Transfer Restrictions and Roleplayers

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Originally Posted by Marluxia

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There's no downside that I can see to segregating RPers away from people who don't consider themselves RPers, most easily with an officially designated RP server.

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That still doesn't tackle the issue others have raised here which is that these communities are already established, and in some cases, heavily invested in. Even if an "official" RP server were designated who would move there if they didn't want to uproot their homes and stories and connections?

It's going to take players dedicated to establishing a community elsewhere, or an incentive for the non-RP crowd to shove off instead.

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Originally Posted by Vanitas

Trying is certainly out of the question I guess.

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Have you heard of Gilgamesh. It is supposed to be the second roleplay server. Roleplay is dead there now. It has been tried before.

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

That still doesn't tackle the issue others have raised here which is that these communities are already established, and in some cases, heavily invested in. Even if an "official" RP server were designated who would move there if they didn't want to uproot their homes and stories and connections?

It's going to take players dedicated to establishing a community elsewhere, or an incentive for the non-RP crowd to shove off instead.

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I agree that that remains a problem, but I think it's worth examining what form this "investment" takes.

By that, I mean that if Square Enix offers free transfers with the retention (or compensation) of all assets, and designates an "official RP server" on top of that, I think it'd be possible for all RPers to move with limited fracturing. If the cost for uprooting is thirty minutes for the transfer to go through (assuming that you are transferring with all of your friends, and your friends have no reason not to transfer because the transfer is free with no losses) then wouldn't that serve as adequate incentive?

I fully acknowledge that I might be overlooking a whole host of issues, but that's the reason for this discussion.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

Have you heard of Gilgamesh. It is supposed to be the second roleplay server. Roleplay is dead there now. It has been tried before.

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I can also name other worlds where the attempts are seemingly unnoticeable or dead. There's probably 20+ FCs/LS pages on the linked RPC site of people who attempted to get communities to thrive as Balmung's had. Sargatanas, Leviathan, Brynhildr. Faerie. They might have had a linkshell or two but they give up or it becomes constrained to one small sub-50 group.

It does look like there's a good attempt being made on Mateus and I wish them all the luck with that.

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

That still doesn't tackle the issue others have raised here which is that these communities are already established, and in some cases, heavily invested in. Even if an "official" RP server were designated who would move there if they didn't want to uproot their homes and stories and connections?

It's going to take players dedicated to establishing a community elsewhere, or an incentive for the non-RP crowd to shove off instead.

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For it to work, SE needs to make a few things happen.

1) Housing needs to be transferred over. If this means adding new Wards to accommodate the Large Estates of FCs, then that NEEDS to happen. Players NEED this peace of mind, this feeling of security, that they are NOT going to lose this.
2) Transfers need to be free. Not everyone can afford to pay $18 to move one (or more) characters.
3) Restrictions of transferring Gil don't need to be loosened. They need to be -removed-. No one wants to lose their Gil from moving.
4) Make Official RP Servers. It. Helps.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

Have you heard of Gilgamesh. It is supposed to be the second roleplay server. Roleplay is dead there now. It has been tried before.

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Right, just give up then. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Marluxia

By that, I mean that if Square Enix offers free transfers with the retention (or compensation) of all assets, and designates an "official RP server" on top of that, I think it'd be possible for all RPers to move with limited fracturing. If the cost for uprooting is thirty minutes for the transfer to go through (assuming that you are transferring with all of your friends, and your friends have no reason not to transfer because the transfer is free with no losses) then wouldn't that serve as adequate incentive?

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Ideally yes, they're offering compensation for housing and furnishings, FC transfer, designated destination worlds will be free of charge, iirc (it's on Lodestone).

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Originally Posted by Vexander

For it to work, SE needs to make a few things happen.

1) Housing needs to be transferred over. If this means adding new Wards to accommodate the Large Estates of FCs, then that NEEDS to happen. Players NEED this peace of mind, this feeling of security, that they are NOT going to lose this.
2) Transfers need to be free. Not everyone can afford to pay $18 to move one (or more) characters.
3) Restrictions of transferring Gil don't need to be loosened. They need to be -removed-. No one wants to lose their Gil from moving.
4) Make Official RP Servers. It. Helps.

