Can Cash Shop be a bit more reasonable

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Originally Posted by Kerii

Their prices look right in line with WoW's... Should I go around and look at other cash shops to see what I already know? If you don't have the money for the items, then you can go without. It's "OPTIONAL".

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$25 for a mount in WoWs cash shop and a lot of the newer items in the cash shop of WoW were the charity items. There are no items on the FFXIV cash shop where the proceeds are donated to charity.

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

I think people are complaining mostly about the cosmetic items. Since cosmetics in cash shops mainly exist in F2P games, for a game with no F2P option there is a very high focus on cash shop cosmetics.

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90% of the cash shop items are lv1 glamours, leftover seasonal event gears and stuff you can also get outside of the cash shop in another skin.

F2P games make sure that you need the items in their cash shops (so you buy it). While SE give you just the option to buy it (if you really really really want it, even if you don't really need it) with no ingame mechanic that force you to buy it (and no, Retainers are not in the cash shop)

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

$25 for a mount in WoWs cash shop and a lot of the newer items in the cash shop of WoW were the charity items. There are no items on the FFXIV cash shop where the proceeds are donated to charity.

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However the proceeds of the Cash Shop did fund the establishment of the EU datacenters.

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Originally Posted by Rennies

Only if they refund people who have already paid for that stuff >_>

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That makes sense. Should refund all people who bought everything ever and get a refund for when things go on sale.
Ya'll have to admit the prices are insane, whether you have money or not but people defend the prices just kill me...
This is the fault of people who willingly throw their wallets at SE. Thanks team.

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Originally Posted by Jijifli

$30 for a flying 2 person mount that plays a boss theme for those riding it that goes on all characters.

Really, are you complaning the moogle mount is too much?

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Still overpriced, who cares about twin seaters? Rarely do I see anyone ride twins mounts.
But these topics never go well, people defend Cash shop too much so the rest of us might as well be mute.
Next thing you know, all glamour/mounts/pets are going to be in Mog and here you go screaming "IT'S OPTIONAL".
At least throw us a bone and add it in-game with a grind if need be, those who want it instantly can buy it. Everyone wins.

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Originally Posted by Belhi

I have two factors which effect my view on if a cash shop is ok.

1. Am I getting my money's worth with the ingame patch content?

2. Does the stuff on the Cash shop in any way place me at a disadvantage or do I feel in any way forced to purchase cash shop items to fully enjoy the game?

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Let's get hypothetical! /darkwingduck.

The major patches are basically paid DLC. Assume (I hate that word) that a person is paying 15 USD per month (or convert to your local currency). Is each patch (which again is just DLC you're paying for) worth 45 USD (again, assume each patch is on the 3 month cycle)? I dunno if it's true or not, but alot of people may think that patches are just "YAY! free content!". Is the content from 3.4 really worth a 45 USD DLC?

If not, then shouldn't the cash shop crap...I mean items (as useless as it is) be a part of those 45 USD patches? I dunno the answer here, just something to think about.

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Originally Posted by Mugiawara

Still overpriced, who cares about twin seaters? Rarely do I see anyone ride twins mounts.
But these topics never go well, people defend Cash shop too much so the rest of us might as well be mute.

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I see people using twin mounts all the time on the 2 servers I play on. I use them myself as well with my EB partner.

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Originally Posted by Bixillarla

I see people using twin mounts all the time on the 2 servers I play on. I use them myself as well with my EB partner.

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I see more people on the bird mounts from the primals.

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

I think people are complaining mostly about the cosmetic items. Since cosmetics in cash shops mainly exist in F2P games, for a game with no F2P option there is a very high focus on cash shop cosmetics.

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OP said it's ridiculous to have a $30 mount. Point still stands.

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Originally Posted by Mugiawara

Still overpriced, who cares about twin seaters? Rarely do I see anyone ride twins mounts.
But these topics never go well, people defend Cash shop too much so the rest of us might as well be mute.
Next thing you know, all glamour/mounts/pets are going to be in Mog and here you go screaming "IT'S OPTIONAL".
At least throw us a bone and add it in-game with a grind if need be, those who want it instantly can buy it. Everyone wins.

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Just going to note the most participation I had in the cash shop was buying a bomb shirt, so about $5. I don't care really for the other things, because I don't like how they look or I don't like something about them. The price isn't really an issue, because there's a reason for it. Like I said, it's a 2 seater (Which your other options are marriage or $65,) that can fly, on all your other characters (One of the other ones is on the married, I believe.) You don't have to buy it. I didn't buy it.

