No need to change it, high O2 concentration or high wind speed is enough to suffocate/kill.Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlas
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11-20-2011, 07:48 AMSynapse
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11-20-2011, 07:59 AMJinko
I don't think it needs to change really, although with Water missing from the skill update list it does leave a big hole.
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11-20-2011, 08:17 AMAnswaOnly as big a hole as there was for Blizzard V, etc. in patches on FFXI--wait for cap increase.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinko
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11-20-2011, 08:22 AMWynn
There is nothing wrong with the current elemental wheel(s).
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11-20-2011, 12:44 PMTheFatHousecat
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11-20-2011, 01:15 PMDrogo
Go dump a bucket of water on a match and tell me that fire is not weak to water.
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11-20-2011, 01:28 PMOMEGA_HACK
Don't know if its been said yet but consider this:
No wind = no oxygen = no fire
Maybe those Aero Spells are pulling the oxygen out of the fire instead of "blowing" on the fire.
And a side note: I use Earth to put out my camp fires, and Wind to blow out candle fire...so by that principle:
Water>Fire
Wind>Fire
Earth>Fire
Fire>Ice
Ice>Wind
Wind>Earth
Earth>Thunder
Thunder>Water
Turns out Fire is SoL. And Wind and Earth are the strongest elements, being able to trump two different elements, funny that they belong to the healer class! lol -
11-20-2011, 01:52 PMWolfie
Good god I can't believe we now have 5 pages of people whining that one made up fantasy magic property was more sensible and better than the next.
Do you guys even realize how ridiculous this topic is?
What's worse is that people straight up want to copy something out of FFXI. Doesn't this game have enough FFXI copy-pasta already? -
11-20-2011, 01:57 PMOMEGA_HACK
Actually it has very little copy-pasta. The don't even have Carbonara in the game yet! (see wut I did thur?)
Seriously, what all is copy-pasted? Auto-attack? Job names (because what they do is not the same as XIs Jobs), classic FINAL FANTASY icons? (Summons, chocobos, airships...)
Oh my so much copy-pasta, we need more Italians! -
11-20-2011, 02:09 PMWolfieSame races, same naming structure, port city, forest city, desert city, same beast men. Granted, Yoshi's trying really hard to differentiate FFXIV's lore from FFXI's and to prop it up in its own unique way. Why would we want to copy FFXI's elemental wheel when FFXIV's is just fine?Quote:
Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK
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11-20-2011, 02:20 PMOMEGA_HACK
Same races was explained prior to the release of the game (sorry if you didn't play XI but we players liked them and wanted to make our characters from XI over to XIV, that was a fan based choice they made so you can get over it)
Naming structure? As in what? Mi'qote names are VERY different sounding, Roegadyn have a COMPLETELY different lore to how they make their names (Galka names were slave names from the Humes) We now get TWO names (first and sur-) so its a different player naming structure...city names are all different....NPC names are all different...idk what you mean here, grasping at straws much?
Cities all the same? Oh my maybe their location but were you expecting them to be in outerspace instead of a geographical location? lol...this quip you've made makes about as much sense as the plus sign at the end of this sentence.+ While there location might be similiar the layout is entirely different and each has a different feel about them. Also Ul'dah =/= Bastok, Bastok was a mining city built into a mountain, Ul'dah is an Oasis city in the middle of a desert. Gridania is a city on a lake, Windurst is a city in a plains-esque area, its not a forest by any means, and if you mean San d'Oria is like Gridania I would laugh even more, Gridania is a myticism-lead city while San d'Oria was a Patriarch (King) driven city.
Um...the Beastmen...please don't make me get pictures to compare what you think are the same, because they don't look anything alike, the CLOSEST looking ones would be the Amalj'aa and the Mamool Ja. But sadly the closest resemblance to each other is the 'a' sound at the end of their names...
So again I ask, where is all this copy-pasta? Because it'sa makin' me hungry. -
11-20-2011, 02:23 PMBowenOmg, Ul'dah is in the middle of a dessert? O_o I wonder how it tastes. . .Quote:
Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK
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11-20-2011, 02:26 PMOMEGA_HACK
lol typo'd and laughed. it was all this talk of pasta! I swear!