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See above. The gil restriction is only in place to prevent flooding a market with excess gil or giving one player an excessive amount of power over the market.

I'm not sure what RPers were expecting exactly. Balmung and Gilga are very saturated player-wise. Trying to shove more people on them would only degrade performance further.

It would definitely be nice if SE could designate/recommend certain servers specifically for RP though, as FFXIV badly needs multiple RP hubs instead of one swamped one. WoW does this and it works well.

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

Right, just give up then. Thanks.

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No need to become snarky now for giving information that this has been attempted in the past. It is better to inform people then inspire false hope.

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Originally Posted by Marluxia

One of the fundamental issues I'd like to have an answer for is this: does Square Enix know why Balmung is overpopulated? Are they even aware that a roleplaying community exists in NA and EU, and that the desire for a large roleplaying community is why Balmung is overpopulated? Or is server population purely a numbers game for them based off of their metrics?

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Yes, they do understand why Balmung is overpopulated and do know about the RP community. These things are not completely connected.

You seem to be missing a few of the other causes that caused both Balmung and Gilgamesh to swell up.

One of the big factors is that it was feasible for individuals to move to Balmung/Gilgamesh, but not feasible for large groups to move away from Balmung/Gilgamesh. $18 is a reasonable price to migrate an individual. $4500 is not a reasonable price to migrate 250 players.

Individuals ended up trickling into Balmung/Gilgamesh, but organized groups were unable to leave together. This ended up causing everyone to be crowded in Balmung/Gilgamesh rather than large groups moving to where there is more room.

With free transfers organizing a 250+ character mass migration from Balmung/Gilgamesh is not an overwhelming task.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

No need to become snarky now for giving information that this has been attempted in the past. It is better to inform people then inspire false hope.

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And then offer no alternatives. Forgive my skepticism when the message you're sending out is "don't bother, this is the way things are and nothing you do will change it" smacks of a defeatist attitude and does nothing to help the situation at all.

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

And then offer no alternatives. Forgive my skepticism when the message you're sending out is "don't bother, this is the way things are and nothing you do will change it" smacks of a defeatist attitude and does nothing to help the situation at all.

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I genuinely think there are no realistic alternatives, unless SE starts to intervene. So I can't and won't offer them, because I don't have them. If you wish to be judgemental due to that? All the more power to you. You're free to have your opinion just as much anyone else here has.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

No need to become snarky now for giving information that this has been attempted in the past. It is better to inform people then inspire false hope.

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This is a unique situation. There's no way into Balmung and if some of those interpretations are correct, they're going to offer you the chance to have an organized transfer off of it, free of charge. It's a chance that hasn't been available before. Now's the time to organize. Take it or leave it.

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Originally Posted by cakesphere

I'm not sure what RPers were expecting exactly. Balmung and Gilga are very saturated player-wise. Trying to shove more people on them would only degrade performance further.

It would definitely be nice if SE could designate/recommend certain servers specifically for RP though, as FFXIV badly needs multiple RP hubs instead of one swamped one. WoW does this and it works well.

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Well considering Balmung was 1.x server and Gilgamesh started in 2.0, I don't think maxing out their particular servers was a big deal back then.

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

And then offer no alternatives. Forgive my skepticism when the message you're sending out is "don't bother, this is the way things are and nothing you do will change it" smacks of a defeatist attitude and does nothing to help the situation at all.

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Actually they were supporting the need for RP Servers rather than supporting an idea that has been tried more than once and failed. It was a little bit back as to their first post, and she has been rightly deterring people from posting this sort of thing over and over, because non-RPers who don't understand the time and work invested and those who just don't care, will always go the route they see as the "easiest" even if they do not understand the work behind something.

