Do you find playing melee more difficult?

as far as I'm aware the vast majority of players are on keyboard, which makes working with the camera and movement cumbersome which make melees fast paced reaction based gameplay far harder, players who use controller on the other hand aren't limited by that, with instant camera movement, being able to move in any direction at top speed on a dime, easier access to our hotbar and melee becomes much easier to play and understand

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Originally Posted by Rayo

as far as I'm aware the vast majority of players are on keyboard, which makes working with the camera and movement cumbersome which make melees fast paced reaction based gameplay far harder, players who use controller on the other hand aren't limited by that, with instant camera movement, being able to move in any direction at top speed on a dime, easier access to our hotbar and melee becomes much easier to play and understand

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Not an issue, you should roughly know where you're going before hand. Most DPS don't think about what button to press next, that's practice, with few exceptions. If you're worried about whether you can tap a key fast enough, then you need to spend more time on a striking dummy, not worrying about whether you should be using kbm or gamepad.

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Originally Posted by Luin

Not an issue, you should roughly know where you're going before hand. Most DPS don't think about what button to press next, that's practice, with few exceptions. If you're worried about whether you can tap a key fast enough, then you need to spend more time on a striking dummy, not worrying about whether you should be using kbm or gamepad.

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of course the difference between the two are minor to near none with practice, but are you telling me you never wasted precious time backing up slowly instead of turning on a dime, or just simply clicking on a target with a mouse rather than going through a list. Also anyone can maximize a striking dummy, but this game is more than just rotation, its knowing mechanics and reacting to mechanics while maximizing your Effectiveness.

Also what I said is mostly from what I witnessed with players from my own FC (I'm comfortable using either keyboard and controller) Most of the tank and melee mains tend to be controller or PS4, while most of the Keyboard users are ranged DPS and healers. with exceptions of course

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Originally Posted by Rayo

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You clearly haven't spent time using Keyboard control enough.
First of all, keyboard users can choose between Legacy and Standard control scheme, and camera control via mouse swipe is very swift and accurate, so even if you opted out and stick with backpedaling movement you can still perform quick backward movement if needed.
Second, tab target is a thing and people can still select enemy from enmity list.
Finally, even with standard WASD movement, keyboard users have access to at least 3x(7+) buttons at any given moment (1-5, q, r, e, f , etc. plus modifier such as shift, alt, ctrl)

I simply find it a bit annoying rather than difficult.

There is a lot of factors that can ruin the melee dps damge such as Tank moving that cause the enemy to move (the side/back effects are missed a lot because of this), constant worry of heavy damage AoE at melee that force you to stop and run, and higher risks when fighting enemies and bosses since they tend to have more dangerous Melee attacks than range attacks.

More things to worry about as a melee dps that Range DPS tend to not have torry since they are mostly out of range for these things.

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Originally Posted by mosaicex

You clearly haven't spent time using Keyboard control enough.
First of all, keyboard users can choose between Legacy and Standard control scheme, and camera control via mouse swipe is very swift and accurate, so even if you opted out and stick with backpedaling movement you can still perform quick backward movement if needed.
Second, tab target is a thing and people can still select enemy from enmity list.
Finally, even with standard WASD movement, keyboard users have access to at least 3x(7+) buttons at any given moment (1-5, q, r, e, f , etc. plus modifier such as shift, alt, ctrl)

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While I'd rather not start having to get into why it doesn't matter how you press a button much less that I have used the keyboard control, I'm using observations from other people with the notion that the default settings of your control layout, whether you're on controller or keyboard can dictate your favored play style early on and likely future preferences.
For example, I was helping someone who has plenty of on both keyboard and controller but was new to FFXIV set up their controller, and I saw them play fine on keyboard. I asked why he wanted to play on controller and they said that he liked playing on controller, as he felt like he was moving more efficiently which would help his tanking, ergo you can conclude that one possible reason for people prefering a job can be affected by their interface choice
While I understand you can nearly make any keyboard layout effective, personal comfort and preference bias toward your controller or keyboard can naturally make you drawn toward certain play styles, unless you already have a clear idea of how you want to play a different job.
I myself played melee on keyboard fine through out the ARR main story , but I grew up on action games on console, so I have a preference to melee combat and controllers which I took up to immediately after digging up some older XBone controllers to hook up to my computer. now a days I can play any job with relative ease. I'm not saying its fact but that its a possibility

