class. I shrug, but for the most part - I'm just happy it's in the game. Thank you SE.

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Originally Posted by LeoLupinos

I see a lot of people that actually have not played Blue Mage wanting it to be just a watered down boring 1 2 3 job same as the other ones.

It's a new thing, didn't you all get to experience the awesome leveling experience of roullete with 15 jobs already? need to be 16? As if you all will be unable to play Blue Mage because of the Limited aspect. Just don't play it then. It is Blue Mage, and that's the most important thing. You can party up, you can do instanced content, that's enough.

They can't initially do Palace because players will get to Lvl 50 without any ability and queue roullete to be useless.

I can't believe that this "limitation" will be forever, they just didn't have the time to code it, they need to produce the content for 51~60, 61~70 and 71~80, and I think that there will be A LOT of abilities. I'm sure when 5.0 is out they will have the time to start developing and changing these limitations. The systems sounds really good to me, I will be able to play as Blue Mage canon to the franchise concept without any "you can't do that because gameplay balancing".

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The only boring gameplay would be a job that has no flow, you simply use the ability that is most fitting for the current situation.

The rest of your post is something I see come up a lot and you need to understand that under the current implementation, Blue Mage will not see play for any relevant content. The job was designed to be a soloist job. The only group content it will be able to do is outdated stuff which is no longer a challenge because it can be de-synced and run. There is no reason to go as a blue mage except for the sheer enjoyment of doing it as a blue mage, and you can only do it as a group if you get other people who think that doing old, easy cleared content with a special job would be fun.

Sure, maybe once or twice it'd be a novelty to do for fun, but it will wear off.

Assuming that they'll eventually be allowed to participate in group content like other jobs runs contrary to their specifically stated design goal with blue mage, which was to make a unique, intentionally overpowered soloist job for special blue mage only content. It's a minigame, a minigame that is locking an iconic Final Fantasy job from ever being truly playable. Based on a system that "promises" to doom other jobs to that same fate.

If we don't want that, we have to tell them that. Which is why this thread exists.

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Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

I get what you mean, but wouldn't that just kind of defeat the point?

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It wouldn't actually. And that's what I've been saying from the moment the Live Letter ended and the flood of negativity hit the forums.

Many skills will be overpowered, yes. But some of the skills will not. Have these non-overpowered skills form some sort of "progression". You still gain them in the exact same way. The Blue Mage would not be changed at all from how it is. But they would count towards the skills you should have at X level.

If you do, in addition to doing any content the 4.5 Blue Mage can in the exact same way (aka. complete freedom in pre-made parties etc.), you get the ability to use Duty Finder but at the cost of using a pre-made, balanced build. Anywhere outside the PvP (which is separate on its own and I think they will release a PvP "build" anyway, once they catch up to the levels as much as they plan on), Deep Dungeon and Duty Roulette you can use any and all your skills as you please. Inside these three, you are limited like any other class but at least you can use them.

This maximizes the amount of stuff that Blue Mage can utilize, while minimizing the time and costs of making it such, both on players and developers. After all, if you are only interested in the Duty Finder, you can only look for those abilities you need for it and have a normal class with unique learning mechanics.

Of course, it's possible that a "grace period" for current raids and such would need to be implemented where you can only use the pre-made build even in pre-made parties, just so that Blue Mage wouldn't completely wreck the most current content making it virtually "mandatory" for the meta.

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Originally Posted by Kitfox

Hello,

The initial response from the raiding community has been overwhelmingly negative.

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The raiding community is barely 10% of the playerbase, if that. You being mad about this really doesn't matter.

(assuming you mean raiding community to be people doing savage and ultimates, which would be the only definition that makes sense)

I admit to being rather disappointed when I heard what Blue Mage was going to be, and am somewhat worried about it having taken some precious development time.

Still, I'm not going to completely knock it since I haven't tried it, I've seen people worrying about having to group up for some stuff like trials, but it's possible that Blue Mage's skills are so versatile and overpowered that you might be able to solo most everything.