Level Sync and How to Fix It

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DeaconMoore

Lowbies getting kicked so higher levels can come in for a quick run will drive new players away and reinvigorate nothing.

---

The exception, not the rule. This mindset is blown out of proportion on the Official Forums. I don't understand it.

The only way I see being able to have a vast number of skills when synched down and be fair is.

Have a every skill 1-70 starting at level 1 for each job/class.
Then everything upgrades like Bio in potency and scaling.

Fast Blade I- Level 1
Fast Blade II- Level 20
Fast Blade III- Level 40
Fast Blade IV- Level 50
Fast Blade V- Level 60
Fast Blade VI- Level 70
Fast Blade- Etc,etc

I am kind of not liking that even if it is boring or slow in starter levels. Once we start screwing with progression, they might as well make everything available at level one and get rid of levels(I like levels, not this world scaling thing the hip mmos are doing now). I like having something to look forward to even when now is not going so hot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashenspire

The exception, not the rule. This mindset is blown out of proportion on the Official Forums. I don't understand it.

---

You're advocating for that very behavior whether you realize it or not. Your whole point is to get the dungeons done even faster for high level players. Why spend 20 minutes with some lowbies in sastasha when you can bootem in 5 and get the place done in 12?

I don't really see why this is considered a problem that needs to be "fixed". I mean, if they do let us keep our abilities or some rendition of it (but obviously scaled), then wonderful. If not, then business as usual. Are people really that adamant about their frustration (a very strong word to use in this context) at losing their skills/spells for 20min? Even in the case of tanks not having their stances, it obviously hasn't been a game breaking loss...

The fix, I would assume, is simple enough to implement (scaling down our tools to whatever level), but given the fact that dungeons are designed around the lack of them and how quickly/easily we clear them, I'd think frustrations would grow even larger among this crowd of complainers. In other words, should the time come that they get a party that does not have the additional skills/spells available to them, then said person become much more frequently frustrated at the fact the run is not going as fast as it "should" be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashenspire

Or you're showing the players without the skills the stuff they will be able to do eventually. Tanks pulling one at a time teach people how to aoe exactly? This continues into Expert roulettes where it doesn't belong. It should be instilled earlier. Do you realize how much faster leveling roulette queues would be for DPS if everyone kept their skills? More people queuing + faster dungeon completion = faster queues. It's a win-win.

Also, the part where I said "if your group has the ability to aoe everything down." If a 70 PLD pulls 4 groups with a low level DRG and MNK, they'll run out of cooldowns, healer will run out of MP, and it'll be a wipe. AKA the group didn't have the ability to aoe everything down.

---

You can't teach people how to aoe because they don't care. Also there is no need to change the level sync except maybe scale the gear of people more down as it is right now.

I always hate the balance argument when it comes to this discussion. If you've cleared something before and have half a brain, old dungeons are hilariously easy. I can leave Selene/Eos on Sic and they'll solo heal just about everything up to the lvl 40-ish dungeons. And besides, we're really gonna pretend like SE gives a shit about balance? Go do any of the Crystal Tower or Mhachi raids now. Not only do you skip most of the mechanics in CT, you and the rest of the raid almost have to go out of your way to wipe in any of those. Same thing with a lot ot Trials. Hell, same thing with a lot of lvl 50 and 60 dungeons. Like...for example, when was the last time you bothered to kill the adds in the last boss of Wanderer's Palace? I'll answer for you: 4 years ago. When was the last time any pre-SB primal took more than 5 minutes? Once you're overgeared for a lot of old content, your biggest hurdle is staying awake. Yup, that takes a lot of skill.

Taking away abilities and forcing players to learn multiple "versions" of their jobs just seems cruel and unnecessary. If SE truly cared about balance, most old content would still pose half a challenge...but it doesn't. It's just busy work made all the more painful by the fact you're playing a gimped version of what you normally play. Some or all of the party is always going to be overgeared and synced down. Might as well give players access to their full kits and let them have some fun. Just make it so the higher level an ability is, the harsher the potency penalty is. That way they can still pretend like they care about balance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Reason they don't do this is that if a new player has an incomplete rotation then they risk being kicked for slowing the run down

---

That is a punishable offense. I think if SE would crack down a bit on people who break the rules they think they can get away with the kick button would be used much more wisely. Bots/harassement/afkers/leechers/wintraders/RMT needs to be punished hard.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vladmiere

That is a punishable offense. I think if SE would crack down a bit on people who break the rules they think they can get away with the kick button would be used much more wisely. Bots/harassement/afkers/leechers/wintraders/RMT needs to be punished hard.

