FFXIV Successor MMO (FFXVII?) Hinted at

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

I got access to alpha and beta tests, in game items, game store credit and I think half a year sub free with it. So part of that was kindda a paying up front thing, some was for access to the alpha/beta.

Their transparency makes me more willing to spend money. And I am not a whale by any means lol. I get a few collectables here and there but things like the mog station are a waste of money imo. I don't even spend money on crowns in ESO, I use the ones I earn through my sub, since they match it dollar for dollar. Hell if I am buying stuff after paying a sub. I seldom roll the dice and even pre order a game much less pledge money to one in development so it was a big deal I did it at all lol

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Hang on, you paid them to access the alpha? You paid them money to test their game?

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Is it bad that I suggested a Ivalice MMORPG on the survey? >w>

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I did the same :)

and for the games I would like to see, I wrote :
- FF Tactic Advance 3
- FF IX remake
- FF Agni's Philosophy

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Originally Posted by Ilyrian

Hang on, you paid them to access the alpha? You paid them money to test their game?

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I'll note, that while there is nothing technically wrong about doing so, if the game never comes out, or dies 3 months into it (Everquest Next and Landmark, never even got out of Alpha test) is a great way to never want to play MMO's ever again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EverQuest_Next

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On March 11, 2016, Daybreak announced development had been discontinued.[12] Daybreak Game Company's president, Russell Shanks, said that "As we put together the pieces, we found that it wasn't fun"

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So far, nobody has come out with a third MMORPG based on the same IP and lived to tell the tale. And I'm not talking about Call of Shooty type games.

What I want, more or less is a MMORPG that incorporates everything that works, and none of the things that just waste players time. Ideally this would just be a new IP entirely, but Final Fantasy allows for a lot of Asset and concept reuse, so SquareEnix may as well make use of it, or we won't see another FF game until 2030.

Like there are things that FFXIV does better than other games, including all of V1.00, 1.23, 2.0, 3.0, and 4.0

Things I miss from 1.00 aren't many, but I miss the high-detail objects players and scenery, seemless maps (yes they were loading tunnel tricks, but they were seamless) there are better ways of doing this now without resorting to instances too.

Instancing, sharding, separate realms/servers was the greatest detriment to MMORPG development. Because having a million players in one spot is technically infeasible, you'd instead break up zones so maybe 500 players per zone were in them at once. That includes the Monsters and dynamic events. There is a much better design that we use every day with the cellular phone networks, and cellular networks handle millions of users at the same time. Sectorize the one unified world into large and small sectors, and just hand-off players between the sectors. If a sector is full, then divide the sector in half.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio
(By which I'm referring to this image https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Spiral.svg.png )


The next issue that I feel is not adequately addressed in current MMO's is built-in player run government/laws. The closest I've seen anything like this is in Archeage (Wizardry didn't have a court, it just dropped PK'ers into the jail if they were killed by the guards) where "criminals" were tried and then just unable to do anything but be bumps in the road while their criminal status was on. It didn't manage to get that many bots. A player controlled government/law system would be able to actually define sets or subsets of rules that they want for their city/housing areas, and the costs would be automatically calculated and imposed.

If you want a completely protected city, you have to hire many guards, the system will put out job applications for players to be guards while they're offline/alt-characters, and such to fill them. Thus a closed loop economy is created. Also the system would automatically do the same for shops and crafting.


The third issue is how monetization completely ruins games, and the greedier the system, the quicker the game decays. Such games need to be devoid of all monetization that affects the game economy first, and limited only to external resource consumption. You want to play it, you buy the game, and pay for your character to run "while offline". Can't afford it? Then your character goes to sleep when you're offline. Want to have a whole family or army? You can have it, just open your wallet. Solves the botting problem by making the bots things the developers actually control and players pay for instead.