Also, glamour is technically all gear, so I want to ask if it has stats on it. If I'm buying 260 gear, then yes we have an issue. Then again people complain about spending $30 on a ticket because they just want the pet (Or worse, complain they have to spending $90.) Actually to be honest, I'd kind of like to buy a Titan mount since DF can't clear it and I can't just PF to stay together. And for minions... is it really a problem? It's a pixel creature following you around that does literally nothing.

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Originally Posted by Lucke

he major patches are basically paid DLC. Assume (I hate that word) that a person is paying 15 USD per month (or convert to your local currency). Is each patch (which again is just DLC you're paying for) worth 45 USD (again, assume each patch is on the 3 month cycle)? I dunno if it's true or not, but alot of people may think that patches are just "YAY! free content!". Is the content from 3.4 really worth a 45 USD DLC?

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I don't think nor would I look at it as paid DLC cause regardless of how often they added new content we would still be paying $15 a month just to log into the game.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

Well...whales will be whales.

They're pretty much trying to combine the F2P with the P2P model by having the sub fee for everyone and the extras for the whales - It ensures the game has no "leechers" that don't pay at all, unlike the normal F2P model while still retaining the extra profits that make F2P viable in the first place.

Quite interesting that it works, really. But then again, WoW did it before IIRC.

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Precisely, SE is able to have its cake and eat it too. The pricing on the cash shop has had no material effect on the number of subs, and as long as it stays that way SE can do whatever the hell it wants with cash shop pricing (getting the sub money AND whatever the market will bear on the cash shop). Successful business strategy 101.

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Originally Posted by Auteur

The pricing on the cash shop has had no material effect on the number of subs, and as long as it stays that way SE can do whatever the hell it wants with cash shop pricing (getting the sub money AND whatever the market will bear on the cash shop). Successful business strategy 101.

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Greed does bite your arse eventually.

Short of a GM entanglement incident (like what occurred in EVE) or a CS-Go style gambling scandal, haven't seen gaming communities cause enough of a storm purely over cash shop pricing to actually hold developers accountable. And have yet to see a Wells Fargo type incident in MMOs.

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Originally Posted by Lucke

Let's get hypothetical! /darkwingduck.

The major patches are basically paid DLC. Assume (I hate that word) that a person is paying 15 USD per month (or convert to your local currency). Is each patch (which again is just DLC you're paying for) worth 45 USD (again, assume each patch is on the 3 month cycle)? I dunno if it's true or not, but alot of people may think that patches are just "YAY! free content!". Is the content from 3.4 really worth a 45 USD DLC?

If not, then shouldn't the cash shop crap...I mean items (as useless as it is) be a part of those 45 USD patches? I dunno the answer here, just something to think about.

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My short answer to that is yes.

My longer answer is that a quick look at the marketplace shows that SE's product is quite competitive. On top of that I get easily 45 dollars worth of entertainment out of it. Further, that money also allows me access to servers that allow me to play the game with friends on the other side of the world as well as reliable and fast (in my experience) technical support if I have problems.

I could flip that around and point out that you could only pay one month sub every patch and see most of the content if that's all you were after. In that case its 15 dollars a patch.

Again, I find what I am provided for the money I give value for money. I have never had to get anything off the Cash Shop to feel I have had a full and satisfying experience.

Here is a question to counter. If the cash shop didn't exist and so none of the things on it were available would you still be willing to pay for the game?

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Originally Posted by Belhi

Here is a question to counter. If the cash shop didn't exist and so none of the things on it were available would you still be willing to pay for the game?

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Yup. I have not spent a single cent on the cash shop and never will. All the items on the shop would be nice to have in game, but I don't NEED to have them. But again, that's just me. No doubt people feel different.

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Originally Posted by Belhi

Here is a question to counter. If the cash shop didn't exist and so none of the things on it were available would you still be willing to pay for the game?

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If the game is fun most people wouldn't care if there was a cash shop or not.

Edit: That, wow, sounds like shots fired XD. I didn't mean it that way. I just meant I wouldn't give a shite if I was enjoying the game. I also didn't care earlier in FFXIVs life, I wanted to support the game, I bought additional retainers and thought it all justified to support the game. Now it's just me, I can't justify the money spent(especially with the weak AUD I have to spend with).

May be true, but that's not my situation at least. I'm against exclusive items in the mogstation in general and I prefer them in game. I have nothing against event items, services such as fantasia and transfer and maybe even recolours, but exclusive items is a delicate matter. I like the game - well, I play it after all - and I love fluffy like mounts, minions and glamours in general. But I already pay the game. Because, as I said, I like the game, I like playing it, I want to have goals inside of it. Some people's goals is getting a better gear, I prefer the cosmetic route. For me, glamour is content just like raids and dungeons (I like those too, mind you), they are not less important.

