How do you deal with constant undercutting?

wait when the pay to sell mobile APP comes out, lol

I make a point of not buying from people who have less than a 10% price difference than other buyers, as I prefer to support those are who aren't just undercutting like this example just to put their wares at the top. So for example if I saw your wares at around 10% cheaper than the next cheapest I would buy those, even if someone had put their wares something like 1gil cheaper then yours.

I usually update my price when I log on and when I log off
(sometime once mid day if I play the whorl day on weekend)
I however undercut by only 1~100g, there are enough people removing 10% of the price everytime they undercut making price go down by 50% in a week (price fluctuat do quick on Ragnarok....)

I always undercut very heavily because I want to sell my stuff, rather than sitting on it for days, or having to play these petty 1 gil MB fights, especially on markets that are slow. It's not just a game you're going to win.

Although it's quite annoying how on some days, hunts become more profitable than a bunch of classes you leveled to 70.

Well, people did finally find a way to beat the annoying undercutting bot, but it basically just boiled down to figuring out what they decided to set as their price floor, then selling lower then that so they wouldn't undercut anymore.

This is still ultimately allowing them to dictate what prices things are being sold at, but it's better then them hogging all the profits.

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Originally Posted by Fiorinol

Although it's quite annoying how on some days, hunts become more profitable than a bunch of classes you leveled to 70.

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I usually make most of my money by selling materia, but in this dead period between raid tiers, it's worth so little that it almost doesn't feel worth selling it right now.

Tend not to think about it or care too much, though if someone is being unreasonable with their undercuts for their frequency, by any chance. Then I'll just take mine off the board, affix materia and relist. If they're that happy with crashing the market, then go for it.

They'll either persist and crash the market, or they will get confused, and/or annoyed

Undercutting can be annoying, but when something is sitting for a week or two and isnt moving, I can understand it. For example, the moogle beds. When they first came out, someone sold one for like 4 million, so others tried that. Didn't work. Not another sold until they were down to about 500k.

If someone undercuts enough, I might buy the item myself and relist it at a more normal price IF I know it will actually sell. For example, bought about 50 aethersands at 9500 a piece when they normally sell for 25-30k each. Sold them back and made a hefty profit.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

Well, people did finally find a way to beat the annoying undercutting bot, but it basically just boiled down to figuring out what they decided to set as their price floor, then selling lower then that so they wouldn't undercut anymore.

This is still ultimately allowing them to dictate what prices things are being sold at, but it's better then them hogging all the profits.



I usually make most of my money by selling materia, but in this dead period between raid tiers, it's worth so little that it almost doesn't feel worth selling it right now.

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It's definitely not worth selling, but when 5 crafts of something that has demand are worth as much as one materia from a hunt, crafting feels very lame.

When I sell things on the mb, I tend to undercut by 1-100 Gil at the most.

I know if I make it too low someone will just resell it because of their greed. My preferred way: I don't sell something for higher than the price I would be willing to buy it for.

I think of both sides of the market, not just the sellers.

Yeah I think some players just want to get their stuff sold and I will undercut if necessary, just have little need to hold on to things I don't need and if someone else can benefit from the items (and reduced price) then it's mostly win win. It is annoying when you see someone purposely competing with you when they reduce the cost by a few gil, but hey ho it's just a game and it's not a massive problem at all.

Hey so, if you undercutters could start undercutting on some Groundsloth pelts, I'd be real appreciative of that ;)

Decided to move off the Gazelle accessory market recently since they're selling much slower and for less gil lately with the new gear, so I priced my last few cheap to clear with a good 10% undercut. One guy who is a regular seller on that market has been undercutting my clearance items like crazy. He's literally halved the price of his market over a few days. Doesn't hurt me at all, rather amusing though :p

I don't have much of a problem with undercutting, except when it's excessive. Lately, I facepalmed over some guy trying to control the mame shiba market. Dude was selling like 10 of them, all at the lowest price. As usual, I sold mine a bit onver the minimum. Next day, price had been cut by 20 000 gils. Just this time, I undercut by a mere 2 000 gils to see what happens. 10 minutes later, he had cut all his shiba by 20 000 gils. I don't understand those people.