Those are the things that I feel are important to address if MMORPG's are to evolve and not turn into rubbish. If that's a Final Fantasy, fine. If it's a sequel to Chrono Trigger, that's probably better, but I don't really expect another FF MMO for any reason other than Yoshi-P wants to start prototyping another one now so it's released by the time FFXIV reaches it's storyline conclusion. Heck a MMORPG that is a sequel of sorts to Neir:Automata would probably be the kind of game that players actually want, but would probably never work in practice.

It's a shame that so many MMORPG's come out with good ideas, and then their developers completely destroy it with cash shop highway robbery.

It's not exclusive to XIV. MMO execs fail to recognize when they create a money grabbing scheme, they are taking a good portion of the consumers. This is where the stagnation comes from, you kill the innovation that comes from competitions. Good for FF if they have tons of things to retcon. But as Riyah pointed out, there's a reason for the unsold boxes. MMOs create their own stagnation, most buyers want to try everything and claim the excuse to play game with friends. Most won't like playing someone else's favorite game, but they are "inclined" to. Stop being 2nd to blizzard at everything, even they don't know better when they stopped at frozen throne.

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Originally Posted by Ilyrian

Hang on, you paid them to access the alpha? You paid them money to test their game?

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Yep. That how that game is funded basicly.

Honestly I am thinking the next MMO SE makes will be apart of the Marvel agreement and part of the 5 games promised out of that agreement. I dont think we will see another FF MMO until 3-5 years from now or who knows could be 10 years from now considering FFXIV current success.

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

Anyhow, A Final Fantasy themed Battle Royale type of game is probably something that would be worth trying, but I don't think that's what people want. I feel the current popularity of eSports will always be a short-lived thing (really, name any eSport celebrities.)

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Mind you I've never played any of the BR games like PubG/Fortnite either. That type of gameplay isn't my thing.

That said, isn't Dissidia basically FF's Battle Royale on a smaller scale though? I really wanted to buy the most recent one, but it just wasn't that much fun, especially without friends. It was pretty lambasted by its community and was almost a dead on arrival game. If they ever release Beatrix as DLC though, I will purchase the game. I promised them that much.

Regarding Esports - The FGC has a HUGE number of personalities and they're constantly growing. Not only that when their game dies, the player moves on to a new game. We've seen it a lot recently. I'm not sure it's been a small thing, or even a short lived thing. I mean hell didn't the LoL world finals or whatever sell out the Staples center in seconds back in 2014, and later even larger venues in the same time frame. Not to mention, events have even aired on ESPN (well not quite the Ocho, but 2/3 LOL).

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Originally Posted by DDkiki

Not dying, but stagnating.

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This is a great point and you can easily see the proof. People are literally chomping at the bit for something extremely high quality that is new. That's why we keep seeing so much hype for games popping up when they do, but the problem with these new MMO's is that dev's keep making awful games. Make a good game and people will try it, and possibly stick with it.

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

*disclaimer, I've never actually played TF2, Overwatch, PubG or Fortnite

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You and me both.
Not that I can't enjoy these types of games, as I do like FPS. Just haven't bothered to give them my money or time in a while.

It's more likely that I would play another FF mmo than an mmo from a different company. Whether I stay on as a long time subscriber with a high level of engagement depends on how well they manage the community. I would want to see a larger investment in moderator teams than they've had in xiv so that they always have eyes on botting, win trading, RMT activities and not allowing much to slip through the cracks. I would never be worried about the quality of the content since I very much enjoy what they've done in xiv and other S-E games. I personally prefer the style of games they make over those from western companies like blizzard, epic, bethesda, but the effort they put into preventing illicit activities seems much less than those companies. I think it needs more money put into that area with a larger task force.

No actual surprise here. XIV is their second MMORPG already. Why would they stop with XIV especially when it proved so much successful?
Ofc there will be another. When? I doubt there will be one for at least the next 6-7 years. Not as long as XIV is still running its prime time and is healthy. Most probably there will be one once XIV is drawing near its conclusion near the end of its life cycle.
The survey was kind of premature in that sense. They should have asked more question about their current MMORPG and not a future one since trends and tech changes over the years the opinions may change as well.