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Originally Posted by Melorie

May be true, but that's not my situation at least. I'm against exclusive items in the mogstation in general and I prefer them in game. I have nothing against event items, services such as fantasia and transfer and maybe even recolours, but exclusive items is a delicate matter. I like the game - well, I play it after all - and I love fluffy like mounts, minions and glamours in general. But I already pay the game. Because, as I said, I like the game, I like playing it, I want to have goals inside of it. Some people's goals is getting a better gear, I prefer the cosmetic route. For me, glamour is content just like raids and dungeons (I like those too, mind you), they are not less important.

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I feel it is worth pointing out that in many cases the cosmetic items that aren't event items likely wouldn't have had the resources spent on their development if the cash shop didn't exist. When deciding wether to allocate resources to create these items, in most cases, I think you would find they first projected what profits they felt they would likely get from it and weighed the development cost vs. the returns. In reality, any item that doesn't either come from a previous event, isn't a service or isn't part of a exclusive offer, likely wouldn't be available anyway even if the cash shop didn't exist.

I want my value for money. If I didn't get that from FF14 I wouldn't be playing it. If I am not getting my money's worth then its a problem. On the flipside though, as long as I am getting my money's worth, I am not going to hold SE attempting to generate more revenue against them as long as it doesn't inhibit the value of the content I get and as long as they don't try and force me to pay extra to properly enjoy what I have already payed for. We get quite a lot of glamour items every patch. There are usually at least 3 new sets, give or take and a number of additional extras.

Now value for money is a subjective thing. For people who aren't happy with what they are getting their issues are perfectly valid. However I doubt the Cash Shop not existing would remedy those issues.

I'm a total whale. I've spend over 1000$ on this series over the past year or so..

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Originally Posted by DamianFatale

I'm a total whale. I've spend over 1000$ on this series over the past year or so..

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This game in particular or multiple games(I'm aware of several phone games that cash grab on nostalgia)? There is a difference if your looking to be defined as a "Whale".

It comes down to acceptance, Fantasia for $10, no problem, but when you have cash shop exclusive aesthetics, whether it be hair, clothing or colors; that could be placed into the game for MGP/Events/etc. It goes a little to far.
A game like TERA, it would be expected, it's free to download and play. However; FFXIV costed me $60 at 1.0, then I had to buy the damn game again at 2.0, and I have to pay a $15 a month subscription. It should be an insult that the front page news is "New Optional Items" ($10 Hair) ($20 Outfit) ($30 mount) but the icing on the cake is the Final Fantasy X themed outfits for paying $30.00 to watch a live stream... that will be free to watch in some form or another shortly after the broadcasting. You're paying $30 to look like a Grand Summoner who in reality can't summon more than a green farting toe nail. That's okay, I'd give a F2P my money and get a lot more out of it any day at this rate, I am slowly breaking away from this game as the true colors seep through the paper.

I won't weigh in on this personally; however, I will say that there is obviously enough people on Gilgamesh that believe the price is more than fair given that I could probably find 100 different people with the outfit. And given that multiple people have admitted to purchasing multiple outfits on the chinese outfit thread (I believe it was), complaints very well may fall on deaf ears as long as there is a demand. I do not want to tell people how to spend their money, but I would ask people to actually think about what they are purchasing. Personally, I wouldn't have problems with the cash shop and some of the pricing if all the items were account-bound. Someone mentioned XIV's prices being in alignment with WoW's but at least everything you purchase in their cash shop is account-wide.

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Originally Posted by Brightshadow

Can the prices of the cash shop be a bit more reasonable it's a bit outrageous to have to pay $30 for a mount when you can buy a game for $15-$60

everything needs to be like 50% off lol it's really unappealing to new/returning players. And if it cheaper you'll get more customers which will increase $$$

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greedy companies will stay greedy until it's too late, then their games die

While I have no real issue with the cash shop since it is glamour only... I do take issue with the prices.
I just cant see the justification. I would actually like the far eastern outfit, but I wont buy it because I don't think I will wear it enough to justify the high cost.

For example, the reason I have the maid set, is because I resold the item (A figurine) I bought for the promotion back on ebay, and thus got back most of the money spent. (out of pocket - $10) and $10 for a 5 piece dye-able set is reasonable to me.

