SE: Thank you for finally releasing the male bunny suits!

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

And while we're at it, cover up the female DRG's AF1 costume, the frostbite in Coerthas alone would kill her before a dragon can claw at that sort flesh.

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That gears gut-me window would gut her if she just leaned forward as well. "Sexy" armor isn't sexy when it can literally kill you.

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Originally Posted by Rokke

Its the female equivalent to the butler set. Making the butler set unisex would widen the gap in the disparity between male & female glams.

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Let females wear the butler set. Let males wear the maid set.

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Originally Posted by Jaibamon

Let females wear the butler set. Let males wear the maid set.

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http://gifimage.net/wp-content/uploa...s-up-gif-6.gif

pass go
collect $200

That's the thing that amuses me the most about this. The devs opened Pandora's box. There's no going back now.

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Originally Posted by Jaibamon

I am curious, why do you want locked gear?

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Well, on top of reasons Cidel mentioned, it would increase the glamour options. Not increase the options for myself or you to wear, but the options we see made and view in our day to day lives in the game. If you have racial and gender locked gear, you'd see more variance in what a crowd of people opt to put on. On top of that, working around restrictions can push peoples creative juices and you can find some really nice looking setups. Not to mention that gear tailored to specifics rather than masses generally fits the form much better. Captures the racial identity and gender charms. If you can't appreciate fashion design with this in mind, we should all just play male midlander hyur and be done with it all. (No offense to male midlanders out there!)

Most people jump to the conclusion that more items = more options, but when people tend to gravitate toward a similar items, it's overall less to look at from the perspective of someone removed from the glamour game.
Seeing a creative outfit purposed using gear only some specific gender and race could wear makes for something interesting to look at and see. Something I likely can't wear. Something that makes makes me appreciate the thought that went into this characters outfit.

This just can't happen if everyone could wear everything.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

(No offense to male midlanders out there!)

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;[

You're not wrong about unisex outfits in the sense that that's a big part of why we're in the male-glamour mess we're in right now, because a great deal of the unisex outfits are designed with the female figure in mind, specifically caster and healer gear, so the male charas get shafted because even people who enjoy that aesthetic can only put up with so much of it. But we're not short on examples where we finally got outfits that were male locked, with the male figure in mind, and what happened? They unlocked them, leaving female charas with twice as many glamour options for that set while males were left with the one outfit. And that's part of what you're talking about, I get it, I'm just facing the reality of the matter and the devs' playing favorites. We had, in this very thread, people preaching to unlock the butler outfit without giving male charas something back to balance it, and mind, I'm talking about something that will be more mainstream acceptable and not played for a joke, as much as my chara would totally rock the maid outfit.

With SE's tendency to double down on gender unlocking outfits for female charas and leaving males with limited glamour options, I'd rather they just went all unisex and give everyone the same glamour options rather than keep things gender locked, because one of two things will happen: 1. they'll release only a female-locked glamour without a male equivalent (the battle-worn Hildy outfit doesn't frigging count), 2. they'll unlock the male outfit. I mean, even with things being unisex they'll still invest more in the female NPCs so we'll inevitably get more of those in the mog shop (just look at the Ivalice raid's NPCs - both guys are using in-game glamour while the lady got brand new clothes, and NPC outfits are the one thing they don't unlock), but at least deal with the non-npc glamour options.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

And while we're at it, cover up the female DRG's AF1 costume, the frostbite in Coerthas alone would kill her before a dragon can claw at that sort flesh.

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Think what you want about the female drg af1, but since then all af but healers have the been same.
Female ninja af1 pants are still and will probably stay the best pants in the game, 2 and 3 were cursed with the same baggy pants as the men.
I want female nin pants to be sexy again.

I was kinda expecting something a little more unique... if they were just gonna use the same model I wonder why it took so long.
Female char though, it's of no consequence to me.

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Originally Posted by Daisy

I was kinda expecting something a little more unique... if they were just gonna use the same model I wonder why it took so long.
Female char though, it's of no consequence to me.

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probably took so long due to hesitation. They knew people would flip their lids over male characters wearing female gear. (waits for people to jump down my throat)

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

They're worked on by different teams so really, no harm done.

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Well, maybe get more male gear in general or you know... work on things that's not copy paste?

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Originally Posted by akaneakki

Well, maybe get more male gear in general or you know... work on things that's not copy paste?

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That's crazy talk :P

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Originally Posted by Transient_Shadow

probably took so long due to hesitation...

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From what was said by the devs in one interview, I'm going to hazard a guess that the male gear designers were uncomfortable putting the bunny suit on male models which is why it sounded like the job practically fell solely on their female designers.