Since we're now also sharing what games we asked them to make, I asked for an Infinite Undiscovery remaster or at least backwards compatible on Xbox and Infinite Undiscovery 2. I know, I'm that lone person who cares about that game. ;-;

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Originally Posted by Ilyrian

I do wonder if the MMO genre has run its course though. The numbers for this game aren't great in the grand scheme of things - and we'll never see the heights that WoW reached at its peak.

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I think it's more the opposite. When BLESS announced to be more "back to the roots", many, many people were up and excited (to be honest, I like the game even in its awful state right now, runs better than GW2 on my system xD).
This weird "MMO(RPG)S die" is a lie and won't happen. I never played WoW because I can't stand the look and feel of Blizzard games and my parents were - thankfully - very strict with internet access when I was a student.
Look, I bought some Elvis Presley songs from iTunes. "Devil in Disguise" is from 1963. And still in 2018, I bought it, 55 years later. While my grandma would say Rock'n'Roll died 3 decades ago, I don't think so.
Analogy: Why should new players of today (e.g. first computer) not try and enjoy MMORPGs today

My suggestion i added was that they use more of the sub money from this game to re-inject into FFXIV instead of funding their other projects, lol

I just want SE's other mmo =( Dragon Quest X Online lol >.<

I hope we get an actual "new" MMO and not just XI with WoW gameplay slapped on.

It's better they start making the next FF mmo now than rush it like they did with FFXIV in the beginning. I think people don't understand how long an mmo should be developed for, it should take some 5 years instead of 1 or 2.

I think that they should invest into making this game even better instead.

On the "as big as WoW!" crowds, WoW was an exception not a rule. FF 14 ARR was launched with 500k "success" and 250k-300k "sustain" concurrent subs for success. WoW's appeal was also its ease of access, before that you had MMOs that required potentially weeks just to get a handle on the system. So i do not see them starting a new MMO project, for at least half a decade, with a potential release being years after that. (assuming they dont go the rework ff 14 route yet again since it worked once already)

It's times like this, actually, where I want to draw out my plans for a MMO I have ideas for, find a development team and a source of money, and get it made.

hmm... I've been saying or thinking that a lot more often as of late. <_<

I would be hesitant to move to another FF MMO, unless they make some changes to fix the current one. I am not confident in the current FF14's ability for longevity - the gear treadmill and linear progression formula isn't exactly exciting. If some changes are made to expand progress horizontally and open up older areas and somehow make current gear useful LONGER, then I would be ok with moving to a new FF MMO (and even staying with this one). But otherwise, I dunno...they take enough money from me as it is.

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Originally Posted by Aster_E

It's times like this, actually, where I want to draw out my plans for a MMO I have ideas for, find a development team and a source of money, and get it made.

hmm... I've been saying or thinking that a lot more often as of late. <_<

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lol

less talky, more dooey

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Originally Posted by Linx0r

lol

less talky, more dooey

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https://i.pinimg.com/originals/1c/79...a81141c718.gif

I'm invested in the FF14 story so I stay .... but I wont be buying a new SE MMO unless it caters to a players base that actively plays the game, not just the 1hr a day people.

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Originally Posted by Aster_E

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/1c/79...a81141c718.gif

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lmaoooo i like you!

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Originally Posted by mikanana

I think that they should invest into making this game even better instead.

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I concur. Update the backend infrastructure to something at least <5 years, solidify a balanced progression method and this games life increases.

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Originally Posted by Ceasaria

I did the same :)

and for the games I would like to see, I wrote :
- FF Tactic Advance 3
- FF IX remake
- FF Agni's Philosophy

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I would love to see an Ogre Battle MMO

Its hilarious they even listed EA as an option for a trusted gaming company..... EA is garbage.

I love FFXIV, and I'd also love to try a new FF MMORPG. It's simply because I love trying new things, and I imagine that a new game would have much improved graphics and new possibities related to character creation and gameplay. But I of course don't want to leave FFXIV, I'm happy here.

This said, I very much doubt they'd make a new one. There's no reason for it so long as XIV does well.