We NEED RP servers, not want them, to avoid problems for future players.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

I genuinely think there are no realistic alternatives, unless SE starts to intervene. So I can't and won't offer them, because I don't have them. If you wish to be judgemental due to that? All the more power to you. You're free to have your opinion just as much anyone else here has.

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I suppose that's true. I guess we're at an impasse. I simply don't think rolling over and waiting for SE to fix it (or advocating for such) is a healthy stance to take, especially for a community as robust and passionate as XIV's RP community.

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

This is a unique situation. There's no way into Balmung and if some of those interpretations are correct, they're going to offer you the chance to have an organized transfer off of it, free of charge. It's a chance that hasn't been available before. Now's the time to organize. Take it or leave it.

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Exactly. Just to flesh out the "organized" part, and anyone fact check me with the lodestone article if you want, they are offering FC transfers, compensation for housing and furnishings, free transfers to new EU servers and designated servers across all data centers, and raising the cap on transferring gil to 10 million.

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Originally Posted by artemos7

Actually they were supporting the need for RP Servers rather than supporting an idea that has been tried more than once and failed. It was a little bit back as to their first post, and she has been rightly deterring people from posting this sort of thing over and over, because non-RPers who don't understand the time and work invested and those who just don't care, will always go the route they see as the "easiest" even if they do not understand the work behind something.

We NEED RP servers, not want them, to avoid problems for future players.

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Ehhhhh... even if they did that we'd still need to solve the "need people to move" part. Hopefully what SE is doing with transfers and such as I mentioned above will make it easier for folks on the fence about moving.

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

This is a unique situation. There's no way into Balmung and if some of those interpretations are correct, they're going to offer you the chance to have an organized transfer off of it, free of charge. It's a chance that hasn't been available before. Now's the time to organize. Take it or leave it.

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If you would read anything roleplayers have said in this thread... People don't want to leave Balmung. (New) People want to be a part of the bigger RP community. The smaller ones? While they are precious attempt don't hold nearly as much roleplayers. I dare to say Balmung probably has over the a few thousand of roleplayers. Those ghost towns? At best fifty or so.

So if you were a roleplayer who would you wish to join? the thousand of potential people you can roleplay with, or the small ghost towns?

On top of that? Us roleplayers don't get magically get along, unlike what people appear to believe here? People's styles vary immensely. You can find on Balmung the more lore tight people, to people roleplaying DBZ. On those small servers? You don't have a choice. It is adjust or get out. Lots of people want to have that choice, find people they jive with.

In the long run this will hurt our roleplay community. Those smaller hubs, while I applaud their attempts, and I hope I'm proven wrong, are not what people want. We need need people into our roleplay community. New ideas, new characters, new stories, to keep a community going. We are aware that Balmung is full, we have housing issues and drama constantly. But this, if Balmung will be kept locked for a longer while, will damage the roleplay community of FFXIV as a whole. Because new people wouldn't want to join FFXIV due to Balmung being locked.

That is the crux of this post, what people appear to be missing. We are concerned if this temporary lock doesn't turn out to be so temporary, it will have dire consequences for our community.

But I suppose for non-RPers this all makes little sense and they merely compare it to just transferring your static over to another server.

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Moreover, players who to transfer to or create new characters on designated Worlds across all data centers will receive special bonuses as described below.
* Pleased be advised the bonuses planned for implementation are subject to change.

Bonuses
*Transfers to designated Worlds will be free of charge.
*EXP bonuses will be applied to designated Worlds (up to level 60).
*Gil and free play time will be awarded to newly created characters that reach a certain level on designated Worlds.
*EXP bonuses will be applied to newly established Worlds (up to level 60).
*Gil and free play time will be awarded to newly created characters that reach a certain level on newly established Worlds.
*For players who own personal housing, we are planning a number of provisions including a reimbursement for the full price of the estate, and compensation for the cost of furnishings which we will add in subsequent updates moving forward. We also plan to accommodate free companies members that plan to move together with or without a free company estate.

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Of these bonuses, how many fit your incentives for a mass-exodus. They haven't stated their designated worlds yet. What stops you from choosing this option. If they cannot give you everything (ie Housing), will you still stay?