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Originally Posted by Kalayel

I don't have much of a problem with undercutting, except when it's excessive. Lately, I facepalmed over some guy trying to control the mame shiba market. Dude was selling like 10 of them, all at the lowest price. As usual, I sold mine a bit onver the minimum. Next day, price had been cut by 20 000 gils. Just this time, I undercut by a mere 2 000 gils to see what happens. 10 minutes later, he had cut all his shiba by 20 000 gils. I don't understand those people.

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can you send that guy to Luisoix?

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Originally Posted by Kalayel

I don't have much of a problem with undercutting, except when it's excessive. Lately, I facepalmed over some guy trying to control the mame shiba market. Dude was selling like 10 of them, all at the lowest price. As usual, I sold mine a bit onver the minimum. Next day, price had been cut by 20 000 gils. Just this time, I undercut by a mere 2 000 gils to see what happens. 10 minutes later, he had cut all his shiba by 20 000 gils. I don't understand those people.

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Sometimes it's an aggressive "get off my market" tactic. He wants you to see that if you undercut him, he'll drive the market into the ground, thus hoping you'll give it up in disgust as unprofitable and move to a different market.

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Originally Posted by SinSiew79

can you send that guy to Luisoix?

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Wish I could

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Sometimes it's an aggressive "get off my market" tactic. He wants you to see that if you undercut him, he'll drive the market into the ground, thus hoping you'll give it up in disgust as unprofitable and move to a different market.

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Yeah, that's why I actually rose the price after that. Didn't want to play this little game. Funny thing is, I sold it shortly after that, certainly someone who don't like the market controlling type.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Sometimes it's an aggressive "get off my market" tactic. He wants you to see that if you undercut him, he'll drive the market into the ground, thus hoping you'll give it up in disgust as unprofitable and move to a different market.

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No, sometimes people will do that to bait aggressive undercutters and then buying them out.

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Originally Posted by Kalayel

I don't have much of a problem with undercutting, except when it's excessive. Lately, I facepalmed over some guy trying to control the mame shiba market. Dude was selling like 10 of them, all at the lowest price. As usual, I sold mine a bit onver the minimum. Next day, price had been cut by 20 000 gils. Just this time, I undercut by a mere 2 000 gils to see what happens. 10 minutes later, he had cut all his shiba by 20 000 gils. I don't understand those people.

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10 of them? Damn. I thought the dude on my server who undercut everyone else by 300k with one Mamaeshiba was bad enough.

Lately the undercutting is getting really bad. Almost all the food isn't worth crafting; it makes no profit on its own. And a lot of the gear you sell at a loss versus selling the mats themselves.

It pisses me off actually. I was in a war for 3 weeks on my server over the night pegasus whistle. Started out at 27 million and a guy kept undercutting me until it sold around 15 million. I wish you could know who was really doing it but it would be a violation of TOS I imagine. It's just really annoying and you need to live in game on the marketboard to constantly do it and when I'm out or at work and log in, I find my stuff undercutted D:

I haven't been able to sell anything but materia and weapons over the last week. All my other items are just sitting there...some being undercut and some still the lowest price.

Makes me wonder if the game somehow blocks visibility of items until certain times, limiting how much/often you can sell.

The market is in pretty terrible shape lately. But it will likely change when the new patch arrives.

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Originally Posted by CainCrimson

I haven't been able to sell anything but materia and weapons over the last week. All my other items are just sitting there...some being undercut and some still the lowest price.

Makes me wonder if the game somehow blocks visibility of items until certain times, limiting how much/often you can sell.

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The game population is currently at a low point with the stutter subbers waiting for the next patch before re subbing. So the market is in a doldrum. Sales will pick up after the patch but will the older synths sell any better? I cannot say.

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Originally Posted by Caimie_Tsukino

The market is in pretty terrible shape lately. But it will likely change when the new patch arrives.