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Originally Posted by Jaibamon

Square doesn't have to limit themselves or put much effort: if they make a piece of cloth aimed to one gender, take that exact piece and apply it to the other gender....

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Except apparently it took a lot of "effort"- case in point: how long it took for the bunny outfits to be made unisex.

You sound very open-minded about the issue and that's great; and I'm not defending the designers or anything, but they've showed that they have a bias towards female models for glamour. Hestzhyen said it perfectly: they're more interested in playing Barbie with their female avatars.

Honestly, I'm fine with either-or, so long as they're fair about it.

No interest in bunny suits personally, but if that's your thing, go for it! Personally, I'd love to see some more cool stuff done for guys-- how about tank tops to go with those tantalum jeans and some full length leather jackets (instead of those weird half-jackets you get from Eureka or for gathering). Or a high school gakuran for guys. You've got a sailor suit for girls.

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Originally Posted by Ryaz

No interest in bunny suits personally, but if that's your thing, go for it! Personally, I'd love to see some more cool stuff done for guys-- how about tank tops to go with those tantalum jeans and some full length leather jackets (instead of those weird half-jackets you get from Eureka or for gathering). Or a high school gakuran for guys. You've got a sailor suit for girls.

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Wouldn't that technically be called a leather coat?

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Originally Posted by Vhailor

Also, I really wish they'd do something about Glamours in combat scenarios. Watching a tank charge into a crowd of monsters wearing swim trunks really shreds whatever sense of immersion still exists within FFXIV.

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And I hope that they never impose BS restrictions.
Yeah I too am somewhat annoyed by Bikini tanks but knowing SE, if they implement restrictions they will go completely overboard.

Let people choose themselves and be done with it.

@Topic: I expect to se men in bunny suits serve me drinks in the Gold Saucer now.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Wouldn't that technically be called a leather coat?

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A coat goes to thigh length or longer. When I say full length jacket, I mean to the waist. The current ones in the game are like half-jackets that only go maybe half way down your back.

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Originally Posted by Granyala

@Topic: I expect to se men in bunny suits serve me drinks in the Gold Saucer now.

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Please no. I spend too much time in there as is.

To each their own i guess, i think it looks .. awful
But kudos to those that wanted it i guess

"Please blacklist me, I'm a degenerate.": The Glamour

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Originally Posted by Maero

To each their own i guess, i think it looks .. awful

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It looks just as retarded on female characters but mass media apparently conditioned most people to not mind females in ridiculous outfits, hence no "awkward feeling" DEVs for the female version.

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Originally Posted by Granyala

It looks just as retarded on female characters but mass media apparently conditioned most people to not mind females in ridiculous outfits, hence no "awkward feeling" DEVs for the female version.

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It is pretty bad, I'm still not really sure why that got put in the game. There didn't seem to be any need for it.

Honestly, I've had to erase my post at least 6 times now because I just don't know what to say about this.
Was there 'really' that many people that requested this to happen? And that absolutely need to genderbend/crossdress their characters?

You do you, I suppose. To me, it breaks my immersion when I see stuff like this. But hey, everyone has the right to choice in what they want in their game, right?

Enjoy...

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Originally Posted by KrenianKandos

And that absolutely need to genderbend/crossdress their characters?

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Clothes are gender-neutral. Specifically the ears and cuffs.

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To me, it breaks my immersion when I see stuff like this.

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Does it break your immersion when a catgirl wears it or just a male Elezen?

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Originally Posted by KrenianKandos

Honestly, I've had to erase my post at least 6 times now because I just don't know what to say about this.
Was there 'really' that many people that requested this to happen? And that absolutely need to genderbend/crossdress their characters?

You do you, I suppose. To me, it breaks my immersion when I see stuff like this. But hey, everyone has the right to choice in what they want in their game, right?

Enjoy...

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and bikini tanks and the ghost costume aren't immersion breaking? Face it people are openly hostile towards this just because they can't handle a little cross dressing. you don't like it? tough. people are tired of dealing with your 'normal' for ages. let people enjoy stuff for pete sakes.

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Originally Posted by jameseoakes

It is pretty bad, I'm still not really sure why that got put in the game. There didn't seem to be any need for it.

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"Herp derp, what is the Gold Saucer?"

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

Clothes are gender-neutral. Specifically the ears and cuffs.

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And genderbending/crossdressing isn't. The action is what makes gender based. And the view of society. So yeah, it's fine if you say clothing is gender neutral. To me, the whole suit is ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

Does it break your immersion when a catgirl wears it or just a male Elezen?