Having mostly been a caster up until now i do find mellee more difficult. If for whatever reason i get spun around i sometimes cannot find my spot to go to while raiding, also there i the fact that in instances ranged can still be attacking while mellee cannot. I guess because you are close up you have to be aware of your surroundings

I've found it a lot more engaging, personally. having to constantly adjust my positioning for maximum damage, and avoid AoEs helps me stay engaged in the action.

I wouldn't say that one is harder than the other but that is different for every player. I have fights where i prefer range and i have fights where i prefer melee.

Also playing tank or healer isn't hard, it just depents on what you like and if you are able to multitask.

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Originally Posted by Rayo

Something something most tank/melee mains play on PS4 because camera controls

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You know why the genre is called 'tab target' MMO, right? You just click "tab" to cycle to the next "Target" on the enemy list. There's absolutely no single objective reason for controller being better for Melee/Tank classes than keyboard. Personal preference? Sure, I accept that. But stop trying to spout it at some kind of mechanical reason as opposed to your personal comfort.

I've been maining Melee jobs on Keyboard for 5 years now, having cleared multiple Savage tiers with above average performances on both Dragoon and Monk. I can guarantee you, without a shadow of a doubt, keyboard is every bit as functional as controller for these jobs if not superior.

I find when I play Melees, most of the time my eyes would be staring at the target ring. Without having the skill effects tuned down, do u guys have problem seeing the target ring clearly?

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Originally Posted by Rayo

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in the past myself i tried to play as melee on controller, it was impossible for me to play it that way, especially because the job i tried to play as was monk, so hitting those positionals was hell for me on controller, besides what for me swaping targets was extremely slow

it all boils down to what method of controlling your character you are more used to, if you are more of a console player, you will be far more used to controllers, but if you are a pc player, you might be used to controllers, or you might not(since most pc games do not require controller)

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

I simply find it a bit annoying rather than difficult.

...constant worry of heavy damage AoE at melee that force you to stop and run, and higher risks when fighting enemies and bosses since they tend to have more dangerous Melee attacks than range attacks.

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This is the biggest issue for me. I always get taken out by boss AoE on my SAM. All it takes is one hit and I'm dead. My SAM is also 61, so it might get better with gear at 70. But it's super frustrating and embarrassing. I like to make my healer's life easy.

It's to the point now where I actually rolled PGL from lvl 1 just to get used to how melee works in this game. With SAM, I started it at 50 so I learned everything on the fly. Gonna level the PGL up till I unlock rogue, then I'll level a ninja to 70.

I'll get my SAM to 70 at some point. But I need start back at level 1.

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Originally Posted by Lium

This is the biggest issue for me. I always get taken out by boss AoE on my SAM. All it takes is one hit and I'm dead. My SAM is also 61, so it might get better with gear at 70. But it's super frustrating and embarrassing. I like to make my healer's life easy.

It's to the point now where I actually rolled PGL from lvl 1 just to get used to how melee works in this game. With SAM, I started it at 50 so I learned everything on the fly. Gonna level the PGL up till I unlock rogue, then I'll level a ninja to 70.

I'll get my SAM to 70 at some point. But I need start back at level 1.

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Once you can leap in and out of melee range the point blank aoes are nothing

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Originally Posted by Ayden

I find when I play Melees, most of the time my eyes would be staring at the target ring. Without having the skill effects tuned down, do u guys have problem seeing the target ring clearly?

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Yes, especially in 24-man content. As a monk, I've had to completely turn off spell effects just so I can see the target ring, and even then it still is a pain since there's no way to turn off or minimize Asylum, Sacred Soil, Shadow Flare.....

as going to post a massive essay but I'm going to try going for the short version...

Each job has their challenges. It varies from fight to fight and sometimes it varies within the same fight. Different jobs have mechanics aimed at them at different points of the fight. Sometimes melees get it easier while healers and ranged deal with mechanics, sometimes melees needs to do their bit while everyone kinda chills. Everyone has their place.