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Originally Posted by Velynea

If you would read anything roleplayers have said in this thread... People don't want to leave Balmung.

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I've read it. Balmung is a problem and they're fixing it. If you don't want to adjust, then fine. Don't adjust.

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

I've read it. Balmung is a problem and they're fixing it. If you don't want to adjust, then fine. Don't adjust.

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Honestly I might consider Mateus myself. At the moment I don't have an FC, and Balmung being Balmung, I've never had a personal Estate. The main issue I'd have is leaving my friends. I've also made an alt on Mateus to just look around a bit but what I'm seeing isn't exactly hope-inspiring. Maybe Ul'dah just wasn't the starting city to select. Sadly, there isn't much a level 1 can do to look around a server to get a good idea of what its like.

i think the trouble is SE don't know how big is the rp community in FF14 and it lead to that situation...
they try to carefully use them ressource, without a clear view of the rp community it's hard to take any action without risk usage of money for nothing... how many rp server do we need? on which datacenter? they are legitimate question that limit SE action.

don't get wrong, i want them to have a more clear stance about this. but how do it? even if they design 1-2-3 server as rp server, what will do the non rper player that are friend with Rper and want to play with them? what will happend if you create a new server dedicate to it, do the whole rp community will move out to the point to make some server empty? or barely populate.

i feel this situation can't be solved, it's clearly to late to have a clear solution for this. maybe they can create a new server dedicate to the rp, enforcing some rule for join this sort of server. but it will recquire more effort and investment on them side, and i don't see them do it without a good reason or a sure way to get back the fund invested.

it's sad, but that a situation that have arise countless time in many mmorpg and never have found a decent solution if is not done at the release of the game.

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Originally Posted by Greedalox

You'd be amazing at what a few people taking the reins with a lot of unhappy people following can do.

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This is quite true. With just a little effort, and some networking, I've been helping cultivate a PvP community on Goblin, and I'm happy to see it thriving.

That said, despite its size, Goblin's got a little of everything. And plenty of housing. No, our Quicksand isn't a notorious hub for RPers, but I know we do have a good number of them around. If you're considering a move for Stormblood, make an alt and come scope out Goblin.

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

I've read it. Balmung is a problem and they're fixing it. If you don't want to adjust, then fine. Don't adjust.

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That isn't helping anyone in this thread. Balmung is a problem, but also has been for a while, they should have worked to fix it long before this and then the need for this thread would have been different. When it started, and we decided on Balmung as the RP server unofficially, there was no worry of population, but now there is clearly. If you aren't an RPer, or aren't from Balmung, then your opinion is great, but it isn't helpful or adding to this discussion in a helpful way. Asking for RPserver designation is a valid inquiry to the team, and should be supported by most RPers who care for the future of their community. Tackling further issues is something we can meet over time if there is some push for at least that to start.

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Originally Posted by artemos7

That isn't helping anyone in this thread. Balmung is a problem, but also has been for a while, they should have worked to fix it long before this and then the need for this thread would have been different. When it started, and we decided on Balmung as the RP server unofficially, there was no worry of population, but now there is clearly. If you aren't an RPer, or aren't from Balmung, then your opinion is great, but it isn't helpful or adding to this discussion in a helpful way. Asking for RPserver designation is a valid inquiry to the team, and should be supported by most RPers who care for the future of their community. Tackling further issues is something we can meet over time if there is some push for at least that to start.

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I'm not talking about the request for an official RP server. Go ahead and request it, doesn't bother me.

What I'm responding to is this "we've tried it, it doesn't work" attitude on creating more unofficial RP communities. SE are giving a very heavy handed incentive to do it right now: Friends of people on Balmung can no longer join them. People who want the easy option of joining the largest RP community can no longer do it.

Forget what SE is going to do about it. What are you (general you) going to do about it?

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

Forget what SE is going to do about it. What are you (general you) going to do about it?