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Both. I could do without the whole suit completely. I get 'why' it's in the game with the Manderville Golden Saucer but I would have been a bit more content with simpler well dressed casino style suits than that. That way you can have 'gender neutral' clothing in butler suits.

Trust me. I've railed against seeing pigs and bikinis on both sexes. I play a Roe; you have no idea how many times I've cringed seeing a Roe in a swimsuit.

But thank you for trying to slap me with a title of sexist by choosing to push the whole "well he's male so let's see if female related gear on females bugs him to show he's a sexist pig". Kudos on that.

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Originally Posted by Transient_Shadow

and bikini tanks and the ghost costume aren't immersion breaking? Face it people are openly hostile towards this just because they can't handle a little cross dressing. you don't like it? tough. people are tired of dealing with your 'normal' for ages. let people enjoy stuff for pete sakes.

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You presume I'm happy with those. I'm not. This has been an issue in this game for a while now where when I play in a fantasy/technology RPG, stuff like those two you pointed out are done in dungeons. I would much rather be event related like the ghost or world restricted like the bikini suits.

But as a counterpoint, I'm also against the fact that the DRG Female armor showed skin. I much prefer the dress up of, say, Artoria/Altria from Fate as armor on females than the DRG one.

I get why they do it. But do I not have a right to voice my opinion on the matter? I thought this was a 'forum' where we are allowed to voice our opinions. I see a ton of opinions out there of many different things. This is me, voicing mine, about this particular topic.

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Originally Posted by KrenianKandos

Kudos on that.

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To be fair, I wasn't calling you sexist. A bunch of other things, yes, but not sexist.
As mentioned above, there's a bunch of things in the game already that break immersion. Let us have this one because despite everything, this is still a huge win.

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Originally Posted by KrenianKandos

But do I not have a right to voice my opinion on the matter?

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The rights for opinion and free speech do not equate freedom from criticism or response. This is, as you said, a forum, and there are more of us here than just you. No one's censoring you, just voicing our own opinions on the matter back.

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Originally Posted by Qojon

"Herp derp, what is the Gold Saucer?"

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I have no idea what you are trying to get at

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

To be fair, I wasn't calling you sexist. A bunch of other things, yes, but not sexist.

As mentioned above, there's a bunch of things in the game already that break immersion. Let us have this one because despite everything, this is still a huge win.

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I think it's mostly the fact that i'm tired of them adding 'more' things to break my immersion, honestly. The line essentially won't stop. Furthermore, this is essentially them having to redo art style for 12 different races (2 types of races for six males) to which I would rather they do something more gender neutral and fitting for both classes that is 'new' than this silly stuff. But again, it's a personal opinion. And perhaps sexist was the wrong word but no, I'm against a lot of things that show up in the game which are silly as hell. I like muh immerzionz, damnit.

Again, if you were one of the few who wanted this, hey, awesome. I'm happy you got something out of the dev team that'll make you happy. To me, I think it wasn't necessary. That's all.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

The rights for opinion and free speech do not equate freedom from criticism or response. This is, as you said, a forum, and there are more of us here than just you. No one's censoring you, just voicing our own opinions on the matter back.

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Oh I completely agree but there are ways to discuss it. I was pointing out I was stating my opinion. Have every right to criticism and respond to my argument, but the way I felt you came towards it was a bit aggressive in the sense you flipped it on me thinking I was one of 'those' people.


Look. Took the wrong way around this and maybe I shouldn't have snipped at you about that last part. But i'm tired of being labelled as a chauvinistic pig that only likes eyecandy cause i'm a straight male; that's so not who I am and it's Monday and we're all snippy on Mondays. I get why you did it cause a lot of times that is the case, but I felt like I had to defend myself here.

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Originally Posted by KrenianKandos

I think it's mostly the fact that i'm tired of them adding 'more' things to break my immersion, honestly.

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That I can respect and partially agree with. Having your healer LB3 in a pig suit kind of makes you wonder if there aren't more important things to worry about than the Garlean Empire when that affront against the Twelve is right there with you. It just doesn't bother me as much as it does you, for a mercy, and I'm even guilty of doubling down on it on occasion. I get a good laugh whenever I go Lalafell and the Allalafather rides again because I also got Sleipnir.

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I get why you did it cause a lot of times that is the case, but I felt like I had to defend myself here.

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We good, fam o/

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

That's the thing that amuses me the most about this. The devs opened Pandora's box. There's no going back now.