In conclusion, if the prices were roughly 50% of what they are now... I'd actually have bought a handful of things already, rather then what I have bought now: Nothing.

Blame WoW, look at their Cash shop items and you'll quickly realize how close the prices are to one another. People complain about the cost of a full set of vanity gear yet wow has 15 dollar helmets lol. Yet to XIV's respect, appearance changing only cost 10 compared to 15 in WoW. Even World Transfer is more generous, 18 compared to 25. So it's easy to complain about the price of cash shop items in XIV, but in order to fully understand their pricing scheme you have to first look at the MMO competitor that set the prices and showed that they worked. No reason SE would make the price 50-75% cheaper if WoW is able to sell their's for the price that they do.

$30 for a two person mount across all characters, when there isn't many 2 people mounts and you can have 40 characters... okay. It's expensive but not too expensive, and I'll probably get it eventually.

$18 for an outfit on one character? That purchase went out the window for me. That's nearly my monthly subscription for one item with one use on one character (I have two extra retainers).

I understand they are trying to make money, I just wish they'd understand they would make a lot more if they introduced some cheaper items as well. Not even make the items they have cheaper, just.... more. If there were a lot of $2-$5 outfits, emotes, etc, I'd buy at least 2-3 a month. These are digital items, after the initial cost of production there is no extra to make each "item" afterwords, so I can't justify spending that much to myself.

Doesn't seem like anyone has pointed out the big issue, you're paying X amount of money for an item, but to use that item, you have to also pay a subscription, so if you don't pay the sub, the item you bought doesn't really belong to you anymore, until you pay again to access it.

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Originally Posted by Kohta

Doesn't seem like anyone has pointed out the big issue, you're paying X amount of money for an item, but to use that item, you have to also pay a subscription, so if you don't pay the sub, the item you bought doesn't really belong to you anymore, until you pay again to access it.

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This is only true because of a technicality. You have to pay the subscription fee to access to the game regardless of whether or not you buy these items. The same could be considered true of a movie theater's concession stand. You can't simply go in, buy concessions, and leave. You have to buy a ticket before you can enter and buy concessions.

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Originally Posted by Kerii

This is only true because of a technicality. You have to pay the subscription fee to access to the game regardless of whether or not you buy these items. The same could be considered true of a movie theater's concession stand. You can't simply go in, buy concessions, and leave. You have to buy a ticket before you can enter and buy concessions.

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Then you buy the item at the place that's free to enter with an objectively equally entertaining experience. I'm not saying this is better than that, but simply comparing the value of Cash shop to Cash shop on a Free vs Premium platform, the difference is unfortunately minimal, but that's really just my opinion I guess?

I suppose what I am saying is; there is too much MMO competition and even non-MMO's like Overwatch, that will consume people time and make them drift away, over something like this. Overwatch you pay for, and for PC users, it's free, loot boxes are given every level or roughly 4-5 matches that contain skins, sprays etc, just for playing.

A little closer to home comparison is Black Desert Online, A rather interesting Story, you buy it, you play for free and the community was smart enough to come together when they started trying to sell player enhancement items (Pay to Win) and thus it was reworked.

Beyond that, you have The Elder Scrolls Online, which now also allows you to level sync with friends anywhere in the world as of recently- and I won't even argue about how incredible the Elder Scrolls story is. it's fully voice acted and it's hundreds of hours of content.

I can go on and on with TERA, Blade and Soul and I'm sure you can come up with a laundry list of games you can literally install right now and pay nothing to play it. The state of the market is that it is a players market, and while I like some aspects of Final Fantasy, I don't think I am alone when I say I am tired of paying the monthly fee to get Tomestone's of [Insert Bibliography Name] and presented constantly with a Cash Shop feeding the fire of disdain.

Is this you? "Oh cool how do I get that?" | ALT+TAB | Google | "How to get cool hairstyle/mount/weapon skin FFXIV" | Cash Shop Link | "What!?" | [Item you wanted] $5 ~$30 | Email reminder of Upcoming Payment to Square Enix | rip

Regardless of how much money someone does or doesn't have, nobody want's to give it all away either, especially when they're already giving it to them.

I'd be fine with it honestly... if only cosmetic items bound to accounts, not to character. And what's frustrating is that some items do, but most don't. That's not fair, tbh.

I'm sorry but "there's no such thing as overpriced" is a ridiculous statement. It doesn't matter if there are a few whales who are willing to pay an exorbitant amount of money for basic things (or shell out extra money every month for extra inventory space - a horrendous practice for a p2p MMO, by the way). Their presence doesn't negate the ability for something to be overpriced. An item's value is not devoid of context.