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undercutting isnt going to go anywhere and your not forced to follow along with the undercutter, point of fact is you should just let it sell as not getting that one sale isnt a big deal unless someone keeps posting new items cheaper than yours everytime they sell one.

back in ARR gil was harder to get and people had less need to undercut so drastically so the market stayed for the most part more stable, nowadays gil is everywhere and even the poor have 20mil+ so people drop prices quickly for the quick sale. it creates a buyers market so to speak and is really great if your into collecting things like minions mounts songs and barding as it will bring prices down and remove any rng in actually getting those items from dungeons / raids as gil is much less rng based to get.

like recently i got a dodo mount for 10mil and no rng, 10mil is really easy to make back and if i get a drop from hoh when i can get back on to finish it ill relist and it will make the one i bought cheaper or free depending on its value at the time.

just be smart and dont worry if you dont sell everything within a hour. making gil is super easy nowadays and you will always have access to more when the time arises. heck even clusters still make gil as i recently sold a few stacks of 100 at 2k each, just gotta sometimes sit on things and eventually they sell.

and just incase your one of those who are into gil collecting then if thats the case you just got to play the undercutting game but then im sure your already prepared for that.

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Originally Posted by chidarake

undercutting isnt going to go anywhere and your not forced to follow along with the undercutter, point of fact is you should just let it sell as not getting that one sale isnt a big deal unless someone keeps posting new items cheaper than yours everytime they sell one.

back in ARR gil was harder to get and people had less need to undercut so drastically so the market stayed for the most part more stable, nowadays gil is everywhere and even the poor have 20mil+...

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I've currently got $500,000, which by that standard would make me the lowest of the low lol....









https://media.tenor.com/images/cdcda...fd82/tenor.gif

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Sometimes it's an aggressive "get off my market" tactic. He wants you to see that if you undercut him, he'll drive the market into the ground, thus hoping you'll give it up in disgust as unprofitable and move to a different market.

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I did that once, but as a counter to someone who was camping their retainers and undercutting me all day long within minutes, sometimes even seconds after I would post something. Our retainers were in different regions, so it was really unnecessary. Luckily, it was gear he was doing it on, so I looked at the signature on the tooltip. Did a little research on the MB and I noticed that same character was buying large amounts of the materials needed to craft said gear. I was gathering mine, so my cost was basically zero. I crashed the market to the point where it would be unprofitable for him to keep up, and within a day, the constant camping and undercuts stopped. I bought him out and jacked the price back up to normal and never had issues after that. He was still listing, but wasn't undercutting constantly anymore.

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Originally Posted by Driskus

I was gathering mine, so my cost was basically zero.

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Time is intrinsically valuable. Your cost is not zero just because you gathered it. You lost out on whatever gil you could have spent that time making.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Time is intrinsically valuable. Your cost is not zero just because you gathered it. You lost out on whatever gil you could have spent that time making.

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That's opportunity costs. I don't think Drikus cares about opportunity costs.

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Originally Posted by Shadygrove

That's opportunity costs. I don't think Drikus cares about opportunity costs.

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Whether he cares about them or not is immaterial.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Whether he cares about them or not is immaterial.

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Loss of potential profit is not the same as cost.

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Originally Posted by Caitlinzulu

Loss of potential profit is not the same as cost.

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There's no functional difference. You spent a resource to acquire your materials.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Whether he cares about them or not is immaterial.

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It actually is very relevant. The value of the lost time is Subjective to how Driskus chooses to spend their time and what value THEY place on that time. If Driskus, sees their time gathering mats as "free time", then the value of said time is "basically zero" as they stated.

Yes, time has value, but the value of said time is inherently subjective to the individual. i.e. The value of the fry guy at McDonald's time is not the same as the value of the time of the best Cardiac Surgeon in the world..........

On topic:

I gather my own mats, either myself or via retainer, and craft all my own pre-crafts. So I don't mind the undercutters, it is very rare that they can afford to go as low as I can.

Most heavy undercutters are relying on volume sales to make their gil and to achieve that they almost always need to be buying mats and pre-crafts. There is a certain point they will not be willing to cross.

It's just the way the game is played. i can tell you from alot of experience those who constantly check the Mb benefit alot more, this is why they do it. If I am a hawk on the MB I will make 2-6 million a day. If I am lazy on the MB, I will only make 500k -2 mil a day. Over the course of a few days or week, that certainly adds up. There is no rule against undercutting, it's part of the MB game. It requires time and effort, so you get out of it what you put in. What I don't like is when people undercut by 10%-30% each time, what's the point? You're hurting yourself as much as anyone else. I always undercut by 1 or 100 gil, no matter the item, no matter the city-state.

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Originally Posted by Remyogic

It actually is very relevant. The value of the lost time is Subjective to how Driskus chooses to spend their time and what value THEY place on that time. If Driskus, sees their time gathering mats as "free time", then the value of said time is "basically zero" as they stated.