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I urge you to read my post again. We cannot do anything about it, unless SE offer us a hand or unlocks Balmung again.

This isn't about making new servers. We don't want them. This is not about transferring. We don't want that.

We just don't want our only true hub to start falling apart if this lock remains. We need new people. We are not like any other community. We are very unique and different in that regard. Without sounding melodramatic, this could take the enjoyment out of our game and how we spend our time if this remains a thing for a longer set period of time. Once more, we need new people to prevent things from stagnating. We need them in numbers, because all those type of various roleplayers need their brand of roleplayers to jive with. This isn't just a matter of "We like raiding" or "We like PvPing" and team up. Our situation is one I'm trying to explain, but I'm not sure if I'm wording things correctly, amongst several others, as no one appears to be understand what we are trying to convey.

Or people are just being immensely dense due to lack of knowledge on our community and prefer to stay that way. I'm not sure.

I doubt SE needs to go so far as to make entirely new Servers as RP servers. What they need to do is to make some of the lesser populated servers into, 'Official RP Servers.' What's an, 'Official RP Server?' Quite literally a server with (RP) next to it's name in the server listing. It does NOT need to be more than that. It does not need more rules or anything of the sort.

The real issue is whether or not this would be the perfect solution... RP'ers tried to leave Balmung, chose Gilgamesh as their new target server and then... Gilgamesh became the second most populated server on the Aether Data Center. I'm not sure how populated Gilgamesh was before the move, but from what I've been told, it was pretty dead.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

I urge you to read my post again. We cannot do anything about it, unless SE offer us a hand or unlocks Balmung again.

This isn't about making new servers. We don't want them. This is not about transferring. We don't want that.

We just don't want our only true hub to start falling apart if this lock remains. We need new people. We are not like any other community. We are very unique and different in that regard.

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Well it's going to happen. What are you going to do about it?

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

I'm not talking about the request for an official RP server. Go ahead and request it, doesn't bother me.

What I'm responding to is this "we've tried it, it doesn't work" attitude on creating more unofficial RP communities. SE are giving a very heavy handed incentive to do it right now: Friends of people on Balmung can no longer join them. People who want the easy option of joining the largest RP community can no longer do it.

Forget what SE is going to do about it. What are you (general you) going to do about it?

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This, so much. I understand not wanting to abandon friends and established communities (I wanted to play with my in-game spouse so much I followed them to Balmung) and assets. That part is well documented and understood.

What I don't understand is the active discouragement of people to find their own way around it. Digging in your heels and refusing to move is your business, and you're welcome to it. Telling other people not to do it on the grounds that you don't think it'll work is, however, none of your business. But we're all entitled to opinions, I suppose, so that's that.

For what its worth, the only reason I'm not an active member of Balmung's RP community is that I'm already a member of an RP community elsewhere, and XIV is where I go to unwind from that. I am fairly experienced in watching and maintaining these sorts of things, and allowing a community to become bloated to excess is, in fact, not healthy for growth at all. People get pushed out or feel they don't belong anymore. This is especially apparent in the (lack of) housing available: I'd probably be an active part of the Balmung RP community if my husband and I could actually get a house and settle down.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

I urge you to read my post again. We cannot do anything about it, unless SE offer us a hand or unlocks Balmung again.

This isn't about making new servers. We don't want them. This is not about transferring. We don't want that.

We just don't want our only true hub to start falling apart if this lock remains. We need new people. We are not like any other community. We are very unique and different in that regard.

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They really can't allow that for a multitude of reasons. Balmung will continue to become more and more full and you'll have one immense server where there will constantly be queues to log in, cities will be packed with more players and loading into zones becomes an issue, and you still have no housing available for these new people you so desperately need.

Some of the responsibility must necessarily fall on the players themselves. There is no one single thing SE can do to solve this problem that lets you have exactly what you want without shortchanging every other server who does not have Balmung's problems.

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Originally Posted by Marluxia

By that, I mean that if Square Enix offers free transfers with the retention (or compensation) of all assets, and designates an "official RP server" on top of that, I think it'd be possible for all RPers to move with limited fracturing.