- points to the other thread where people are bitxhing about hair being locked behind content like people here who want a dress others had to pay for locked behind content.- There's no pleasing people on either side. They should've just told people NO and leave the dress there.

By the amount of Y'shtola outfits and Chinese dresses I see, plenty of people buy it so the prices won't go down anytime soon.

I really wanted her outfit, but after seeing lalas and Roes and basically every second person run around in it....I don't feel like blending with the masses.

In most games, the fluff will always be the most expensive. Why? Because you don't need it to progress in the game. Fluff is the perfect way to make money because you will be milking the ones that do not mind spending the extra while not hindering the ones that want to progress in-game. I quite like that even if there are some things I would like to buy but simply can't afford at the moment.

If they start selling gear or upgrade items in the shop while still charging a sub, that's the time when I will stop playing for sure.

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Originally Posted by cammi

There's no pleasing people on either side.

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So you say, but do you truly think putting the hairstyle into the saucer at the same price of the other hairstyles would have caused any noteworthy ruckus?

If someone came up to me & said "I'll buy your shirt off you, I love it so much, I'm throwing money at you, name your price, I'll pay it!", do you think I'd say "Sure, it's only worth $1"? Hell no, I'd think to myself that the idiot wants it so much & doesn't care about the value of money that they will have to pay $100.

That is **EXACTLY** how players reacted to certain content when they saw it & SE reacted exactly as I would - cough up, fools. Sorry 'bout it, you brought it on yourselves.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

So you say, but do you truly think putting the hairstyle into the saucer at the same price of the other hairstyles would have caused any noteworthy ruckus?

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No but here 's the thing.. people still would've complained. Why? Cause the other hairs wasn't in the GC. They were just given. So yes people would complain. Cause now you're making them do GC instead of just giving it to them like the other hairs were. My point still stands, there's no right answer cause no matter what they do people WILL complain. Which is why the dress should've just stayed there. But that's just me.

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Originally Posted by Chessala

In most games, the fluff will always be the most expensive. Why? Because you don't need it to progress in the game. Fluff is the perfect way to make money because you will be milking the ones that do not mind spending the extra while not hindering the ones that want to progress in-game.

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Not going to comment on whether the price is right or not, but on this argument instead. Please, people need to stop this. It's a weak argument at best and just downright self-center and/or selfish at worst. Just because you don't care about the glamour content as much as those who are supportive of this thread doesn't make it any less important than -insert- content are to you.

A valid argument is something like SE is a business, and business are out to earn money. Whether they are treating the customer right is another question. Seriously, just stop it with the "cosmetic content doesn't affect progress/give an advantage, so it doesn't matter" argument.

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Originally Posted by cammi

No but here 's the thing.. people still would've complained. Why? Cause the other hairs wasn't in the GC. They were just given. So yes people would complain. Cause now you're making them do GC instead of just giving it to them like the other hairs were. My point still stands, there's no right answer cause no matter what they do people WILL complain. Which is why the dress should've just stayed there. But that's just me.

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This is a silly thing to say. They already have a system in place for delivering new hairstyles: adding them to character creation/the aesthetician. I HIGHLY doubt people would have complained about that. I also doubt people would complain much if costumes were added to the Gold Saucer... there are already costumes there, so it makes sense.

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Originally Posted by Kohta

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Yet most of the games you listed don't even have half the playerbase of games like WoW and FFXIV. Why? Back when TESO was sub based it was an utterly unplayable garbage mess. Now it's at least playable, but still boring. Blade and Soul and BDO are garbage KMMO grindfests. TERA is a patch simulator. WildStar is In-Game Advertisements... In Space!

Six in one hand, half a dozen in the other. Either you sub for a good gaming experience + optional cash shop, or you don't sub for what basically amounts to a polished up browser game.

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Originally Posted by SessionZero

WildStar is In-Game Advertisements... In Space!

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Kind of off-topic but I'm trying to figure out what you mean by this and failing. As far as f2p games go, WS has the best model of the bunch to be honest. With how you earn Omnibits from playing, you rarely have to actually spend money in the cash shop for a costume or whatever that you might want - and they're all account-wide unlike in this game.

That and I've never seen an in-game advertisement in WildStar outside of the Welcome Window when you first log in...

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Originally Posted by Naunet

-snip-

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I may be mis-remembering because it's been awhile since I played WS but I remember the F2P version being clunky and intrusive. Either way, my point was that free to play does not entertainment make. I don't have to pay anything to watch paint dry either but that doesn't make it quality entertainment.