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11-20-2011, 02:35 PMBowenHehe.Quote:
Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK
Anyways, I agree, I don't understand what that person is talking about. There are some FFXI inspired things in FFXIV but, is that really a bad thing?
Is it so bad that FF is sometimes inspired by WoW? (btw I haven't played WoW but, I have watched my best friend play it and didn't think it was so bad at all. A little too easy I admit but, not bad) -
11-20-2011, 02:44 PMWolfie
I was halfway through typing up a big reply with examples and everything and then I remembered this Cracked article and I said "f*** it". You win, there's no copy-pasta in FFXIV, cya later.
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11-20-2011, 05:25 PMRazorFirst of all, that article slightly discouraged me from bringing up an issue with the whole "blowing out a candle" concept. Second of all, I have a friend who tried to make a character called Pinkie Pie, so kudos for making him rage when it was taken XDQuote:
Originally Posted by Wolfie
Regardless. There is a serious issue with the whole candle argument. To anyone who knows anything about chemistry, when you light a candle what is actually burning is the vaporized wax. Yes the wick burns, but its more or less just a place to hold the flame. The heat from the flame turns the wax into a liquid, and then to a gas, which then burns like any other petroleum vapor. By blowing on the candle, you are simply moving it away from its fuel source. You can confirm this theory by using the candle trick. You can do a similar experiment by using two candles instead of a match.
If you were to "blow your flame" to a new fuel source (something flammable enough), like say, that string confetti everyone loves, or the drapes, or the paper box the cake comes in, or someone's hair; you'd quicky learn why fire loves wind. While there is some merit to the notion that strong enoughwindanything can put out a fire, you can also extinguish a fire by dropping a load of ice on it. Or dirt, or water, or even gasoline if there is a large enough quantity to prevent the fire from breathing.
It's just a matter of using what makes the most sense. (A hint: not wind) -
11-20-2011, 05:53 PMRubicon
Who cares. CNJ is nerfed.
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11-20-2011, 06:21 PMBahnso many useless one liners from you based on ur post history lololkekekeQuote:
Originally Posted by Richard_BG
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11-20-2011, 06:26 PMRichard_BGproblem? :D hurrrrlolololkekekekQuote:
Originally Posted by Bahn
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11-20-2011, 10:04 PMWynnQuote:
Originally Posted by Razor
And yet the heat from a fire can boil away water and fire cannot burn in a vacuum... Either one makes just as much sense as the other.
In the end, who really cares? This is a silly argument. -
11-20-2011, 10:06 PMGramul
Wind to suffocate the fire. There, problem solved.
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11-20-2011, 11:00 PMHiirNoivlI think everyone is assuming they are blowing ON the fire. Let's pretend that the air is being sucked away from the fire... thus extiguising it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gramul
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11-20-2011, 11:13 PMTonkrabut why dont make it more of that "feeling natural right" ? everybody would tell you that water extinguishes fire.. point and thats it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcell
the elemental wheel from the old dev team is crap... like many things from the old dev team are crap. they wanted to invent things which really dont fit the final fantasy universe in every case..
the "new" classes, the elemental wheel... just all. and why that? it just doesnt feel natural.. -
11-20-2011, 11:15 PMJinkoOh yea and when is that ? besides we don't even know a cap increase would solve the issue, water could be reserved for another class for all we know.Quote:
Originally Posted by Answa
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11-20-2011, 11:19 PMwhoopeeragon
[QUOTE=Tonkra;452635]but why dont make it more of that "feeling natural right" ? everybody would tell you that water extinguishes fire.. point and thats it.
A bucket of water, my dear, will not be very effective against an inferno. A quick moving air which sucks out oxygen from around the blaze will nearly instantly cause a very very shor life for the flames. And what was it when water gets overly heated by fire...?...oh yes, it turns to steam. -
11-20-2011, 11:23 PMkhryss
I honestly just think that the elemental wheel should be more intuitive or traditional. I m often times forced to look at the internet just make sure im using the right elements in ffxiv even though ive seen it a couple of times.