Dungeon-wise i find tanks to be the easiest by far (which makes me not understand the whole tankxiety thing). People are not that demanding. You're most likely to be more demanding on yourself than others. I literally got my first tank to level 50 back in the day by pretty much just spamming rage of halone combo and flash and people would still commend me. Things do change when we're talking about min-maxing and trials. Especially end game stuff. You need a very in depth knowledge of the fight to maximize your cooldown usage. IMO the only dps that comes close to reaping as many benefits to knowing a fight well is BLM. By this i mean everyone beneficts from knowing the fights but some jobs get more punished than others when you lack such knowledge.

Things are complex and this is just one layer. You also can consider rotations, possible skills that hold you in place (be it animation locks or the different types of "ley lines"), keeping certain buffs / timers up, properly timing of spells / abilities/ weaponskills and your own gamestyle. I'm sure people notice they "click" more with some jobs than others.

With that said i think all jobs deserve respect and i encourage people to give them all a whirl, even if you don't click with the job. Sure you might not be best DPS ever but at least you'll have a semblance of insight of their strengths, weaknesses and hopefully that will help you work better with them when you're playing your main.

Edit: With that said... I have never felt a pit of despair as bad as trying to heal a full ranged dps team as AST in the new 24-man raid. I felt utterly useless. Each on a different corner of those massive arenas. My earthly star (aoe heal) was useless, my collective conscious (mitigation + regen) was useless and my aoe balances (+dmg) missed at least 3 of them every time... just please.... stop being at max range... for the love of the Twelve... just stop being allergic to anything that can remotely help you. The boss aoe damage will get to you no matter where you are. Buffs/heals however will not.

As someone who's strictly played a caster class since EverQuest, WoW, and now FFXIV - absolutely. I finally got my rotation down on my DRG, right before taking a break from the game for 6 months, which means i've totally forgotten what I learned and now I'm hesitant to take the DRG into dungeons XD Gotta get some practice dummy time in or maybe some Feast action to get me back into the swing of DRG.

Ranged is always much easier in MMOs. Bosses are given mechanics to make the tank and healer work. These mechanics almost always destroy melee dps. Meanwhile as ranged, you can sit there spamming your abilities, rarely having to worry about death. Even in FFXIV with bosses throwing out room-wide AoEs, it's still much easier to play ranged.

Not only that, but you can actually enjoy the fights and stuff. Instead of spending the whole time with your face at butt level. Some games don't offer the camera distance this game does. So you never get to see anything but the boss' rear.

For the most part, I find melee pretty easy. Certain fights can be a problem, like the first boss in Lighthouse. Had an incident last week where I had the choice to die to tsunami or die to 5 massive AoEs that I no chance to run through in time. Was just in a bad position at the time.

But overall, being able to move around and attack feels very smooth to me, where cast times for casters always felt a bit awkward.

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Originally Posted by Fail

Ranged is always much easier in MMOs. Bosses are given mechanics to make the tank and healer work. These mechanics almost always destroy melee dps. Meanwhile as ranged, you can sit there spamming your abilities, rarely having to worry about death. Even in FFXIV with bosses throwing out room-wide AoEs, it's still much easier to play ranged.

Not only that, but you can actually enjoy the fights and stuff. Instead of spending the whole time with your face at butt level. Some games don't offer the camera distance this game does. So you never get to see anything but the boss' rear.

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MCH is laughing at back. Clearly on of the hardest job to play. Mechanicaly, it's very hard, and much more if you want to play well, and any error is fatal. After playing MCH, I found most of the others jobs easy, because they aren't so much rigid than it.

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Originally Posted by Azerhan

MCH is laughing at back. Clearly on of the hardest job to play. Mechanicaly, it's very hard, and much more if you want to play well, and any error is fatal. After playing MCH, I found most of the others jobs easy, because they aren't so much rigid than it.

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I think he was meaning that ranged as a whole tends to be a bit easier on average. I do agree with you that MCN is one of the hardest classes in the game, but most of the rest of the ranged classes are pretty darn easy.