Yes, time has value, but the value of said time is inherently subjective to the individual. i.e. The value of the fry guy at McDonald's time is not the same as the value of the time of the best Cardiac Surgeon in the world..........

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Subjectivity is a different issue than failing to recognize time as an expended resource in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Subjectivity is a different issue than failing to recognize time as an expended resource in the first place.

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Driskus never failed to recognize that they were expending the resource of time. You failed in trying to mandate they equate a high value to that time. If they value their time at $0, then even a million hours = $0. The expended resource of time and it's impact on profits is ENTIRELY a subjective matter.

Driskus never stated that their cost was absolute zero, either, they stated "basically zero". You are the one who tried to force a different value onto their time.

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Originally Posted by Remyogic

Driskus never failed to recognize that they were expending the resource of time. You failed in trying to mandate they equate a high value to that time. If they value their time at $0, then even a million hours = $0. The expended resource of time and it's impact on profits is ENTIRELY a subjective matter.

Driskus never stated that their cost was absolute zero, either, they stated "basically zero". You are the one who tried to force a different value onto their time.

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Believe whatever you want, I guess. Sorry for trying to help people make better economic decisions.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Believe whatever you want, I guess. Sorry for trying to help people make better economic decisions.

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I'm not "believing whatever I want". My statements are facts of economics and the monetary value of time.

I understand where you were going with your original statement, but you made it in a confrontational manner and not in a helpful, informative manner.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Time is intrinsically valuable. Your cost is not zero just because you gathered it. You lost out on whatever gil you could have spent that time making.

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If you truly wanted to be helpful and were not just trying to stupify the OP, it could have been said this way:

"It takes quite a bit of time to gather your own mats, be sure to check the market board regularly for those mats. Often, the price of the mats you need will temporarily drop to a level where it is more time/cost efficient to buy the mats and use the time you normally gather to earn gil in other ways."

However, dropping vague one-liners and trying to pass it off as infinite wisdom, isn't helpful in any way.

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Originally Posted by Remyogic

I'm not "believing whatever I want". My statements are facts of economics and the monetary value of time.

I understand where you were going with your original statement, but you made it in a confrontational manner and not in a helpful, informative manner.



If you truly wanted to be helpful and were not just trying to stupify the OP, it could have been said this way:

"It takes quite a bit of time to gather your own mats, be sure to check the market board regularly for those mats. Often, the price of the mats you need will temporarily drop to a level where it is more time/cost efficient to buy the mats and use the time you normally gather to earn gil in other ways."

However, dropping vague one-liners and trying to pass it off as infinite wisdom, isn't helpful in any way.

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Your version is three times as long and does not capture the original meaning. My original statement also wasn't vague. Like I said though, believe whatever you want. Your "facts" are wrong, but I guess we practice feelonomics in this forum.

Undercutting by 1g is just childish... I can see that they're just trying to keep theirs at the top of the board but when things don't sell very often it means my incidental items never sell. I'll usually check the history and put an item up for what it seemed to sell for in the past. If someone keeps 1g undercutting me I start lowering the price by about 2% each time. Usually others will follow suit, adjusting a bit, so mine is never so low as to be attractive for resale. If they match my price, even if their listing is above mine due to Retainer name, I don't undercut at all.

The fact is that I am the worst monster when it comes to the board.

Have you ever bought out an item that was confirmed for Fashion Report to put it up for over ten times its original price? Then someone puts 3-5 of them up all weekend, adding more when they sell, and regularly undercutting by 5-10% until they're selling for near what you paid.
Perhaps you found something people like for glamour that uses very cheap mats and listed it for nearly one-hundred times what it cost you? One day ten of them are listed for half what you're charging, driving the price down, with more following until your price looks ridiculous compared to the sale history.
Or perhaps even buying vendor items and listing them for double or triple their cost? It seems good until they start being listed for vendor price plus market tax and an additional 1000g.

That's what I do.

I see people in this thread complaining about listings being under the regular price, that it annoys them, and it annoys me just as much to see listings trying to take advantage of situations to charge way more than the item is really worth or previously sold for. I attempt to correct this. It's not completely altruistic: seeing prices shift and change over the course of time, desperately squeezing as much profit as possible from the situation, while I make steady returns is pretty funny.