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Originally Posted by Clover_Blake

I love FFXIV, and I'd also love to try a new FF MMORPG. It's simply because I love trying new things, and I imagine that a new game would have much improved graphics and new possibities related to character creation and gameplay. But I of course don't want to leave FFXIV, I'm happy here.

This said, I very much doubt they'd make a new one. There's no reason for it so long as XIV does well.

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I think they are asking to gauge interest. A new MMO takes a long time to develop. 14 will have a few more expansions regardless.

http://i66.tinypic.com/2zf7mdt.png

Remember Flowerpots.

Article source:
https://kotaku.com/final-fantasy-xiv...owe-1548656999

XVII is like 10+ years away. We don't know how long xiv will live.

If they made a new FF mmo I would try it out for sure.

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Originally Posted by Ayer2015

Its hilarious they even listed EA as an option for a trusted gaming company..... EA is garbage.

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And there wasn't CD Projekt Red or Naughty Dog...

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Originally Posted by Ceasaria

I did the same :)

and for the games I would like to see, I wrote :
- FF Tactic Advance 3
- FF IX remake
- FF Agni's Philosophy

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I suggested:
-An Ivalice MMO
-Another Tactics game
-Another Crystal Chronicles game
-A Sequel to Chrono Trigger and Cross
-A Sequel to Bravely Default and Second
-A Sequel to Threads of Fate
-A Sequel to Mischief Makers
-More games that hearken to older RPGs but also add to them

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

I suggested:
-An Ivalice MMO
-Another Tactics game
-Another Crystal Chronicles game
-A Sequel to Chrono Trigger and Cross
-A Sequel to Bravely Default and Second
-A Sequel to Threads of Fate
-A Sequel to Mischief Makers
-More games that hearken to older RPGs but also add to them

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Good list! I do feel like Octopath is basically a sequel to the Bravely series. And Live a Live too. Or at least, there definitely should be a Bravely 3 if it isn't on Switch soon enough

I suggested

FFXI solo version
FFIV remake
FFVI remake
Chrono sequel
better PC ports than the crappy mobile ports we get
another multiple path game like 7th saga

I asked for an Ivalice mmo with an open world PvP setting. Gotta have it.

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Originally Posted by Aster_E

It's times like this, actually, where I want to draw out my plans for a MMO I have ideas for, find a development team and a source of money, and get it made.

hmm... I've been saying or thinking that a lot more often as of late. <_<

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I'd love to hear your thoughts if you have any. Feel free to make a secondary thread. I tend to do this exercise when im bored at work/long shower/bath thoughts so it's usually pretty neat to see others ideas.

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Originally Posted by Ayer2015

I'm invested in the FF14 story so I stay .... but I wont be buying a new SE MMO unless it caters to a players base that actively plays the game, not just the 1hr a day people.

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Who exactly does 1hr a day people represent?

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Originally Posted by Justuas

XVII is like 10+ years away. We don't know how long xiv will live.

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Im not so sure about that. FFXIV was in development in 2005, just 3 years after the JP release of XI. In 2010 it was released just 8 years after JP launch of XI. ARR is 5 years old in august. It is not beyond possibility they launch XVII back to back with XVI like they did with XIII and XIV.

My suggestion was pretty simple. Once they launch the new FF MMO, instead of just individual subs for each of their online games, have the option for a monthly fee for all of them as well.

Also, stop with the remakes. Remasters are ok but remakes are basically a new game its pointless and a waste of assets and time to tell the same story again.

There are a few quility MMOs. Most of them are sub based. But with so many F2P games with P2W elements and most of the non whales don't care about being the best.... Well Whales be had. I watch one of my favorit streamers get easily 2-3k on a friday night some donations are $100. By the same people every week. So ya there are people out there with a lot more many and many with no money to play games. I feel sub based games are where you want to be.
F2P/P2W games are really the 1% P2W players taken advantage of the 80% F2P players.

Where Sub games are balanced and everyone is on a level playing field you get out what you put in. so I view sub as middle class of gaming.