Please put relevant tomes in Main Scenario Roulette

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Originally Posted by Serilda

Well yes, I see it happening literally every day. They do it for the new player bonus. Or just because they like playing with new people. Or because they're helping a friend or need the same dungeon themselves. I've done it myself plenty of times, and I'm no saint. Not everyone refuses to play the game unless they're motivated by a few extra scripture tomes.

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It doesn't even matter anymore. The new player experienced was ruined when players began to expect them to skip cutscenes. There's literally nothing you can do to help new players enjoy this content because It's either they burden the party and make everyone wait on them watching the CS or they skip it so they can fight an extremely easy burnable boss that would otherwise be dead before they even got there. This is not a toxic player behavior issue, it's just bad game design. The damage to ruin the new player experience is already done. Better to add lore tomes to it, to increase the queue times rather than making new players have to wait awful queue times for what is going to be an awful first time experience regardless. With that said, the queues will be further worsen with the implementation of jump potions. New players might be lucky to get a queue at all for this if SE doesn't add more rewards.

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Originally Posted by Ogulbuk

As much as I would hate to lose the source of Poetics for relic, I REALLY think they should convert these two raids into solo duties. It is disgusting that a new player basically stops to watch the first cut scene, and by the time it's over the whole raid has been cleared. This is a critical chunk of the story, players should be able to enjoy it.

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Who says you have to lose Poetics? Why not just reward both sets of tomes? There's plenty of other roulettes that already do this. The idea is to not remove the rewards but rather increase the incentive.

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Originally Posted by Ogulbuk

The only reason to make this content more appealing to more people would be because those that need to clear it are not having an easy time getting queued in. I don't think that is the case, those queues come by very quickly, so obviously there is a good balance at the moment for people to do those (3.0 may change things if the new relic does not have any real use for Poetics.)

So, the only reason for this seems to be desire for one more daily source of Lores, and I'm not sure we need that ATM. You can just farm ARF or GGL HM if you are short on lores.

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or you can give more options for people who don't like running the same thing over, and over, and over, and over again. What would honestly be the downside of putting lore or scripture in the Main Scenario Roulette?

like how could it possibly be a bad thing?

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I read the post, actually. The incentive as it is at present is perfectly fine, it doesn't need to reward better tomes because then it will simply start making the other roulette options inefficient. You can cast aside the attempts at armchair psychology. I am sure many people reading the thread will appreciate it.

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How would it make the others inefficient? You can still run those roulettes as well. Lore is uncapped, so its not as if the developers have to gauge how fast we can get lore. You can run the main scenario roulette, AS WELL as the other roulettes to get lore, thus meaning more lore everyday..... how is that bad?

I don't run main scenario either because there is no incentive. Even poe for relics since blue scrips are much more efficient and quick. If they added lore, sure, them I could have used for relics.

The only downside to adding lore as a roulette bonus would be....ummm.....hmmmmm....is there one?

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Originally Posted by Theodric

You can cast aside the attempts at armchair psychology.

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I do not think that means what you think that means.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I read the post, actually. The incentive as it is at present is perfectly fine, it doesn't need to reward better tomes because then it will simply start making the other roulette options inefficient.

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there's nothing inefficient about a bonus that only occurs daily. i haven't done Main Scenario Roulette for like a year, i do Expert like 3-4x a week at least still. every roulette should be more efficient than rerunning an expert dungeon without roulette.

I would have thought it obvious - it's inefficient in the sense that if the bonus is equal to or greater than what a higher level roulette option offers then there's a good chance that people will start ignoring a different roulette option for not being as profitable. Not everybody has a lot of time or desire to hit up every bonus offered by the roulette system each day.

This is a community where it has become the norm to skip a major mechanic in Zurvan EX just like it became the norm to do the very same with Garuda EX back when that was relevant content. If the Main Scenario roulette offered a major chunk of lore tomes or even scripture as an incentive then there is a legitimate risk that people would drift away from another roulette option in favour of it given how quickly and easily it can be tackled.

The developers will be thinking of the bigger picture and how changes will affect other bits of content when deciding how best to funnel players into particular instances. If some people disagree, fine - debate, that's fun. Engaging, even. You don't need to be snotty about it though, hence the 'armchair psychologist' comment earlier.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I would have thought it obvious - it's inefficient in the sense that if the bonus is equal to or greater than what a higher level roulette option offers then there's a good chance that people will start ignoring a different roulette option for not being as profitable. Not everybody has a lot of time or desire to hit up every bonus offered by the roulette system each day.