BRD: lol one of the easiest classes in the game
RDM: IMO, the easiest class in the game
BLM: Very simple rotation, though punishing if you screw up. This class does require good knowledge of encounters to maximize DPS though
SMN: Somewhat janky rotation, but the class is relatively simple
MCN: Very difficult job due to clunky mechanics and the incredibly ping reliant Wildfire skill

Melee:
DRG: The rotation is very straightforward, but this job has a million oGCD attacks. So many buttons.
NIN: Mudras are still a bit ping reliant and buff timing is incredibly important for TA windows. Add to that all of the support skills and the constant 15% haste buff and this class is probably the hardest melee job.
MNK: A million positionals and 15% haste. Rotation is relatively easy though for what it is worth
SAM: Looks very simple at first glance, but gets incredibly complex to min/max.

So on average, I'd call the ranged classes simpler to play optimally, though MCN is the most difficult ranged class by far IMO.

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Originally Posted by Tex_Mex

I think he was meaning that ranged as a whole tends to be a bit easier on average. I do agree with you that MCN is one of the hardest classes in the game, but most of the rest of the ranged classes are pretty darn easy.

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I dont think that post had anything to do with basic rotatio. More like how you position yourself as range or melee and how much mechanics ranged have to deal and how much melee have to deal.

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Originally Posted by Sunako

I dont think that post had anything to do with basic rotatio. More like how you position yourself as range or melee and how much mechanics ranged have to deal and how much melee have to deal.

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ahhhh gotcha. Well then sure, ranged is definitely easier than melee because they are not punished as hard for bad positioning and they have less mechanics to deal with.

I do find melee to be more difficult.

Not necessarily because I find them more mechanically difficult, but because I tend to prefer ranged combat since I main SMN/SCH. I'm used to when and how I need to be aware of mechanics at range, but much less so at melee range so I tend to get hit or mess up mechanics more on the rare instances I decide to play melee. Hilarious for my friends, slightly bruising to my pride. XD

It’s not hard if you put in time to practice and sss. It’s just those queues....

hmm for me melees are way harder... not just in ff but in most mmos. I love pet cls in general tho I automatically end up on either a range cls like archer/hunter/sniper who goes with wolfs/bird etc or on a magic cls like smn or necromancer – and favoring these kind of cls I never got used to melee in any game...

I'm lately pushing my last jobs to 70... played nin, mnk and currently drg for the last weeks and... its so embarrassing how I act most of the time on these cls...

can't wait to survive the last 4,5 lvl just for the god of war title... so yeah for me melees are more difficult but still a lot of fun, especially the fast ones like nin or mnk (heard lately sam is going to wush wush faster as well now... my was still crit/det in the beginning) q.q

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Originally Posted by Fail

Ranged is always much easier in MMOs. Bosses are given mechanics to make the tank and healer work. These mechanics almost always destroy melee dps. Meanwhile as ranged, you can sit there spamming your abilities, rarely having to worry about death. Even in FFXIV with bosses throwing out room-wide AoEs, it's still much easier to play ranged.

Not only that, but you can actually enjoy the fights and stuff. Instead of spending the whole time with your face at butt level. Some games don't offer the camera distance this game does. So you never get to see anything but the boss' rear.

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I have to agree. Having been a caster for the 4+ years and switching to mellee to raid it is harder times for me. So many mechanics in Savage for instance range dps could still be attacking while mellee must move out to avoid damage and in turn loose lots of up time. It really annoys me alot, lol

I played a ranged caster dps in wow for the better part of a decade, and decided to try something completely new with DRG last summer. It's not as frustrating as I thought it'd be.

My skills don't have a cast time, so I can often continue my rotation while on the move. On the flipside of this, when the tank needs to move targets it can be slightly annoying trying to keep up in the middle of a critical moment in the rotation.

The only other problem that came up in the past was being on top of a boss or being in the middle of a thick of enemies that needed to be AoE'd down... and then I couldn't see the ground or anything around me because of the almost blinding spell animations going on around my character. Until I learned that I could turn down or turn off other players' spell animations, I often found I couldn't tell when I was standing in an enemy aoe circle.

It's really not as bad as I thought, even for us ground-hugging dragoons.