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11-20-2011, 11:55 PMTonkraQuote:
Originally Posted by whoopeeragon
firstly im not your "dear"... secondly... wind GIVES oxygen to the fire and spreads it.
your example is just stupid, sure one small bucket wont be effective against a huge inferno..
to blow your candle out only works, because candles are VERY small flames. to blow it out works only because the breath wind is SO big in comparison to the fire. you have to keep the ratio in mind.
Fire men do extinguish house fire with water from the fire engine.
yes water steams slowly when you heaten it... but it doesnt disappear within a second...
therefore you would need much less water and much more fire within the ratio.
that works if you drip water drops into a fire... the water drops will disappear.
fire is the opposite of water and the other way around. but throwing a burning torch into a bucket of water wont make the water disappear.. but the water will cause the torch to be extinguished.
sure a bucket of water wont kill a house fire, because the quantity is in no relation. -
11-21-2011, 12:29 AMSpellbinder
What was this about again? Waffles on fire?... Did someone burn my waffles?!?!!
(ノ ゜Д゜)ノ ==== ┻━━┻ -
11-21-2011, 12:35 AMChardrizard
I can't believe people are fighting over such a trivial things, it has just proven how amazing dev's works are, because apparently there is nothing much to complain.. except the bucket of waters for 7 pages.
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11-21-2011, 07:15 AMSilvertearRenSomeone has probably done that during the summer birthdays. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Richard_BG
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11-21-2011, 07:53 AMCoDeWa
Thought I was going to disagree with this post before reading it. Heh. A more understandable elemental wheel would be nice.
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11-21-2011, 07:57 AMCoDeWa
[QUOTE=whoopeeragon;452641]
If you use wind to suck the oxygen out of an area, unless closed off, that area is going to be quickly replaced with the gas nearest to it, which is also oxygen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonkra
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11-21-2011, 08:11 AMAenarionYou DO realize you're wrong right? the air you exhale contains slightly more carbon dioxide, and slightly less oxygen (down from 20% to about 14-16%). If breathing worked the way you claim it does, CPR would kill people instead of saving them :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bahn
you can extinguish fire with a myriad of things, whether it's wind, water, or whatever, as long as you achieve the goals of denying the oxidation reaction its reactant, which is the shit that's burning, or oxygen itself. it's all about scale in this case, enough of wind or water can extinguish a fire, and not enough of it will either do little, or help spread the fire along.
the serious lack of proper science knowledge in this topic is both hilarious and saddening at the same time. -
11-21-2011, 08:24 AMRazorFor some reason, that comment made me laugh even though I already knew it was true.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aenarion
I'm glad you brought that up because it goes along with something I had said earlier. You can even use gasoline to put out a fire if you were to pour enough of it fast enough onto the flame to prevent the flame from breathing. (EDIT: I highly recommend none of you try this at home outside of a controlled lab station because it has a very high risk of backfiring, but for the sake of an extreme example, it does actually work.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Aenarion
The issue is that if you had a mild flame like say... your hair was on fire. And you had 3 resources available to you: A compressed air gun, a pale of water, and a pale of gasoline, which would you use?
All of which could be sufficient to put out the fire under the right circumstances but water is the only resource that has no risk of making the situation worse. (Unless of course you love hair gel and the fire on your head is a grease fire, but even then the reason why you don't use water on a grease fire has less to do with the fact of water vs fire but would require a much longer explanation to anyone without a chemistry background) -
11-21-2011, 09:39 PMPayadopa
Are we really talking chemistry here? In a fantasy game?
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11-21-2011, 09:40 PMLebannen
I would like it to change and make more sense.
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11-21-2011, 10:42 PMninesunz
This thread is so full of LAWL!!!!
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11-22-2011, 02:08 AMnormalforceSo, I've been looking at this so-called "elemental" chart, but it seems to be missing quite a few elements...Quote:
Originally Posted by Payadopa
http://xkcd.com/965/ -
11-22-2011, 04:06 AMAnswaxkcd, full of such nerdy delights.Quote:
Originally Posted by normalforce
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11-22-2011, 06:11 AMSpellbinder
Ok, so with no water attacks in the game until 2.0, what will mages do against mobs that are weak to water? Are they being changed? New elemental wheel?