This is a community where it has become the norm to skip a major mechanic in Zurvan EX just like it became the norm to do the very same with Garuda EX back when that was relevant content. If the Main Scenario roulette offered a major chunk of lore tomes or even scripture as an incentive then there is a legitimate risk that people would drift away from another roulette option in favour of it given how quickly and easily it can be tackled.

The developers will be thinking of the bigger picture and how changes will affect other bits of content when deciding how best to funnel players into particular instances. If some people disagree, fine - debate, that's fun. Engaging, even. You don't need to be snotty about it though, hence the 'armchair psychologist' comment earlier.

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This would only be an issue if the script bonus was too high. If you do something like 100 lore and 5 scripts like the leveling one, then people will still do the others.

I am gonna have to throw my ring into the "Make it Solo" hat. They learned their lesson from it in future dungeons. If we made this Solo with some NPCs instead of players, I'm sure it would be a relatively quick fix. And it would mean that players that want the story CAN take it at their own pace.

Just put in gates that only open up if everyone finished the current CS. Like we see in the later dungeons, gates help against speed runs.

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Originally Posted by Paladinleeds

I am gonna have to throw my ring into the "Make it Solo" hat. They learned their lesson from it in future dungeons. If we made this Solo with some NPCs instead of players, I'm sure it would be a relatively quick fix. And it would mean that players that want the story CAN take it at their own pace.

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That would remove some fun out of those instances, like playing with cannons while the tanks pull a whole army to them.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I would have thought it obvious - it's inefficient in the sense that if the bonus is equal to or greater than what a higher level roulette option offers then there's a good chance that people will start ignoring a different roulette option for not being as profitable. Not everybody has a lot of time or desire to hit up every bonus offered by the roulette system each day.

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Then just give the MS roulette a 100 Lore reward bonus. High enough to queue for it and still lower than lv50 roulette (which have 120 Lore reward bonus)

What about giving a tome reward that adds up each time a cs is fully played?
10 cs, 10 tomes each, bonus 100 if all played. In terms of time, 10 tomes for the time of watching a cs is way more effective than running a duty for it, so no one will complain and cs viewers welcomed.

MS roulette reborn!

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Originally Posted by LalaRu

What about giving a tome reward that adds up each time a cs is fully played?
10 cs, 10 tomes each, bonus 100 if all played. In terms of time, 10 tomes for the time of watching a cs is way more effective than running a duty for it, so no one will complain and cs viewers welcomed.

MS roulette reborn!

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it won't work. Taking into consideration the whole "let's rush this to finish it sooner" mindset it has set into the game comunity (part of it, at least) they will find another reason to skip it and force to new players to see the cs in the Inn. Nowadays it seems the norm is to rush everything.

Better still just stop attaching everything to lore on things like the Anima. Make it so the items can be collected from Grand company seals, poetics, Hunts and lore or the equivalent in Stormblood.

Level 50 content gives level 50 rewards, makes sense to me.

Praetorium and Castrum Meridianum should be completed as solo content as with the MSQ run. Those dungeons are a great failure because, given that bonus tomes pop ups often, the run is absurdly easy and the yield of poetics is too juiciy to be ignored, those supposed epic end-game dungeons look more like grinding spots. And them being 8-man further aggravates the problem.

If anything, and for the sake of being able to run the instance repeatedly, they could rework the dungeons to be an actual dungeon, with actual loot and 0 cutscenes (they could make it with a different lore and different bosses or just make it a "Minstrel Ballad" kind of dungeon, whatever people prefers), and not a speedrun grind. All this while eliminating Main Scenario Roulette for good, of course.

People don't get the problem and why the only fix is made them solo content:

- Castrum Meridianum 10m of cutscenes.
- The Praetorium 35m of cutscenes.
- Both dungeons are near 4 years old.

If you force people to watch those cutscenes, or even just wait, everytime no one will que and new players will suffer.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

If you force people to watch those cutscenes, or even just wait, everytime no one will que and new players will suffer.

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Maybe it will be not so much severe, players eventually will get fc and friends, and will found it not so difficult put up a group for clearing it. And maybe they will get a nicer experience, compared to actual "skip cs or gtfo" it may happen nowaday when a first timer gets there.

Agreed, the wait for new players, especially DPS, trying to do this dungeon is ridiculous. Add something to help more people que for it. If it can be done for the LVL 50 roulette it should be done for the Main Story one too.