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Why is the the RPers who have to move? Label Balmung the official RP server and let the non-RPers - people who would have a much easier time uprooting - take advantage of free transfers/etc.

It's a LOT easier to move/rebuild a raid group on another server than it is to re-establish an entire RP community with character relationships, housing RP hubs, history, and more.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

Why is the the RPers who have to move? Label Balmung the official RP server and let the non-RPers - people who would have a much easier time uprooting - take advantage of free transfers/etc.

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This problem is just going to happen again. If there's only one option, it's going to get bloated.

Also, what if the non-RPers also don't want to leave for the same reasons? They have friends, etc. You going to live with Balmung locked forever?

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

What I don't understand is the active discouragement of people to find their own way around it. Digging in your heels and refusing to move is your business, and you're welcome to it. Telling other people not to do it on the grounds that you don't think it'll work is, however, none of your business. But we're all entitled to opinions, I suppose, so that's that.

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Once more, my humble excuses for having a different opinion and not wishing to offer a one sided, unrealistic statement. Stating that it is not my business is absurd while we are discussing this topic. Just because you do not enjoy to hear another view does not mean you need to try to silence it.

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

Also, what if the non-RPers also don't want to leave for the same reasons? They have friends, etc. You going to live with Balmung locked forever?

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Again: If a raid group wants to move, it's just a matter of picking a different name for your server. For a roleplayer to move, they have to manage the logistics of how their move would impact their ability to roleplay, whether or not they should devise a way to remove their character from rp, potentially cutting off existing in-character relationships, interrupting plotlines, and just overall disrupting the entire in-character network. A community of roleplayers is a lot more complex than a community of non-roleplayers. It is a heck of a lot easier for non-roleplayers to jump ship to another server.

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Originally Posted by Velynea

Once more, my humble excuses for having a different opinion and not wishing to offer a one sided, unrealistic statement. Stating that it is not my business is absurd while we are discussing this topic. Just because you do not enjoy to hear another view does not mean you need to try to silence it.

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Likewise. You're insisting it won't work and that the only solution is to allow Balmung to become more and more bloated, and that players shouldn't attempt to branch out and grow the community outside of it because it's not personally what you want to have happen.

But I'll stop pushing my point further, we're not going to see eye to eye on this at all.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

Why is the the RPers who have to move? Label Balmung the official RP server and let the non-RPers - people who would have a much easier time uprooting - take advantage of free transfers/etc.

It's a LOT easier to move/rebuild a raid group on another server than it is to re-establish an entire RP community with character relationships, housing RP hubs, history, and more.

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I'm not sure I believe this? Balmung's possibly got a larger PVE community. Houses. Economy. History there as well. Why would it be easier to transfer say 5000 people than it is 1000? Is Balmung's RP population actually bigger than its PVE's?

Are you not unaware of how the raiding community works or? It's not just 8 people who move. You move their FCs. Their friends in other FCs. You want the raid community at your fingertips. "Hey I know this rad group who needs a PUG. I know this other raider from my LS's (note multiple linkshells) of people who I can ask to fill, to farm."

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Originally Posted by Kuroneko_Jutah

This, so much. I understand not wanting to abandon friends and established communities (I wanted to play with my in-game spouse so much I followed them to Balmung) and assets. That part is well documented and understood.

What I don't understand is the active discouragement of people to find their own way around it. Digging in your heels and refusing to move is your business, and you're welcome to it. Telling other people not to do it on the grounds that you don't think it'll work is, however, none of your business. But we're all entitled to opinions, I suppose, so that's that.
For what its worth, the only reason I'm not an active member of Balmung's RP community is that I'm already a member of an RP community elsewhere, and XIV is where I go to unwind from that. I am fairly experienced in watching and maintaining these sorts of things, and allowing a community to become bloated to excess is, in fact, not healthy for growth at all. People get pushed out or feel they don't belong anymore. This is especially apparent in the (lack of) housing available: I'd probably be an active part of the Balmung RP community if my husband and I could actually get a house and settle down.