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Indeed, they'll probably stick with the same excuse as usual for cosplay outfits; LYSE WAS A GIRL, SO MEN CANT WEAR THIS. But, whats the new excuse for non-cosplay gender restricted glamours going to be, like the expeditioners tabard...and so on.

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Originally Posted by jameseoakes

I have no idea what you are trying to get at

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Whooosh....

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Originally Posted by Qojon

"Please blacklist me, I'm a degenerate.": The Glamour

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You don't need a glamour for that, as we can see by your post.

Anyways... yeah, thanks SE for the bunny outfits. Was hoping for more but I'll take it nonetheless.

Honestly, I was just as disappointed because I thought they'd put a bit more of effort into it. Though, some pieces can be used to get the desired glamour like some people mentioned. I main girl Au Ra so I really don't have word with this, apparently. -.-

As for the bikini tanks breaking immersion... you weren't too immersed with the game if that breaks it, to be honest. Glamour prisms are a thing in Eorzea and they project an item's look into other. These "bikini tanks" are still using their full plated armours, but through the prisms, they make them look like bikinis. The only exceptions to this rule, are the Shisui and Sky Rat outfit. The Coliseum outfit is "Disciple of War" gear, so either physical DPS or tanks can use them. But they have a lower defensive stat compared to tank-only gear. This applies to other pieces of gear as well, was using the bikinis as an extreme example.

I wish they just removed the restrictions, baby steps. One day my male role may be able to become a bikini tank, he is modest and likes to leave certain things the imagination. I am also glad they did not try and make a "male" version and kept it more or less the same as the female one.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Well, on top of reasons Cidel mentioned, it would increase the glamour options. Not increase the options for myself or you to wear, but the options we see made and view in our day to day lives in the game. If you have racial and gender locked gear, you'd see more variance in what a crowd of people opt to put on. On top of that, working around restrictions can push peoples creative juices and you can find some really nice looking setups. Not to mention that gear tailored to specifics rather than masses generally fits the form much better. Captures the racial identity and gender charms. If you can't appreciate fashion design with this in mind, we should all just play male midlander hyur and be done with it all. (No offense to male midlanders out there!)

Most people jump to the conclusion that more items = more options, but when people tend to gravitate toward a similar items, it's overall less to look at from the perspective of someone removed from the glamour game.
Seeing a creative outfit purposed using gear only some specific gender and race could wear makes for something interesting to look at and see. Something I likely can't wear. Something that makes makes me appreciate the thought that went into this characters outfit.

This just can't happen if everyone could wear everything.

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The problem with this line of thinking is that, as you say people gravitate to certain styles. All the locks do is make it so that most people who have access will gravitate to that style. The problem isn't that the popular options are so popular you need to lock them to encourage visual diversity, but rather, we need a much bigger selection of popular styles.

If only catgirls can wear a popular outfit in a limited selection of outfits of which many are not regarded as popular, then most catgirls are going to wear that popular outfit. Diversity in regards to catgirls goes the way of the dodo.

If everyone can wear a popular outfit in a huge selection of popular outfits, then diversity across the board is increased.

Locking outfits to races or gender does not promote diversity. It only compartmentalizes the lack of diversity.

We need less locking, but also MORE outfits widely regarded as popular. Such as how many calls for male clothing that isn't a dress (of which I've made many a post). Eureka glams helped in this regard since none of the chest pieces are dresses/robes/longcoats and have no restrictions in who can glam them.

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Originally Posted by Vhailor

Also, I really wish they'd do something about Glamours in combat scenarios. Watching a tank charge into a crowd of monsters wearing swim trunks really shreds whatever sense of immersion still exists within FFXIV. I'm not sure how they'd fix this, but there are options; maybe introduce some sort of level 1 "leisure" job that players can switch to (but one that can't gain XP). Then, restrict all of these purely Glamour-focused, non-combat outfits to this new job.

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Well, actually if you payed attention to the story then you'd see that glamor IS a thing in universe. There are side quests where it's used and even portions of the main quest. The tank running into combat with swim trunks? The trunks are an illusion. He's really wearing platemail. That's literally how glamor works. It's magic. I could give actual examples in the story but needless to say it'd be spoilers. Glamor is a thing in universe.

In fact given glamour is an actual thing in universe the tank running into combat in swim shorts is being smart and tactical. The enemy doesn't know what's covered, what isn't, or how well armed he is.

Wait a minute... This was never confirmed right? Are modders playing games with us???

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Originally Posted by Roth_Trailfinder

Meh. I understand a lot of people want to play dress-up with their doll (character) and to break gender lines, but honestly, I’d rather see Devs spend time on content than on addressing a silly clothing imbalance.

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Glam is true end game.