---

Unfortunately, there is a major loophole that has been mentioned countless times on the forums. Playstyle. Unless that is taken out of the equation, then there is no way it will be turned into a punishable offence.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vladmiere

That is a punishable offense. I think if SE would crack down a bit on people who break the rules they think they can get away with the kick button would be used much more wisely. Bots/harassement/afkers/leechers/wintraders/RMT needs to be punished hard.

---

I would think it's actually not. For the same reason a healer can be kicked for not DPSing, in that it's a difference in playstyle or a disruption of play, I'd argue you can kick someone legitimately for lacking the abilities needed to make "your" run more in-line with how you want to play. Such is the result of their passive responses on many matters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DeaconMoore

You're advocating for that very behavior whether you realize it or not. Your whole point is to get the dungeons done even faster for high level players. Why spend 20 minutes with some lowbies in sastasha when you can bootem in 5 and get the place done in 12?

---

Why boot lowbies in 5 minutes when you can get the place done in 6? I've run thousands upon thousands of dungeons as tank, dps, and healer. And the only time I've ever booted or seen someone booted from a dungeon was a Dragoon that used nothing but Full Thrust. Not comboed. Just Full Thrust.

No one is advocating kicking people for low dps. It IS a punishable offense. But the low level roulette is nothing but a chore, and there's no incentive to run it at level 70 unless AiN, and even then it's almost always Tank.

I think it's fine the way it is. It's not like the lower dungeons are hard in any way even when level sync is used. Also this would make dungeons miserable for newbies which is not a good thing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashenspire

Why boot lowbies in 5 minutes when you can get the place done in 6? I've run thousands upon thousands of dungeons as tank, dps, and healer. And the only time I've ever booted or seen someone booted from a dungeon was a Dragoon that used nothing but Full Thrust. Not comboed. Just Full Thrust.

No one is advocating kicking people for low dps. It IS a punishable offense. But the low level roulette is nothing but a chore, and there's no incentive to run it at level 70 unless AiN, and even then it's almost always Tank.

---

You're only running sastasha in 6 if you unsynch, it takes about that long just to run thru the place. You're not doing that in a roulette with lowbies.

Right now their is no reason to kick lowbies. Your change would create a reason and it would be to kick them to get the "chore" of the lowbie dungeons done with quicker.

As far as kicking for low DPS, well you admit to doing just that once and as long as no one says in chat they're kicking the person for that, prove it.

While I understand the sentiment, I don't think it can be done without SQEX spending a ton of time rejigging countless old dungeons and trials to prevent the new skills from completely breaking them.

If anything, I think it would be a better approach if SQEX simply took old level caps into consideration when they rejig jobs. It's great that they reinvent jobs to make them more fun and functional, but they need to find a way to do that without simply butchering their gameplay at previous level caps.

Sorry for the double reply because I can't edit on my phone.

I'd also like to mention that the only thing that will genuinely revive old content is the players wanting it to happen themselves. Old content is already fun AND a challenge. You just have to find that challenge yourself instead of having SQEX hand it to you. Want Ultima to be harder? Either do it on MinIL or try 4-manning it with no tank, Synced.

High-level people don't want to play through low level dungeons cause they are boring, partly because they are crippled in skills.
Roulette bonus was made specifically to incentivize people doing the low level dungeons as necessary despite them not wanting to due to how boring they are.
You want to remove the boring aspect of them, and make them more fun than the high level content...cause let's be honest, sometimes it's actually fun to "melt" the large groups like they were nothing.

Solution?! Remove the roulette bonus altogether...Sure, go ahead and guess how many people will actually DO it then?!

You want to be "rewarded" for being rewarded. And you want that while hurting new players, which WILL get kicked more often with this change. No matter how much you say they won't. Then there are people that will just leave or provoke being kicked cause they got a higher level dungeon that would take twice as long as if they got a low level one. Tanks and healers could afford doing that, seeing as their queue is almost instant, getting a chance at an even faster run.

You really don't know how "people" work. Heck, you don't even seem to understand what motivates you. Just thinking that it would be "cool", without actually thinking (or outright denying when told of them) about the consequences won't help anyone with anything.