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That isn't how our community works, it thrives in larger numbers. Because that means, new people can find groups or form new groups for older RPers to join or work with and grow with. We aren't limited like most of the other communities in the game, sometimes numbers in one place aren't great for raiders or PvPers, because it can cause rifts and outsiders, but here that isn't as much of a problem. She wasn't saying don't do it, she was saying it has been tried and failed many times, or never really got off the ground in the first place, and when we ask for some help, the first reply from someone shouldn't always be: "Do it yourself." because movement and growth of the community requires a large agreement that is hard to obtain and solidify. Oversimplifying the case or solution isn't helping.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

Why is the the RPers who have to move? Label Balmung the official RP server and let the non-RPers - people who would have a much easier time uprooting - take advantage of free transfers/etc.

It's a LOT easier to move/rebuild a raid group on another server than it is to re-establish an entire RP community with character relationships, housing RP hubs, history, and more.

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I don't disagree, and really your solution is the other side of the coin.

The problem is that there needs to be some kind of segregation between RPers and non-RPers, the reason why Balmung is full is because of that lack of segregation.

Doesn't really matter who moves, as long as it's one side or the other. But a move does need to happen or there.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

Again: If a raid group wants to move, it's just a matter of picking a different name for your server. For a roleplayer to move, they have to manage the logistics of how their move would impact their ability to roleplay, whether or not they should devise a way to remove their character from rp, potentially cutting off existing in-character relationships, interrupting plotlines, and just overall disrupting the entire in-character network. A community of roleplayers is a lot more complex than a community of non-roleplayers. It is a heck of a lot easier for non-roleplayers to jump ship to another server.

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I agree, it's easier for non-RPers to leave. but that doesn't answer my question. What are you going to do if the non-RPs don't want to leave also?

Unfortunately, server stability has to take priority over Roly Playing. We can play shoulda coulda woulda all day when it comes to SE, but it doesn't change the fact that if they don't do something proactive about this issue now, especially after a Data Center relocation and right before the release of an entire expansion, I can't even imagine what the consequences might be.

I don't role play, and I can certainly understand how difficult it would be to just move to another server, but I would rather you guys have the ability to do so now, before Balmung becomes so unstable that it shuts down the server, and possibly the entire Data Center, to where no one at all can play for a long time.

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

I agree, it's easier for non-RPers to leave. but that doesn't answer my question. What are you going to do if the non-RPs don't want to leave also?

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That's not really a fair question. Obviously something has to give or SE will keep the server locked forever. But "what if"s aren't really helpful. I was pointing out that fragmenting a roleplay community has a much greater negative impact on roleplayers than fragmenting the raiding community has on raiders.

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Originally Posted by artemos7

That isn't how our community works, it thrives in larger numbers. Because that means, new people can find groups or form new groups for older RPers to join or work with and grow with. We aren't limited like most of the other communities in the game, sometimes numbers in one place aren't great for raiders or PvPers, because it can cause rifts and outsiders, but here that isn't as much of a problem. She wasn't saying don't do it, she was saying it has been tried and failed many times, or never really got off the ground in the first place, and when we ask for some help, the first reply from someone shouldn't always be: "Do it yourself." because movement and growth of the community requires a large agreement that is hard to obtain and solidify. Oversimplifying the case or solution isn't helping.

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It is difficult. It requires coordination, cooperation, and planning; networking together (outside the game in many cases). The unfortunate reality of the situation is that doing these things involves a lot of risk and little reward and folks would rather stay on Balmung instead. It's this attitude that bugs me because it just enforces the status quo and doesn't allow for change. SE putting up an RP tag on specific servers would go a long way to solve it but at the end of the day if people aren't willing to relocate to "seed" these communities we'll end up right back where we are right now: an overpopulated Balmung.

I have a question to those who don't want to leave. What would you do if SE created a completely new world and designated it as an official RP server, and didn't do so for Balmung?